152 replies to this topic

[tims4wins]

O'Brien a top candidate at Penn State

Schefter has been wrong plenty of times before, but thought this was thread-worthy. I've been pretty neutral on BOB over the past few years, but I can see why he is being given consideration for head coaching jobs, given what he has done with this offense since Moss was traded.

Edit: if BOB leaves, who becomes the next OC?? I think they have to look externally. It won't be Dante, it won't be Ivan fears. Tight ends coach is Brian Ferentz, but he is young into his coaching career. Chad O'Shea is the receivers coach, I don't know anything about him. George Godsey is an "offensive assistant", don't know anything about him either.

Edited by tims4wins, 06 January 2012 - 11:37 AM.

[SoxScout]

Bring back McDaniels and Mangini

[PaulinMyrBch]

Versus running a bottom line stating that contract details are being finalized with O'Brien and PSU...would this mean he finishes the season with the Pats? Can't imagine leaving the team right now.

[Mystic Merlin]

Yes, he isn't leaving the team before the postseason - that's nuts.

[BannedbyNYYFans.com]

Ian Rapoport

I spoke with O’Brien’s agent Joe Linta, who told me over the phone that his client’s goal is clear: “Everybody’s dream, like his, is to be an NFL coach.”

That is not to say he’s not interested in Penn State. It’s just, there has been no contact and no negotiations. He may be their top candidate, as reported, but nothing has progressed.

In addition, O’Brien won’t take anything without seeing what the NFL world has to offer. His star is as bright as possible now. He will sit back the next few days, see if any NFL teams come calling, then move forward. O’Brien is not ruling anything out. Just waiting.

Edited by BannedbyNYYFans.com, 01 January 2012 - 09:01 PM.

[Ed Hillel]

Mangini

Yeah, I'm guessing no on this one.

[bakahump]

Might be blasphemy....and is certainly early...but who would you like to see take over A.B. (after Belichick).

On the negative he is 59.

On the positive he still seems to have that "passion" (funny to say that about BB ) and his "genius" has lost nothing in the 10+ years he has been here (IE the game hasnt passed him by). He also doesnt seem to have any other aspirations (Politics, Broadcasting, College etc etc) and he seems to have no health issues.

I thought BOB would be a great heir apparent....problem of course is keeping (guys like) him around until BB decides to leave.

I thought Paul Johnson (GT Head Coach/Former Navy/Former Georgia Southern HC) might be a good replacement. Though the fact that he has never won with something other then the option offense and that he is 54yo (assuming BB sticks around another 5 years or something puts him at 59...) and has never been a coach of any level in the pros is probably me being romantic ("Hey a another Service acadaemy guy!! They can coach!")

[bradmahn]

If O'Brien does, in fact, leave for the Penn State job, or any other head coaching gig, one name to keep an eye on is Brian Daboll, OC, Miami Dolphins. He came up with the Patriots as WR coach before leaving for the Jets in 2006 to become a quarterbacks coach, eventually joining Mangini in CLE as the offensive coordinator. He's been limited by the talent on both of the squads when he was calling plays, but I think his experience all over the offense and his familiarity with the Patriots offensive philosophy and terminology make him an option to return here as OC. He seems to gameplan well against the Patriots when he's been up against them, and, unlike a McDaniels, a return to Foxborough won't be stigmatizing.

Offensive coordinator under Belichick and with Brady (not to mention the other talent on the team) is a fast track to a head coaching position (maybe even for the Patriots).

[Jinhocho]

I havent been too impressed w BoB. As such, I wont be super sad to see him go. I think it would be crazy to make him a head coach at this juncture. I think, given his college exp, he would be interesting for Penn State.

[Corsi]

I havent been too impressed w BoB. As such, I wont be super sad to see him go. I think it would be crazy to make him a head coach at this juncture. I think, given his college exp, he would be interesting for Penn State.

I'm not asking this with any snark, but what would O'Brien and this offense have to do to impress you?

[Kid T]

If O'Brien does, in fact, leave for the Penn State job, or any other head coaching gig, one name to keep an eye on is Brian Daboll, OC, Miami Dolphins. He came up with the Patriots as WR coach before leaving for the Jets in 2006 to become a quarterbacks coach, eventually joining Mangini in CLE as the offensive coordinator. He's been limited by the talent on both of the squads when he was calling plays, but I think his experience all over the offense and his familiarity with the Patriots offensive philosophy and terminology make him an option to return here as OC. He seems to gameplan well against the Patriots when he's been up against them, and, unlike a McDaniels, a return to Foxborough won't be stigmatizing.

I wonder if BB considers him persona non grata, for his "betrayal" in leaving with Mangini.

[Dick Pole Upside]

According to Holley's War Room, Daboll was one of the few who stood up to Coach Bill, but left in a snit when McDaniels was promoted over him (after recommending McDaniels original hire to BB). Daboll also had a few pissy things to say about the Pats while coaching both Cleveland and the NYJ. Not likely.

I know it would be a true long shot, but I'd like to see Spags get some consideration for DC. I'm not sold on Matty P. or Pep.

[bradmahn]

I wonder if BB considers him persona non grata, for his "betrayal" in leaving with Mangini.

According to Holley's War Room, Daboll was one of the few who stood up to Coach Bill, but left in a snit when McDaniels was promoted over him (after recommending McDaniels original hire to BB). Daboll also had a few pissy things to say about the Pats while coaching both Cleveland and the NYJ. Not likely.

I know it would be a true long shot, but I'd like to see Spags get some consideration for DC. I'm not sold on Matty P. or Pep.

Valid points, and good to know re: War Room.

[( . ) ( . ) and (_!_)]

According to Holley's War Room, Daboll was one of the few who stood up to Coach Bill, but left in a snit when McDaniels was promoted over him (after recommending McDaniels original hire to BB). Daboll also had a few pissy things to say about the Pats while coaching both Cleveland and the NYJ. Not likely.

I know it would be a true long shot, but I'd like to see Spags get some consideration for DC. I'm not sold on Matty P. or Pep.

Correct me if I'm wrong but isnt Spags a striaght 4-3 guy. I don't see how he is a fit if there is no versatility to his coaching repetoire. I get that he is a name and beat the crap out of the Pats in the superbowl, but how is he a fit?

[Mystic Merlin]

Spags isn't coming to NE.

EDIT - The consensus feeling is he's going to Philly, where he coached from '99-'06 and where his wife's family lives.

Edited by Mystic Merlin, 02 January 2012 - 04:43 PM.

[Jinhocho]

I'm not asking this with any snark, but what would O'Brien and this offense have to do to impress you?

I think BB diagnosed the offense - we had it in the tv special when the Jets exposed the Moss Welker offense. Insert Gronk and Hernandez. I give OB credit for helping develop it, but this is an amazing offense and this guy hasnt been a coordinator long, has no long term NFL experience, and the Josh MCD story should show everyone the perils of hiring the guy who throws up big numbers right out of the gate. I could understand hiring a RAC or Weis, but this stretches it.

[Tyrone Biggums]

You don't have to look far to see where Bill will go for his next coordinators, he hires from within, always. It's the same way that Bill Walsh and Parcells always did business, that being said I would laugh pretty hard if Mangini was ever named the quality control coach for the Patriots let alone the defensive coordinator. I think this season has shown that the Pats need a true DC, and quick.

Bill O' Brien I think is underrated as an OC, just as I feel we might have overrated Weis and McDaniels a little bit (obviously extremely talented but we do keep going back to them as the irreplaceable cogs on the wheel from the past). Having a coordinator essentially call out the franchise player on the sidelines speaks volumes to the amount of respect that he has in the locker room, that's what the head coach needs to be capable of, its one of the reasons that Brad Childress failed in Minnesota.

[Reverend]

You don't have to look far to see where Bill will go for his next coordinators, he hires from within, always. It's the same way that Bill Walsh and Parcells always did business, that being said I would laugh pretty hard if Mangini was ever named the quality control coach for the Patriots let alone the defensive coordinator. I think this season has shown that the Pats need a true DC, and quick.

I dunno about this--as others have posted, Belichick didn't get to put the full 3-4 system he wanted into place because of the shortened off-season. Therefore I think it's unlikely Belichick will draw too many conclusions from the problems they've had this year.

I'm also sort of impressed they can play at all with the personnel issues they've had.

[EddieYost]

If O'Brien ends up the HC of the Jags, you could make an argument that chewing out Brady on the sidelines was part of what got him the job. It certainly made him more visible, and I am sure impressed some.

[Tyrone Biggums]

I dunno about this--as others have posted, Belichick didn't get to put the full 3-4 system he wanted into place because of the shortened off-season. Therefore I think it's unlikely Belichick will draw too many conclusions from the problems they've had this year.

I'm also sort of impressed they can play at all with the personnel issues they've had.

I'll give you that, Bill the GM has not done his job in terms of drafting the right defensive personal in the secondary. However, the signings of Carter (we need to bring him back) and Anderson have been huge. I think he was at his best when he was concentrating on just being the HC/GM as opposed to the HC/DC/GM, that's a lot for anyone to do.

[( . ) ( . ) and (_!_)]

I'll give you that, Bill the GM has not done his job in terms of drafting the right defensive personal in the secondary. However, the signings of Carter (we need to bring him back) and Anderson have been huge. I think he was at his best when he was concentrating on just being the HC/GM as opposed to the HC/DC/GM, that's a lot for anyone to do.

No offense isn't stating that BB wears to many hats just made up conjecture from the papers and radio? Do you have any sources that cite belichick playing the role of DC as well? As bear a I can tell belichiks role hasn't changes much from what you read in patriots reign or saw in a football life. Not giving someone the DC job title is kind of a red herring here.

[dcmissle]

Valid points, and good to know re: War Room.

Hijack -- the book is a gem.

Among other things, it reveals how the Pats lost their way in drafting Maroney and Chad Jackson. The Pats scouts had no use for either of them, grading both poorly on work ethic and the skills the team deemed necessary at each position. Daboll flat out said he wanted no part of coaching Jackson.

The Pats had demanded of their scouts blunt bottom line assessments of college prospects. The scouts delivered brutal reviews on these two and were sick that both players remained high on the board on the eve of the draft and hoped that other teams would draft them (Pats' scouts were excluded from the War room during the draft). Pioli was sympathetic to the scouts' views on these two players.

BB was influenced by Urban Meyer on Jackson, and by two McDaniels on Maroney (Josh's brother Ben coached Maroney in college). It was the first time in the BB regime that so much outside influence weighed in on top draft choices, and was close to a breach of an unwritten rule between BB and Pioli that if either of them didn't want a guy, he would not be drafted.

Edited by dcmissle, 03 January 2012 - 09:59 AM.

[Smiling Joe Hesketh]

I'll give you that, Bill the GM has not done his job in terms of drafting the right defensive personal in the secondary. However, the signings of Carter (we need to bring him back) and Anderson have been huge. I think he was at his best when he was concentrating on just being the HC/GM as opposed to the HC/DC/GM, that's a lot for anyone to do.

They did draft Dowling only to see him get hurt.

Josh Barrett is also on IR.

[Smiling Joe Hesketh]

Hijack -- the book is a gem.

Among other things, it reveals how the Pats lost their way in drafting Maroney and Chad Jackson. The Pats scouts had no use for either of them, grading both poorly on work ethic and the skills the team deemed necessary at each position. Daboll flat out said he wanted no part of coaching Jackson.

The Pats had demanded of their scouts blunt bottom line assessments of college prospects. The scouts delivered brutal reviews on these two and were sick that both players remained high on the board on the eve of the draft and hoped that other teams would draft them (Pats' scouts were excluded from the War room during the draft). Pioli was sympathetic to the scouts' views on these two players.

BB was influenced by Urban Meyer on Jackson, and by two McDaniels on Maroney (Josh's brother Ben coached Maroney in college). It was the first time in the BB regime that so much outside influence weighed in on top draft choices, and was close to a breach of an unwritten rule between BB and Pioli that if either of them didn't want a guy, he would be drafted.

Maroney, at least, looked pretty good for a while. Nearly 1000 total yards in each of his first two seasons. He never seemed the same after hurting his shoulder in 2008.

He was/is an immense shithead though, so there's probably more to the story than that.

[bowiac]

They did draft Dowling only to see him get hurt.

Josh Barrett is also on IR.

I don't know where someone goes from being unlucky to being injury prone, but they did run a bit of a risk with Dowling. The guy fell to the Patriots in the draft because of injury woes. Of course, Gronkowski would tell me that missing your senior year with an injury isn't a big deal...

[Jimy Hendrix]

This might be a separate thread, but with Gronk, Dowling, and Cannon (off the top of my head, are there others?), betting on senior season injury guys seems like a Pats draft strategy at this point.

[tims4wins]

This might be a separate thread, but with Gronk, Dowling, and Cannon (off the top of my head, are there others?), betting on senior season injury guys seems like a Pats draft strategy at this point.

Tate

[Jed Zeppelin]

Wheatley was an injury guy as well.

[JerBear]

One common thing that we're seen from the BB era Patriots is that they look at the entire college career and are not worried about a lost season due to injury, no matter what season it was. Other teams seem to devalue players more for lost senior seasons.

[bowiac]

Cannon actually played his senior year - he was diagnosed at the combine.

[axx]

Saw on Rotoworld that BoB is going to interview for the Penn State job Thursday. So much for not being interested.

http://www.rotoworld...atriots-offense

[Shelterdog]

Wheatley was an injury guy as well.

Wheatley played every game, had a medical redshirt for a broken wrist his junior year and then was essentially healthy his last two years (he missed two games). The injuries really took place when he hit the pros-including, bizarrely enough, breaking his other wrist.

Ras-I Dowling didn't miss nearly as much time in college as people think-here's the number of game he missed by year).

2010: 7
2009: 1
2008: 0
2007: 0
2006: 0 (he was at prep school and played the whole year)
2005: 4 games (knee injury)
2004: 5 games (broken hand)

7 games in a year is bad, but 17 games in 7 years is ok, and missing 8 games in 5 years is actually pretty good. I think the injury risk was overstated with him but it did come to fruition: people just call him injury prone without looking up how many games he actually missed.

The BB philosophy seems to be that there is value in players who had health issues (a) once and (b) had those issues in the 12 months before the draft; he really doesn't pick anyone who misses time in more than one year in college.

Edited by Shelterdog, 04 January 2012 - 10:49 PM.

[Jinhocho]

Hate OB interviewing during playoffs - focus on the job at hand.

[Mystic Merlin]

Hate OB interviewing during playoffs - focus on the job at hand.

I guess. All I can say is that plenty of assistants on plenty of bye teams have been doing this for years, Romeo and Charlie included. I suspect he can manage.

[crystalline]

BB was influenced by Urban Meyer on Jackson, and by two McDaniels on Maroney (Josh's brother Ben coached Maroney in college).

I didn't know that. Explains why McDaniels got him in Denver even though he turned out to have nothing left.

[PaSox]

It's going to be tough particularly if he gets the job. Penn State has already lost three recruits and I assume he will want to hit the ground running and get to as many verbals as possible to make sure they stick.
The current staff was out meeting with recruits (Wednesday) and saying they should know within the week what direction the program is going. Also, Penn State has a big official visit weekend coming up Jan. 13-15 for the majority of the Class of 2012. Kids due to arrive Friday afternoon, full slate of activities scheduled for the 14th and a breakfast on the 15th.

[TheoShmeo]

I guess. All I can say is that plenty of assistants on plenty of bye teams have been doing this for years, Romeo and Charlie included. I suspect he can manage.

Yep. The last time the Pats won a Super Bowl the OC had taken the ND job and was, I believe, doing work for them during the two weeks leading up to the big game. I'd rather that all of the coaches on the staff were spending every waking moment on the Pats, but something less than that is clearly manageable.

[lexrageorge]

It's going to be tough particularly if he gets the job. Penn State has already lost three recruits and I assume he will want to hit the ground running and get to as many verbals as possible to make sure they stick.
The current staff was out meeting with recruits (Wednesday) and saying they should know within the week what direction the program is going. Also, Penn State has a big official visit weekend coming up Jan. 13-15 for the majority of the Class of 2012. Kids due to arrive Friday afternoon, full slate of activities scheduled for the 14th and a breakfast on the 15th.

Well, one of the things that Penn St is aware is that O'Brien has a game on the evening of the 14th, and therefore will have little time to spend at Penn St due to O'Brien's contractural commitment to the Patriots. He'll likely make still be able to make the breakfast on the 15th. I'm also quite sure Belichick is already preparing for this possiblity. He went through the same with Charlie Weiss and they still won a Super Bowl and Brady was still Brady.

[jon abbey]

O'Brien takes the PSU job:

http://espn.go.com/c...any-lions-coach

[soxhop411]

O'Brien takes the PSU job:

http://espn.go.com/c...any-lions-coach

soooo will he at least finish the season?

[Mystic Merlin]

Good for him, haters gonna hate but he has managed to coach one of the best offenses in football the past couple seasons.

EDIT - And, yes, he will finish out his season with the Patriots.

Edited by Mystic Merlin, 05 January 2012 - 10:14 PM.

[soxhop411]

if you were a betting man, who is the next Offensive coordinator for the pats?

[Tyrone Biggums]

ESPN is now reporting that Bill O'Brien has accepted the Penn State job

[dcmissle]

Good for him, haters gonna hate but he has managed to coach one of the best offenses in football the past couple seasons.

EDIT - And, yes, he will finish out his season with the Patriots.

Yes. It's a monster job he's taking on but a worthwhile one too. No guts, no glory.

[BannedbyNYYFans.com]

if you were a betting man, who is the next Offensive coordinator for the pats?

Chad O'Shea, the WR's coach. Everybody seems to view him as the offensive Matt Patricia.

If Belichick and Brady want McDaniels back he's a possibility but I don't see why he would want to come back unless he couldn't get another job.

[JBill]

Well, good luck to him. I think Penn State was understandably a little desperate and didn't have a lot of options left, and he'll be in a tough spot, as I'm sure Penn State fans are unhappy. Hope he withstands all of it and does well.

[RedOctober3829]

I'd say Brian Ferentz has a shot at the OC job. Also Pat Hill.

[Mystic Merlin]

McDaniels is a natural contender to return, but who knows where his head is at - returning to the Pats may not be his best path to a second head coaching gig because he would run the risk - given his short-lived reign as Broncos HC and disastrous tenure as Rams OC - of being pigeonholed as a product of Tom Brady and the Pats' offensive staff. That might not be fair, but perception is both a kingmaker and destroyer in this league.

I doubt Scarnecchia will get the nod. He's probably best-suited to his bread and butter, the OL, and he appears content with that role, seeing as he's been the OL coach (and Assistant HC) since 2000 (and, amazingly, he's been with the Patriots since 1991).

As relative newcomers, Ferentz (TE) and O'Shea (WR) seem like longhshots. Then again, who knew Matt Patricia?

I'd say, of all the prominent in-house options, Ivan Fears (RB) is the best bet to take over - he's been with the team since 1999, and he may have greater ambitions than than older Scarnecchia.

Of course, this is all guesswork - BOB doubled as the QB Coach, so that seemingly natural successor to the job isn't there. I think this is the best argument for McDaniels returning.

Edited by Mystic Merlin, 05 January 2012 - 10:39 PM.

[mascho]

Chad O'Shea, the WR's coach. Everybody seems to view him as the offensive Matt Patricia.

If Belichick and Brady want McDaniels back he's a possibility but I don't see why he would want to come back unless he couldn't get another job.

McDaniels may want to rehab his name and image. Right now he's known as the head coach that drafted Tebow in the first round, and I know Stafford was hurt much of the season but the Rams didn't exactly put up great numbers. They were 31st in yards per game this year, just squeaking past Jacksonville. A season or two running this offense might give him some more juice.

And good on O'Brien. Tough challenge that awaits him and I wish him nothing but the best.

EDIT - Strangely MM and I are looking at different kinds of the same coin.

Edited by mascho, 05 January 2012 - 10:41 PM.

[Super Nomario]

If Belichick and Brady want McDaniels back he's a possibility but I don't see why he would want to come back unless he couldn't get another job.

It might not be a bad move for McDaniels. BB mentored him on his head coaching aspirations, and they seem to have a good relationship. McDaniels is still only 35; he doesn't have to make an immediate play for a HC gig. He can come back to NE, get some more mentoring, and oversee an offense that will allow him to pad his resume (after a season overseeing the worst scoring offense in the league by almost 30 points).

Edited by Super Nomario, 05 January 2012 - 10:41 PM.