Cheesesteaks vs. Chowdah Part I - The Sixers/Celtics Series Thread

TheRooster

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Minor nits, but Manute started shooting threes at the end of his career and even hit 31% in 92-93. I got the impression that Whiteside got benched due to lack of effort.
 

DannyDarwinism

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Minor nits, but Manute started shooting threes at the end of his career and even hit 31% in 92-93. I got the impression that Whiteside got benched due to lack of effort.
Tough to separate the chicken from the egg here because throughout the season when he be benched due to match-ups he'd pout and sulk, leading to more time riding the pine. But Whiteside and the other defensive bigs that get minutes for decent teams (Gobert, Adams, even Baynes) are far, far more agile laterally than Bol or Eaton ever were, and are far more capable of flashing out to defend the perimeter for spells. Honestly, if you're familiar with either of those guys, just try to picture them defending the Celtics. Horford would play them off the court.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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I never saw any reports or speculation on Smart and his possible re-injuring of his thumb in G1. (I wasn't in the game thread as I watched the game on DVR.) Is the guess that it was just a stinger of sorts?
Prior to that there was a play where he came up holding and then shaking the thumb.
Yeah, if I recall correctly, it was Simmons who kicked him in the thumb while Smart tripped onto the floor. The second play before the end of the first half.

According to this article, the splint protected the thumb and didn't cause further injury.

"If there's a weakness to Marcus Smart's game, it has to be knocking down shots. Having to play with a splint on his surgically repaired right (shooting hand) thump {sic} certainly hasn't helped.

But while he acknowledges there's some discomfort with wearing it, the splint has already paid dividends. He took a blow to the thumb against Philadelphia in Game 1 on Monday and, because of the protection, didn't suffer a recurrence of the injury that would have sidelined him again."
 

Cesar Crespo

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I didn't mean Bol and Eaton in particular, just that there is still a place in the game for bigs with terrible offense. Manute Bol was not mobile at all and I don't really remember much of Mark Eaton's career to comment on it either way.

edit: Speaking of really tall dudes, Gheorge Muresan was better than I remembered. Too bad his career was derailed. I'm guessing Shawn Bradley ranks highly on those lists too. Really tall dudes who block shots.
 
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snowmanny

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Mark Eaton was pretty damn good, and he played less college ball than Matt Cassel.
 

DannyDarwinism

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I didn't mean Bol and Eaton in particular, just that there is still a place in the game for bigs with terrible offense. Manute Bol was not mobile at all and I don't really remember much of Mark Eaton's career to comment on it either way.

Then it was confusing when you questioned a post in which I was specifically talking about those two ( i.e. "neither of those guys would see the floor in the modern NBA"). Of course there's still a place in the NBA for defensive bigs, but the game has changed to the point where a big isn't sufficiently defensive if he can't move laterally. Mark Eaton was a really good defender who would get put in the pick and roll every single time down the court by Brad Stevens or any other decent coach in the modern NBA.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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This article points out stats that show the Sixers got better quality shots than the Celtics in game 1, but it sure didn't seem that way to me watching the game. I had just the opposite reaction watching, and it was one of the reasons I'm optimistic for game 2. Anyone else see it that way?

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/23388997/why-philadelphia-76ers-better-shape-think-boston-celtics
Without knowing anything about qSQ, there is this line in the article - "whereas Philadelphia's attempts came primarily from high-percentage shooters" - that makes me think that the determination of qSQ is based on who is shooting the ball. If this is correct, then the open look from Marcus in 3Q where he was all but dared to shoot probably is a lower qSQ than any contested three by Belinelli.

That would be IMO a mistake.
 

nighthob

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This article points out stats that show the Sixers got better quality shots than the Celtics in game 1, but it sure didn't seem that way to me watching the game. I had just the opposite reaction watching, and it was one of the reasons I'm optimistic for game 2. Anyone else see it that way?
I'm not sure that the metric accounts for the types of shooters that Philly employs. Guys like Redick, Belinelli, Ilyasova, Saric, et al are strictly catch & shoot guys. So I suspect that a lot of shots as measured by this system might look like quality shots due to distance from the basket and the separation from the defender (after being run off the three point line) without actually being a quality shot (because their guys aren't as good shooting off the bounce).

A lot of Boston's defensive planning, obviously, relies on taking the Philly guys out of their comfort zone. The Sixers need more shooters like Rozier.
 

HomeRunBaker

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I'm not sure that the metric accounts for the types of shooters that Philly employs. Guys like Redick, Belinelli, Ilyasova, Saric, et al are strictly catch & shoot guys. So I suspect that a lot of shots as measured by this system might look like quality shots due to distance from the basket and the separation from the defender (after being run off the three point line) without actually being a quality shot (because their guys aren't as good shooting off the bounce).

A lot of Boston's defensive planning, obviously, relies on taking the Philly guys out of their comfort zone. The Sixers need more shooters like Rozier.
I wouldn't classify them as strictly catch and shoot guys.....particularly Redick who now gets a lot of his own offense on pull ups off the dribble. They are all lethal in catch-and-shoot situations especially with the ball in Simmons hands on a delayed break but they are allcapable of scoring in a variety of ways with the exception of Belinelli.
 

snowmanny

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Shocking! But as they say, a playoff series doesn't really start until somebody wins on the road.

ed or 7 games, whichever comes first
 

nighthob

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Smart's defense most reminds me of Artest's. Though MWP is a bad comp because he was good offensively. Quinn Buckner was pretty much an all D guard.
Artist was never good offensively. He had a couple of years when he peaked at below average.
 

DJnVa

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If I had told you that Fultz would only score 1 fewer point than Simmons you'd think it was a Sixers blowout and Fultz scored a dozen garbage time points.

NOPE.
 

JCizzle

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Jaylen looked about 50% out there. Get better soon, I'd almost consider resting him game 3 and trying again game 4. All this without Hayward, Kyrie and Jaylen. Unreal.
 

DJnVa

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Kenny Smith nearly speechless: "I don't think I've ever seen...seen....seen that."
 

tbrown_01923

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Well I guess Boston is my daddy
Maybe... i really want this group of young C's to win a road game in the playoffs - learning to win on the road is a stepping stone necessary for trophys. And we haven't seen this group do it yet - so we can skip the "daddy" role play until we see that happen.
 

Red Averages

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Jaylen looked about 50% out there. Get better soon, I'd almost consider resting him game 3 and trying again game 4. All this without Hayward, Kyrie and Jaylen. Unreal.
He was still +9 and a significant contributor. As long as he’s not making it worse he should keep playing. He seemed to know his limitations fairly well and I trust the doctors that let him play. Plus if they can win game 3 they at putting themselves in great position for extended rest.
 

Red Averages

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Btw Philly got the short end of the stick with 5pm and 6pm starts in games 3&4. That’ll dim the crowd somewhat plus the unusual start time is a benefit.
 

JCizzle

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These 2 games were great but the real test is coming up. Can they take how they play at home on the road in the playoffs? So far, they haven't shown they can.
You have to think they're more likely to win 4 than 3. Sixers are going to come hard on Saturday.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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Cross posting from the game-thread:


I think we can say that Brad Stevens has rendered part of the 76ers Euro line-up unplayable in this series. Belinelli and Ilyasova played 28 and 21 minutes in the first game and the results were the 76ers getting torched on defense. Tonight then only got 19 and 16 minutes respectively. That makes it harder for Philly to get buckets.

The next mission is to put more clamps on Covington and continue to chase Redick off the three point line. McConnell, who is far better than Shane Larkin (sorry, Sean and Max), can get his and the Celtics will live with it.

And London, Boston is nobody's daddy. This series is still up for grabs. All the Celtics have done is held on to their home-court advantage. We can revisit when one of these teams wins a game on the road.
 

LondonSox

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I think you guys have a great defensive strategy for Ben, I'm choosing to take the silver lining that this gives him a kick in the ass to sort his shot out this offseason.
But more than just the plan it's the discipline. Which is a credit not just to Stevens but the young players.

But this team runs on two rookies, the Celtics team still has Horford to run things if needed. Ben got fully shook and there isn't really any plan b.
Which is fine at this stage of the rebuild. He def showed he is a rookie today

I do agree that game on the road is an acid test for them still, and I think the sixers do have a chance to sort themselves out and win at home.
It is just home court but choking away the lead that fast was pretty tragic.

They just kept speeding it up and jacking bad threes. I get that the goal is a fast paced game but not when you up huge on the road and facing a run maybe?
Even more concerning is they came out of the half and jacked up a bunch more bad threes and that's really unacceptable.

I don't think the series is over as in a sweep but I think it's hard to be optimistic.

I hate watching embiid jack threes when he's the biggest boy inside. In a few years he might get to a realible 3 point guy, and I get some matchups the threat of the three and dragging a slower big out is great but this isn't that matchup, and he isn't that shooter. I think his form and shooting touch elsewhere suggests good things one day. But not now.

I do think the mask bothers embiid a lot, it take such light contact with the big guys to move it and he's clearly aware of every contact on it.

Kudos to the garden tonight, loud.
 

benhogan

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Only the 3rd time a team came back from down 22pts in the playoffs over the last 10yrs.

How many games did they come back from down 20 or more this year? Seems like a bunch
 

LondonSox

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Cross posting from the game-thread:


I think we can say that Brad Stevens has rendered part of the 76ers Euro line-up unplayable in this series. Belinelli and Ilyasova played 28 and 21 minutes in the first game and the results were the 76ers getting torched on defense. Tonight then only got 19 and 16 minutes respectively. That makes it harder for Philly to get buckets.

The next mission is to put more clamps on Covington and continue to chase Redick off the three point line. McConnell, who is far better than Shane Larkin (sorry, Sean and Max), can get his and the Celtics will live with it.

And London, Boston is nobody's daddy. This series is still up for grabs. All the Celtics have done is held on to their home-court advantage. We can revisit when one of these teams wins a game on the road.
I think they have a plan for Ben and a team that can execute and stay disciplined. This is when we are reminded he is a rookie, you learn and improve from these games, you got to take your lumps. But hard to see him changing this year.

I think the sixers can potentially level the series. But it's a hell of an ask to win 4/5 even if three are at home and so far Boston has been significantly less impressive on the road.
 

BigSoxFan

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I think this series comes back to Boston tied. Game 3 is effectively an elimination game for Philly and the crowd will be fired up. The Celtics are a team that clearly is feeding off its home crowd. I expect Game 3 to be a double digit Philly win. I hope Game 4 is closer with the Celtics having a chance in the 4th.

Simmons was truly awful tonight. 13/12 AST/TO ratio so far. McConnell was a nice spark. He should probably play more.
 

JCizzle

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Before or after the game?
:oops:

--
If Simmons didn't learn how to shoot when he had a whole year off with nothing to do but shoot standing still with a broken foot (eg Hayward), when will he ever? Seems like such a wasted opportunity. I'm thinking KOC is right and the dude just needs to switch hands. He's still spectacular, obviously.
 

amarshal2

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I think the sixers can potentially level the series. But it's a hell of an ask to win 4/5 even if three are at home and so far Boston has been significantly less impressive on the road.
True in the last series. Celtics had a better road record in the regular season.
 

tbrown_01923

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I hate watching embiid jack threes when he's the biggest boy inside. In a few years he might get to a realible 3 point guy, and I get some matchups the threat of the three and dragging a slower big out is great but this isn't that matchup, and he isn't that shooter. I think his form and shooting touch elsewhere suggests good things one day. But not now
A couple a game to keep them honest and open the lane, but 6? When the rest looks pretty easy for him?
 

BigSoxFan

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True in the last series. Celtics had a better road record in the regular season.
Celtics road record with Kyrie: 22-8

Celtics road record without Kyrie: 6-8

Includes playoffs. This is where his loss is felt the most.
 

InstaFace

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And an assertion by DotB that seems worth debating in something other than the immediate post-game glow (or haze):

Have to give credit where it's due. Who were the officials in that game? That may have been the most well-officiated game I've seen in the NBA this season.
I thought we got the benefit of a few calls. The trap on Smart where he drew one on Covington, a few no-calls on the other end. I dunno if it was massively slanted or whatever, there weren't any real remote-throwers I don't think... hard to really say whether this was a gold-standard officiating game or if "a few calls likely missed" is too low a bar.
 

ehaz

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Will Jaylen’s hammy heal at all if he keeps playing like this? He was gutsy and excellent in limited time but he’s clearly playing hurt. It could make sense to rest him for game 3 if it means he’s not limping after dunks (or worse) in the rest of the series.

Hopefully it’s just residual soreness and he’s back to playing 40 minutes by game 4/5.