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Patriots at Bills


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#1 jsinger121


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Posted 25 September 2012 - 07:53 AM

Pretty much a must win in my view if they eventually want a bye come playoff time. I will be making the trek up to Orchard Park for the game. Any other SOSHer's heading up to the game?

#2 dcmissle


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Posted 25 September 2012 - 08:16 AM

Pretty much a must win in my view if they eventually want a bye come playoff time. I will be making the trek up to Orchard Park for the game. Any other SOSHer's heading up to the game?


Pretty much. Don't want to hear "easy schedule" in response.

As usual, what seemed easy months ago -- e.g., Arizona -- is clearly not so easy in retrospect, and this annual problem is exacerbated this year by the replacement refs. Nobody knows how long this impasse will last; given the mindset of NFL owners, there is little reason to be optimistic. Meanwhile, my sense is that the Pats are disadvantaged relatively speaking, not because replacement refs have it in for them but because the Pats coaches are not gaming this situation like others and continue to instruct our players to play the game the right way.

#3 Rasputin


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Posted 25 September 2012 - 09:16 AM

Patriots 75
Bills 3
Referees 59

#4 CaptainLaddie


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Posted 25 September 2012 - 09:17 AM

No Spiller or FJax will helpa lot.

#5 jsinger121


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Posted 25 September 2012 - 09:19 AM

Fred Jackson is practicing this week and says he will 70-75% sure he will play. I don't see him being very effective if he does.

#6 Alternate34

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 09:26 AM

Pretty much a must win in my view if they eventually want a bye come playoff time. I will be making the trek up to Orchard Park for the game. Any other SOSHer's heading up to the game?


I'll be at the game. Brief tailgating spurt starting around 10:00 AM I guess, and then get in the stadium early because I got club seats for my Dad's birthday. If you want information about the Bills, check out this thread:

http://sonsofsamhorn...-buffalo-bills/

Quick preview of the Bills:

(1) C.J. Spiller will almost definitely NOT play which is a big break for the Pats.

(2) Fred Jackson may play which mitigates this a little.

(3) The D-Line does a good job protecting against the run while maintaining some form of a pass rush, though the pass rush seemingly should be better.

(4) The rest of the defense has been spotty. The LBs are pretty bad in pass coverage. The CBs are young and play like it. Terrance McGee is sometimes brought in to spell Aaron Williams at the CB2 spot. When a 35 year old midget needs to step in for a second year CB, well, that's not good. The safeties have been surprisingly inconsistent. Last year George Wilson and Jairus Byrd were solid if unspectacular. This year, their instincts are off. Late breaks to balls, failure to cover their deep half of the field adequately, things like that. They do a good job in run support.

(5) The offense, when it works, is run first. Fitzpatrick is still inaccurate and will miss his targets by a yard or so fairly frequently. However, if he is accurate, he is dangerous because he does a good job sniffing out single coverage and an excellent job getting the ball out before getting sacked. The Bills O-Line generally does not have to hold up very long because the ball is out quick.

Stevie Johnson is the most dangerous receiver on the team. He is not fast, but he is crafty. Watching him before the ball is thrown is fun. He has a lot of sneaky tricks. All that said, he is solid, though not fantastic. The rest of the receivers are bleh. Their #2 Donald Jones is a second year UFA from division 1AA. He has some speed but not enough to be a deep threat. He can take a hit though. T.J. Graham caught his first TD last game and is seeing more of the field. He isn't good yet, but he may get there. Scott Chandler is their top TE. A receiver first, he still is a better blocker than their WR, so that is something. He isn't beating guys in coverage, but the scheme gets him some open looks. You'll see other WRs from time to time. Their roster fodder to make up for the David Nelson injury.

The O-Line is bigger than many in the NFL, another reason why this team runs better than it passes. Cordy Glenn is a beast from the LT run blocking, both huge and surprisingly mobile, and holds up long enough for the short passing game. He looks pretty good for a 2d rounder. LG LeVitre is good. He is not small, but small for this team. However, he is technically sound and agile and is fairly normal size for other O-Lines. C Eric Wood is a beast. RG Craig Urbik and RT Eric Pears are more big, tall guys who run block better than they pass block.

Not much else. The Pats should win, but as was shown last year, that isn't guaranteed. I think both teams improve their defenses from last year, so it's hard to see the two games from last year as blueprints for this year. The refs could always get influenced by the crowd, which is going to be as bloodthirsty as the Baltimore crowd and most likely drunker.

#7 jsinger121


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Posted 25 September 2012 - 11:37 AM


Jason La Canfora@JasonLaCanfora

Bills are releasing veteran stalwart P Brian Moorman. Surprise move. Have a feeling he might not be a free agent all that long



#8 Alternate34

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 03:45 PM


Fucking weird move. I have no idea why they would do this. The net average of 32 yards is a red herring considering it has only been 3 games.

#9 Turrable

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 04:42 PM



Hey upstate New York, Ontario, C.J. Spiller's left shoulder, the Sabres, Harvard, both sides of Niagra Falls, Ralph Wilson, Norwood, serial killers from Jodie Foster movies, and scab refs:

Fuck you.

#10 Marbleheader


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Posted 25 September 2012 - 06:45 PM

Wonder if the Buffalo hotels have something special planned for Brady.

#11 mjm3773

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 07:49 AM

Pretty much a must win in my view if they eventually want a bye come playoff time. I will be making the trek up to Orchard Park for the game. Any other SOSHer's heading up to the game?


I will be at the game. But then I live in Rochester, am a Bills fan, and have had front row season tickets for 17 years.

And of course due to a prior commitment, I had to miss the Pats game last year and the the end of The Streak 2.0.

#12 Alternate34

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 08:08 AM

http://musketfire.co...injury-updates/

Article about both the injuries to Spiller and Jackson. The author speculates that if Jackson is able to play Spiller will most likely not be made active but without Fred, it is a little more likely that C.J. could play, though this article does not seem the best source.

#13 Salva135


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Posted 26 September 2012 - 09:48 AM

Pretty much. Don't want to hear "easy schedule" in response.

As usual, what seemed easy months ago -- e.g., Arizona -- is clearly not so easy in retrospect, and this annual problem is exacerbated this year by the replacement refs. Nobody knows how long this impasse will last; given the mindset of NFL owners, there is little reason to be optimistic. Meanwhile, my sense is that the Pats are disadvantaged relatively speaking, not because replacement refs have it in for them but because the Pats coaches are not gaming this situation like others and continue to instruct our players to play the game the right way.


That's a pretty interesting take. What are you basing this on? Are DBs not trying to get away without enough illegal contact downfield? If there were even a minor edge to be exploited in this current situation, Belichick is the one guy we would all assume would take the most advantage. It's basically the mantra of this organization.

Edited by Salva135, 26 September 2012 - 09:50 AM.


#14 dcmissle


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Posted 26 September 2012 - 01:06 PM

That's a pretty interesting take. What are you basing this on? Are DBs not trying to get away without enough illegal contact downfield? If there were even a minor edge to be exploited in this current situation, Belichick is the one guy we would all assume would take the most advantage. It's basically the mantra of this organization.


Except maybe BB has too much respect for the game (what we've been seeing is not football) or, less altruistically, does not want to inculcate bad habits in two units -- the o-line and the d-backfield -- that can ill afford them.

Ed Reed is Exhibit A in how other teams are tweaking their games. He's a clean player, always has been. That end zone blast is very uncharacteristic of him, but he sensed he could get away with it.

Exhibit B would be Rams/Redskins in week 2. Jeff Fisher is always an edgy punk, IMO, but the Rams took it to another level vs RGIII.

#15 Salva135


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Posted 26 September 2012 - 05:32 PM

Except maybe BB has too much respect for the game (what we've been seeing is not football) or, less altruistically, does not want to inculcate bad habits in two units -- the o-line and the d-backfield -- that can ill afford them.

Ed Reed is Exhibit A in how other teams are tweaking their games. He's a clean player, always has been. That end zone blast is very uncharacteristic of him, but he sensed he could get away with it.

Exhibit B would be Rams/Redskins in week 2. Jeff Fisher is always an edgy punk, IMO, but the Rams took it to another level vs RGIII.



Belichick having too much respect for the game is complete crap. If there's an edge to be gained on the football field, he's taking it. Fisher has always been a bit dirty, and a single play by Ed Reed is evidence of nothing.

The increased variance of games due to bad officiating only hurts good teams like the Pats, but the idea that Belichick is not "gaming the system" as well as other coaches, to his own detriment, is laughable.

Edited by Salva135, 26 September 2012 - 05:37 PM.


#16 Alternate34

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 07:59 PM

Except maybe BB has too much respect for the game (what we've been seeing is not football) or, less altruistically, does not want to inculcate bad habits in two units -- the o-line and the d-backfield -- that can ill afford them.

Ed Reed is Exhibit A in how other teams are tweaking their games. He's a clean player, always has been. That end zone blast is very uncharacteristic of him, but he sensed he could get away with it.

Exhibit B would be Rams/Redskins in week 2. Jeff Fisher is always an edgy punk, IMO, but the Rams took it to another level vs RGIII.


This is silly. BB has always coached his players to push the envelope. Giants-Bills Super Bowl, he had his players "accidentally" kick the ball so it would take longer to spot. He coached LT who was constantly playing on the edge. Rodney Harrison is one of his favorite players and he was dirty as shit.

Ed Reed may be a clean player, but as with any good safety, he has taken head shots before.

Additionally, I don't think there is a consistent way to take advantage of the refs because they have been so inconsistent from week to week and from game to game. There is little merit to this argument.

#17 Jed Zeppelin


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Posted 26 September 2012 - 09:36 PM

This is silly. BB has always coached his players to push the envelope. Giants-Bills Super Bowl, he had his players "accidentally" kick the ball so it would take longer to spot. He coached LT who was constantly playing on the edge. Rodney Harrison is one of his favorite players and he was dirty as shit.

Ed Reed may be a clean player, but as with any good safety, he has taken head shots before.

Additionally, I don't think there is a consistent way to take advantage of the refs because they have been so inconsistent from week to week and from game to game. There is little merit to this argument.


Hell, from play to play.

#18 Pxer

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 10:58 PM

Heading to the game. What can I expect as a Patriots fan? Pretty rowdy atmosphere both inside and out? What's the parking situation like?

#19 Alternate34

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 11:27 PM

Heading to the game. What can I expect as a Patriots fan? Pretty rowdy atmosphere both inside and out? What's the parking situation like?


I have shown up in full regalia the last couple of years and my buddies have come with me decked out as well. You will get boos, you suck chants, and the like outside the stadium (I always do this to Dolphins and Jets fans when I go to those games), but I doubt there will be any physical trouble unless you are really looking for some. It is generally more light-hearted. If you go tailgating, you won't find trouble in the stadium lots in genera. The biggest private lot is at Erie Community College. Tailgating there is a cinch and is not far away from the stadium. There are other private lots that have more intense tailgating, hard alcohol, beer bongs, weed. I doubt you'll tailgate there anyway, but that is the only place I could think of worrying about open Pats fandom, though again, I haven't had any trouble. Obviously, fights sometimes occur, but I haven't seen one outside the stadium. There was one incident where a Pats fan was in a Port-a-Potty and Bills fans tipped it over. Ultimately, if you use your head, you shouldn't have a problem. If the person taunting you is smiling and good natured, they can take some ribbing back. If they are clearly blasted, then just walk on by.

Last year in the stadium, I had a guy taunting me and pat me on the face. My wife grabbed my arm so I wouldn't do anything and we texted security. They responded promptly and the guy was removed. Fights do break out, but then again, I suspect those are situations where it takes two to tango. The place will be loud so long as the Bills have a chance.

Parking and traffic is generally shitty. The stadium lots and Erie Community College lot don't open until 9:00 AM for tailgating (I am pretty sure) which means there is a clog starting around 8:30 AM. Aside from that, stadium lots cost $25 to park in , Erie Community College costs $20 to park in. There are plenty of private lots (people's lawns etc.) that charge less and less the further you are from the stadium, though there are lots closer than Erie Community College that charge less than the College because they don't have tailgating. As for where to park, that depends on where you are coming from and going. I travel from North of Buffalo (from Niagara Falls). I can PM you the route I take if that will help. In general, I-90 gets clogged a bit and once you get off, it gets worse. Getting out is pretty hellish. I can PM info, but a general strategy to get out is to make damn sure that the stadium parking lot exits are not between you and the way you want to go. Here is the parking lot map:

http://www.buffalobi...adium/maps.html

Last I checked, they put up a roadblock at the intersection of Big Tree Road (20A) and Abbott Road to prevent traffic heading east, so if you are going to take the 20A, then you need to park on the east side of that barrier. Gillette and Ralph Wilson Stadium are generally rated the worst for stadium traffic. Gillette is because there is so much limitation on how to get there. Ralph Wilson is because of the general chaos of the situation.

Edited by Alternate34, 26 September 2012 - 11:28 PM.


#20 Pxer

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 12:02 PM

Thanks for the info -- first non-home game. Should be a blast.

#21 jsinger121


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Posted 27 September 2012 - 12:57 PM

There's also a dirt lot on Southwestern Avenue that runs for 20 bucks. I think it opens prior to 9am. Also I thought you were a Bills fan Alternate?

#22 tims4wins


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Posted 27 September 2012 - 01:28 PM

Mankins not at practice again, fuck. If we have a McDonald-Wendell-Connolly interior that could be problematic. At least Buffalo's best pass rushers are edge rushers... right?

#23 jsinger121


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Posted 27 September 2012 - 01:30 PM

Mankins not at practice again, fuck. If we have a McDonald-Wendell-Connolly interior that could be problematic. At least Buffalo's best pass rushers are edge rushers... right?


I wouldn't be concerned at all. They are going in full pads today and probably want to give him some maintenance. There is zero chance he is going to miss Sunday's game.

#24 Ed Hillel


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Posted 27 September 2012 - 01:34 PM

Belichick having too much respect for the game is complete crap. If there's an edge to be gained on the football field, he's taking it. Fisher has always been a bit dirty, and a single play by Ed Reed is evidence of nothing.

The increased variance of games due to bad officiating only hurts good teams like the Pats, but the idea that Belichick is not "gaming the system" as well as other coaches, to his own detriment, is laughable.


Maybe he didn't want his players to get into habits that would have to be stopped on a dime.

#25 tims4wins


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Posted 27 September 2012 - 01:51 PM

I wouldn't be concerned at all. They are going in full pads today and probably want to give him some maintenance. There is zero chance he is going to miss Sunday's game.


Isn't BB's policy generally that if you don't practice at all, you aren't playing? If he doesn't practice tomorrow I think I'll be pretty concerned, since this is 2 days in a row.

#26 jsinger121


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Posted 27 September 2012 - 02:05 PM


Erik Scalavino@PFWErik

#Bills RB C.J. Spiller (shoulder) returned to practice today, per@gggaughan



#27 Ed Hillel


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Posted 27 September 2012 - 02:24 PM

As good as Spiller is, I kind of hope he's back. I'd rather they try and run a healthy Spiller, let alone a slowed one, to throwing every down.

#28 mjm3773

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 02:33 PM

Yes, Spiller practiced, but he was limited. I highly doubt that he will play on Sunday. And although Fred Jackson said that his knee was sore when he woke up this morning, Gailey said that he looked like he had fresh legs in practice today, so FJax is more likely to play.

As for if Mankins doesn't play, that may be a problem for the Pats. For as good as Mario Williams is, and he has been good so far this year despite ungawdy stats, the Bills best d-lineman has far and away been Kyle Williams, who would normally line up opposite Mankins.

#29 Jed Zeppelin


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Posted 27 September 2012 - 02:55 PM

TV map says I'm getting the CBS late game instead of the Pats. What the actual fuck? If I wanted to watch Jets/49ers I could just switch to Fox.

#30 Zenicity

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 02:57 PM

I'll be there! Rochester native Pats fan. Got great seats from a supplier for the company I work for. I'll be wearing my Gronk jersey proudly.

#31 RedOctober3829


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Posted 27 September 2012 - 04:26 PM

Referee: John Parry
Umpire: Dan Ferrell
Head linesman: Derick Bowers
Line judge: Rusty Baynes
Field judge: Scott Edwards
Side judge: Ron Torbert
Back judge: Perry Paganelli
Replay official: Earnie Frantz
Replay assistant: Brian Matoren


http://blogs.buffalo...t-patriots.html

Tim Graham

Guns Hoculi got assigned to Bengals-Jags.....

#32 Turrable

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 05:16 PM

Guns Hoculi got assigned to Bengals-Jags.....


This is a disgrace. Where's Mike Carey assigned?

Also, here's the map http://www.the506.com/temp11.html always a pleasant surprise when these 1pm Buffalo games are actually on.

Edited by Turrable, 27 September 2012 - 08:25 PM.


#33 BigSoxFan


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Posted 27 September 2012 - 06:53 PM

People in Waco, TX are getting hosed. Wash/Tampa over GB/Saints? Ouch.

#34 mjm3773

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 07:08 PM

People in Waco, TX are getting hosed. Wash/Tampa over GB/Saints? Ouch.


Waco is where Baylor is located. Thus RG III fans. They tend to do that a lot for recent college stars.

#35 BigSoxFan


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Posted 27 September 2012 - 07:24 PM

Waco is where Baylor is located. Thus RG III fans. They tend to do that a lot for recent college stars.


Ah, I didn't even think of the RGIII angle. Whoops, carry on...

#36 Alternate34

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Posted 27 September 2012 - 10:59 PM

There's also a dirt lot on Southwestern Avenue that runs for 20 bucks. I think it opens prior to 9am. Also I thought you were a Bills fan Alternate?


Nah, my wife is an insanely devout Bills fan. She devours all information about the Bills and I get it second hand. She wins beer bets against fans from other teams that show up at local bars. She challenges them to list their roster, a bet they can never win because she knows every Bills player on the roster. The only hope they have is if she gets practice squad players confused with roster players. When she was a kid, she wanted season tickets so when we ended up in Corning, NY, we got them. So basically all I know about the Bills is from talking to her and from watching them all the time, but I grew up on the South Shore.

#37 jsinger121


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Posted 28 September 2012 - 11:12 AM


Jeff Howe@jeffphowe

No Mankins, Hernandez, Edelman or Deaderick. Francis returns.



#38 jsinger121


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Posted 28 September 2012 - 11:19 AM


Greg A. Bedard@GregABedard

With Logan Mankins missing practice all week, it points to Donald Thomas starting at LG. That's his more natural position.



#39 jsinger121


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Posted 28 September 2012 - 11:28 AM


Buffalo Bills@buffalobills

RBs C.J. Spiller and Fred Jackson are listed as questionable for Sunday's game against the Patriots



#40 Super Nomario


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Posted 28 September 2012 - 11:38 AM

Guessing the inactives:
G Mankins
TE Hernandez
WR Edelman
DL Deaderick
DE Bequette
DE Francis

Conflicting reports about whether DL Forston is on the roster, but he's likely the 7th guy if he is.

#41 soxhop411


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Posted 28 September 2012 - 03:04 PM


Mike Reiss@MikeReiss

TE Rob Gronkowski a new addition to the injury report. He is listed as questionable with a hip injury.


#42 jsinger121


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Posted 28 September 2012 - 03:05 PM


Mike Reiss@MikeReiss

The Patriots rule WR Julian Edelman (hand) and TE Aaron Hernandez (ankle) as out for Sunday's game. OL Logan Mankins questionable.



#43 jsinger121


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Posted 28 September 2012 - 03:13 PM


OUT

WR Julian Edelman (hand)

TE Aaron Hernandez (ankle)

QUESTIONABLE

DE Brandon Deaderick (ankle)

CB Alfonzo Dennard (hamstring)

DT Justin Francis (ankle)

TE Rob Gronkowski (hip)

DT Kyle Love (knee)

OG Logan Mankins (hip)

OL Nick McDonald (shoulder)

CB Sterling Moore (knee)

RB Shane Vereeen (foot)

OT Sebastian Vollmer (back)


In addition, the Bills released their complete report:

OUT

WR Martin Ruvell (ankle)

QUESTIONABLE

RB Fred Jackson (knee)

RB C.J. Spiller (shoulder)

PROBABLE

CB Leodis McKelvin (groin)



#44 NortheasternPJ


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Posted 28 September 2012 - 03:22 PM

Where are we going to find someone to start at WR with Edelman out? Wavier wire?

#45 jsinger121


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Posted 28 September 2012 - 03:25 PM

Greg Salas though I wish Jabar Gaffney was healthy.

#46 Mystic Merlin


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Posted 28 September 2012 - 03:29 PM

Er, Deion?

We might see Slater as the next guy up if someone else goes down; otherwise, I don't think it's a big deal, at least in the short-term.

#47 BigSoxFan


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Posted 28 September 2012 - 03:36 PM

This game just screams for more Stevan Ridley. Of course, I'm sure McDaniels is furiously drawing up plays for Woodhead as we speak.

#48 Mystic Merlin


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Posted 28 September 2012 - 03:42 PM

This game just screams for more Stevan Ridley. Of course, I'm sure McDaniels is furiously drawing up plays for Woodhead as we speak.


:(

Vereen would be a nice boost, but he seems to be trending in the 'permanent inactive' direction.

Ridley would help his case if he keeps blocking well in pass protection; it's pretty obvious they don't completely trust him in that area, or in the receiving game for that matter. There's no reason he can't grab no-huddle snaps from Woodhead, who isn't impressing anyone.

#49 Super Nomario


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Posted 28 September 2012 - 03:57 PM

Mike Reiss@MikeReiss
TE Rob Gronkowski a new addition to the injury report. He is listed as questionable with a hip injury.

Ugh. Seeing this, with Hernandez and Edelman already out, and Mankins unlikely to play, makes me sick to my stomach.

#50 BigSoxFan


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Posted 28 September 2012 - 04:00 PM

Ugh. Seeing this, with Hernandez and Edelman already out, and Mankins unlikely to play, makes me sick to my stomach.


I'd be very surprised if Gronk doesn't play and I'm also not very concerned about the loss of Edelman, mostly because I hate the plays that McDaniels calls for him. Welker and Lloyd should be very busy on Sunday. Even Branch might get 10+ targets.




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