231 replies to this topic

[Jungleland]

Am I wrong in the assumption that Vjax is too much of a me first guy? Or am I simply overreacting to his holdout and subsequent inconsistent play this year?

[phragle]

First, Bill did change his scheme this season and it was largely because of Haynesworth & Carter, two 4-3 DL who had a stated preference for that alignment. And Carter did rush ~100% of the time; he wasn't asked to drop in coverage very often, if at all. The Pats went to more 3-4 looks late in the season, but when Anderson was on the field, he was ~100% rushing, as well.

Well I think the lockout was the biggest reason we switched, and that Carter and Haynesworth were picked up after the decision was made to run the 43.

My point with "strict DE" is that BB prefers to have a guy who can do more than just rush the passer from the DE/OLB spot; he'd prefer a Willie McGinest or Lawrence Taylor who CAN rush ~100% of the time, and probably does in most games, but can also drop into coverage to mix things up.

If Williams were to come here, I have no doubt he'd be used 95%+ to rush the passer, i.e. do what he's best at/play to his strengths. But his experience - even limited - in 3-4 under Wade Phillips makes him more versatile and more likely "BB bait".

In any case, we're saying the same thing - pass rush is a need, Williams would fit that need, the Pats scheme requires a pass rusher who can rarely drop into coverage when necessary and one who can reliably set the edge. Williams can do all that, which makes him a better fit in BB's scheme than Andre Carter, for example.

I don't think we're far apart either, but I think Mario is more like Reggie White than like Lawrence Taylor.

[ragnarok725]

I've got some other stuff to add here, but a heck of a lot of talk here about replacing Brian Waters... and I'm not sure why. He signed a 2 year deal before the season and played at a Pro Bowl level. I've got to believe he'll honor the contract and come back for another shot at a ring, seeing as this team should be as good or better next year with the draft and cap situation they've got.

http://www.arrowhead...triots-released

Brian Waters signed a two-year contract with the Pats worth up to $5.5 million. Since the contract is signed before the season begins, it becomes a guaranteed deal as well compared to the veteran deals handed out after the first week of the season every year.

[jsinger121]

I've got some other stuff to add here, but a heck of a lot of talk here about replacing Brian Waters... and I'm not sure why. He signed a 2 year deal before the season and played at a Pro Bowl level. I've got to believe he'll honor the contract and come back for another shot at a ring, seeing as this team should be as good or better next year with the draft and cap situation they've got.

http://www.arrowhead...triots-released
[/left][/size][/font][/color]

Waters has talked about retirement I believe after last nights game. So that is a possibility.

[BigJimEd]

Waters is contemplating retirement

though he signed 2yr deal in August, Brian Waters said he'll take 2-3wks to decide his future

[soxfan121]

Well I think the lockout was the biggest reason we switched, and that Carter and Haynesworth were picked up after the decision was made to run the 43.



I don't think we're far apart either, but I think Mario is more like Reggie White than like Lawrence Taylor.

Chicken or egg? I think the 4-3 switch was prompted by the lockout and the decision was made based on the available talent (i.e. Washington's desire to dump Fat Albert, Carter being UFA) but either way the decision to "tweak" the scheme and incorporate a more traditional 4-3 look (complete with the disaster that was man-2-man press coverage) with DE's who didn't drop into coverage. By the end of the season that had been scrapped - both because of Fat Albert washing out and Carter getting hurt - and the Pats were using a 3-4 alignment in some situations - but Anderson was still rushing full-time. So was it a "switch" or what? Verbiage....the bottom line is that BB will be flexible, based on the available talent.

As for a comp for Williams, I see him more like McGinest than Taylor or White, personally. Willie sucked at dropping into coverage - Parcells used to bitch about it all the time - but he was capable of occasionally executing the zone blitz and letting Bruschi rush while he covered a short zone. That's what I'd envision for Williams - rushing 95% or more of the time but not a complete disaster if BB wants to send Spikes & Mayo up the middle and drop the DE/OLB into a short zone to take away a crossing route.

And whoever wants to get rid of Waters should be shot. Waters was great and if he wants to come back, he comes back. Cannon can use another year of development. The OL is pretty well set, given the two young tackles (presuming Vollmer's health), Mankins and Cannon. A young developmental C to back up Connolly or Koppen would be nice.

[RedOctober3829]

my bad, did not refresh before answering.

Edited by RedOctober3829, 06 February 2012 - 12:08 PM.

[the1andonly3003]

I'll bet you 10 million dollars we don't sign Matt Tolbert.

http://mlb.mlb.com/t...layer_id=445196

Mike...Matt...big difference...but Mike Tolbert/Peyton Hillis pounding type of a RB would complement well with the stable of RBs we have on this roster

if anything, the Patriots need to look hard at building depth (and lots of it) on this team - given this team's injury pone past as well as the Super Bowl loser curse

2010: Steelers - lots of injuries, knocked out in the first round
2009: Colts - tons of injuries the next season
2008: Cardinals - wasn't the same team, although Warner did retire
2007: Patriots - Brady goes down in first play of next season

The list goes on and on...Super Bowl losing teams always regress the next season. Patriots need to make sure not to regress.

[( . ) ( . ) and (_!_)]

Mike...Matt...big difference...but Mike Tolbert/Peyton Hillis pounding type of a RB would complement well with the stable of RBs we have on this roster

if anything, the Patriots need to look hard at building depth (and lots of it) on this team - given this team's injury pone past as well as the Super Bowl loser curse

2010: Steelers - lots of injuries, knocked out in the first round
2009: Colts - tons of injuries the next season
2008: Cardinals - wasn't the same team, although Warner did retire
2007: Patriots - Brady goes down in first play of next season

The list goes on and on...Super Bowl losing teams always regress the next season. Patriots need to make sure not to regress.

The 2008 Patriots went 11-5 without Tom Brady. They missed the playoffs, but that was an oddity at 11-5.

[Corsi]

Probably a pipe dream, but what would it take to pry Michael Bush away from the Raiders? I doubt they'd be interested in moving him considering how fragile McFadden is, but I think Bush would be a star here.

[Three10toLeft]

Probably a pipe dream, but what would it take to pry Michael Bush away from the Raiders? I doubt they'd be interested in moving him considering how fragile McFadden is, but I think Bush would be a star here.

New offensive coordinator Greg Knapp is expected to install a zone-blocking scheme in Oakland.

Darren McFadden never flourished under former coach Tom Cable's zone-blocking scheme, only emerging once Hue Jackson molded the offense to his strengths. ESPN's John Clayton suggests the Raiders will have to decide whether to re-sign free agent Michael Bush or trade McFadden this offseason. Knapp has been a decidedly run-heavy play-caller, though it's odd that the Raiders are now installing an offense that won't cater to the skills of its most dynamic player. Beat writer Steve Corkran suggested last week that McFadden could be dangled as a trade chip for new GM Reggie McKenzie. Feb 2 - 6:57 PM

Source: John Clayton on Twitter

[Shelterdog]

Jeez, I know we're all a bit on edge today but could you PLEASE do some basic fact checking before playing uneducated contrarian?

I'm competely educated on this subject. He's probably one of the 15 best players in the NFL and he's getting franchised and, in all probability, signed to a monster long term contract. This is NFL roster management 101: re-sign superstar pass rushers.

[bowiac]

Mike...Matt...big difference...but Mike Tolbert/Peyton Hillis pounding type of a RB would complement well with the stable of RBs we have on this roster

if anything, the Patriots need to look hard at building depth (and lots of it) on this team - given this team's injury pone past as well as the Super Bowl loser curse

2010: Steelers - lots of injuries, knocked out in the first round
2009: Colts - tons of injuries the next season
2008: Cardinals - wasn't the same team, although Warner did retire
2007: Patriots - Brady goes down in first play of next season

The list goes on and on...Super Bowl losing teams always regress the next season. Patriots need to make sure not to regress.

I don't think there's anything inherent about being a Super Bowl loser that makes you regress. Three of those teams won at least 10 games, and the one that didn't lost their QB.

I'd bet money on the Patriots winning more games than the Giants next year.

[soxfan121]

I'm competely educated on this subject. He's probably one of the 15 best players in the NFL and he's getting franchised and, in all probability, signed to a monster long term contract. This is NFL roster management 101: re-sign superstar pass rushers.

Care to address HOW it's gonna happen? Even Texan fans aren't as positive as you are and they're pretty well versed in their own team's needs/situation.

Instead of bold proclamations, how about "I'm pretty sure the Texans will do everything they can to re-sign Williams and if they don't it's because he wants $20M/season, which means he's not coming to NE." THAT, I can buy. THAT is a statement that can't really be argued with because it doesn't beg an obvious question - if the Texans are going to franchise Williams , A.) where are they getting the cap space and B.) what are they doing with Foster, Myers, Demps and their other UFAs and 2012 needs?

[phragle]

Chicken or egg? I think the 4-3 switch was prompted by the lockout and the decision was made based on the available talent (i.e. Washington's desire to dump Fat Albert, Carter being UFA) but either way the decision to "tweak" the scheme and incorporate a more traditional 4-3 look (complete with the disaster that was man-2-man press coverage) with DE's who didn't drop into coverage. By the end of the season that had been scrapped - both because of Fat Albert washing out and Carter getting hurt - and the Pats were using a 3-4 alignment in some situations - but Anderson was still rushing full-time. So was it a "switch" or what? Verbiage....the bottom line is that BB will be flexible, based on the available talent.

As for a comp for Williams, I see him more like McGinest than Taylor or White, personally. Willie sucked at dropping into coverage - Parcells used to bitch about it all the time - but he was capable of occasionally executing the zone blitz and letting Bruschi rush while he covered a short zone. That's what I'd envision for Williams - rushing 95% or more of the time but not a complete disaster if BB wants to send Spikes & Mayo up the middle and drop the DE/OLB into a short zone to take away a crossing route.

95% is too high, IMO. Also Anderson isn't blitzing anywhere near 100% of the time. He has been playing the Weak OLB (Vrabel's role) that rushes probably like 50% depending on the DC. Now he rushed a lot yesterday, but that's because we were in the nickel most of the game.

I still think a 4-3 team offers him more money to play end, because he is just better at it. He doesn't have any weaknesses there.

If you had to rate how good Williams is at a particular position in relation to all the other players at that position, how would he rate? At 43 end he would be a 10 of 10 for me, at 34 end he'd be a 9.5, and at 34 SAM he'd be a 9.

Maybe the 43 team with a need and cap space doesn't exist, but I don't know where to find cap figures.

[Hendu for Kutch]

Who was the last superstar FA the Pats brought in? Adalius Thomas? I know this was in part due to trying to figure out the Richard Seymour / Vince Wilfork situation, but I just don't think it's realistic they bring in a big name like Bowe / Williams / Nicks.

With the amount of cap space they have, anything is realistic at this point. People forget what a huge acquisition Colvin was at the time they got him, largely I think because of his hip injury that made him less effective afterwards.

Anyways, people have always said "Belichick never does...." right up until he does it. He'd never used a 1st round pick on a guard...until he picked Mankins. He would never use a high pick on a LB, he only trusts veterans...until they took Mayo.

[soxfan121]

95% is too high, IMO. Also Anderson isn't blitzing anywhere near 100% of the time. He has been playing the Weak OLB (Vrabel's role) that rushes probably like 50% depending on the DC. Now he rushed a lot yesterday, but that's because we were in the nickel most of the game.

I still think a 4-3 team offers him more money to play end, because he is just better at it. He doesn't have any weaknesses there.

If you had to rate how good Williams is at a particular position in relation to all the other players at that position, how would he rate? At 43 end he would be a 10 of 10 for me, at 34 end he'd be a 9.5, and at 34 SAM he'd be a 9.

Maybe the 43 team with a need and cap space doesn't exist, but I don't know where to find cap figures.

I'd have to re-watch games for Anderson to "know" how much he was rushing - and I ain't doing that for a month or so - but my faulty recollection is that Anderson was rotating wtih Deaderick on "passing downs" and rushing when he was on the field. Can't recall seeing him drop into coverage, but again - faulty memory, lots of alcohol consumption in the past 24 hours, etc.

I'd rate Williams a 9.5 across the board; I've always thought he was a bit susceptible to the run but that's usual for a pass rush demon. I watched more of him this year in the 3-4 than I had since his rookie year and it seemed to me that he was OK in space. Again, since I think the world of Willie McGinest and he was, at best, OK in space, I keep comping the two. I think Williams is a bit quicker and stronger; Willie was smarter and had better football instincts.

[Kenny F'ing Powers]

(6) and (7) I think it would be good to re-sign both Ellis and Anderson, because (a) they were very helpful this year, and (b) I don't think they'll cost that much.

Ellis? Really?

Define "very helpful". The guy was a complete dud this season and showed up for a few plays in the postseason. All for the low low cost of 4 million dollars (9th highest on the team). I think Ellis signs a one-day deal with the Jets and retires. Dudes toast.

[Shelterdog]

Care to address HOW it's gonna happen? Even Texan fans aren't as positive as you are and they're pretty well versed in their own team's needs/situation.

Instead of bold proclamations, how about "I'm pretty sure the Texans will do everything they can to re-sign Williams and if they don't it's because he wants $20M/season, which means he's not coming to NE." THAT, I can buy. THAT is a statement that can't really be argued with because it doesn't beg an obvious question - if the Texans are going to franchise Williams , A.) where are they getting the cap space and B.) what are they doing with Foster, Myers, Demps and their other UFAs and 2012 needs?

Well the franchise tag number is an awful lot so you do try very hard to re-sign him to a deal with a relatively light salary in 2012 but a huge signing bonus and a bigass option bonus in year two. You probably

Care to address HOW it's gonna happen? Even Texan fans aren't as positive as you are and they're pretty well versed in their own team's needs/situation.

Instead of bold proclamations, how about "I'm pretty sure the Texans will do everything they can to re-sign Williams and if they don't it's because he wants $20M/season, which means he's not coming to NE." THAT, I can buy. THAT is a statement that can't really be argued with because it doesn't beg an obvious question - if the Texans are going to franchise Williams , A.) where are they getting the cap space and B.) what are they doing with Foster, Myers, Demps and their other UFAs and 2012 needs?

They'll get cap space the same way every team gets cap space: they'll restructure some deals and cut some veterans. Antonio Smith and Owen Daniels are both good but overpaid and a little older-they could easily be cut or have their contracts restructured. They can save $3 million by cutting Matt Leinart. There's always a way to get one player onto the team. Sure it sucks for them that maybe they lose a guy like Demps or Meyers but those are the breaks when you have a good team.

The franchise tag does give them an incentive to extend Williams to a more cap-friendly deal, which is easy enough to do (low first year salary, big signing bonus, big roster bonus in year two of the deal).

[soxfan121]

First, if the Texans franchise Williams, the starting point on negotiations is ~$20M/season. So his agent would derelict if he didn't get Williams at least $20M in real money in year one, even if the salary is low and the bonus is high. Second, the option bonus in year two would need to be guaranteed, otherwise, if Williams gets hurt he loses that money. So we're at $40M guaranteed, without yearly salaries or additional bonuses.

So yeah, if the Texans are willing to say goodbye to all their pending UFAs, to risk Foster by using an RFA tender instead of signing him long term and to thin their depth (especially at QB/OL/RB), then yes, the Texans could franchise Williams.

I think it more likely that the Texans sign all of their UFAs, sign Foster to an extension, fill a few holes in FA, sign their draft picks and let Williams walk. They build their defense (going forward) around Cushing and Watt.

In any case, the Patriots should be looking to use their cap space on defensive help, whether it's Williams or someone else. The Pats, because of how well they've structured things, could pay Mario Williams whatever Mario Williams wants to be paid. (So could Tampa Bay, FWIW) It's nice to root for a team that doesn't need to contemplate cutting contributors so they can retain "one player".

[TheoShmeo]

A lot of people are pegging Brandon Lloyd as the WR free agent. The connection with McDaniels and Lloyd's comments after Josh joined the Pats make that prediction seems plausible.

I haven't seen much of Lloyd recently. I'd love to read the thoughts of folks who have seen him a lot in the last several years and whether they think his game and strengths would fit well in NE. That he succeeded in a McDaneils offense suggests that he would, but if anyone has more to offer regarding how Lloyd might fit into the Pats system, please share them.

[dcmissle]

A lot of people are pegging Brandon Lloyd as the WR free agent. The connection with McDaniels and Lloyd's comments after Josh joined the Pats make that prediction seems plausible.

I haven't seen much of Lloyd recently. I'd love to read the thoughts of folks who have seen him a lot in the last several years and whether they think his game and strengths would fit well in NE. That he succeeded in a McDaneils offense suggests that he would, but if anyone has more to offer regarding how Lloyd might fit into the Pats system, please share them.

Having endured quite enough for any 24-hour period, you DON'T want to know how he *performed* in a Redskins uniform. If we sign him, just assume due diligence has been done, write it off to Redskins' dysfunction and go on your merry way.

[Reardons Beard]

What the CB market look like - or any DB for that matter?

[Reverend]

What the CB market look like - or any DB for that matter?

Going that direction depends greatly on: 1) The McCourty Issue (I wonder if he hasn't been hurt even if not fully injured) and 2) I-Dowling. I don't know that we have enough information to even speculation on what BB thinks about this situation with respect to CB.

A safety would be nice though.

[soxfan121]

Having endured quite enough for any 24-hour period, you DON'T want to know how he *performed* in a Redskins uniform. If we sign him, just assume due diligence has been done, write it off to Redskins' dysfunction and go on your merry way.

This. I really want no part of Lloyd; there will be better, other options on the market. The McDaniels factor is overrated; the guy has more than a little Haynesworth in him.

[soxfan121]

http://www.kffl.com/...ption=DB&y=2012

Most intriguing names on the list (IMO)
Brent Grimes
Carlos Rogers
Brandon Carr
Cortland Finnegan
Rashean Mathis
Ronde Barber
Terrell Thomas

Edited by soxfan121, 06 February 2012 - 10:10 PM.

[Soxy Brown]

This. I really want no part of Lloyd; there will be better, other options on the market. The McDaniels factor is overrated; the guy has more than a little Haynesworth in him.

I could be mistaken, but I think you're misinterpreting dcmissle. Who cares that he played like crap 6-7 years ago in Washington? Besides that, I have an honest question: What are you basing your opinion on? I know he had a rep as a diva when he first entered the league, but he's put up good-to-great numbers playing with some mediocre (at best) QBs the past two seasons. Expecting a repeat of 2010 is unrealistic, but I think Lloyd can provide a nice complement to this offense. He can be an outside WR that works the sidelines, something this team could greatly benefit from. He seemingly shares a mutual affection with McDaniels. Given that, I find it hard to believe that the guy isn't a worker. I can't see McDaniels tolerating a slacker who won't put in a full effort, which is where Haynesworth seemingly went astray.

This is a ridiculously deep FA WR class. Lloyd could be somewhat overlooked and come at a fairly reasonable price. He brings an athleticism that this team sorely needs at the WR position. He says he wants to play for McDaniels, he'll be able to grasp the scheme, he fills a need, and I don't think he'll be as overvalued as FAs typically are. Frankly, I'll be pissed if they don't sign Lloyd. I can't think of any reason not to pursue him. As if his talent wasn't enough, the fact that he'll have a huge leg up on learning the offense (compared to other potential WR additions) makes him a no-brainer.

[jp9183]

If we don`t draft a center or re-sign Koppen. Do we go for Jeff Saturday?

[Kid T]

The Pats have a really good core, and among their own key free agents are Wes Welker, Andre Carter, Dan Koppen, BJGE, Deion Branch, Shaun Ellis, and Mark Anderson.

My two cents:

(1) Don't re-sign Koppen - Connolly did a really good job and I think they're fine without Koppen. Let him sign for several million elsewhere. I mean, if he takes a big hometown discount, fine, but they don't need him.

(2) Franchise Wes Welker or try to get him to sign a 2-year deal for less AAV. Anyone that wants this guy gone is nuts. He's a warrior.

(3) Re-sign Carter, but don't do it for too much. Another one-year deal or a two-year deal for less AAV. He was terrific for NE this year but he is on the back 9 of his career for sure.

(4) I'd love to have Lawfirm back, but I have a feeling he's going to be offered a bigger deal from someone else. I don't know that I'd spend a ton to keep him, though, really, his ball security is incredible.

(5) I don't think Branch is a big priority. The one thing that holds me back, though, on that opinion is that he and Brady do have good chemistry together. It's clear that not any new WR can come into this offense and get with it, so there's value in having Branch around. Maybe keep him on a pretty cheap deal as the 3rd WR or something.

(6) and (7) I think it would be good to re-sign both Ellis and Anderson, because (a) they were very helpful this year, and (b) I don't think they'll cost that much.

Now, the Pats are in GREAT shape vis-a-vis the cap. They have at least $20 million to spend, and that's before any cuts are made. They're in the best shape of any AFCE team. They have money to spend. I think getting Brandon Lloyd is almost a certainty. With Josh McDaniels on board, Lloyd will know the offense already, he's proven he can be effective in it, and Lloyd has said he wants to be where McDaniels is. I think they can get him for less than what other teams can. Having a big burner like Lloyd would be a HUGE help to the offense.

I think Lloyd would be an incredible complement to Welker if he comes at a reasonable price. I've seen some comments lately that he is interested in re-signing with St. Louis though (although it could be his agent coaching him to leave his options open).

On defense, I'd try to add another pass-rusher and a cover guy, preferably a safety. The pass-rusher I'd prefer is Cliff Avril of Detroit. Just 25 years old, he had 11 sacks for the Lions last year. He's a RFA, so they will try to keep him or franchise him. But apparently he isn't interested in the franchise tag (who is?). Nonetheless, the Pats may trade a pick for him. I'd love to have that guy....dominant speed rusher.

I think I read that Detroit is currently up against the cap so they may not be able to sign him. That having been said, I imagine there will be tremendous competition for him. He would look awesome in a Pats uniform. Signing Avril, bringing back Carter and Anderson, and adding a stud OLB in the draft would give BB a ton of options on building a strong pass rush from multiple fronts.

we need to boost our RBs...how about adding Jason Snelling into the mix or a hard hitting Matt Tolbert

I think we see Ridley replacing BJG and Vereen replacing Faulk. Throw Woodhead in the mix and that's probably our RB situation for next year. I think they also add a mid/late draft pick who also can contribute on special teams.

[Super Nomario]

Grantland had a good article on the 3-4 / 4-3 hybrid front the Pats have been running:
http://www.grantland...atriots-defense

Bottom line: the Pats ran a hybrid of 3-4 and 4-3 this year with combination of 1-gap and 2-gap techniques. I think this strategy makes sense going forward, as it lets them incorporate both classic 3-4 and 4-3 personnel. I don't think they'll get Williams, but if they did they could use him and Love or Brace to one side of Wilfork in one-gap techniques with Deaderick and Pryor to the other side lined up in a two-gap on the end.

[jsinger121]

A couple of free agent FS I would consider. Reggie Nelson had a very good year for Cincinnati along with Titans FS Michael Griffin. Both are free agents.

[Section15Box113]

I think I read that Detroit is currently up against the cap so they may not be able to sign him. That having been said, I imagine there will be tremendous competition for him. He would look awesome in a Pats uniform. Signing Avril, bringing back Carter and Anderson, and adding a stud OLB in the draft would give BB a ton of options on building a strong pass rush from multiple fronts.

From back in 2008:
AVRIL TALKS OF SCHEDULED VISIT TO NEW ENGLAND: The Pittsburgh Tribune-Review catches up with Purdue DE/OLB Cliff Avril after Avril's pre-draft visit to the Steelers. In the piece, Avril notes that he is scheduled to take a pre-draft visit to New England. At 6-foot-3, 253 pounds, Avril would likely project to outside linebacker in the Patriots' 3-4 scheme, and could also play with his hand on the ground in sub packages. It is possible he could project to inside linebacker as well.

Reiss - April 5, 2008: http://www.boston.co..._points_39.html

Anyone remember how that visit went?

Apparently, at the time, BB liked Crable more (pick 78) than Avril (pick 92 to Detroit). That said, if Avril made a good impression...


Edit: to jsinger's post, we had Griffin in as well, IIRC. Don't remember about Nelson off the top of my head. Edit to the Edit: Yep. BB had Nelson in too FWIW.

Edited by Section15Box113, 07 February 2012 - 10:58 AM.

[Marbleheader]

Though they may only be able to get one via trade, I'm ready for Brady to have his Corey Dillon Part II. I can still remember Gil after his first game or two saying "Now that is an NFL running back'. Lawfirm is very good and reliable. Ridley showed flashes. I'm convinced a bona fide stud at RB next season would help Brady and McDaniels immensely in getting this team back to the Super Bowl. I think Brady needs that balance as he gets older. It may well be they key to ring #4.

[jsinger121]

Though they may only be able to get one via trade, I'm ready for Brady to have his Corey Dillon Part II. I can still remember Gil after his first game or two saying "Now that is an NFL running back'. Lawfirm is very good and reliable. Ridley showed flashes. I'm convinced a bona fide stud at RB next season would help Brady and McDaniels immensely in getting this team back to the Super Bowl. I think Brady needs that balance as he gets older. It may well be they key to ring #4.

Make a poison pill offer to restricted free agent Arian Foster and there is your Corey Dillon Part Deux.

[BigSoxFan]

Though they may only be able to get one via trade, I'm ready for Brady to have his Corey Dillon Part II. I can still remember Gil after his first game or two saying "Now that is an NFL running back'. Lawfirm is very good and reliable. Ridley showed flashes. I'm convinced a bona fide stud at RB next season would help Brady and McDaniels immensely in getting this team back to the Super Bowl. I think Brady needs that balance as he gets older. It may well be they key to ring #4.

I doubt we'd go that route with Ridley already in house but a guy I've always liked is Steven Jackson. Problem with him is that he's had 8 full seasons of wear and tear on his body.

[Shelterdog]

Make a poison pill offer to restricted free agent Arian Foster and there is your Corey Dillon Part Deux.

Isn't it likely that the Texans tender him at a first round (or even the first and third round pick) level? If they tender him a second, sure, but otherwise he's pretty expensive.

[RedOctober3829]

If we don`t draft a center or re-sign Koppen. Do we go for Jeff Saturday?

I'd rather go with Scott Wells of Green Bay.

[jsinger121]

Isn't it likely that the Texans tender him at a first round (or even the first and third round pick) level? If they tender him a second, sure, but otherwise he's pretty expensive.

Tender amount Compensation required
$2.562 million First- and third-round
$2.017 million First-round
$1.417 million Second-round
$927,000 Determined by RFA's original draft status

Edited by jsinger121, 07 February 2012 - 11:10 AM.

[Eck'sSneakyCheese]

Too bad about the achilles injury for Laron Landry. I wonder how much it's going to affect him moving forward? He's an amazing safety. Don't know why but I've always liked Finnegan from the Titans too. He has a reputation for being an ass, but he's really physical and has pretty decent awareness. I think we need that kind of Rodney Harrison type of DB moving forward. The D needs some attitude in the secondary.

[collings94]

Mario Williams won't reach free agency, he seems happy in Houston and that looks like a good situation to be in. I think this team could really use a true deep threat. A burner with good size could really benefiet the Patriots.

[jsinger121]

Mario Williams won't reach free agency, he seems happy in Houston and that looks like a good situation to be in. I think this team could really use a true deep threat. A burner with good size could really benefiet the Patriots.

Money talks and if the Texans can't make the money work there then he goes somewhere else likely.

[phragle]

Money talks and if the Texans can't make the money work there then he goes somewhere else likely.

So you just want to sign Mario Williams and Arian Foster? Have any other fantasies you'd like to fulfill? Perhaps we should sign Drew Brees to be our backup so we can trade Brian Hoyer for Ed Reed.

[Hendu for Kutch]

So you just want to sign Mario Williams and Arian Foster? Have any other fantasies you'd like to fulfill? Perhaps we should sign Drew Brees to be our backup so we can trade Brian Hoyer for Ed Reed.

Can I borrow your Jumping To Conclusions mat? Where did he say that? He said Foster would be Dillon Part II and Williams might sign somewhere else if Houston doesn't come up with the money.

[ivanvamp]

If we don`t draft a center or re-sign Koppen. Do we go for Jeff Saturday?

I would love Saturday as a backup to Connolly. Kraft loves the guy and he isn't going to play for Indy. Not sure he can hold up as a starter at this point, but he's still a guy I'd check into.

I'm in for Lloyd - big play WR, knows McDaniels' system, wants to be with McDaniels, so maybe he comes inexpensively. Fills a huge, huge need. Him and WW on the outside, Branch as the 3rd WR (because he still can be useful), with Gronk/Hernandez in the two TE set. That's a pretty good lineup.

[Morning Woodhead]

http://www.kffl.com/...ption=DB&y=2012

Most intriguing names on the list (IMO)
Brent Grimes
Carlos Rogers
Brandon Carr
Cortland Finnegan
Rashean Mathis
Ronde Barber
Terrell Thomas

I would love to get Grimes if the Falcons don't franchise him. It wouldn't surprise me if Devin McCourty starts camp at FS. Grimes would be a perfect fit, but he'd also cost a decent chunk of change.

[tims4wins]

No chance that Saturday signs as a backup. One, because I think he will hang em up if he can't find a starting job. Two, the Pats MO with their backup O lineman has ALWAYS been to develop guys. I can't remember a single veteran they've ever had as a backup.

[phragle]

Can I borrow your Jumping To Conclusions mat? Where did he say that? He said Foster would be Dillon Part II and Williams might sign somewhere else if Houston doesn't come up with the money.

Try reading the thread.

I think Williams would fit very well into this scheme. They played 4-3 and 3-4 thoughout this season. He is exactly the type of player they need. Young, disruptive who will command double teams and brings an impact on defense. To me he is the type of guy you invest in to elevate the defense to the next level.

Bingo....this is exactly what the Pats need. He is at the age where you pay him the type of money he will command. As much as everyone wanted Peppers a few years ago he was 30 at the time while Williams is 27 and still getting better and he showed early on that he can play in a 3-4 defense along with a 4-3. This is the time to back up the Brinks Truck because this is not another Adalius Thomas.

And the best part about Mario Williams is he only will cost you cash. You won't have to give up any draft picks for him.

Make a poison pill offer to restricted free agent Arian Foster and there is your Corey Dillon Part Deux.

[jsinger121]

Houston is going to sign one of the two. Its more likely its Foster but they better not do it via just a restricted offer tag because Foster will get poached by another team. They are more likely to let Williams go with Watt, Barwin, Reed and Cushing and Ryans on defense.

[Hendu for Kutch]

Try reading the thread.

Sure. Still looking for the part where he suggested we sign both rather than just mentioning that either of them would be a good sign.

[phragle]

Houston is going to sign one of the two. Its more likely its Foster but they better not do it via just a restricted offer tag because Foster will get poached by another team. They are more likely to let Williams go with Watt, Barwin, Reed and Cushing and Ryans on defense.

I agree.

Sure. Still looking for the part where he suggested we sign both rather than just mentioning that either of them would be a good sign.

Cool story. He said we need a guy like Williams, and then said we should make a poison pill offer to Foster. He never said either.

QED