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Fragile Mo?


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#51 rembrat


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Posted 11 August 2011 - 03:34 PM

I know, I know, Mariano always has stretches like this and rebounds just in time for September and October BUT the dude is 41 and his cutter, imo, has been less than impressive this year. He isn't giving up bloop broken bat hits anymore. He is giving up solid hits.

#52 tims4wins


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Posted 11 August 2011 - 03:35 PM

Lefties are hitting him a lot harder this year than over the last several years. .267 coming into today.

Edit:

2008: .147
2009: .182
2010: .214
2011: .267 (coming into today, with lefties going 1-1 today)

Edited by tims4wins, 11 August 2011 - 03:39 PM.


#53 brs3


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Posted 11 August 2011 - 03:36 PM

Every year he has a blip.

2010 - 6 runs over 6 games in Sept
2009 - 5 runs over 5 games in Apr-May
2008 - 9 hits(3 R) over 6 games in July
2007 - 9 runs over 4 games in Apr,5 R over 3 games in July

Is there any data on whether his velocity/location as slipped over this current blip? If not, I fully expect he'll bounce back.

#54 phrenile


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Posted 11 August 2011 - 03:53 PM

Is there any data on whether his velocity/location as slipped over this current blip?

http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=844&position=P#pitchtype

His current 91 mph cutters are the same speed they've been for a few years.

#55 Rough Carrigan


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Posted 12 August 2011 - 09:15 AM

I suspect the movement and how late it occurs is more relevant to the quality of his pitches. The one Branyan destroyed looked like just a generic inside fastball. Maybe it was a rare straight 4 seamer or maybe it was a cutter with little movement that got killed.

Hey, I'm completely a Red Sox fan so I'm utterly biased in discussing him. I acknowledge that up front. But there have been times in the last couple years where he's thrown cutters that didn't seem to be doing much compared to how they did in his prime. But, frustratingly to me, he got away with it.

I sort of wonder why, given that he's throwing some 91's now not 94 or 94+ cutters any more, why some lefties don't edge up in the box toward the mound to hit that cutter before it's broken inside.

#56 jon abbey


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Posted 12 August 2011 - 09:26 AM

That Soriano signing is certainly looking a lot better the last week or so.

#57 terrynever


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Posted 02 September 2011 - 11:02 AM

Bob Costas did an informative interview with Mo this week in Fenway for the MLB Network. If you read between the lines, Mo most likely will retire at the end of the 2012 season, at the age of 42. The numerical symmetry is perfect. Mo said in the interview he will have a good idea "by next spring training" what he wants to do. He said he doesn't want to stick around once he loses his ability to consistently save games. Sort of like Trevor Hoffman did the last two years while chasing 600 saves.

So for all of you Red Sox people wondering when Mo will ever get out of your lives, the target date is the end of the 2012 season.

The interview, by the way, is pure Mo, smiling and gracious as ever. Just the best person the Yankees have ever had represent their organization over the years. Sure, we can't say we know these players as people, but Mo's goodness just shines through whatever he is doing, on and off the field. He has a restaurant in New Rochelle that he frequents in the offseason, hanging in the kitchen, greeting customers. Smiling all the time.

#58 kieckeredinthehead

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 12:25 PM

He has a restaurant in New Rochelle that he frequents in the offseason, hanging in the kitchen, greeting customers. Smiling all the time.

Mochelle Mochelle?

#59 steveluck7

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 12:35 PM

Mochelle Mochelle?

A pitchers erotic journey from Panama to the Bronx

#60 Rudy Pemberton


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Posted 02 September 2011 - 12:41 PM

He said he doesn't want to stick around once he loses his ability to consistently save games.


As opposed to the players who admit that they want to stick around as possible, even after it's clear to everyone else that they are no longer any good?

#61 Meff Nelton

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 12:50 PM

Mo has been talking about retirement for a decade, and he's still here. Obviously, we're much closer to the end, but I won't pay attention to anything but an announcement.

#62 terrynever


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Posted 02 September 2011 - 01:20 PM

Mo has been talking about retirement for a decade, and he's still here. Obviously, we're much closer to the end, but I won't pay attention to anything but an announcement.

I didn't realize Mo had been doing that. For a decade? Wow. Never knew that.

#63 Meff Nelton

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Posted 02 September 2011 - 01:40 PM

I didn't realize Mo had been doing that. For a decade? Wow. Never knew that.


In his late-20s and early 30s, he was saying he would walk away early to build churches and devote his life to faith. The Green God always speaks louder.

EDIT: http://www.nytimes.c...f-the-game.html

Edited by Meff Nelton, 02 September 2011 - 01:42 PM.


#64 terrynever


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Posted 02 September 2011 - 01:47 PM

In his late-20s and early 30s, he was saying he would walk away early to build churches and devote his life to faith. The Green God always speaks louder.

EDIT: http://www.nytimes.c...f-the-game.html

Thanks. That's probably the only time Mo has disappointed me. (I doubt he noticed.) When he said after Game 7 of 2001 that the outcome was in God's hands, it baffled me. Once it came out a few years later that Mo quietly blamed Scott Brosius for not completing the DP in that fateful inning, I felt better about Mo. He's a little bit human.

#65 Lose Remerswaal


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Posted 02 September 2011 - 03:56 PM

When was the last time there was a pitching coach (or manager) visit to the mound for Mo, prior to last night? I can't remember one.

#66 terrynever


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Posted 02 September 2011 - 04:52 PM

When was the last time there was a pitching coach (or manager) visit to the mound for Mo, prior to last night? I can't remember one.

After he walked Kevin Millar, I ran through my TV and met Mo on the mound, asking WTF are you doing?

Seriously, it happens about five times a season. You look back over his career logs, he was never perfect. He blew saves as a young man, too. But sometimes he gets in long stretches where it seems so automatic. That's his secret. Consistency in everything he does, beginning with the simple pitching motion.

#67 Lose Remerswaal


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Posted 06 September 2011 - 02:42 PM

After he walked Kevin Millar, I ran through my TV and met Mo on the mound, asking WTF are you doing?

Seriously, it happens about five times a season. You look back over his career logs, he was never perfect. He blew saves as a young man, too. But sometimes he gets in long stretches where it seems so automatic. That's his secret. Consistency in everything he does, beginning with the simple pitching motion.

I know he blows saves, more this year than most. But most of those (all?) seem to me to have been under 20 pitch affairs, where he gets in trouble, and gives up the tying or go-ahead run and that's it. This time he walked two guys, which NEVER happens, around a single, and loaded the bases and threw 30+ pitches and had Adrian Gonzalez coming up and the coach came out for a visit, which I don't even recall happening during the 2004 ALCS or any other time.

#68 Al Zarilla


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Posted 06 September 2011 - 03:42 PM

I know he blows saves, more this year than most. But most of those (all?) seem to me to have been under 20 pitch affairs, where he gets in trouble, and gives up the tying or go-ahead run and that's it. This time he walked two guys, which NEVER happens, around a single, and loaded the bases and threw 30+ pitches and had Adrian Gonzalez coming up and the coach came out for a visit, which I don't even recall happening during the 2004 ALCS or any other time.

When you've been around as long as he has though, you probably get about every possible result in a six batter set.

#69 CoRP

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Posted 11 September 2011 - 10:19 AM

Quietly, Rivera Nears an Underrated Record

Mariano Rivera is not only one of the greatest pitchers to have ever lived, but he is also an awesome human being. Props on #600.

Edited by CoRP, 14 September 2011 - 04:18 PM.


#70 CoRP

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Posted 17 September 2011 - 06:42 PM

601

#71 cheekydave

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Posted 20 September 2011 - 01:10 PM

Wish he was a sock. Classy humble man easy to root for hard to believe he plays for them. Would love to know how many saves were 1 run saves versus entering the 9th ahead 5-2 as it were
Also frankly Gossage.Lyle.Fingers et al were a different set of relievers. Is it even possible to compare 3 innings a game closers to usually 3 and sometimes 4 batter closers? The whole save record itself is diluted due to this.

#72 terrynever


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Posted 20 September 2011 - 07:08 PM

Wish he was a sock. Classy humble man easy to root for hard to believe he plays for them. Would love to know how many saves were 1 run saves versus entering the 9th ahead 5-2 as it were
Also frankly Gossage.Lyle.Fingers et al were a different set of relievers. Is it even possible to compare 3 innings a game closers to usually 3 and sometimes 4 batter closers? The whole save record itself is diluted due to this.

If you're old enough to have seen the 1970s relievers go three or four innings, you know we're talking about two very different job descriptions. Mo is a one-inning guy, two when he was young. Lyle once came into a playoff game against KC in the fourth inning and pitched 5.2 innings to close it out. I think Sparky was my favorite Yankee reliever until Mo came along. In 1977, he pitched 9.2 innings of relief over 4 games. With a WHIP of 0.750. I'm pretty sure that was the series he went 5.2 innings in one game.

The 1996 Mo pitched 107 innings, striking out 130. That might have been his greatest season. Third in Cy Young voting, 12th in MVP. as a rookie.

Where did this "fragile" stuff come from? Mo is the most enduring reliever in history. 16 seasons and counting.

#73 mt8thsw9th


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Posted 21 September 2011 - 10:11 AM

Rivera/Pedro
ERA G GS GF CG SHO SV IP H R ER HR BB IBB SO HBP BK WP BF ERA+ WHIP H/9 HR/9 BB/9 SO/9 SO/BB 6
Rivera - career 2.22 1039 10 *881* 0 0 *602* 1209 933 322 298 65 274 35 1108 45 3 13 4806 *206* 0.998 6.9 0.5 2 8.2 4.04
Pedro - 1998-2003 2.2 201 199 1 34 11 0 1408 1009 394 344 93 315 10 1761 70 1 31 5542 213 0.94 6.4 0.6 2 11.3 5.59