Gordon Hayward 2020: I'm standing here in pieces and you're having delusions of grandeur!

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k-factory

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yep off by a minute, he looks ready to go. I was merely replying to k-factory's wanting to wait a few weeks

Brad said no minutes restriction pre-game, so Gordon will be fine going forward
I said 9 more days given the wonky sked but yeah he looked great. I was just reflexively on the side of caution given the original 6 week timetable from the team. Karalis brought up a good point in his pod that if the timetable wasn’t padded and he wasn’t ready there would be a lot more hand-wringing. Fair enough. [unwrings hands]
 

lovegtm

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Man, they are so much more dynamic when you have two matchup problems/playmakers on the floor at all times.
 

benhogan

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I said 9 more days given the wonky sked but yeah he looked great. I was just reflexively on the side of caution given the original 6 week timetable from the team. Karalis brought up a good point in his pod that if the timetable wasn’t padded and he wasn’t ready there would be a lot more hand-wringing. Fair enough. [unwrings hands]
I was with you a couple of days ago: Minutes restriction, handle with care, take advantage of schedule, etc BUT Brad said no restrictions pre-game and GH looked more than fine.

It looks like the Celtics caught a break here w/Gordon and handed MS some needed rest before 3 interesting games (Indy, Phila, Dallas) coming up.
 

DJnVa

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I think we should figure out a new thread title. We all have the faith.
 

DJnVa

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Tatum is playing though.

Celtics have to be the only team that can get 5 days off and come out of it less healthy.
 

benhogan

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This is getting fucking ridiculous (the whole team, not just Hayward).
Maybe all of our endless discussions about the end of the roster this Summer wasn't for naught.:)

Just goes to show how important all 17men are...

10-day contracts start in January
 

DJnVa

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They said it was sore earlier in the season, and then he got some treatment when he was out for the hand. But yeah, I'd like more info on that...

FWIW, he did make the trip to Dallas, so this could be an overabundance of caution.
 

CoffeeNerdness

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Missing 13 games and having lingering soreness is certainly a reason to be cautious. How much is this going to improve over the rest of the season if 3.5 weeks off the court didn't help? Oof this guy is like Eric Idle in European Vacation at this point.
 

Light-Tower-Power

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He did look slower on his drives the last couple games vs. earlier in the season. I thought it was just rust and having not played for a while but I wonder if this is part of it. Agree that it doesn't sound particularly good.
 

CoffeeNerdness

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I may be wrong but I believe increased discomfort often follows a cortisone shot. Either way this seems grim at best.
 

TripleOT

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I think we should figure out a new thread title. We all have the faith.
How about "Should the Celtics trade Gordon Hayward before he possibly walks this summer?"

Hayward for Steven Adams and Dennis Schroeder?
Hayward and pick, or two (non Mem) for Andre Drummond, also with a summer option?

Hayward for LaMarcus Aldridge?

Hayward and four or five firsts, including MEM, for Karl Anthony Towns?
 

nighthob

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How about "Should the Celtics trade Gordon Hayward before he possibly walks this summer?"

Hayward for Steven Adams and Dennis Schroeder?
Hayward and pick, or two (non Mem) for Andre Drummond, also with a summer option?

Hayward for LaMarcus Aldridge?

Hayward and four or five firsts, including MEM, for Karl Anthony Towns?
Or a three way deal with Hayward going to Golden State to help the tank job, Russell to New York for filler and a pick package going to Boston.
 

TripleOT

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Or a three way deal with Hayward going to Golden State to help the tank job, Russell to New York for filler and a pick package going to Boston.
Do the Celtics really need any more picks? I was looking for a way to solve the Cs big problem, and not stick the Celtics with any big, long term deals.
 

nighthob

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New York is full of expiring deals. And lottery picks in ‘21 and ‘22 would be valuable in case Memphis conveys this year.
 

lovegtm

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Even if/when Hayward comes back healthy, I think it's time to think about using his salary+talent as a trade piece. The Celtics are confident now that they'll have Brown/Tatum/Smart for a long time, plus Grant and Semi providing competent-ish big wing depth.

If Hayward comes back off this foot thing and looks good (as he did after his return from the hand), there are teams desperate for what he brings who will give assets for him. Ideally you roll him into salaries that provide that long-needed trade ballast, while also adding premium picks and maybe solving the big body problem.

His salary+talent opens up so many trade possibilities that it's impossible to list them all here.

Again, this isn't a comment on Hayward being bad, and more that they're committed to a lot of money at his position, and he fits really well for Western Conference teams who need a big playmaking wing right now.
 

chilidawg

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How about "Should the Celtics trade Gordon Hayward before he possibly walks this summer?"

Hayward for Steven Adams and Dennis Schroeder?
Hayward and pick, or two (non Mem) for Andre Drummond, also with a summer option?

Hayward for LaMarcus Aldridge?

Hayward and four or five firsts, including MEM, for Karl Anthony Towns?
If I'm trading Hayward I want an elite big coming back. Towns or Drummond fit the bill, not Aldridge or Adams. Hayward and picks for Drummond and Wood.
 

benhogan

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Ugh, while I like to play the fake trade game more than most I can't even begin (or stomach) kicking around trades. Selling low is just the worst and not how the Celtics usually operate.

healthy Hayward: Celtics want him
hobbled Hayward: nobody wants him

If Danny starts making trade inquiries, his medicals will be sent out and the Woj bombs/rumors will be rampant. PLUS most NBA executives are probably leery of dealing w/Ainge (ex-IT4 hip issue)

Expect they'll stand by Gordon (no choice), hope for the best (healthy and get Utah Gordon) and won't resign him if he opts out, since the left foot issue has the potential to deteriorate as he ages

If the worst happens (hobbled, shut down). They'll try their best this season but start focusing on the future (2021 and beyond). Hayward will opt-in for 2021 and the Celtics will shop him as an expiring deal next year.
 
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benhogan

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Or a three way deal with Hayward going to Golden State to help the tank job, Russell to New York for filler and a pick package going to Boston.
How does Danny sell a fully healthy 2021 Hayward to the Warriors? I'm assuming thats what it would take for GSW to even consider this
 

128

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Ugh, while I like to play the fake trade game more than most I can't even begin (or stomach) kicking around trades. Selling low is just the worst and not how the Celtics usually operate.

healthy Hayward: Celtics want him
hobbled Hayward: nobody wants him

If Danny starts making trade inquiries, his medicals will be sent out and the Woj bombs/rumors will be rampant. PLUS most NBA executives are probably leery of dealing w/Ainge (ex-IT4 hip issue)

Expect they'll stand by Gordon (no choice), hope for the best (healthy and get Utah Gordon) and won't resign him if he opts out, since the left foot issue has the potential to deteriorate as he ages

If the worst happens (hobbled, shut down). They'll try their best this season but start focusing on the future (2021 and beyond). Hayward will opt-in for 2021 and the Celtics will shop him as an expiring deal next year.
That makes a ton of sense
 

lexrageorge

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...
If Danny starts making trade inquiries, his medicals will be sent out and the Woj bombs/rumors will be rampant. PLUS most NBA executives are probably leery of dealing w/Ainge (ex-IT4 hip issue)
...
The bolded has been mitigated by the fact that most GM's around the league now realize that the Cavs sent the Celtics a malware virus in return.
 

NomarsFool

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The challenge with the Celtics right now (or I should say when they are all healthy again) is that they realistically can't play their 5 best players on the court at the same time. That's not a good recipe for the playoffs.

So, the question is whether there is a good fit where someone would benefit from Hayward for the rest of this season, and the Celtics would benefit with a big in return. Unfortunately, I think there aren't many, or possibly any, situations out there like that. Indiana is the closest, but I think there are some contractual problems as well as personal animosity issues that make that unlikely.
 

JakeRae

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The challenge with the Celtics right now (or I should say when they are all healthy again) is that they realistically can't play their 5 best players on the court at the same time. That's not a good recipe for the playoffs.

So, the question is whether there is a good fit where someone would benefit from Hayward for the rest of this season, and the Celtics would benefit with a big in return. Unfortunately, I think there aren't many, or possibly any, situations out there like that. Indiana is the closest, but I think there are some contractual problems as well as personal animosity issues that make that unlikely.
I don’t think this is true but, more importantly, think it’s very premature to reach conclusions about the efficacy of a lineup that’s only been used for 5 minutes so far this season.

I fully expect the Celtics, if healthy, to close games small with their 5 best players on the court.
 

nighthob

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If Danny starts making trade inquiries, his medicals will be sent out and the Woj bombs/rumors will be rampant. PLUS most NBA executives are probably leery of dealing w/Ainge (ex-IT4 hip issue)
Everyone knew that Lil’ Zeke’s hip was a degenerative mess. Cleveland’s only real regret is that they didn’t draft Shae Gilgeous-Alexander with the pick.
 

lovegtm

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Ugh, while I like to play the fake trade game more than most I can't even begin (or stomach) kicking around trades. Selling low is just the worst and not how the Celtics usually operate.

healthy Hayward: Celtics want him
hobbled Hayward: nobody wants him

If Danny starts making trade inquiries, his medicals will be sent out and the Woj bombs/rumors will be rampant. PLUS most NBA executives are probably leery of dealing w/Ainge (ex-IT4 hip issue)

Expect they'll stand by Gordon (no choice), hope for the best (healthy and get Utah Gordon) and won't resign him if he opts out, since the left foot issue has the potential to deteriorate as he ages

If the worst happens (hobbled, shut down). They'll try their best this season but start focusing on the future (2021 and beyond). Hayward will opt-in for 2021 and the Celtics will shop him as an expiring deal next year.
I'm theorizing about this for the case in which he comes back in a game or two and looks good over the next month. I'm still starting to think that it's worth looking at trading him. There are also teams that are really, really desperate for exactly what Hayward provides, so if the foot looks fine in the near future, they won't have a hard time talking themselves into paying up for him.

I think the question mostly comes down to whether you think Hayward + this roster or a reorganized roster is the best path to winning this year. After this year, you're basically going to be forced to trade Hayward for the best return possible if you re-sign him.
 
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