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Adding a WR in Free Agency (in addition to retaining Welker)?


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Poll: Adding a WR in Free Agency (in addition to retaining Welker)? (272 member(s) have cast votes)

If you had your choice, who would best fit the Patriots' needs at WR in free agency?

  1. Brandon Lloyd (88 votes [43.35%])

    Percentage of vote: 43.35%

  2. DeSean Jackson (8 votes [3.94%])

    Percentage of vote: 3.94%

  3. Vincent Jackson (25 votes [12.32%])

    Percentage of vote: 12.32%

  4. Mike Wallace (62 votes [30.54%])

    Percentage of vote: 30.54%

  5. Reggie Wayne (11 votes [5.42%])

    Percentage of vote: 5.42%

  6. Other (9 votes [4.43%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.43%

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#1 RedOctober3829


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 04:03 PM

There are some intriguing names on the open market that the Patriots could go after. I think the consensus is that they need to retain Welker plus add another wideout because Branch and Ochocinco did not cut it. With respect to just free agency, what receiver would most fit the needs of this offense? I left off Dwayne Bowe because he is likely to be franchised.

Brandon Lloyd(UFA)--Lloyd quickly established himself as the Rams' top receiver after a trade landed him in St. Louis midway through the year. His explosive downfield ability and large catching radius make him a legitimate target to help Sam Bradford. The Rams will make a strong play to retain him and Lloyd has expressed interest in playing for coach Jeff Fisher.


DeSean Jackson(UFA)--Jackson is a great weapon for the Eagles offense that relies upon big plays. Unfortunately, Jackson's ego and sense of self-worth appears to have created a rift in negotiations thus far. Jackson will probably want to be paid as a top wide receiver, which he may not get from the organization after some his comments and actions of several months ago. To be fair, his play doesn't warrant it either.



Vincent Jackson(UFA)--Partially due to his actions and injuries in the past, the Chargers have been reluctant to sign Vincent Jackson to a long-term extension. However, after a third 1000-yard season with the Chargers, GM AJ Smith and Head Coach Norv Turner have expressed interest in keeping Jackson in San Diego for the long haul. If the Chargers don't have him locked up prior to the start of free agency, he may very easily leave on a tempting offer elsewhere.


Mike Wallace(RFA)--No receiver in the league forces safeties back like Wallace. His deep speed is second to none on the perimeter and he capitalizes on it with the ability to run those vertical routes proficiently. He's improving in other areas of his game and is an extremely valuable piece to the Steelers' offense. Keep in mind the highest Restricted tender would only net the Steelers a first round pick, which Wallace is certainly worth.


Reggie Wayne(UFA)--After missing the 1000-yard mark for the first time since 2003, Wayne finds himself a free agent. All of the talk out of Indy has been on Peyton Manning and his costly option The Colts have been an organization takes care of their own over the last decade, but for a team expected to enter rebuilding, it'll be interesting to see if that philosophy changes for in the transition. Many expect Wayne to be playing elsewhere next season.


http://www.footballs...2012/fa/wr.html

My choice would be Brandon Lloyd. He is familiar with the Patriots' offense having spent time with Josh McDaniels and has expressed interest in following McD wherever he landed. I'd think long and hard about DeSean Jackson because of his pure explosiveness, but character concerns would hinder any long-term, big money deal.

Edited by SoxScout, 08 March 2012 - 10:04 PM.


#2 Fishercat


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 04:17 PM

I said Brandon Lloyd. Given unlimited money, I would say to take the chance on Vincent Jackson, but I think Vincent Jackson will command probably twice as much money and more years than Brandon Lloyd would and I would rather they use that money to acquire some additional pass rushing help or secondary help.

Desean Jackson is tempeting as hell, but I worry about his performance levels. Not that Philly is the paragon of organizations, but if he struggles to do damage with Michael Vick, Jeremy Maclin, and Lesean McCoy helping, that's not quite the 2006 Oakland Raiders and Randy Moss. Mike Wallace is great, but the acquisition cost in addition to the money he would need to leave Pittsburgh is a lot. Wayne's potential wear and tear worries me.

#3 phragle


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 04:27 PM

Why didn't you list Colston or Bowe?

Wallace isn't an option IMO.

Give me Lloyd.

#4 jsinger121


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 04:30 PM

Colston should definitely be an option especially when the Saints have 3 big free agents in Brees, Colston and Nicks and only 1 can get the tag which will obviously be Brees.

#5 RedOctober3829


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 04:32 PM

Why didn't you list Colston or Bowe?

Wallace isn't an option IMO.

Give me Lloyd.


As I said, Bowe is likely to be franchised as well as Colston.

#6 RedOctober3829


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 04:32 PM

Colston should definitely be an option especially when the Saints have 3 big free agents in Brees, Colston and Nicks and only 1 can get the tag which will obviously be Brees.


They would be stupid not to sign Brees long-term and then use the franchise tag on Colston.

#7 jsinger121


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 04:34 PM

They would be stupid not to sign Brees long-term and then use the franchise tag on Colston.


Well he isn't signed yet and reports are out there that they aren't close so when push comes to shove Brees get franchised if no new deal is there once the new league year starts.

#8 mascho


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 04:35 PM

I think the best fit would likely be Lloyd.

However, I would expect them to sign Reggie Wayne. Belichick has never been shy in praising Reggie Wayne. Here is how Belichick described Wayne after a regular season game in 2009:

"I mean, I can't say enough about Reggie Wayne," Belichick said. "That guy is the best receiver we cover every year and it seems like he just keeps getting better. I thought the routes he ran and the cathes he made were nothing short o spectacular, with the go route, he two touchdown catches, the third down conversion on the corner route in front of our bench. He's a tremendous receiver and he had some production against us."


Http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/articles/2009/11/17/patriots_coach_belichick_quite_open_about_talent_of_colts_wayne/

In a way, sounds similar to the courtship of Ocho. Hopefully if it comes to pass, it would be with better results.

#9 Shelterdog


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 04:43 PM

Wallace isn't an option IMO.


I'm not that sure about it. He'd cost a boatload but I'm not sure that a late first round pick (as opposed to the old cost of a first and a third) isn't that expensive for a 25 year old receiver who had about 2400 yards in the last two years. (The fact that you'd be damaging a good AFC rival also helps).

I'm not sure if you can do "poison pill" deals but the Steelers apparently have real cap issues next year so you could make it hard for them to resign him.

EDIT: On second thought he's going to want 10 million a year or something I'll bet somebody else with more cap flexibility than the Pats will be willing to make the deal.

Edited by Shelterdog, 07 February 2012 - 04:52 PM.


#10 Mike in CT



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Posted 07 February 2012 - 04:45 PM

Wallace and Vincent Jackson are feared deep threats. I can't imagine anything more beneficial to Brady, the Tight Ends, and the short passing game WR's.

DeSean Jackson is a nut case and shouldn't be considered.

Wayne and Lloyd are very good but if you let Welker walk, have you really change the dynamic of the offense by replacing him with one of those guys?

Edited by Mike in CT, 07 February 2012 - 04:46 PM.


#11 jsinger121


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 04:50 PM

I'm not that sure about it. He'd cost a boatload but I'm not sure that a late first round pick (as opposed to the old cost of a first and a third) isn't that expensive for a 25 year old receiver who had about 2400 yards in the last two years. (The fact that you'd be damaging a good AFC rival also helps).

I'm not sure if you can do "poison pill" deals but the Steelers apparently have real cap issues next year so you could make it hard for them to resign him.


I'm pretty sure you can still do them but its not looked well among teams.

#12 phragle


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 05:02 PM

As I said, Bowe is likely to be franchised as well as Colston.


Oh, I must have missed the first paragraph. I still think Colston should be an option.

I'm not that sure about it. He'd cost a boatload but I'm not sure that a late first round pick (as opposed to the old cost of a first and a third) isn't that expensive for a 25 year old receiver who had about 2400 yards in the last two years. (The fact that you'd be damaging a good AFC rival also helps).

I'm not sure if you can do "poison pill" deals but the Steelers apparently have real cap issues next year so you could make it hard for them to resign him.


You raise some good points, and he should be an option, but I'd rather keep the pick for defense.

Edit regarding the other players

Wayne: I just don't think he's that good anymore.

D. Jackson: I don't think he is the selfish head case everyone else thinks he is, but he's not much of a route runner, and can't beat press man. I want somebody that can beat press coverage. He'd be an awesome addition to special teams.

V. Jackson: He's an idiot on and off the field. Do not want.

Edited by phragle, 07 February 2012 - 05:25 PM.


#13 Jungleland

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 05:30 PM

I think Brandon Lloyd will prove not only to be the best fit given the McDaniels familiarity, but likely the best value as well. He earned 1.4 million in 2011 (http://www.spotrac.c.../brandon-lloyd/), and given his age (31 in July), I imagine he will command a far cheaper sum than the other younger options.

Of the young insanely fast candidates, Wallace strikes me as not only the most talented of the bunch but also the least difficult. I've seen him do the whole negative body language thing when someone else gets the ball on a play where he's open, but to the eye test it strikes me as more competitive than crazy. Either way, I can't see the Steelers not resigning him. If they decide to use their cap room elsewhere, however, I think it'd be worth it for New England to consider giving up the first round pick it would take. The cap room is there for the Pats, but I still personally lean toward Lloyd and using the rest of the money to shore up the defense. I also think you want to keep Welker for 2012 at just about any cost, so a sizable chunk of available cash should be reserved for his pricy franchise tag.

I love Reggie Wayne, but at 33 he's got two and a half years on Lloyd. I'd really like to see this team sign a guy who can be a legitimate downfield presence for the next two seasons minimum, and I think his age presents the highest risk of failure to do that. If you can go into 2012 with Gronkowski-Hernandez-Welker and a true deep threat, you're looking at the best group TB has had in his career. Keep whichever of Chad and Deion will come back cheaper as the 5th option and either get Welker on a reasonable deal or franchise him and hope Edelman/draft pick can give you 80% of what he does in 2013 and beyond.

Ultimately, keeping Gronk and Herndandez in Patriot uniforms as long as possible should be priority number one. Lloyd looks to me to be the sole FA candidate whose skills and cap hit will simultaneously a. keep that possible b. allow Welker to be franchised if need be and c. be the legitimate downfield guy this offense needs.

Edited by Jungleland, 07 February 2012 - 05:32 PM.


#14 BucketOBalls


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 05:34 PM

Reading this thread...I think if they want a good WR, they are gonna have to draft one. Not sure how you would prioritize it over other needs, but I think that is the only way you get a guy who can really help for very long.

#15 soxfan121


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 05:38 PM

None is my vote. And don't re-sign Welker.

#16 BucketOBalls


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 05:38 PM

<not sure what happened there>

Edited by BucketOBalls, 07 February 2012 - 05:39 PM.


#17 Marbleheader


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 05:41 PM

It seems like guys BB likes never seem to work out. Ocho, ADT. Just never seems to work out.

Never? Welker, Moss, Harrison, Dillon...

#18 RedOctober3829


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 05:43 PM

Never? Welker, Moss, Harrison, Dillon...


He liked that Brady fellow enough too I think....

#19 CaptainLaddie


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 05:45 PM

Reading this thread...I think if they want a good WR, they are gonna have to draft one. Not sure how you would prioritize it over other needs, but I think that is the only way you get a guy who can really help for very long.

None is my vote. And don't re-sign Welker.

Um, so what's the plan at WR? Deion Branch? Julian Edelman?

#20 ragnarok725

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 05:46 PM

Brandon Lloyd is the obvious answer here. He's stated he wants to go with Josh McDaniels wherever he goes. He's later in his career - he has to see playing with Brady as a chance to become a big name and maybe win a ring. Hopefully he'd come at a discount due to his down season and the connection with McDaniels. I think what was made clear in a number of games was that when teams flooded the middle of the field and brought moderate pressure, the Pats had a lot of trouble. Having no threats on the outside really made it easy to roll safety coverage over the middle and hone in on the LBs. Adding an outside threat that keeps a safety honest over the top and on the outside will do a lot to open up the seam for Gronkowski. Having a guy like Lloyd would also keep the best CBs off of Welker, making him much more effective against teams like the Jets who throw Revis at him.

Warning: I'd mute the sound.


Give me that guy.

The OL is in pretty good shape if Waters doesn't retire, and you've got to hope one of the RBs develop. If BJGE's price tag is small he's worth hanging on to as well. The one way to really improve the offense is on the outside. Lloyd seems like a perfect fit.

#21 dynomite

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 05:52 PM

After (I would assume) re-signing Welker, I don't see the Patriots spending another chunk of change on a WR, especially 1) with Gronknandez still the focus of the offense, and 2) one with a history of behavioral problems. Personally, I'd be happy with this:

Staying: Edelman
Question marks: Welker, Branch, Ocho, Slater

- Re-sign Welker
- Re-sign Branch (1 year/vet min)
- Re-sign Slater (clearly a Belichick guy, great on ST)
- Cut Ocho (almost a certainty given his $3 million price)
- Bring a bunch of UDFAs into camp and try to strike gold with the next Victor Cruz/Rod Smith.

And

- With one of our late 1st Rounders (or, perhaps, after we trade down a bit) draft Rutgers WR Mohamed Sanu. 6'2", ~215, great hands (100+ catches this year), great blocker, Schiano raves about him. This recommendation comes from a college football fanatic friend who describes him as a "faster, taller Hines Ward." Sounds like a Patriots-type player that would be perfect for this offense.

Bringing back Branch would give the Pats leeway to bring Sanu along slowly, giving him all of camp and the first few weeks of the season to integrate into the offense. The Pats also have two 1st Rounders, so they could still trade the other or draft one of the DE/LBs that everyone's predicting they'll take.

He's a deep threat, he's versatile (he can run out of the backfield and throw, too), he's a great blocker, he's tough, he's big, he won't be too expensive, and -- most importantly -- he's incredibly football smart.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXJKIE2jTL0&feature=related

Forget the highlight reel catches -- look at the devastating blocks Sanu is throwing.

This kid is a monster.

Edited by dynomite, 07 February 2012 - 05:57 PM.


#22 ragnarok725

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 05:54 PM

- With one of our late 1st Rounders (or, perhaps, after we trade down a bit) draft Rutgers WR Mohamed Sanu. 6'2", ~215, great hands (100+ catches this year), great blocker, Schiano raves about him. This recommendation comes from a college football fanatic friend who describes him as a "faster, taller Hines Ward." Sounds like a Patriots-type player that would be perfect for this offense.

Bringing back Branch would give the Pats leeway to bring Sanu along slowly, giving him all of camp and the first few weeks of the season to integrate into the offense. The Pats also have two 1st Rounders, so they could still trade the other or draft one of the DE/LBs that everyone's predicting they'll take.

It's a highlight reel, sure, but Sanu looks like the definition of a Patriots player: versatile (he can run out of the backfield and throw, too), tough, and incredibly football smart.
<snip>

This kid is a monster.

Yup - I posted about him in the other thread we had on WRs a while back. Sanu would be awesome. Most mocks have him gone by 27 these days and I feel like he could be on the rise after the combine as well. I like him a lot as well and would be perfectly content with him as the new outside option, but I don't think they should be trading up for a WR if they'd have to.

Edited by ragnarok725, 07 February 2012 - 05:58 PM.


#23 SpacemanzGerbil

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 06:03 PM

Um, so what's the plan at WR? Deion Branch? Julian Edelman?


Now, I do not advocate leaving the position free agent free but this has to be the best crop of WRs I have ever seen entering the league in a single draft year. The depth of this class at wideout is shockingly good.

#24 cshea


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 06:07 PM

Oh, I must have missed the first paragraph. I still think Colston should be an option.



You raise some good points, and he should be an option, but I'd rather keep the pick for defense.


FWIW, they have New Orleans first in addition to their own, so there's still some chips to play with. I wouldn't be totally opposed to trying to screw over the Steelers and grab Wallace, but the money would be a concern.

Lloyd and Wayne seem like the more realistic targets, and I'd be fine with either.

#25 phragle


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 06:11 PM

Um, so what's the plan at WR? Deion Branch? Julian Edelman?


Mario Williams obviously.

#26 dynomite

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 06:13 PM

Yup - I posted about him in the other thread we had on WRs a while back. Sanu would be awesome. Most mocks have him gone by 27 these days and I feel like he could be on the rise after the combine as well. I like him a lot as well and would be perfectly content with him as the new outside option, but I don't think they should be trading up for a WR if they'd have to.


I'm not usually one to get amped about draft prospects, but Sanu is ridiculous. I can't remember the last time I was this excited about a draft prospect.

Two mocks released today (for whatever they're worth) have him going at #30 to the Niners and #25 to the Broncos.

#27 ragnarok725

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 06:30 PM

I'm not usually one to get amped about draft prospects, but Sanu is ridiculous. I can't remember the last time I was this excited about a draft prospect.

Two mocks released today (for whatever they're worth) have him going at #30 to the Niners and #25 to the Broncos.

Absolutely - he certainly ticks all the boxes. Versatile, comes from a good system the Pats love. Big, fast, and with good hands. He's got an interesting back-story too - a native of Sierra Leone that didn't settle in the U.S. full time until 2009. I'd be psyched about him if that's the way they go.

#28 Oil Can Dan

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 06:37 PM

I really think DeSean Jackson would be a great fit. You don't need him to do the thing that he's not great at doing - crossing the middle/intermediate routes. You've got Welker in the slot and the two TEs that MUST be accounted for, and then you've got the burner stretching the field. Can't cover all of that.

On his attitude - he had a bad year and he handled this contract thing poorly, no doubt. But assuming he's got the contract that he's been pining for I'd expect him to be a good soldier as he was in Philly prior to 2011.

He's young, he's excellent in stretching the field, and defensive coordinators will overlook him at their own risk. I think he'd be a great fit for the Pats.

#29 dynomite

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 06:49 PM

Absolutely - he certainly ticks all the boxes. Versatile, comes from a good system the Pats love. Big, fast, and with good hands. He's got an interesting back-story too - a native of Sierra Leone that didn't settle in the U.S. full time until 2009. I'd be psyched about him if that's the way they go.


Exactly. Also, I must have missed this, but Mike Reiss last month already wrote a blurb about FoxSports.com mock that had us taking Sanu at #27: http://espn.go.com/b...er-option-at-wr

I really think DeSean Jackson would be a great fit.


I disagree for a number of reasons, but I think it will suffice to say that the Patriots would never spend that kind of money on a free agent.

#30 Dick Pole Upside

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 07:32 PM

I loved Reggie Wayne, but no thanks. Loved, as in past tense. As someone said upthread, he's 33, and I think he's at the point where the wheels will fall off quickly. Driving around town (Indy) last Friday, I heard him interviewed on the radio. He was asked if this year with the Colts was tough on him. "Tough? Not really." "Really? Why do you say that, Reggie?" "I think this year may have been one of my funnest years. After, like, the fourth game, it was clear we weren't going to make the playoffs, so the pressure was off." Now, he might have been trying to say 'something' to deflect away from the abject disaster that was the Colts' season, but to say he had fun because the pressure of winning wasn't there... well, I would prefer not to have guys his age with that approach to the game at this stage of their careers like that on the Patriots. The Patriots need athletes, and they need guys desperate to be great.

I voted Jackson (like his height and ability to go get the ball). Lloyd would be my #2. With Brady's recent (last two years) aversion to throwing outside the numbers, I actually don't think Brady would know what to do with Wallace, even with JMcD back running things.

edit: Whaddya know... didn't even see the Can Brady Throw Deep? thread 'til now. No. That's why Wallace would be a wasted luxury, imo.

Edited by Dick Pole Upside, 07 February 2012 - 07:40 PM.


#31 Norm Siebern

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 07:34 PM

Mike Wallace.

He is exactly what the Patriots need to stretch the field, and signing him hurts another AFC contender. Double win. He is young, fast and a threat. That would mean that the Patriots top 3 of 4 recievers are all under 25. Welker gets resigned and goes back to driving teams crazy in the slot. Gronk is the TE, and Hernandez is some wierd hybrid TE, big wideout. Save the two picks for a RB and a Defensive stud (S, CB or rush LB). Or, if he is still there, Sanu, but I wonder if he is still there at 27.

If all it costs is $, and you are in cap heaven as the Patriots are, then you get Wallace, improve your own team, and really hurt the Steelers. It allows you to get the best out of Brady for the last two to three years, and sets up Mallet with a fantastic receiving corps as all three (Wallace, Gronk and Hernandez) enter their prime to welcome Mallet to the starting position. To me this is the best choice.

#32 Three10toLeft

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 07:36 PM

I really think DeSean Jackson would be a great fit. You don't need him to do the thing that he's not great at doing - crossing the middle/intermediate routes. You've got Welker in the slot and the two TEs that MUST be accounted for, and then you've got the burner stretching the field. Can't cover all of that.

On his attitude - he had a bad year and he handled this contract thing poorly, no doubt. But assuming he's got the contract that he's been pining for I'd expect him to be a good soldier as he was in Philly prior to 2011.

He's young, he's excellent in stretching the field, and defensive coordinators will overlook him at their own risk. I think he'd be a great fit for the Pats.



I tend to agree, although his history of concussions would concern me. But like you said, with his speed there is no way a defense could shut down that passing game.

#33 bradmahn

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 07:39 PM

Mike Wallace.

He is exactly what the Patriots need to stretch the field, and signing him hurts another AFC contender. Double win. He is young, fast and a threat. That would mean that the Patriots top 3 of 4 recievers are all under 25. Welker gets resigned and goes back to driving teams crazy in the slot. Gronk is the TE, and Hernandez is some wierd hybrid TE, big wideout. Save the two picks for a RB and a Defensive stud (S, CB or rush LB). Or, if he is still there, Sanu, but I wonder if he is still there at 27.

If all it costs is $, and you are in cap heaven as the Patriots are, then you get Wallace, improve your own team, and really hurt the Steelers. It allows you to get the best out of Brady for the last two to three years, and sets up Mallet with a fantastic receiving corps as all three (Wallace, Gronk and Hernandez) enter their prime to welcome Mallet to the starting position. To me this is the best choice.


It's going to cost a first round pick to sign Wallace... and they've already used two high picks on RBs last year. Sign Lloyd to a 2-3 year deal, draft Sanu and get him ready to take over.

#34 phragle


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 07:50 PM

I hope everybody isn't falling in love with Sanu over a highlight video

#35 BigJimEd

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 08:22 PM

I believe Pitt is in tough shape cap wise so Wallace will be an interting decision. Do they risk tendering him at the first round level or do they find room to tag him? I imagine they get it done before that time but it may be difficult.

Another name I haven't seen mentioned is Meachem. New Orleans has quite a few free agents. Meachem is a good outside guy who is used to playing in an offense with multiple options. Caught 40-45 passes the last few season getting over 600 yards.

#36 collings94

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 08:45 PM

Lloyd is the most likely to come to New England, but Jackson would be the best pickup. Hands, Size and Consistency, three biggest things you need in today's NFL and he has them.

#37 dynomite

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 08:55 PM

I hope everybody isn't falling in love with Sanu over a highlight video


I heard Mohamed Sanu was bit by a rattlesnake once. After three days of agony, the rattlesnake died.

Sorry... Anyway, he's the real deal. His draft stock has been rising and he's a consensus 1st/2nd round pick. Here's what nepatriotsdraft has to say about him:

Strengths: Good height with above average bulk for the position – One of the most versatile WR’s in the country – Lines up at multiple positions in multiple formations – Playmaker-utilized on reverses and other run plays at least once a game – Is even a threat to throw the ball – Effective screen receiver, allows blocks to set up – Large catch radius – Physical receiver who can take contact well – Works the middle of the field consistently – Moved to WR from Safety and has been extremely productive despite limited experience – Competitive player who plays hard and expects the ball each time the QB drops back – Good short area quickness for his weight – Big strong hands, snatches the ball out of the air – Smart player who grasps concepts and has the ability to learn multiple positions.



#38 Tyrone Biggums


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 09:12 PM

I'd shy away from all of these guys and add a game breaking wideout in the draft, lord knows we have a ton of holes to fill

#39 abty

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 09:27 PM

I wish you guys would sign Desean Jackson. It'd hand us the edge on the Eagles and would make you stronger. He's a big baby (Threw a ball, from the field, to our D.C) but, if he's happy, he will win games for you. He'd be a nightmare for the Jets or any rival you want to knock out of the division.

#40 koufax32


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 09:40 PM

I'd shy away from all of these guys and add a game breaking wideout in the draft, lord knows we have a ton of holes to fill


Isn't it a little simplistic to say "we'll simply draft a game changer?" This discussion is predicated on the assumption that drafting WRs is a virtual crapshoot.

#41 Shelterdog


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Posted 07 February 2012 - 09:42 PM

I'd shy away from all of these guys and add a game breaking wideout in the draft, lord knows we have a ton of holes to fill


While every NFL team has to get rebuilt every year, this team really isn't in bad shape. Almost everyone is back, you have some extra picks, you've got a few decent players back from the IR, you've got a lot of ton space, you have a few young guys who should be able to step up (Vereen and Ridley and Dowling) and you generally have reasonable in-house alternatives for everyone you lose but Welker, Branch and Carter/Anderson. That's not a lot of holes to fill.


And drafting wideouts (especially at the end of the first) is a total crapshoot.

Edited by Shelterdog, 07 February 2012 - 09:56 PM.


#42 Norm Siebern

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Posted 07 February 2012 - 10:55 PM

It's going to cost a first round pick to sign Wallace... and they've already used two high picks on RBs last year. Sign Lloyd to a 2-3 year deal, draft Sanu and get him ready to take over.


Forgot about the RFA first round requirement. To me, I still do it. Mike Wallace is worth a first round pick, and the fact that the Pats have two means they still use one for a defensive need. This is a postion in need of serious upgrade, and Wallace is the best available serious upgrade.

#43 soxfan121


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Posted 08 February 2012 - 08:12 AM

Um, so what's the plan at WR? Deion Branch? Julian Edelman?

Now, I do not advocate leaving the position free agent free but this has to be the best crop of WRs I have ever seen entering the league in a single draft year. The depth of this class at wideout is shockingly good.


Every year, there are multiple UDFA WR who make teams and an impact. Wes Welker is a good example. Victor Cruz, another.

Given the depth of the draft, the multiplicity of picks, and the other needs, I'd look at a WR in the 3rd round or with the second 2nd round pick and I'd be scouting the hell out of the potential UDFAs. Two young guys, added to Edelman, Branch & Ocho, plus a veteran FA picked up late in FA: Harry Douglas, Pierre Garcon, Jericho Cotchery, Danny Amendola - all of these guys figure to be uber-cheap and potentially productive in the Pats scheme.

Gronk remains target #1, Hernandez becomes target #2, Edelman/draft pick takes over for Welker in the slot, Branch and a veteran FA or UDFA on the outside.

McDaniels is back, so I also expect a return to more screens/passes to the backs, which bodes well for Woodhead, Ridley and Vereen - and that, alone, will improve this passing game, as the "first level" was basically ignored under BOB and it allowed defenses to flood the second and third level routes in the middle of the field. And despite that, the Pats were once again a top 3 offense.

The Pats are in the market for third, fourth and fifth options in the passing game. Yes, the top 2 options are not WR; so what? They're fucking good enough. So focus on 3rd, 4th and 5th options - not guys who will want $8M+/season, because that money should be spent to improve the defense.

#44 Morning Woodhead

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 08:24 AM

Of all the options my favorite is far and away Wallace. Antonio Brown may even be a better fit, but I think he's not a free agent until the following year. Wallace is exactly what this offense needs. The thought of having Wallace pull a safety with him up the field, and what that would do to the middle of the field for Gronknandez is exciting. I understand the Pats will lose a 1st rounder, but I think he's worth it.

Sanu is another great option, but I'd hate to draft a WR with one of our first round picks, and trade the other, and not address the defense. I think Sanu is going to be in the NFL a long time, but we have bigger areas of needs. With that said, if they draft him, I'll be happy.

I think in reality, getting a deal done with Welker, and signing Brandon Lloyd is probably where its going to shake out, and thats not a bad alternative. That still puts us in a better situation than this year, and things worked out ok.

#45 Judge Mental13


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Posted 08 February 2012 - 08:25 AM

I, too, am firmly on the Mike Wallace bandwagon. I just think that the steps it would take to sign him are totally inconsistent with this orginization's philosophy on wide receivers. That being said, this orginization's philosophy on wide receivers has led to a roller coaster ride of bargain free agent deals ranging from Joey Galloway to Randy Moss, and a drafting record of .... well.... nobody in particular.

Might be time to re-think the way they fill the position. Get Wallace.

#46 KiltedFool


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Posted 08 February 2012 - 09:40 AM

The Steelers are in fact well over the salary cap at the moment, more than $20 million. They do have one of the more effective cap wizards on staff in their chief negotiator Omar Khan, so there is a plan. Lamarr Woodley and Lawrence Timmons' recent contracts were both written with wiggle room for cap purposes, and Woodley's restructure was just executed to drop his cap figure by ~$6.5 million. There are multiple aging vets that will be cut (Kemoeatu thank God, Jonathan Scott, Bryant McFadden) or face "restructure or be cut/retire" decisions (Ward, Smith, Hampton, Farrior, Foote). Long story short I believe the Steelers can get there from here. If Wallace wants to stay and the Steelers want him, he'll stay. I don't know if he wants to stay or wants to get paid. I don't know what the Steelers want, but looking at them letting Santonio Holmes go in hindsight they were right on him, though they were roasted at the time.

Wallace is a rocket. But Antonio Brown outworked and outshined him the second half of the season, as his production dropped off. Whether that was because of defenses loading heavy to stop Wallace or Wallace getting a little complacent I don't know, I suspect some of both. Wallace has taken some minor heat for lack of effort from fans, such as blatantly wimping out instead of trying to tackle the ballcarrier on an interception late in the season. New OC Haley is known for pushing receivers to excel, he drove Larry Fitzgerald to go from great to "Oh My God" and got quite a bit out of some others like Breaston.

So it's not out of the realm of possibility for Wallace to be available, but I wouldn't count on it.

#47 Otis Foster


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Posted 08 February 2012 - 09:43 AM

I, too, am firmly on the Mike Wallace bandwagon. I just think that the steps it would take to sign him are totally inconsistent with this orginization's philosophy on wide receivers. That being said, this orginization's philosophy on wide receivers has led to a roller coaster ride of bargain free agent deals ranging from Joey Galloway to Randy Moss, and a drafting record of .... well.... nobody in particular.

Might be time to re-think the way they fill the position. Get Wallace.


Agreed. I won't repeat the arguments, just note that w/n Brady is accurate with his long-passing (see other thread), having someone like Wallace will force the safeties to respect his speed and the possibility - however diminished - that Brady will find him. Losing a No. 1 for a proven wr is a lot different than using the No. 1 to draft a speed demon whose abilities may not translate well to the NFL. Wallace has done it. He's never averaged less than 16 ypc, and his numbr of receptions has annually increased over the last 3 years. Use the remaining No. 1 (at most 4 picks later) on defense.

#48 H78

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 10:32 AM

Actually, I just said I would resign Wes in another thread.

But JUST to throw shit against the wall, what do you think the chances are that the Dolphins entertain a second round pick for Davone Bess? This isn't just because of the slot position/Dolphins connection, but I think the guy is a younger Welker in the making.

#49 baruch20

  • 140 posts

Posted 08 February 2012 - 10:44 AM

abty

Isn't there a moratorium on your posts? Like 2 weeks or something.

Aren't there some loose ball recovery seminars you could attend? The ninjitsu school of fumble recovery ? N.S.F.R.-N.Y. :ph34r:
(Frikkin 8 out of 9 fumbles recovered . . . FML) :(


Well we know Bill loves Reggie Wayne, but does he really seem to be declining? Did anybody get to watch much of him this year? Colts weren't really at the top of my watch list this season . . .

#50 BigJimEd

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Posted 08 February 2012 - 10:48 AM

Every year, there are multiple UDFA WR who make teams and an impact. Wes Welker is a good example. Victor Cruz, another.

Not necessarily disagreeing with your overall plan but how many UDFA or late round guys contribute significantly in their rookie season?

Not to mention the Patriots track record with college WRs isn't great. I think the odds of finding a late round or UDFA that can contribute next year for the Pats is slim. Not something i would want them to rely on.

I'd be hesitant to guarantee large money to Welker down the road though and wouldn't be surprised to see him play under the franchise tag. If Wallace is available and the Pats go after him then I think they look to move Welker. Wallace is young and would probably fit into the offense nicely. With him on the outside they could probably get by with Edleman type in the slot. I just don't see it happening.


More realistically, I see Welker playing under the tag or a cap friendly long term deal that allows the Pats an out after a couple season with a limited cap hit. And then singing a 2nd tier guy like Meachem who is still fairly young and is used to being the 2nd, 3rd or even 4th option.




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