12 replies to this topic

[Sampo Gida]

Most of us remember the 2012 Aceves for his rough start, worse finish and his confrontations with Bobby V at the end, and his season ending stats are certainly unimpressive.  However, many overlook that from April 23 to July 29th he was pretty darn good.

 

Over this period he pitched 50 IP, 43 games with 20 saves in 23 opportunities, and had a 2.34 ERA.  That was a tremendous workload and he kept the team in the race for a WC spot until August. 

 

Following the infamous player-owner meeting it was all downhill for Aceves and the team.  Over his next 20 games he had a 8+ ERA which killed his season stats line, but the season was over.  Whether his poor performance was due to his workload the previous 3 months, or conflicts with Bobby V, I have no idea.

 

My main point is that for the part of the season when games actually counted, Aceves was a valuable member of the team, and that was true in 2011 as well.

Edited by Sampo Gida, 17 February 2013 - 08:53 PM.

[Hugh G Rection]

The one thing I will say about Aceves was last season his pure "stuff" looked explosive... He is a douchebag and his numbers were crap, but if he's used correctly and he keeps his head/attitude in check he could be a useful bullpen arm/ spot starter.... Probably better off trying to trade him to a bullpen desperate team like the Mets after he's hopefully raised his stock with a decent Spring. I think the latest dustup during BP is really much ado about nothing.

[Sampo Gida]

I always wonder about guys who have such a large increase in velocity.  He was hitting 97 at times early last year.    Increased 4 mph in avg velocity since he was with the Yankees.   If he were a Yankee we would be wondering if he was a Bosch client.  Maybe Toradol really works as well as Schilling says. LOL.

 

He might want to move on someplace where he can start, so he is being difficult,  Apparently his agent talked to Cherington today.  No idea what that was about.

 

But if the Red Sox do decide to trade him, and lets face it, the bullpen looks pretty stacked with a bunch of guys w/o options, he does have trade value, and there are teams who love his versatility and rubber arm, and a number of teams need another starter, or at least more starting pitching depth.  The main reason against trading him is his ability to start if needed.  Starting pitching depth is valuable

[Stanley Steamer]

What would you be looking at for a return? Sure, if the Sox were blown away by something, but otherwise continue with the experiment. Maybe it's his nature to be erratic. But we all agree his 'stuff' is above average and they should give him every opportunity to pitch more. The sky's the limit. The reality far more likely to be close to the earth.

[BeantownIdaho]

Trade him now...

 

http://bostonglobe.c...CvCI/story.html

[Sampo Gida]

What would you be looking at for a return? Sure, if the Sox were blown away by something, but otherwise continue with the experiment. Maybe it's his nature to be erratic. But we all agree his 'stuff' is above average and they should give him every opportunity to pitch more. The sky's the limit. The reality far more likely to be close to the earth.

 

You would get salary relief plus a mid level prospect or backup  who can play 1B/OF.  Would not be surprised to see him dealt for Carp but it could be anywhere.

 

Generally when the media acts in concert going after a certain player or manager it means they know he his out of here. 

 

I would keep him, but I am nobody.

[Stanley Steamer]

Well, we're all nobodies, really, but what the hey. I'd keep him, but this his last chance. If he can't work it out with Farrell, then find a new team.

[koufax37]

I would absolutely keep him at this point.  His value to us exceeds what we could get in return without question.  And if he acts up or doesn't accept his role, then he can be released, suspended, etc.  Farrell is much better at that stuff than Bobby, and we have the horses to not put up with it.  But managed properly I think Aceves is way more valuable in a Red Sox uniform, than his trade value would be.

 

Interesting point on PEDs.  It would not surprise me at all given his stature, his mph gain, his overall personality, etc.  Trial by speculation isn't very fair, but if I were to speculate I would have him towards the top of my list of suspicions.

[alwyn96]

Aceves is pretty clearly a volatile, crazy person. A team can work with that provided the player is good, but how good Aceves really is is kind of iffy. There's probably a talent-to-crazy ratio where at some point the extent of your craziness outweighs your value to the team and you gotta go, but not having to deal with Aceves every day, we're probably not in a great position to know where that is.

 

We can get a sense of his talent level, though. I'm not sure Aceves is so good or irreplaceable that he'd really be missed. He only seems to have a decent K/9 when pitching in short 1-inning stints, and that tends to be accompanied by a spike in HR-rate. His K/9 when starting is pretty pedestrian, and he may have the upside of a mediocre to acceptable swing starter. The Red Sox have a couple guys around who probably project to be generally as good or better in that kind of role who don't flip out on people or start brawls or who are crazy weirdos, though. Tazawa, de la Rosa, Morales - all these guys have arguably better skills and are (to my knowledge) not crazy assholes. If Aceves can keep his shit together and pitch well, great, but I'm not sure the team would be that much worse off if he was let go.

Edited by alwyn96, 13 March 2013 - 02:05 PM.

[Frank, Fenway]

He has options left, why wouldn't they just stash him in Pawtucket? 

[alwyn96]

He has options left, why wouldn't they just stash him in Pawtucket? 

 

I think they are straight up scared of the dude. He might actually kill somebody.

Edited by alwyn96, 14 March 2013 - 12:42 AM.

[touchstone033]

I wouldn't jump to conclusions about PED use because of his velocity increase. He was dealing with injuries while on the Yankees, so his '11 spikes could be seen as the result of him being healthy. Last year's velocity was probably the result of him working in 1-inning stints out of the 'pen -- it's common for starters-turned-relievers to see a velocity jump.

 

He's not as good as his 2011 ERA or as bad as his 2012 ERA. He's a very useful pitcher, though, capable of multiple-inning relief stints, starting, and working out of the back end of the 'pen.

 

I don't really care about his personality.

[touchstone033]

I should also say, I was going to jump in this thread to respond to the title and say, he's wasn't that bad! But the title's pretty misleading, eh?