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Least Favorite NFL Players


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#51 PBDWake

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:00 AM

Let's break it down by class with my top 3, and a retired HOFer

True, Despicable Scumbags Division
The Rapistburger
Michael Vick
Ray Lewis
Retired Hall of Famer: Leonard Little

Shut Your Mouth, You Arrogant Little Pricks Division
Antonio Cromartie
Bart Scott
Shawn Merriman
Retired Hall of Famer: Tom Jackson

On The Field Douchebaggery Division
Ryan Clark
Ndamukong Suh
James Harrison
Retired Hall of Famer: Bill Romanowski

Fuck You For What You Did to My Team Division
Eli Manning
Bernard Pollard
David Tyree
Retired Hall of Famer: Desmond Howard

Edited by PBDWake, 07 December 2012 - 09:01 AM.


#52 PaulinMyrBch


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:04 AM

I'm sick of Drew Brees. The holier than thou quotes and the bullshit, Ray Lewis style "is the red light on" pregame bullshit singing huddle thing. Plus that shit on his face.

Techinically not a player, but whoever thought up that Cee Lo Green, Ramones rip off lead in song for Thursday Football. That guy should have to date Javon Belcher in hell.

#53 Mugsys Jock


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:14 AM

Not a super-villain, but I can't stand Peyton Hillis. Quitter.

#54 Shore Thing

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:22 AM

There is a tremendous amount of LDT hate. I don't recall any particularly bad behavior, just a little whining. I thought he was a generally respected guy?

#55 Shore Thing

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:24 AM

by the way, someone should start one of these for least favorite sports announcers. Stephen A. is on in the background and I want to throw my laptop into his face.

#56 Ralphwiggum

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:26 AM

Re: LDT . . . A LOT of whining, particularly after the Divisional Round Game in '07 when he made sure to differentiate between himself (classy) and the Pats and Bill Belichick (not classy). I think the money quote was something like "they take after their coach" or some such bullshit.

So, to sum up: Merriman doing an obnoxious sack dance after sacking a QB: classy. Pats doing the same dance after knocking his choking team out of the playoffs: not classy.

And he sat on the bench and sulked during the AFC Title game the next year, and then whined some more. He's just a whiny bitch.

#57 maufman


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:29 AM

I'm a Steelers fan, and I can't understand how Roethlisberger doesn't top every one of these lists.

I hate Mike Vick more than is probably rational, considering how many football players have abused human beings and haven't paid a price for it the way Vick did. Something about the systematic abuse of dogs just sits wrong with me.

If I'm going to extend my hate beyond true sociopaths, I'd go next to outspoken bigots like David Tyree and Tony Dungy. Not that they're unusual in their views, but there's something to be said for a bigot who keeps his hateful views to himself.

#58 Seels

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:33 AM

I'm sick of Drew Brees. The holier than thou quotes and the bullshit, Ray Lewis style "is the red light on" pregame bullshit singing huddle thing. Plus that shit on his face.

Techinically not a player, but whoever thought up that Cee Lo Green, Ramones rip off lead in song for Thursday Football. That guy should have to date Javon Belcher in hell.


Yea, totally agreed on Brees.From his stupid political rants, to his stuff about Bounty Gate, to the horrible pre game set up, but really, honestly, it's the way he's often dropped into the same tier of QB as Brady Manning and Rodgers, which is a joke.

#59 maufman


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:41 AM

I never really understood the hate for Tom Brady. Seeing the hate here for Drew Brees and the Manning Brothers*, however, I guess I understand a bit better.


*- Especially Peyton. With the Pats losing two gut-punch SB losses to Eli in the past five years, the irrational hate for Eli is more understandable.

#60 Tony C


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:50 AM

...
9. Charlie Whitehurst
10. Kelly Jennings


Charlie Whitehurst?

There is a tremendous amount of LDT hate. I don't recall any particularly bad behavior, just a little whining. I thought he was a generally respected guy?


Are you serious?

My list:
QB category:
1a: P Rivers
1b: J Cutler
3: Flacco

Asshole cheap shot pseudo tough guy category:
4: Suh
5: James Harrison
6: Suggs

Diva ass and also a Jet category:
7: Cromartie
8: Santonio Holmes
9: Bart Scott

Shawn Merriman category:
10: Shawn Merriman

Hall of Fame category:
Favre
Tomlinson

Fun to stew in hate..

#61 Shore Thing

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:50 AM

I hate Mike Vick more than is probably rational, considering how many football players have abused human beings and haven't paid a price for it the way Vick did. Something about the systematic abuse of dogs just sits wrong with me.

Top of the list for me. Despicable human being. The accolades and respect given to him boggle my mind. Really, he's had one very productive year - 2010. 122/81 TD/INT for his career. Most overrated player in the NFL

#62 Shelterdog


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:54 AM

I never really understood the hate for Tom Brady. Seeing the hate here for Drew Brees and the Manning Brothers*, however, I guess I understand a bit better.


Because he's essentially the bad rich kid from an '80s movie. Rich, handsome, whines a lot and gets calls, squeeky voice, wears funny hats to the Met Costume ball, quite possibly doesn't drink beer, probably prefers Nobu to a BBQ, definitely might sleep with your girl, names his daughter Vivian, married to a Brazilian supermodel rather than a cheerleeder like every other red-blooded American quarterback.

Don't get me wrong, I love him, but you compare that to good old boy Favre or slightly goofy Peyton and you can see why a lot of football fans don't like the guy.

EDIT: My list begins and ends with Ray Lewis. Gladwell was on the Simmons podcast a while ago saying it was inexplicable that Lewis doesn't get more national ads. I guess so IF YOU IGNORE HIS INVOLVEMENT IN A DOUBLE HOMICIDE.

Plus he's overrated and the most obvious PED user in the NFL.

Edited by Shelterdog, 07 December 2012 - 10:01 AM.


#63 Oppo

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:58 AM

I'll add Marshall Faulk for his post-playing career. That guy has never gotten over SB 36 and bashes the Pats every chance he gets on NFLN.

#64 drleather2001


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 10:04 AM

Brady's "un-football eccentricities" make a lot more sense when you consider he was very close to his siblings, who happened to be three older sisters.

Growing up in that household, snuggling a lamb/goat was probably a favorite afternoon activity.

I dunno. Obviously his Dandy persona leaves a lot of fodder for jokes and the fans of his rivals, but I'd prefer he just do his thing in a relatively low key manner (which he does) than be an omnipresent blowhard like Peyton or Polamalu.

#65 loshjott

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 10:05 AM

I would hate Brady irrationally if I were not a Pats fan. I know this because I hated Joe Montana irrationally when he was playing and he and Brady are so very similar.

#66 glennhoffmania


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 10:12 AM

Michael Vick. Dog murdering piece of literal garbage. Should have been banned from the NFL for life for that scandal.


Seconded. Aside from the fact that he's a piece of shit criminal who tortured defenseless animals, he's a shitty QB who is (or was) extremely overrated and overhyped.

#67 BernieRicoBoomer

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 10:17 AM

Sorry, just trying to make a joke about hating people who followed rival teams...a joke needing explanation is not funny at all.

Nothing personal...carry on.

Edited by BernieRicoBoomer, 07 December 2012 - 12:22 PM.


#68 MentalDisabldLst


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 10:18 AM

Pat Angerer is really just baiting us.

#69 PBDWake

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 10:20 AM

Outside of the obvious ones (Simpson and Curruth), I don't think anyone will ever hit the Leonard Little level for me. A combination of the original, sickening act, the fact that he went out and got another DUI, that he never served prison time (ostensibly because he's Leonard Little), and the fact that because the media loved to blow the early 2000 Rams, he got all this praise, and of course, that he was still on the field after it happened... Nobody, not even Vick, has ever sickened me to see playing the game the way he did. For those unfamiliar:

After leaving a birthday party in 1998, Little crashed into and killed Susan Gutweiler in St. Louis, Missouri. When tested, his blood alcohol level measured 0.19 percent, a level in excess of the statutory level of intoxication (0.08) in the state of Missouri. Little received four years probation and 1,000 hours of community service.[21]
On January 18, 2003, with charges dating back to 1999, Little was charged with communicating threats and making harassing calls according to the Charlotte-Mecklenburg police department. Little's attorney, Scott Rosenblum, said the charges were filed after Little and his former girlfriend ended their relationship. Rosenblum added, "We don't think this case is going anywhere. It was groundless from the beginning".[22]
On April 24, 2004, he was arrested again for Driving while intoxicated after being stopped by The Ladue Police Department for driving 78 in a 55 miles per hour zone on Interstate 64. At the time he had red eyes, smelled of alcohol and failed three roadside sobriety tests. He later admitted drinking alcohol to the police.[23] After being convicted of misdemeanor speeding but acquitted of DWI, Little was sentenced to two years' probation on May 6, 2005


The media coverage also hurts. This is the linked story for Leonard Little's Manslaughter: http://sportsillustr...profile_little/
Aside from not condemning him, they treat it like an unfortunate accident. There's also a lot of bullshit road to redemption nonsense. And in the links on the bottom? Little says his punishment has been hard on him.

#70 Reverend


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 10:38 AM

Because he's essentially the bad rich kid from an '80s movie. Rich, handsome, whines a lot and gets calls, squeeky voice, wears funny hats to the Met Costume ball, quite possibly doesn't drink beer, probably prefers Nobu to a BBQ, definitely might sleep with your girl, names his daughter Vivian, married to a Brazilian supermodel rather than a cheerleeder like every other red-blooded American quarterback.

Don't get me wrong, I love him, but you compare that to good old boy Favre or slightly goofy Peyton and you can see why a lot of football fans don't like the guy.


This was very much along the lines of what I was thinking and why I think a lot of people here hate Peyton. Basically, there was this bullshit narrative imposed where Peyton was Good Guy Peyton and Brady was cast as his foil. Peyton, midwestern family man Good Guy Peyton versus Brady the playboy having a child out of wedlock with a movie star and dropping her for a supermodel.

Granted, it's not really Peyton's fault but rather a function of him having been at the top of the marketing pyramid. But I used to get sorta annoyed by the depiction because, although I think Peyton has grown up a great deal, I always found him to be a smarmy spoiled kid who had to settle a case out of college who was epitomized by the "I'm trying to be a good team mate here" comment. Meanwhile, Brady was actually a super hard worker and seems to be clean cut and well-behaved to the point of being utterly boring and who has done right by his kid from a pregnancy he only found out about after he and the mother broke up.

That Peyton plays for Indy and has a Louisiana accent and Brady is from southern California and plays in Boston just caps people's projection of good and bad America on to the guys. Not either guy's fault, but it is pretty stupid and I get annoyed by it whenever I find someone who buys it. As far as I'm considered, in the movie of their careers, Peyton gets played by Billy Zabka.

#71 phragle


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 10:44 AM

Kyle Arrington
Brian Waters

#72 maufman


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 10:54 AM

That Peyton plays for Indy and has a Louisiana accent and Brady is from southern California and plays in Boston just caps people's projection of good and bad America on to the guys. Not either guy's fault, but it is pretty stupid and I get annoyed by it whenever I find someone who buys it. As far as I'm considered, in the movie of their careers, Peyton gets played by Billy Zabka.


It's much worse than that. He's from the Bay Area, and doesn't even seem to be ashamed of it. :)

#73 RingoOSU


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 11:02 AM

Ndamakung Suh. When he was drafted I actually thought he would be one of my favorite players to watch for a long time. I didn't see it coming at all that he would be one of the most dislikable players in the league.

Same here, it's rare for a defensive player to stand out in the college game, but Suh did. I really don't remember him being such a huge prick in college, but now him getting fined/suspended by the NFL is becoming a Turkey Day tradition as well as watching the Lions lose.

#74 TheoShmeo


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 11:03 AM

Pat Angerer is really just baiting us.

The Texans' Whitney Mercilus kind of pisses me off too. The guy isn't good enough to have such a cool last name.

Has anyone mentioned Jack Tatum? I hate him not so much for the hit but rather how he handled it.

And while we're talking about Raiders, Phil Vilipiano gets a nod for all the crap he got away with in the game for which the Snow Bowl was sweet redemption.

#75 TheRooster

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 11:31 AM

RAY LEWIS

no one else really comes close

Ryan Clark and his cheap shots almost cracked the one-man list

David Tyree is out of the league so he's not eligible

#76 Al Zarilla


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 11:39 AM

I would hate Brady irrationally if I were not a Pats fan. I know this because I hated Joe Montana irrationally when he was playing and he and Brady are so very similar.

I can understand about Brady, as in the stuff Shelterdog said, but Montana? Can you expand on what you hated about him?

#77 loshjott

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 11:59 AM

I can understand about Brady, as in the stuff Shelterdog said, but Montana? Can you expand on what you hated about him?


I said it was irrational...really no logic behind it.

I guess it was because he always was so perfect and I tend to root for the underdog. I hated the way he raised his arms in the TD sign after every big score.

I was a Pats fan then so I really had no reason to root against the 49ers, and of course I rooted for them in the SB against the Dolphins. It's not like I loved the Giants or Rams or anything. I don't know...irrational.

But he's nowhere near my most hated players list.

#78 patinorange


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 12:34 PM

Oakland Raiders


The Raiders have shifted to the most pity team list, joining the Bengals and Browns.
The Chargers are creeping up.

I wish the Raiders would be good again so I can hate them again,

#79 Al Zarilla


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 12:50 PM

I said it was irrational...really no logic behind it.

I guess it was because he always was so perfect and I tend to root for the underdog. I hated the way he raised his arms in the TD sign after every big score.

I was a Pats fan then so I really had no reason to root against the 49ers, and of course I rooted for them in the SB against the Dolphins. It's not like I loved the Giants or Rams or anything. I don't know...irrational.

But he's nowhere near my most hated players list.

I was already living in the SF Bay Area when Walsh and Montana came along. I really liked those teams, and also the Steve Young teams. Going on a bit of a tangent, other reasons people hate people, my wife hates Montana because of his dumping of his first two wives. That never dented my admiration for him.

Jack Tatum is my all time most hated football player. People forget about his running mate in the Raiders defensive backfield, George Atkinson. He's portrayed as a lovable old guy around here now, but he was almost as much of a headhunter as Tatum.

#80 C4CRVT

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 12:59 PM

Pollard is #1 for me. As mentioned upthread, could easily have been three more Lombardis in the trophy case...drifts off into dreamworld where Pats have won 6 of the last 11 superbowls... alas.

The rest I could give a shit about.

#81 DanoooME

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:07 PM

Charlie Whitehurst?


Seahawks fan here, he's got to be the worst QB the team has ever had. And that covers a TON of ground (McGwire, Stouffer, Mirer, Friesz, Huard, Foley, Gelbaugh)

#82 Ralphwiggum

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:07 PM

On the Pollard thing, I know this is a thread for irrational hate and all, but please, the 2009 Pats were not winning the Super Bowl whether or not Welker's knee got shredded in that last regular season game. It was obviously in the BB "A Football Life" that Belichick knew they were not nearly good enough that year. Welker's injury did not help, but they could not win on the road in the regular season, they were not going to be winning back to back road playoff games even if they did not get smoked by the Ravens in that playoff game.

#83 Smiling Joe Hesketh


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:23 PM

This is only kind of racist.


Good enough for me. He's gone.

#84 DourDoerr

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:35 PM

Don Shula and Bill Polian. Can't compete? Change the rules to favor your team via Rules/Competition Committee.

Shula in particular is a piece of work. High and mighty over Spygate, yet he was in a tampering case over his move to Fins. Always thought of those 80's Fin teams as dominant with all those AFC east titles - am ecstatic that the record of the Patriots' last 10 years (and counting) TOWERS over those teams.

#85 lostjumper

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:49 PM

On the Pollard thing, I know this is a thread for irrational hate and all, but please, the 2009 Pats were not winning the Super Bowl whether or not Welker's knee got shredded in that last regular season game. It was obviously in the BB "A Football Life" that Belichick knew they were not nearly good enough that year. Welker's injury did not help, but they could not win on the road in the regular season, they were not going to be winning back to back road playoff games even if they did not get smoked by the Ravens in that playoff game.


Umm, are you forgetting how he shredded Brady's Knee and wrenched Gronk's ankle? That's why we don't like him. He actively tries to injure players.

Edited by lostjumper, 07 December 2012 - 01:49 PM.


#86 EP Sox Fan

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:56 PM

Eli Manning - Lucky asshole now considered elite QB (for which he can thank Giants defensive line)
Phillip Rivers - Somehow this guy is considered to be a top 6-7 QB and borderline elite despite the fact that he's never won anything and is douche. Seriously, his MNF performance against the Broncos was one of the singleworst choke jobs I've ever seen by a QB. Yet somehow still talked about as being a top QB.
Wes Welker - Admittedly because he killed UT when he was at Tech. For reasons why I just can't explain adequately, I've always wanted him to get destroyed on a crossing route. Yet the little bastard always manages to avoid the damage.
Vick - overrated dog killer whose limitations as a QB were conveniently overlooked by the media due to PR hype machine.
Ray Lewis - somehow his whole accused of being involved in a murder thing never seems to get mentioned
DeSean Jackson - Overrated WR diva
Brandon Jacobs - Big mouth, mediocre player.
TO - Encapsulates everything I hate about the modern pro athlete. George Teague has a special place in my heart for chasing him down and smacking him when TO celebrated a TD catch on the midfield star at Texas Stadium. Even when he played for my team I wanted him to die in a fire.

While not a player - JERRY JONES. Holy shit what an asshole. As a Cowboys fan, I know that this franchise will be doomed to mediocrity so long as he's the GM...which he will continue to be so long as he owns the team....so until he dies. Now I know how Raiders fans felt. No one in the league thinks they know more about football while knowing shit. Can't evaluate talent. Enables asshole players. Enabled bandwagon fans but bulding obscene tribute to his own ego at enormous cost then pricing out real fans causing stadium to be filled with bandwagon fans more concerned about being seen at the game and fans from opposing teams.

I'm really not bitter. At all.

#87 Smiling Joe Hesketh


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 01:59 PM

Umm, are you forgetting how he shredded Brady's Knee and wrenched Gronk's ankle? That's why we don't like him. He actively tries to injure players.


Neither of those plays was a deliberate attempt to injure.

#88 Reverend


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 02:05 PM

Neither of those plays was a deliberate attempt to injure.


Duuuuuude... Am I hearing this right? Does Smiling Fucking Joe Hesketh want to introduce intentional harm and rationality as a criteria for hating a player?

Posted Image

#89 Ralphwiggum

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 02:10 PM

Umm, are you forgetting how he shredded Brady's Knee and wrenched Gronk's ankle? That's why we don't like him. He actively tries to injure players.


Not at all, hate away (although on Gronk's ankle he was just making a tackle). I was reacting to the post above which said that we could "easily" have three more Lombardis if not for Pollard. Maybe you could make the case for two (although Brady got hurt in the first quarter of the first game of the season, hard to assume anything at that point) but definitely not three.

Like I said, I know this is an irrational hate thread, and although I don't really hate Pollard (after hearing him interviewed several times I actually think he comes across as a very smart and thoughtful player and I don't consider his overall play to be dirty) I totally understand why a Patriot fan would hate the guy. But there is no need to overstate the case. He did not cost the Pats 3 Lombardis. There is no way they were winning in 2009, they were a 10 win team that got blown off their home field in the Wild Card round.

Edited by Ralphwiggum, 07 December 2012 - 02:10 PM.


#90 Smiling Joe Hesketh


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 02:15 PM

Duuuuuude... Am I hearing this right? Does Smiling Fucking Joe Hesketh want to introduce intentional harm and rationality as a criteria for hating a player?

Posted Image


I try to differentiate just a little bit from shit happens, ya know?

#91 FelixMantilla


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 02:24 PM

People forget about his running mate in the Raiders defensive backfield, George Atkinson. He's portrayed as a lovable old guy around here now, but he was almost as much of a headhunter as Tatum.

I was at Schaeffer Stadium in the early 70's when the Raiders came into town. Before the game while the Raiders were warming up in front of us, some leather-lung yelled out, "Hey Atkinson, you're a cheap-shot artist." Atkinson turned around the flipped the double bird for about ten seconds.

What an asshole.

#92 Super Nomario

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 02:47 PM

Neither of those plays was a deliberate attempt to injure.

On one hand, this is a fair point, but on the other hand fuck Bernard Pollard

#93 soxfan121


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Posted 07 December 2012 - 03:12 PM

On one hand, this is a fair point, but on the other hand fuck Bernard Pollard


I reserve my hate for Sammy Morris, Lil' Wayne & Kevin Faulk (in that order) for that play.

#94 jablo1312

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 04:08 PM

Mercury Morris

#95 abty

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 07:23 PM

Michael Vick (He's so talented, can strangle 4 dogs with his left hand and then throw them 74 yards)

RG3 (Great guy, respect him, he will take the division from us. Fuck him)

Tony Romo (Aids this is Tony. Tony, this is Aids. Please, go introduce yourselves)

Desean Jackson

Miles Austin

Dez Bryant

Get these assholes out of my division. And, honorary mention (no offense)

Vince Wilflop (he sure will)

#96 MoGator71

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 11:34 PM

As a Giants fan I'm surprised you even give enough of a shit about Tony Romo to hate him...it's like me hating Chad Henne or Chad Pennington.

#97 quint


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Posted 08 December 2012 - 12:54 AM

Outstanding level of discussion here, chums. Let's do favorite color schemes next. Or worst 90's draft caps.

#98 drleather2001


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Posted 08 December 2012 - 01:41 AM

Granted, it's not really Peyton's fault but rather a function of him having been at the top of the marketing pyramid. But I used to get sorta annoyed by the depiction because, although I think Peyton has grown up a great deal, I always found him to be a smarmy spoiled kid who had to settle a case out of college who was epitomized by the "I'm trying to be a good team mate here" comment.


Back in, I think, 1998 (i.e. long before Brady hit the scene), Peyton was still at Tennessee, and ESPN was already playing him up to be the next Big Thing. I distinctly recall watching ESPN at one point, and they showed Peyton on one of their highlight reels, jumping up after a TD, running over to the sideline, and conducting the Tennessee marching band for, I dunno, 30 seconds.

For whatever reason, that little anecdote has always made me hate him. I don't give a shit about marching bands per se, but it was such an entitled gesture, like "I own this entire fucking school, and I am your master, watch me!", that has been borne out again and again, between begging for the calls, and the post game comments, and the "It's anyone's fault but mine" body language after an INT that I will never like the guy.

Edited by drleather2001, 08 December 2012 - 01:42 AM.


#99 slowstrung

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Posted 08 December 2012 - 09:02 AM

Brandon Meriweather is about the only guy I can think of that was a least favorite in the NFL while he was still on the Pats, so that's something. Though in mitigation, to this day I still enjoy watching footage of that FIU-Miami brawl.

#100 54thMA

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Posted 08 December 2012 - 10:39 AM

Has anyone mentioned Jack Tatum? I hate him not so much for the hit but rather how he handled it.

And while we're talking about Raiders, Phil Vilipiano gets a nod for all the crap he got away with in the game for which the Snow Bowl was sweet redemption.


Tatum was the ultimate headhunter, that hit on Stingley was the cheapest of cheap shots. Remember his hit on Sammy White in the Super Bowl in 1977, almost took his head off, Sammy held onto the ball, he was calling for his mother on the ground according to Tatum.

Vilipiano; he punched Russ Francis in the face through his facemask, breaking his nose in the process, no penalty called and was holding all day long as well.

The shit the Raiders got away with in that game was unreal, the Patriots got jobbed out of a trip to the Super Bowl that year as a result; they would have had to travel to Pittsburg for the AFCCG, but the Steelers were a crippled team at that point as the Raiders found out in the AFCCG.




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