25 replies to this topic

[SeoulSoxFan]

Not to trade him, or lose him in retirement, but to surround him with an above average D and playing mistake free football.

Eli outplayed Brady again, but he could have just been on the other end too. What tonight's loss tells me some few well-worn cliches:

1. Too much on reliance QB play is risky
2. Complete (not just the defense) team wins championships
3. Mental toughness counts -- Eli had it one over Brady

As Brady goes into the last 3-5 years of his career, I'm convinced more than ever that you can't count on a magical QB play to always bring home the trophy (Eli won 2, but has had many more failures too).

Draft another CB, sign a veteran safety, draft an edge rusher, and bring back Carter. With Chung, Mayo, Spikes, and yes, even Nink on board, it's time to win "without" Brady.

[mascho]

First, kudos to you for starting this thread. I couldn't bring myself to do it.

Someone mentioned in the game thread that we're entering the Elway Super Bowl Era with Brady. He needs some help. He needs a stud RB, his Terrell Davis. He needs to have a D that can force some stops when needed (although the D did fairly well tonight). An edge rusher and secondary help would be huge.

[jsinger121]

Sign Mario Williams
Love to get Mark Barron to team next to Chung
Bring back Anderson and Carter

[Ed Hillel]

How did Eli have mental toughness over Brady? Eli's receivers made great plays at the end and Brady's, well, dropped the ball.

[SeoulSoxFan]

One of the podcasts had Pioli saying they were planning the free agency and submission of possible picks to then-expanding Houston on the plane ride home from the SB win.

Perhaps it's the adrenaline masking the pain, but I hope the wheel starts to turn soon, and get ready for the next season.

The most admirable thing about the Pats is to put the last game behind them. This one is almost impossible to do in short time, but it's the best thing to do if & when the Pats win the next one.

[Frisbetarian]

Fuck Eli outplayed Brady. If Wes Welker catches a ball that 90%+ NLF receivers catch the Pats win the game and Brady is MVP.

[SeoulSoxFan]

How did Eli have mental toughness over Brady? Eli's receivers made great plays at the end and Brady's, well, dropped the ball.

I thought the throw to Welker was more on Brady than Welker. Plus the long throw in the middle to Branch. Brady played very well, but Eli did what he did with the game on the line.

[scottyno]

how did eli outplay brady, im as pissed as anyone, but keep in mind what secondary each was facing, I really only remember 1 bad pass brady threw all day and ab unch of drops

[ilol@u]

I don't know. Brady did carry this team for the entire season (besides the Baltimore game). I mean the guy threw 5200+ yards and 39 TDs. I think changing the personnel and the system just because of one game is silly. I wouldn't mind getting a playmaker running back though, BJGE is very solid, but he is not a explosive playmaker.

[Mike in CT]

It's not the running back (particularly citing Terrell Davis), it's the scheme and the commitment to the running game. Undrafted T.D. or Arian Foster can run for 1800 yards in the Texans scheme. They couldn't do that in this current Patriots scheme.

[Rudy Pemberton]

Pats could have won either of the SB's they've lost. Or, lost any of the ones they've won. Odds are that Brady won't win another, but I don't think you make moves based on an assumption that he can't win this team another title, because he certainly can. I'm not too worried about the organization looking forward, they'll make moves in the same fashion they always have. Suggesting this team had some kind of flaw that prevented them from winning seems like an overreaction.

[Ed Hillel]

I thought the throw to Welker was more on Brady than Welker. Plus the long throw in the middle to Branch. Brady played very well, but Eli did what he did with the game on the line.

He couldn't lead Welker because of inside safety coverage. That's a standard catch for Welker to adjust to.

Either way, Brady was great tonight outside o the first play and a short throw on the Gronl ball, which is probably not an INT with healthy Gronk. Like I said in another thread , a healthy Gronk and they win. Also made some mental mistakes and had some bad luck on fumbles. It's a shame.

[Oogies Loogies]

I thought the throw to Welker was more on Brady than Welker. Plus the long throw in the middle to Branch. Brady played very well, but Eli did what he did with the game on the line.

This. I hope Welker doesn't become the goat for a poorly thrown ball. Felger's already puttingit on him.

[Rudy Pemberton]

Pats could have won either of the SB's they've lost. Or, lost any of the ones they've won. Odds are that Brady won't win another, but I don't think you make moves based on an assumption that he can't win this team another title, because he certainly can. I'm not too worried about the organization looking forward, they'll make moves in the same fashion they always have. Suggesting this team had some kind of flaw that prevented them from winning seems like an overreaction.

[Ed Hillel]

I thought the throw to Welker was more on Brady than Welker. Plus the long throw in the middle to Branch. Brady played very well, but Eli did what he did with the game on the line.

He couldn't lead Welker because of inside safety coverage. That's a standard catch for Welker to adjust to.

Either way, Brady was great tonight outside o the first play and a short throw on the Gronl ball, which is probably not an INT with healthy Gronk. Like I said in another thread , a healthy Gronk and they win. Also made some mental mistakes and had some bad luck on fumbles. It's a shame.

[dcmissle]

First, kudos to you for starting this thread. I couldn't bring myself to do it.

Someone mentioned in the game thread that we're entering the Elway Super Bowl Era with Brady. He needs some help. He needs a stud RB, his Terrell Davis. He needs to have a D that can force some stops when needed (although the D did fairly well tonight). An edge rusher and secondary help would be huge.

That would be me.

We were not getting it done with the 3-yard runs. I understand not playing Ridley, but one wonders if might have played out differently if they had the balls to play him.

The team may not be that far way if they can get a pass rush terror and some health at CB.

[SeoulSoxFan]

Pats could have won either of the SB's they've lost. Or, lost any of the ones they've won. Odds are that Brady won't win another, but I don't think you make moves based on an assumption that he can't win this team another title, because he certainly can. I'm not too worried about the organization looking forward, they'll make moves in the same fashion they always have. Suggesting this team had some kind of flaw that prevented them from winning seems like an overreaction.

Except you can't deny the continuing thread that runs through ALL losses -- not being able to close out with the lead, late in the 4th.

I don't think you can deny this team has flaws -- in fact it played above it. I'm saying Brady is still a top 3 QB in the league, surround him with a stout defense and it can compensate for any drop in Brady's play or an unfortunate/mental error plays like the Welker drop or the safety.

[dcmissle]

_{It's this simple [[ http://profootballta...e-enough-plays/}

[Harry Hooper]

Neither the O-line nor the D-line played well for the Pats in the 4th quarter. Other stuff is pretty much a distraction.

[SWHB]

Except you can't deny the continuing thread that runs through ALL losses -- not being able to close out with the lead, late in the 4th.

I don't think you can deny this team has flaws -- in fact it played above it. I'm saying Brady is still a top 3 QB in the league, surround him with a stout defense and it can compensate for any drop in Brady's play or an unfortunate/mental error plays like the Welker drop or the safety.

This is too simplistic, by far. Why didn't they close it out? Welker dropped a catchable, if not great, throw - was that because of some fundamental flaw with the team's construction? If the Pats recovered one of the Giants fumbles and put the game early (which doesn't seem far fetched), are we having this discussion? As in most losses, the Pats didn't take the lead on the last possesion; however, I don't think that this is an indication of any serious problem with the team. On any given Sunday and all that...

[RedOctober3829]

No excuses(injuries, etc) tonight. They did not make enough plays to win the game on both sides of the ball.

They have $26 million in cap room for next year. Targets in free agency would be a #1 corner(Carlos Rogers), a big-play outside receiver in addition to re-upping Welker (Brandon Lloyd or Robert Meachem), and possibly Carl Nicks if Brian Waters doesn't come back.

In the draft, I'd like to get Mark Barron and Nick Perry(DE/OLB USC).

[Three10toLeft]

No excuses(injuries, etc) tonight. They did not make enough plays to win the game on both sides of the ball.

They have $26 million in cap room for next year. Targets in free agency would be a #1 corner(Carlos Rogers), a big-play outside receiver in addition to re-upping Welker (Brandon Lloyd or Robert Meachem), and possibly Carl Nicks if Brian Waters doesn't come back.

In the draft, I'd like to get Mark Barron and Nick Perry(DE/OLB USC).

I don't follow much college football so I can't comment much on the draft.

But spending big money on a CB seems too much risk, not enough reward. Especially one coming off a career year like Rodgers. Reminds me of spending money on RP in baseball.

[RedOctober3829]

I don't follow much college football so I can't comment much on the draft.

But spending big money on a CB seems too much risk, not enough reward. Especially one coming off a career year like Rodgers. Reminds me of spending money on RP in baseball.

From looking at the absolute dogshit that's at corner right now, I'm not sure how you can't take the risk. You can't consistently count on scrap heap players to stop the WRs they have to face in this version of the NFL. It's either sign an elite guy in FA or trade up for a guy like Kirkpatrick or Claiborne. Other FA options are Brent Grimes or Cortland Finnegan.

[Three10toLeft]

I don't really see CB as a direct reason for losing this game though. Moore made some plays and Arrington was solid against the run. If you're gonna pour money on the defense, back the truck up for Mario Williams. The Giants secondary has been a punch line all year, but their DLine isn't. You can throw those scrap heap players on the field in the secondary if you can create a consistent pass rush.

I feel like we lost the game on offense without a healthy Gronk and a RB that we could hand the ball to that would have allowed us to sustain drives. The Patriots won rings when they had a more balanced attack. It's the FO's job to find a RB that can alleviate some pressure off of Tom. Or they need to tweak their system to compliment the skill sets of Ridley and Vereen and see what they have there. If they don't have a feature back between those two guys, then cut bait.

[SeoulSoxFan]

I wish for Ridley and Vereen to turn out to be even half of Gronk/Sweet Leaf next year. In fact that just could be the game plan.

Especially with both of their abilities to make catches out of the backfield, could be a much more effective outlet against a strong front-4.

This feels completely different than in 2007. I couldn't watch or talk about Pats for weeks. This year, the page already feels like it's turning.

[BucketOBalls]

From looking at the absolute dogshit that's at corner right now, I'm not sure how you can't take the risk. You can't consistently count on scrap heap players to stop the WRs they have to face in this version of the NFL. It's either sign an elite guy in FA or trade up for a guy like Kirkpatrick or Claiborne. Other FA options are Brent Grimes or Cortland Finnegan.

Go for Dline instead. If the line gets pressure, they don't need as much form the corners and BB did seem to do a good job coaching up guys(Sterling Moore). Pats need to get back to having the dominant line play they had in the dynasty years. Not sure they cna, but I think that's what they need.