184 replies to this topic

[ajml]

Maybe this doesn't deserve it's own topic but it will be interesting to see how Shannahan handles the playoffs vs the regular season. I predict it follows a similar path - strict at first then tapering off into total unpredictability.

He already has a tough call to make with Shea Weber. He's a star but there's no way this doesn't deserve a game in the press box. There's no gray area like a body check with intent here. I'm embarrassed to agree with Jeremy Roenick here... You are the best player on your team and you just won the game, get ahold of your emotions.




Edit: sorry I'm incredibly stupid at embedding videos

Edited by ajml, 12 April 2012 - 09:44 AM.

[Haunted]

I don't see any way they can justify not giving him a few games at least for that. I know they were taking shots at each other, but he used his arms to slam someone's head into the glass.


But then, let's see where the dartboard lands. Since Weber is a star, it's a much smaller target.

[soxhop411]

Darren Dreger ‏ @DarrenDreger

• Close

Weber fined $2500 for driving Zetterberg's head into the glass. Sheawill have to be squeaky clean for rest of playoffs to avoid susp.#TSN

[Hendu's Gait]

bullshit. he intentionally rammed another player into the glass, not even close to puck playing.

[Wave em in Wendall]

$2,500 fine for Weber. No suspension.

Source

Shanahan starts the playoffs with a swing and a miss.

[The Four Peters]

Wonder how much Zetterberg's going to be fined for elbowing a player in the back of the head while he was facing the glass.

[AMcGhie]

Completely disagree. The retaliatory jab after the hard hit into the boards was warranted, and ok in my book, but the 2nd move of grabbing his head and slamming it into the boards should have gotten a game, at least. Shannahan is fully Crespo '04-ing suspensions in the league.

[TheRealness]

$2,500 fine for Weber. No suspension.

Source

Shanahan starts the playoffs with a swing and a miss.

Yeah, he should have at least gotten a game. That was bush league move from him. I mean, he shoved Dude's head into the glass. Granted, it didn't look all that painful, but still, inexcusable behavior.

He should have gotten a game at least. This sets the stage for the rest of the playoffs. I wouldn't expect any suspension unless somebody ends up using their broken shaft to stab someone to death.

[timlinin8th]

$2,500 fine for Weber. No suspension.

Source

Shanahan starts the playoffs with a swing and a miss.

if it was a player of no consequence, definitely a game at least. Total star-player-playoff bias here, which is BS.

[SidelineCameras]

I can't help but wonder if there isn't a reverse-reverse Red Wings effect happening here. The first playoff suspension question that comes up in Shanny's career could be hugely beneficial to his old club. I can see Shanny going light in order to avoid accusations that he is rigging things for the Wings.

You know, the way Colin rigged things for us last year?

[ajml]

Did he put out a video on this one yet? Maybe he decided Weber was already justly punished by the 2 minute roughing penalty he served at 20:00 of the 3rd!

[Greg29fan]

I can't help but wonder if there isn't a reverse-reverse Red Wings effect happening here. The first playoff suspension question that comes up in Shanny's career could be hugely beneficial to his old club. I can see Shanny going light in order to avoid accusations that he is rigging things for the Wings.

bingo

[Senorec]

Not much of a poster in this forum (or any for that matter), but the NHL's statement just gets it all wrong. They seem to rationalize that because Zetterberg can go for Game 2, a suspension isn't warranted. So its the result of the action, not the action itself that is given more weight. When you are player's action has been described with such terms as "WWE" and "turnbuckle smash" you have a problem. Trying to determine if the NFL or NHL is the more arbitrary league when it comes to discipline.

"We felt this was a reckless and reactionary play on which Weber threw a glancing punch and then shoved Zetterberg's head into the glass," said NHL Senior Vice President of Player Safety and Hockey Operations Brendan Shanahan. "We reached out to Detroit following the game and were informed that Zetterberg did not suffer an apparent injury and should be in the lineup for Game 2."

[FelixMantilla]

What a disappointment Shanahan has turned out to be. Throw the bum out, he's obviously not fit for the job.

[ForceAtHome]

What a disappointment Shanahan has turned out to be. Throw the bum out, he's obviously not fit for the job.

I'm curious... who would people want with this job? I've never been a huge critic or fan of Shanahan, either at the beginning or now. I've always been of the belief that this job is really difficult to do without pissing off a lot of people. I think that just sort of comes with the territory. While in this instance I think Weber should have gotten at least a game and there is pretty strong agreement on that front, many cases aren't so cut and dry. Heck, I've seen people who were screaming for 5+ for Weber while others were saying 1-2. There would have been people upset at any ruling Shanahan handed down, imho.

Should it be an ex-player who understands what it's like to play NHL hockey and be on the receiving and giving end of blows? Does that lead to conflict of interest and conspiracy theories (e.g., Shanahan couldn't suspend Weber and look like he was helping his old pals in Detroit, and the obvious Colin to Gregory connection)? Who should be in charge of discipline and what background should they have? I don't have a good answer, but I'm curious if there is a good answer.

[PedroSpecialK]

He's been ruling on every hit this whole season based on who gets hurt or not, whether it's a real or feigned injury. Why would he change now?

I don't care who the discipline czar is. Just use intent and not injury to make your rulings, because the latter makes it an exercise in randomness.

[kenneycb]

Honestly the only thing I really want is consistency and not have the star system come into effect. If this was, say, Gabriel Bourque or some other non-marquee player I have little doubt he'd get at least one game. Not to mention Weber was already fined for boarding earlier in the year but I guess that doesn't count towards his "repeat offender" tag because boarding is not the same as turnbuckling. I'm just looking for a consistent logical thought pattern behind his decisions and I'm struggling. There are scores and scores of other examples (Paille's suspension last year vs. the Sesito hit on Horton comes to mind) out there too.

[ForceAtHome]

I don't care who the discipline czar is. Just use intent and not injury to make your rulings, because the latter makes it an exercise in randomness.

Honestly the only thing I really want is consistency and not have the star system come into effect.

I am in 100% agreement with these two statements. I think that would be a great start.

[mikeford]

@capgeek
#NHL Shea Weber fined $2,500 from his $7.5m salary — applying the same ratio to someone making $50,000, that's $16.

[The Four Peters]

$2500 is the max allowed by the CBA so that analogy is pretty stupid. I'm sure Shanahan would have fined him more if he could have.

Edit: Actually, players don't get paid in the playoffs, so that analogy is even more stupider.

[Jed Zeppelin]

As usual, the only correct answer for who should get the job is robots.

[Boston Brawler]

I am in 100% agreement with these two statements. I think that would be a great start.

Seconded. You have to remove the players and forget about the outcome of the incident to have a fair system.

[Ferm Sheller]

I bet that also a factor here is that the NHL took into account the well-being of the Nashville franchise (and therefore the NHL itself), which has had little playoff success in its 15 years and which is based in a non-traditional hockey market.

[Boston Brawler]

Bitz suspended 2 games for boarding last night

Link to the Shanaban: http://video.nhl.com...id=60&id=171899

Edited by Boston Brawler, 12 April 2012 - 07:33 PM.

[ajml]

Well obviously there was an injury! Of course it's deserved but if I'm the Canucks I take that trade off

[kenneycb]

I believe that's the first guy on the Canucks to get suspended all year. Not sure if any guys have gotten fines but I'm 90% sure there have been no suspensions.

[Toe Nash]

$2500 is the max allowed by the CBA so that analogy is pretty stupid. I'm sure Shanahan would have fined him more if he could have.

Edit: Actually, players don't get paid in the playoffs, so that analogy is even more stupider.

It's stupid that the max is $2500. That should be changed. That doesn't make the analogy stupid, just that getting upset at Shanahan over it is stupid since there's nothing more he can do.

[Rudy's Curve]

Three games for Hagelin

Edited by Rudy's Curve, 15 April 2012 - 07:02 PM.

[RedOctober3829]

Anything on Matt Carkner?

[Rudy's Curve]

Anything on Matt Carkner?

One game

[RedOctober3829]

How Carkner gets 1 game and Hagelin 3 is beyond me.

Edited by RedOctober3829, 15 April 2012 - 07:49 PM.

[MiracleOfO2704]

How Carkner gets 1 game and Hagelin 3 is beyond me.

It's tricky hitting those triple point bars on the dartboard.

[Jettisoned]

How Carkner gets 1 game and Hagelin 3 is beyond me.

I bet you thought this was just awful as well:


Edit: By the way, that's Shanahan intercepting Roy on his way to basically do what Dubinsky did.

Edited by Jettisoned, 15 April 2012 - 08:58 PM.

[Myt1]

$2500 is the max allowed by the CBA so that analogy is pretty stupid. I'm sure Shanahan would have fined him more if he could have.

Edit: Actually, players don't get paid in the playoffs, so that analogy is even more stupider.

You're more stupider. The point is that a fine can't approach anything like deterrence when people make so much money.

[Blacken]

You're more stupider. The point is that a fine can't approach anything like deterrence when people make so much money.

Percentage-based fines could, but the NHLPA would never go for that.

"We fine Derpy McHerpDerp 10% of his season salary" hurts significantly at all levels.

[TheShynessClinic]

MSG Networks ‏ @MSGNetworks
Shanny announces that Hagelin's suspension may get reduced if Alfredsson plays tonight on @BoomerandCarton. He is on MSG right now.

So if the Rangers were to appeal the suspension, Shanahan would reduce the suspension depending on Alfies injury status.

Has he lost his fucking mind? This is awful.

[cshea]

What a joke.

Free Campbell.

[FelixMantilla]

^{When the hell did Shanahan lose his mind? His decisions get more bizarre by the day.}

Edited by FelixMantilla, 16 April 2012 - 09:11 AM.

[Jed Zeppelin]

Bruins need to take advantage of this asap and send Marchand out there with a gun to create some space for his line. If he doesn't actually shoot anybody he shouldn't be punished, right?

[MentalDisabldLst]

No shanabans for yesterday's Philly-Pittsburgh shit-fest? The two sides did everything except drag metal chairs out onto the ice to use WWF-style. Matt Cooke also did his best to cause damage during play.

[Toe Nash]

No shanabans for yesterday's Philly-Pittsburgh shit-fest? The two sides did everything except drag metal chairs out onto the ice to use WWF-style. Matt Cooke also did his best to cause damage during play.

Neal should have been chucked and should get suspended. There was no reason for his play at the end of the game no matter how the game had gone.

Asham should be as well.

[ajml]

I'm sure I'm just missing the joke but Matt Cooke was basically the only person not involved in the shenanigans yesterday

[teddykgb]

At this point, as crazy as it sounds, it seems semi clear that injury to the player is the controlling element. It's complete fucking madness if you ask me, but it seems like Shanahan strongly values the extent of injury in determining suspensions. I'm sure this will result in exaggerated injuries to lousy players, but that seems to be the thing that he keys in on.

[SidelineCameras]

I think most/all of us agree that this punishing of players based on results vs intent is completely asinine. What I can't figure out is the logic behind it, if there is any. What is the league thinking? The only thing I can come up with is that injuries/results of actions are easier to quantify then the intent of actions, so if you go on injuries you actually have something to measure. But that just seems ridiculous. Shea Weber *tried* to hurt Zetterberg, tried really hard. So just because Zetterberg avoids injury, Weber avoids a suspension? And if Alfredsson comes back, it makes Hagelin's elbow any less dangerous or illegal?

Edited by SidelineCameras, 16 April 2012 - 09:56 AM.

[SidelineCameras]

Let me try that again more succinctly: has the league ever come out and said why resulting injury is factored into SD decisions?

[Haunted]

At this point, as crazy as it sounds, it seems semi clear that injury to the player is the controlling element. It's complete fucking madness if you ask me, but it seems like Shanahan strongly values the extent of injury in determining suspensions. I'm sure this will result in exaggerated injuries to lousy players, but that seems to be the thing that he keys in on.

Especially when the league has teams like Montreal with some hairy track records on milking injuries, or other teams like Vancouver that overstate injuries early while campaigning for suspensions.

I mean, sure, if all 30 teams in the league were honest this might work. But here on Planet Earf that just isn't the case.

[cshea]

No shanabans for yesterday's Philly-Pittsburgh shit-fest? The two sides did everything except drag metal chairs out onto the ice to use WWF-style. Matt Cooke also did his best to cause damage during play.

Asham received a match penalty, which comes with an automatic 1 game suspension, plus league review. He'll be talking with Shanny either today or tomorrow, and I don't see any scenario where the 1-gamer is repealed. I'd say he's looking at getting at least 4 more games tacked on.

Craig Adams will also have a hearing. He took an instigator penalty in the final 5:00. That comes with an automatic 1 gamer as well.

James Neal is the real culprit, and I'll be stunned if he gets off with less than 4 games. He took 2 clear cut runs and attempted to injure Couturier and Giroux within a 20 second span. And given the gutless puke he is, he made a beeline for the bench to stay ou of harms way.

[TheShynessClinic]

Looks like Neal might be missing quite a bit of time:

Nick Kypreos ‏ @RealKyper

#SNPlayoffs breaking news. #Penguins Neal will have 2 separate #NHL discipline hearings Tues 10am. Asham will follow with in person @ 11am

[Dropkick Izzy]

Matt Cooke also did his best to cause damage during play.

That's Masterson candidate Matt Cooke to you.

[TheShynessClinic]

To be honest, I almost hope Neal/Adams/Asham aren't suspended. I want them playing in the next game, so when Philly has a lead going into the 3rd, all bets are off. I'm not calling for injuries, I'm calling for actual accountability. I'd love to see Rinaldo absolutely tune up one of these guys and embarrass them on National TV. It's the only way shit like this will end.