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#1 Corsi


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Posted 22 October 2012 - 04:13 PM

Olney:

If Torey Lovullo goes to the Red Sox, it'll very likely be as the bench coach.

https://twitter.com/...488267286343680

Edited by Corsi, 22 October 2012 - 04:15 PM.


#2 jacklamabe65


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Posted 22 October 2012 - 05:18 PM

Speculation is that Rick Peterson will be named as pitching coach as he served as John Farrell's pitching coach when he was a player. Farrell has always spoken very highly of him.

#3 Laser Show

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 05:26 PM

Speculation is that Rick Peterson will be named as pitching coach as he served as John Farrell's pitching coach when he was a player. Farrell has always spoken very highly of him.


Really? It was my understanding that he was the Orioles director of pitching. Where are you hearing that?

#4 Rough Carrigan


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Posted 22 October 2012 - 06:02 PM

On the basis of what little I know I'd like to see Rick Peterson brought aboard as the pitching coach. He was way ahead of his time in having filmed analysis done of the A's pitchers in the early 2000's. But this and what little else I know about him makes him seem like a tinkerer.

I'd sort of classify pitching coaches into three groups. The goodoledunnitthiswaywhenIpitched pitching coaches, the tinkerers and the big picture guys. The goodoledunnitthiswaywhenIpitched guys are friends of the manager. The tinkerers are always wondering if maybe a pitcher's dropping his hands two low as he breaks them in his windup. Or maybe he should stop bringing his hands over his head in his motion and just bring them up to his chest to slightly change the tempo of his motion. Etc . . etc etc. Peterson getting the images taken of the A's guys was a sort of high tech version of what a tinkerer pitching coach does to see if a guy's motion has changed.

The big picture guys are the guys who do things like some of the stories I've heard about Leo Mazzone when he was with the Braves. They had picked up John Burkett and Mazzone had Burkett throw for him in the bullpen. Mazzone immediately told him his slider was shit and that he wouldn't throw it any more. He had a novel regimen for having pitchers throw much more often and also believed it was crucially important to be able to not effortlessly but with great certainty be able to pound a fastball strike over the outside corner. Now, maybe for all I know Mazzone was also constantly trying to make slight adjustments to guys' pitching motions but the few things I've heard were always big picture, qualitative sort of things.

My question is, I've heard of Peterson being a sort of tinkerer. Does anybody know of him also being a sort of big picture guy?

Edited by Rough Carrigan, 22 October 2012 - 06:03 PM.


#5 Montana Fan


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Posted 22 October 2012 - 06:40 PM

Rough, which type do you think Farrell was? I would have said a combo of tinkerer and big picture.

#6 TheoShmeo


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Posted 22 October 2012 - 06:47 PM

Really? It was my understanding that he was the Orioles director of pitching. Where are you hearing that?

This was on ESPN.com/Boston today:

The identity of Farrell’s coaches is not yet known, although an industry source said that Farrell is planning to bring Torey Lovullo as his bench coach. One potential candidate for pitching coach is Rick Peterson, who was once Farrell’s pitching coach in the minor leagues and this year served as the Orioles’ pitching coordinator. The two are believed to have had at least indirect contact, according to a baseball source.


http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/red-sox

#7 Rough Carrigan


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Posted 22 October 2012 - 06:59 PM

Rough, which type do you think Farrell was? I would have said a combo of tinkerer and big picture.

Don't know. I guess I thought he was more of a tinkerer. One thing I remember was about him having worked with Wakefield for Wake to have a series of specific checkpoints within the course of his windup to try to keep track of to make sure he released his knuckler just right. Though sort of on the other side of it, he helped get Okajima to develop his famous "Oki-doke".

Maybe most good pitching coaches are some of both. I'm just very curious about Peterson because I know of some things with the A's and of him supposedly saying that he could fix Victor Zambrano of the Devil Rays' motion in five or ten minutes or something like that and all of it is very heavily on the tinkerer side of things. But he's depicted as being a very smart and free thinking guy so I wonder what his focus has been on the big picture side of coaching.

#8 SoxLegacy

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 07:28 PM

In regards to Peterson, according to their website, here is what he did for the Orioles:"Peterson will oversee the organization’s pitching development program. Peterson has 12 years of experience as a major league pitching coach, most recently with the Milwaukee Brewers in 2010. He was also the pitching coach for the Oakland A’s (1998-2003) and New York Mets (2004-08), guiding staffs which finished in the top three in the American League in ERA every season from 1999-2003, including league-leading ERAs in 2002 and 2003. In addition to his on-field experience, Peterson is co-founder of a company that offers biomechanical analysis and developmental programs for pitchers that improve efficiency and minimize the risk of injury."

Not sure how much he had to do with the day to day stuff regarding the Orioles pitching staff, but given the pedestrian nature of that staff and the performances they turned in this year, they seem to be doing something right. Is it connected to Peterson? Not sure if you can tell.

#9 Green Monster

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Posted 22 October 2012 - 08:35 PM

So is Peterson still under contract with the Orioles, or would the Sox have to offer compensation??

#10 OttoC


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Posted 22 October 2012 - 09:07 PM

So is Peterson still under contract with the Orioles, or would the Sox have to offer compensation??


If Peterson was hired by the Orioles in January 2012 (Wikipedia), I suspect that he still is under contract. Is it imperative to sign a pitching coach immediately or xan they wait until his contract is up (assuming a one-year deal)?

#11 Infield Infidel


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Posted 22 October 2012 - 09:21 PM

I don't think it would require compensation because pitching coach is ostensibly a different position from director of pitching development or whatever his position with the Orioles is called

#12 Montana Fan


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Posted 22 October 2012 - 10:40 PM

I'm sure Duquette will play nice.

#13 adam42381

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 04:42 AM

Leo Mazzone is available, right?

#14 someoneanywhere

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Posted 23 October 2012 - 06:24 AM

So is Peterson still under contract with the Orioles, or would the Sox have to offer compensation??


On-field major-league jobs are generally -- as it would be here -- promotions. No compensation necessary.

#15 mabrowndog


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Posted 23 October 2012 - 12:23 PM

Gammons on NESN:

* "Fairly obvious" Torey Lovullo is coming back here.
* While Brad Ausmus would certainly have moved here for a manager's job, not sure if he'd leave his full-time home in California for a bench coach role despite having a summer home on the Cape and his mother still in Brookline.

#16 mabrowndog


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Posted 23 October 2012 - 12:42 PM

Alex Speier @alexspeier
Source: Lovullo to become Sox bench coach; #redsox give permission to 2012 coaching staff to pursue other jobs

Alex Speier @alexspeier
That said, Farrell will talk w/members of '12 staff (aside from Magadan, who's left for #rangers) about roles for '13

Edited by mabrowndog, 23 October 2012 - 12:45 PM.


#17 mabrowndog


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Posted 23 October 2012 - 01:10 PM

Scott Lauber @ScottLauber
Source: "Less than 50-50" that Rick Peterson is #RedSox' next pitching coach

Scott Lauber @ScottLauber
Multiple sources: Torey Lovullo has been identified as possible coach. Brian Butterfield less likely. Chili Davis highly unlikely #RedSox

Edited by mabrowndog, 23 October 2012 - 01:11 PM.


#18 Corsi


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Posted 23 October 2012 - 02:23 PM

Source confirms Torey Lovullo will be #RedSox bench coach.

https://twitter.com/ScottLauber/status/260823602537058304
link to tweet

#19 Corsi


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Posted 26 October 2012 - 10:12 AM

RedSox officially name Torey Lovullo as John Farrell's bench coach.

https://twitter.com/ScottMCBS/status/261838421922836480
link to tweet

#20 DLew On Roids


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Posted 26 October 2012 - 02:30 PM

Sparky Anderson says that Torey Lovullo is the greatest bench coach prospect he's seen since Joe Maddon.

#21 David Laurila


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Posted 26 October 2012 - 04:06 PM

Not sure I've heard Gary Tuck's name come up as a candidate for pitching coach. The bullpen coach is essentially the assistant pitching coach and it's not uncommon for that promotion to occur. Jeff Jones in Detroit is a recent example.

#22 JimBoSox9


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Posted 26 October 2012 - 05:14 PM

Not sure I've heard Gary Tuck's name come up as a candidate for pitching coach. The bullpen coach is essentially the assistant pitching coach and it's not uncommon for that promotion to occur. Jeff Jones in Detroit is a recent example.


Tuck has a reputation for being a wizard of coaching catcher defense, IIRC, so they may not want to move him to a spot that leaves him more hyperfocused on pitching.

#23 RedOctober3829


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Posted 26 October 2012 - 07:20 PM

Sox to ask permission from the Orioles to interview Rick Peterson for pitching coach.
https://twitter.com/nickcafardo/status/261985145886748672
link to tweet

Cafardo

And magically 10 mins later its granted.

https://twitter.com/nickcafardo/status/261987482294444032
link to tweet

Edited by RedOctober3829, 26 October 2012 - 07:29 PM.


#24 reggiecleveland


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Posted 27 October 2012 - 08:48 PM

Sparky Anderson says that Torey Lovullo is the greatest bench coach prospect he's seen since Joe Maddon.


This deserves some love. I remember when Sparky retired one of the Detroit stations had a tribute/roast and ran a clip of of Sparky's absolutes. There was full minute each or "worst call ever" "best pitched game ever" "best guy I ever managed" The best were the clips of "Lou Whitaker is the best 2b I ever coached, Lance Parish is the best Catcher, Kirk Gibson is the biggest hustler" with shots of Joe Morgan, Johnny Bench and Pete Rose. Sparky said it was "The best video: he had ever seen.

#25 Red(s)HawksFan


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 11:04 AM

ESPNJoeyMac:

Per Red Sox: Club has named Brian Butterfield as the 3rd base coach.



#26 Rough Carrigan


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 11:27 AM

ESPNJoeyMac:

Wow! That's great. Seriously. Butterfield's rep in the game in sky high. This speaks very well for Farrell.

#27 bosockboy


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 11:30 AM

Very high quality hire.....fantastic news. If we can hire Peterson we are really cooking. Curious to see who's being looked at for hitting coach.

#28 StuckOnYouk

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 11:33 AM

If we can get Peterson and retain Tuck those will be two really nice moves, without even getting into the hitting coach.

#29 Green Monster

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 12:17 PM

Very quiet with respect to Hitting coach candidates. I'm gonna throw Mike Lowell's name out as idle speculation. His name was oddly mentioned as a managerial candidate (which he quickly dismissed). Hitting coach might be more to his liking. Reputation as a player who was able to unite a clubhouse....overlapped with Farrells time in Boston so there maybe some familiarity.......down side is no professional experience as a hitting coach that I am aware of.............Thoughts?

#30 SoxLegacy

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 12:21 PM

That's great news about Butterfield!

#31 Rasputin


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 12:24 PM

Can anyone point me to any articles anywhere that indicate I should be excited about Butterfield?

#32 Rough Carrigan


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 01:35 PM

Can anyone point me to any articles anywhere that indicate I should be excited about Butterfield?

Our own Dave Laurila had this interview with him at BP:
http://www.baseballp...?articleid=9753

And, fwiw, Gammons has frequently praised Butterfield for his rep as a great teacher.

Edited by Rough Carrigan, 30 October 2012 - 01:39 PM.


#33 John Marzano Olympic Hero


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 01:36 PM

This deserves some love. I remember when Sparky retired one of the Detroit stations had a tribute/roast and ran a clip of of Sparky's absolutes. There was full minute each or "worst call ever" "best pitched game ever" "best guy I ever managed" The best were the clips of "Lou Whitaker is the best 2b I ever coached, Lance Parish is the best Catcher, Kirk Gibson is the biggest hustler" with shots of Joe Morgan, Johnny Bench and Pete Rose. Sparky said it was "The best video: he had ever seen.


I think that he also said Barbaro Garbey was going to make everyone forget about Mickey Mantle. So while I appreciate Sparky Anderson's baseball accumen, his opinions aren't always grounded in reality.

#34 Rudy Pemberton


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 02:13 PM

He also died before Lovullo was a bench coach, too.

#35 TheoShmeo


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 02:38 PM

Very quiet with respect to Hitting coach candidates. I'm gonna throw Mike Lowell's name out as idle speculation. His name was oddly mentioned as a managerial candidate (which he quickly dismissed). Hitting coach might be more to his liking. Reputation as a player who was able to unite a clubhouse....overlapped with Farrells time in Boston so there maybe some familiarity.......down side is no professional experience as a hitting coach that I am aware of.............Thoughts?

Lowell seems very unlikely to me. My guess is that he passed over the manager gig because he wasn't ready to commit to the demands of a 162-game plus grind. I also think that he's the kind of guy who will be able to go straight into the manager's chair. Now it's true that being the manager is much more taxing than being a coach, but I still think that Lowell is going to go straight to the bigger job when he's ready to leave the beach.

Unrelated: On pitching coach, as much as I'd like to see them hire Rick Peterson given the success he's enjoyed and the fact that he seems to be an innovator, I have some trouble believing that Farrell will go with someone who will be more than just an extension of him. I hope I'm wrong and that he's secure enough to go with something of a marverick. I think we're going to get an interesting vista into Farrell on this one.

Edited by TheoShmeo, 30 October 2012 - 02:41 PM.


#36 John Marzano Olympic Hero


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 02:57 PM

He also died before Lovullo was a bench coach, too.


Seriously? Holy cow!

#37 Noah

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 03:02 PM

Seriously? Holy cow!


Am I missing something here? Lovullo has never been a bench coach, right?

#38 Rasputin


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 03:59 PM

Our own Dave Laurila had this interview with him at BP:
http://www.baseballp...?articleid=9753

And, fwiw, Gammons has frequently praised Butterfield for his rep as a great teacher.


Thanks, good stuff. I'm not entirely sure I like the idea of someone who says Jeter is an above average fielder being our infield guy but if we assume he's being polite there, I'm good.

#39 Rough Carrigan


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 04:16 PM

One can also infer from Butterfield following him to Boston that whatever bug was up Omar Vizquel's ass about how Farrell handled things it couldn't have been too justified. Why would Butterfield follow Farrell if he couldn't run a team/

#40 TheoShmeo


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 04:38 PM

One can also infer from Butterfield following him to Boston that whatever bug was up Omar Vizquel's ass about how Farrell handled things it couldn't have been too justified. Why would Butterfield follow Farrell if he couldn't run a team/

Or maybe Butterfield was part of the problem.

I'm not saying that he was...I just don't look at Butterfield coming to Boston as a complete answer to Vizquel/Steve Simmons.

#41 mabrowndog


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 04:38 PM

Glad the Sox proved me wrong. I didn't think Butterfield would leave Toronto, as he'd been coaching there for a decade in various roles and under several administrations. I also thought he'd be a leading candidate to manage the Jays. Guess not.

Fantastic move bringing him aboard.

#42 JimBoSox9


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 07:02 PM

Thanks, good stuff. I'm not entirely sure I like the idea of someone who says Jeter is an above average fielder being our infield guy but if we assume he's being polite there, I'm good.


A theme in that conversation that jumped out at me is that he doesn't seem to care about athleticism when he evaluates a fielder. His comments about Scutaro echo the common refrain about Jeter - great hands, great footwork, ignoring that he just flat doesn't get to as many balls as other shortstops. I think when he's talking about a good/bad fielder, he's thinking entirely about mechanics and not at all about natural range. Probably not the attitude you want in a manager, but pretty on point for a teaching role.

#43 Rough Carrigan


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 07:31 PM

A theme in that conversation that jumped out at me is that he doesn't seem to care about athleticism when he evaluates a fielder. His comments about Scutaro echo the common refrain about Jeter - great hands, great footwork, ignoring that he just flat doesn't get to as many balls as other shortstops. I think when he's talking about a good/bad fielder, he's thinking entirely about mechanics and not at all about natural range. Probably not the attitude you want in a manager, but pretty on point for a teaching role.

I think he's perfect for Middlebrooks. He must've made a half dozen bad throws this year where he had the ball early enough but just never tried to square up his feet. I wouldn't call it laziness. it was more being too casual about technique. I expect Butterfield to drive home the importance of squaring up and then pointing that left foot at the first baseman as he throws. There will be fewer throwing errors.

Edited by Rough Carrigan, 30 October 2012 - 07:31 PM.


#44 BannedbyNYYFans.com

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 07:51 PM

Butterfield. Bad news, looks like Peyton's father. Good news, loves Gronk and the Pats.

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#45 pjr

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 08:50 PM

From Alex Speier's column tonight.

According to a major league source, the Red Sox will interview White Sox bullpen coach Juan Nieves for the vacant role of pitching coach. Nieves joins Orioles director of pitching development Rick Peterson as the first two known candidates for the position; the Sox expect to interview at least one to two additional candidates for the job.
http://www.weei.com/...-pitching-coach

#46 Sprowl


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 09:37 PM

That both Lovullo and Butterfield are following Farrell to Boston, whether returning or for the first time, speaks well for Farrell's leadership capacities. It has the additional advantage of putting knowledge of Toronto players' talents and quirks in the Red Sox dugout. I hope for some mind games a la Belichick-Bledsoe.

#47 Rasputin


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 09:38 PM

A theme in that conversation that jumped out at me is that he doesn't seem to care about athleticism when he evaluates a fielder. His comments about Scutaro echo the common refrain about Jeter - great hands, great footwork, ignoring that he just flat doesn't get to as many balls as other shortstops. I think when he's talking about a good/bad fielder, he's thinking entirely about mechanics and not at all about natural range. Probably not the attitude you want in a manager, but pretty on point for a teaching role.


This is an excellent point, one I had not considered, and one that puts the whole thing in a much better light.

#48 TheoShmeo


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Posted 30 October 2012 - 10:19 PM

That both Lovullo and Butterfield are following Farrell to Boston, whether returning or for the first time, speaks well for Farrell's leadership capacities. It has the additional advantage of putting knowledge of Toronto players' talents and quirks in the Red Sox dugout. I hope for some mind games a la Belichick-Bledsoe.

Perhaps.

But there are other potential explanations/factors that could be at play.

As was the case for Farrell, it's not hard to believe that moving from Toronto to Boston, and all that comes with it, would be pretty big independent draw.

And in Lovullo's case, the chance to move from 1B to bench coach for someone who apparently regards himself as a future manager is another one, as is the fact that he has ties to the Sox organization.

Butterfield is moving laterally so that type of argument isn't there. But as respected as he is, it's at least possible that the new manager in Toronto would want to install his own man at 3B. At minimum, Butterfield locked up a certain job when he accepted Farrell's offer. And now he gets to watch the Gronk every Sunday....

Edited by TheoShmeo, 30 October 2012 - 10:24 PM.


#49 Otis Foster


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Posted 31 October 2012 - 10:50 AM

Can anyone point me to any articles anywhere that indicate I should be excited about Butterfield?


There's an article at http://www.sportsnet...move_to_boston/. The articlepraises his teaching and also conjectures that Butterfield has an out in his deal if he's offered the Jay's managerial position.

Does that strike you as realistic? Why would the RS risk having to go back to square 1 if he gets the offer?

#50 EddieYost


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Posted 31 October 2012 - 11:03 AM

There's an article at http://www.sportsnet...move_to_boston/. The articlepraises his teaching and also conjectures that Butterfield has an out in his deal if he's offered the Jay's managerial position.

Does that strike you as realistic? Why would the RS risk having to go back to square 1 if he gets the offer?


Because he is the guy they wanted and they feel that its unlikely he will get the Blue Jays manager job?




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