89 replies to this topic

[86spike]

Chris Broussard reports that it's close to a done deal.

In an interview on ESPN Radio's Mike and Mike Friday morning, Chris Broussard said the Nets and Magic are already working on a trade that would send Dwight Howard to the Nets and that a deal is "very close to happening".

Broussard who broke news of Howard's intentions, said the deal, as he understands it, would be Howard for Brook Lopez and two first round draft choices, presumably the Nets two picks in 2012: their own' first round pick and the Rockets lottery-protected pick obtained in the Terrence Williams trade a year ago. Whether other players would be included remains uncertain.

I gotta believe there will more to it than that... like NJ taking back Hedo's awful deal and adding in more youth going to Orlando.

Either way, this is amazing for the team!

[Ed Hillel]

Paging Dan Gilbert!

[Marbleheader]

Howard to Stern: Drop Dead

I like it because the Knicks are pretty much out of the running for Paul, and the Nets have a chance to show them up.

[bowiac]

Deron Williams and Dwight Howard really is a blueprint for greatness. I really hope this happens, and I'm not even a Nets fan (yet).

[jsinger121]

That's how you sell out the Barclays Center.

[86spike]

Howard to Stern: Drop Dead

I like it because the Knicks are pretty much out of the running for Paul, and the Nets have a chance to show them up.

The Knicks adding Tyson Chandler is a pretty great move for them. The biggest weakness they had last spring was interior defense and Chandler fixes that. NYK and NJ/BK could be a really sick rivalry if this trade happens.

Pinch me.

[dolomite133]

So who is the third player, preferably a high scoring wing, that the Nets could add alongside Howard/Deron?

[Marbleheader]

Definitely, the Knicks just got a lot better. Howard then immediately steals the headlines. After 'Waiting for Chris Paul' for two years, to have the Nets be the ones that get the top-tier superstar would be a kick in the gut to Knick fans to some degree.

[Marbleheader]

So who is the third player, preferably a high scoring wing, that the Nets could add alongside Howard/Deron?

Once Howard is in place, they will be a highly desirable destination for one. Maybe gamble on Redd? In the interim, they have to hope Turkeyglue (if he's part of the deal) and Anthony Morrow benefit from having Howard and Williams drawing attention.

[bowiac]

So who is the third player, preferably a high scoring wing, that the Nets could add alongside Howard/Deron?

Jason Richardson?


I have no idea what the cap is going to be like if this goes down. Somehow the ESPN trade machine says a straight Howard-Lopez deal works, which I'm not quite sure about. If it does however, then the Nets won't have much cap room left, so will have to settle for exemption players to fill out the team. Howard/Deron is such a perfect core however that I think they're immediately competitive even without picking up a top third guy.

[Grin&MartyBarret]

Definitely, the Knicks just got a lot better. Howard then immediately steals the headlines. After 'Waiting for Chris Paul' for two years, to have the Nets be the ones that get the top-tier superstar would be a kick in the gut to Knick fans to some degree.

Honestly, as a Knicks fan, and an NBA fan, I like this a lot. Sure, the Nets will be good, but this will be an awesome rivalry, and it's gonna be a lot of fun for me personally to have Deron Williams and Dwight Howard playing up the block from me.

If this had happened and the Knicks were still sitting around waiting on Paul, I'd be nervous. But the Chandler deal addresses their biggest weakness and makes them a better team. I think Howard to the Nets is perfect for the NBA. Two very good but not great teams in their largest markets (LA/NY), the Heat as the villains, and the Bulls and the Thunder? Memphis a tough team. The top of the league seems pretty up for grabs to me.

[dolomite133]

BTW why doesn't Orlando amnesty Arenas?

[CaptainLaddie]

They very well may.

[PBDWake]

BTW why doesn't Orlando amnesty Arenas?

I think they want to see if they have any shot of unloading him in any deal involving Howard first, and see if they can hold on to the amnesty just in case.

[dolomite133]

I think they want to see if they have any shot of unloading him in any deal involving Howard first, and see if they can hold on to the amnesty just in case.

I don't know why they'd hold on for a better option. Arenas' contract is perfect amnesty fodder. He's due $20M/year so he's a tough trade.

BTW, I raised this question elsewhere, but is Broussard a credible NBA reporter? Doesn't he often report bogus rumors that turn out false?

[bowiac]

I think they want to see if they have any shot of unloading him in any deal involving Howard first, and see if they can hold on to the amnesty just in case.

I think they're likely to keep Arenas.

You have to pay him regardless, so using the amnesty clause on him just lets you use his cap room on someone else. But why do they even want to do that. They're a lottery team without Howard. So they can win 35 games instead of 30? Plus it costs you actual money. If you're rebuilding a team, you may as well not pay one of the highest overall payrolls in the process.

The amnesty clause makes a lot more sense for contending teams that are running into cap issues than it does for rebuilding teams.

[RedOctober3829]

I don't know why they'd hold on for a better option. Arenas' contract is perfect amnesty fodder. He's due $20M/year so he's a tough trade.

BTW, I raised this question elsewhere, but is Broussard a credible NBA reporter? Doesn't he often report bogus rumors that turn out false?

In my mind, if Adrian Wojnarowski isn't reporting it then it's not true.

[Grin&MartyBarret]

And now, Orlando is considering filing tampering charges against the Nets and Houston in regards to Dwight Howard.

http://www.nba.com/2...arge/index.html

At the root of the charges are an alleged meeting between Prokhorov and Howard. Not sure how Houston is involved.

[86spike]

And now, Orlando is considering filing tampering charges against the Nets and Houston in regards to Dwight Howard.

http://www.nba.com/2...arge/index.html

At the root of the charges are an alleged meeting between Prokhorov and Howard. Not sure how Houston is involved.

Denver threatened to file tampering charges against NYK during the Carmelo stuff... this sounds like a negotiating ploy just like it was then.

Besides, Prok is in Russia.

[SpacemanzGerbil]

I don't know why they'd hold on for a better option. Arenas' contract is perfect amnesty fodder. He's due $20M/year so he's a tough trade.

BTW, I raised this question elsewhere, but is Broussard a credible NBA reporter? Doesn't he often report bogus rumors that turn out false?

If you are on a desktop, take the keyboard and hit yourself in the forehead with it. Your brain is malfunctioning.

Either that or given a choice, folks who pay NBA player salaries grow erect at the thought of paying $60M over the next three seasons for a player not on their roster.

[gammoseditor]

ESPN reporting that Howard met with nets GM Billy Hunter and owner Mikhail Prokhorov last night which is clearly tampering. Why have a meeting? How stupid can you be?

http://espn.go.com/n...oward-tampering

[86spike]

ESPN reporting that Howard met with nets GM Billy Hunter and owner Mikhail Prokhorov last night which is clearly tampering. Why have a meeting? How stupid can you be?

http://espn.go.com/n...oward-tampering

It didn't happen. This is just Orlando's attempt to get some leverage over NJ as they haggle over the trade pieces. NJ fired back with it's own leverage generating rumor: it's about to sign Nene, which would mean they can't take Turkoglu back in the deal.

it's all posturing.

[86spike]

BTW why doesn't Orlando amnesty Arenas?

they just did it

[amfox1]

And now, Orlando is considering filing tampering charges against the Nets and Houston in regards to Dwight Howard.

http://www.nba.com/2...arge/index.html

At the root of the charges are an alleged meeting between Prokhorov and Howard. Not sure how Houston is involved.

Orlando has apparently backed off of pursuing Houston.

sam_amick Sam Amick
Source now says Orlando has decided against pursuing tampering charges against Houston due to lack of information. NJ possibility remains.

@ChrisMannixSI
Orlando not pursuing tampering charges against Houston, source directly involved tells SI.com

[dolomite133]

they just did it

Might look good in Green for one year?

EDIT: Depends how much we'd have to pay. BTW what is the "waiver wire" process? Rotating order a la fantasy sports or blind auction/highest bidder?

Edited by dolomite133, 09 December 2011 - 03:42 PM.

[86spike]

Might look good in Green for one year?

EDIT: Depends how much we'd have to pay. BTW what is the "waiver wire" process? Rotating order a la fantasy sports or blind auction/highest bidder?

are the C's under the cap? I think you can only bid on an amnesty player if you're under the cap.
BTW, Howard says there was no meeting with Prok:

In spite of multiple sources who contend Dwight Howard and business associates met with Mikhail Prokhorov and Billy King Thursday night, Howard tells Chris Broussard that no such meeting took place. In a telephone conversation Friday afternoon, Howard said "there was no meeting."

Also, a "league source" also denied to Stefan Bondy that a meeting took place. A call seeking comment from Onexim, Prokhorov's company, has not yet yielded a response.

[gammoseditor]

It didn't happen. This is just Orlando's attempt to get some leverage over NJ as they haggle over the trade pieces. NJ fired back with it's own leverage generating rumor: it's about to sign Nene, which would mean they can't take Turkoglu back in the deal.

it's all posturing.

I'm not saying you're wrong, but the article say it did, and it's not quoting someone from Orlando, it's stating that Dwight Howard, Billy King, and Mikhail Prokhorov were all in the same room last night.

The New Jersey Nets met with Dwight Howard Thursday night in a move that would be a violation of the league's tampering rules, according to multiple sources.

Howard met with Nets owner Mikhail Prokhorov and general manager Billy King in Miami, sources said. Howard was joined by a few business associates.

The meeting violates the NBA's tampering rules because Howard's current team, the Orlando Magic, did not know about the meeting or give the Nets permission to meet with him, according to the sources.

[Brickowski]

Howard is in play. RealGM is reporting that the Magic have given Howard's agent permission to talk to the Lakers, Nets and Mavs.

[kazuneko]

are the C's under the cap? I think you can only bid on an amnesty player if you're under the cap.

No. They aren't under the cap. If he is perceived as having any value at all some team under the cap will bid on him, and possibly trade him to a team looking for a veteran bench player. Of course, its not clear how much value Arenas has at this point.
The more interesting case to follow will be Billups, who can still play. He will most certainly be bid on by multiple teams (most of whom won't want him as he is too old to interest a team that isn't a contender, and teams under the cap are rarely contenders) and probably traded. Actually, if the Cs end up wanting to dump Green in a sign-and-trade, Billups is the type of skilled veteran on a one-year-deal they might be interested in (though that chip might be better used on a center).

[The Social Chair]

http://sports.yahoo....gic_nets_121011

Orlando Magic superstar Dwight Howard has requested a trade to the New Jersey Nets, league sources told Yahoo! Sports on Saturday.

Orlando GM Otis Smith has made it clear that he will trade Howard wherever the Magic get the best possible package, but the fact that Howard is willing to sign a five-year, $109 million extension with New Jersey makes it likely that the Nets can be the most aggressive in offering an attractive package. New Jersey has been pursuing possible third-team partners to strengthen the offer for Howard, front-office sources tell Y! Sports.

Los Angeles had long been a preferred choice of Howard’s, but sources say that several factors have pushed him toward the Nets over the Lakers. Howard has a strong relationship with Deron Williams, and has also resisted following the same career path as Shaquille O’Neal, who left the Magic for the Lakers two decades ago.

The Nets are offering a package centered on Brook Lopez and multiple first-round picks, sources said. New Jersey could also be looking for deals to sweeten its offer to Orlando. The Nets have been determined to make a deal for Howard, one of the league’s most dominant players, to be a centerpiece for them as the move into the new Barclays Center in Brooklyn next season. Howard could pair with Williams to make the Nets instant Eastern Conference contenders.

The Magic are still focused on a possible trade to the Lakers, sources said, for a package that would include Andrew Bynum. The Magic want to unload Hedo Turkoglu in any deal that includes Howard. The Nets, flush with salary cap space, would likely take Turkoglu into a deal.

Lose-Lose proposition to me as a Boston fan. Howard as a Laker or Howard in the Atlantic are two unappealing options. As an NBA fan I think it would be cool to see Howard in Brooklyn.

Edited by The Social Chair, 10 December 2011 - 07:20 PM.

[letbuchholzplay]

Not really that high on Dwight Howard. I know he has great games and I know how athletic he is. Just doesn't seem to get it done when he needs to. There are just guys who don't win when it truly matters and it seems to me he is that guy. No statistical evidence just an eyeball test on this one. I think of the stars in the league who I would take for one game to win it all and I think of many names besides his...Kobe, Wade, Durant, Paul, Nowitski, Rose etc... As I said I know he wins games. He gets you to the playoffs. He gives you a good regular season record. I just don't think he ever wins "that" game. One mans opinion.

[Jed Zeppelin]

Half of the guys you listed have never been to the Finals...

[Hee-Seop's Fable]

Not really that high on Dwight Howard. I know he has great games and I know how athletic he is. Just doesn't seem to get it done when he needs to. There are just guys who don't win when it truly matters and it seems to me he is that guy. No statistical evidence just an eyeball test on this one. I think of the stars in the league who I would take for one game to win it all and I think of many names besides his...Kobe, Wade, Durant, Paul, Nowitski, Rose etc... As I said I know he wins games. He gets you to the playoffs. He gives you a good regular season record. I just don't think he ever wins "that" game. One mans opinion.

Not to many guys get it done alone without serious help complimenting their weaknesses. Rose would be a great compliment for him. Why the hell does Howard not want to consider replacing Noah et. al. in Chicago? Anyone have a clue?

[Cellar-Door]

Not to many guys get it done alone without serious help complimenting their weaknesses. Rose would be a great compliment for him. Why the hell does Howard not want to consider replacing Noah et. al. in Chicago? Anyone have a clue?

Endorsements I'm sure is part of it, NY and LA are better markets, and he would be "the man" instead of a sidekick.

[86spike]

Endorsements I'm sure is part of it, NY and LA are better markets, and he would be "the man" instead of a sidekick.

doesn't love the idea of Jordan's shadow maybe? Plus, Rose is a shooter whereas Deron Williams is more of a distributor type of PG. Maybe Howard sees Deron as a better partner to ensure he's the top dog.

[Infield Infidel]

If Chris Paul goes the the Clips and Howard goes to the Nets, this would be a tremendous off-season for the red-headed stepchild teams in the nation's two largest markets.

[Kid T]

Plus, Rose is a shooter whereas Deron Williams is more of a distributor type of PG. Maybe Howard sees Deron as a better partner to ensure he's the top dog.

If he used that logic, wouldn't playing with Rondo be more appealing than Paul?

[letbuchholzplay]

Half of the guys you listed have never been to the Finals...

OK but would you rather have Rose, Durant or Paul on you team? Big guy that can dunk. No moves and can't hit a jumper out side of 8 feet. 25 years ago maybe but in the day and age of big guys that can step out and shoot it...He is a dinosaur. Actually in the day of Hakeem, Ewing etc...he would have been eaten alive because his footwork is terrible and just not getting better. For someone who is so athletic why doesn't he get better with his foot work and inside game? I just have a hard time giving someone that much money when late in games he is a liability...It is now hack a Howard.

[Brickowski]

I've had simiar discussions at various times and agree that Howard is a very limited offensive player. But he's so damned athletic and such a great defender, shotblocker and rebounder that you just swallow hard and overlook his offensive deficiencies. He's unquestionably a force.

But is Lopez and picks enough to get him? It may be, since that deal would also generate a huge trade exception for the Magic.

[Grin&MartyBarret]

Not to many guys get it done alone without serious help complimenting their weaknesses. Rose would be a great compliment for him. Why the hell does Howard not want to consider replacing Noah et. al. in Chicago? Anyone have a clue?

It's a good question. But Otis Smith is insistent that he will be fielding offers from all teams, not just the 3 teams Howard has named. If that's the case, the Bulls will certainly be a strong contender. In fact, now that it looks like Chris Paul is a Clipper, I'd say that the Bulls have the ability to offer the best package, followed by the Lakers and Nets.

It will be very interesting to see what direction the Nets go if they miss out on Dwight Howard now.

[swingin val]

OK but would you rather have Rose, Durant or Paul on you team?

I would rather have Howard. He has some flaws, but he is such a damn beast that he is probably the only player in the league, minus Lebron, that can singlehandedly turn a shitty team into a playoff team.

[Clears Cleaver]

Prokorov is running for Russian president?!?!?!?!

LOLOL. C'mon. So many potential issues here. I bet he sells the team if he "wins"

[86spike]

Prokorov is running for Russian president?!?!?!?!

LOLOL. C'mon. So many potential issues here. I bet he sells the team if he "wins"

He has something like a 2% chance of winning. Nobody beats Putin.

[86spike]

As a Net fan I've been following this really closely this weekend.

Here's my take:

There is discord in the Orlando front office. Otis Smith doesn't want to dump Howard and has his hackles up about being forced to trade him to specific destinations. Howard went public yesterday with the fact that he feels he has "no relationship" with Otis and alluded to discussions with the owner, instead of Otis, about his future. Things are already getting uglier than the Melo/Denver stuff ever got. I think Dwight (via his agent) is leaning on ownership to make a move asap.

So what should Orlando do? Assuming they have decided they will trade him, they have two avenues to consider:

1. Rebuild - take youth and picks and dump as much salary back onto the trade partner as possible.
2. Reload/Contend - take veterans and whatever star power you can get back and try to keep winning without Dwight.

Orlando is opening a new arena this season and is hosting the All-Star game. Those are both reasons for them to want to keep winning. I bet they look at what Denver did after trading Melo (they landed veterans and some youth and played well to close out the year), and see this as a possible outcome. On top of that, Otis has lined up signings of Big Baby, Von Wafer and Jason Richardson... non of whom you would sign if you're going into a full rebuild.

So as of yesterday, it looks like Orlando, or at least Otis Smith, want to reload, not rebuild.

But then it appears that non of those 3 deals have actually been finalized. Why the delay? Is Orlando rethinking now that Howard has made it absolutely clear in public that he wants to be a Net, Laker or Mav? Are they considering a straight rebuild?

I think that's where we are right now.

From my perspective, NJ has the best package to offer them if they want to rebuild (Lopez, multiple 1st rounders, absorbing Turkoglu's albatross contract). However, if Orlando just wants to reload, then they will either need to get a 3rd team in the mix who will take Lopez/picks in return for sending their veteran star(s) to Orlando, or they will need Howard to make it known that he'll only extend with NJ (which it doesn't appear Howard is quite willing to do).

The word is that the Lakers have refused to send out both Gasol and Bynum in a deal for Howard. They also cannot absorb the Turkoglu contract and their picks are limited (and always at the end of the first round anyway). Unless they relent and send both their big men to Orlando, I really don't think they're going to get him.

Chicago seems to have a lot to offer, but the question remains: will Dwight extend there? Dallas has nothing they can send Orlando. Will another team jump in (like Golden State maybe?) and would Dwight want to extend there?

I suspect that Otis has been on the horn with every team in the NBA trying to figure this out.

All the while, I really like NJ's chances of making this happen.

[swingin val]

From my perspective, NJ has the best package to offer them if they want to rebuild (Lopez, multiple 1st rounders, absorbing Turkoglu's albatross contract).

This is a pretty lousy package, IMO.

If NJ gets Howard, they will be a playoff team. Not a top seed, but in the playoffs. So therefore, you are looking at getting Lopez, and a bunch of middle first round picks? The only other picks NJ has to offer is a 2012 Houston 1st rounder, which is top 14 protected.

Sure, they shed Turkoglu's contract, but overall this is no way to rebuild a team.

[Brickowski]

This is a pretty lousy package, IMO.

If NJ gets Howard, they will be a playoff team. Not a top seed, but in the playoffs. So therefore, you are looking at getting Lopez, and a bunch of middle first round picks? The only other picks NJ has to offer is a 2012 Houston 1st rounder, which is top 14 protected.

Sure, they shed Turkoglu's contract, but overall this is no way to rebuild a team.

If the Nets also took Hedo the Magic would have not one but two huge trade exceptions to acquire two very, very good players this offseason.

[ishmael]

If the Nets also took Hedo the Magic would have not one but two huge trade exceptions to acquire two very, very good players this offseason.

Yep, this is the really interesting part. I can imagine the Magic offering a few of those picks back to Danny here in Boston for a guy like Rondo if the Celtics decide that it is better to clean house post-Big Three as opposed to limping forward...

[dolomite133]

If the Nets also took Hedo the Magic would have not one but two huge trade exceptions to acquire two very, very good players this offseason.

As has been pointed out elsewhere: What players?

[Brickowski]

As has been pointed out elsewhere: What players?

Whatever players other teams wanted to dump for cap management purposes. They could do a couple of deals like the Mavs' acquisition of Lamar Odom a few days ago.

Edited by Brickowski, 12 December 2011 - 03:49 PM.

[dolomite133]

Whatever players other teams wanted to dump for cap management purposes. They could do a couple of deals like the Mavs' acquisition of Lamar Odom a few days ago.

Yeah but you said very, very good players. I don't see a whole lot of them becoming available next year via free agency.