Jump to content


Yo! You're not logged in. Why am I seeing this ad?

SOSH

Happy Patriots Day.  I expect some heavy usage today so please if there are any problems just let me know via twitter @sonsofsamhorn.  thanks folks.  nip

Photo

2011 MLB Draft Game Thread: Day 1


This topic has been archived. This means that you cannot reply to this topic.
802 replies to this topic

#51 phragle


  • wild card bitches


  • 10807 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:12 PM

A lot of talk of Archie Bradley going 4th or before Bundy. I told you guys he was nasty.

#52 TheGoldenGreek33

  • 1859 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:14 PM

A lot of talk of Archie Bradley going 4th or before Bundy. I told you guys he was nasty.

He's nasty, but a helluva lot more risky than Bundy.

#53 phragle


  • wild card bitches


  • 10807 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:14 PM

Goldstein latest mock

http://www.baseballp...articleid=14156

CJ Cron and Swihart

(I'll be blown away if they take Cron over Jed)

Bell at 24? fuck me!

Beede at 76 HAHAHAHAHA

Edited by phragle, 06 June 2011 - 12:21 PM.


#54 RedOctober3829


  • SoSH Member


  • 14483 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:18 PM

Goldstein latest mock

http://www.baseballp...articleid=14156

That would be a really nice get in the first round. If they can get Bell at 36, unbelievable haul.

#55 gammoseditor


  • also had a stroke


  • 2581 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:19 PM

Goldstein latest mock

http://www.baseballp...articleid=14156


His Yankee pick

51. New York Yankees: Williams Jerez, OF, Grand Street HS (NY). The Yankees have been on this local product from Dellin Betances' alma mater for a long time. He's ultra-athletic and toolsy, but extremely raw.


Sounds about right. Get ready to listen to Yankee fans talk about his upside like he's already reached it, ignore his downside, and complain he's not ranked in the top 25.

Edited by gammoseditor, 06 June 2011 - 12:19 PM.


#56 phragle


  • wild card bitches


  • 10807 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:19 PM

He's nasty, but a helluva lot more risky than Bundy.

How so?

#57 ehaz

  • 755 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:20 PM

Piliere just said that Swihart could potentially fall the most, farther than Bell.

Edited by ehaz, 06 June 2011 - 12:24 PM.


#58 NoLastCall125

  • 501 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:21 PM

Goldstein latest mock

http://www.baseballp...articleid=14156


I recently read a write up in BA that talked about Cron and I was very intrigued. Plus power and can hit for average (the magazine suggested he'd be drafted by the Nationals to replace Dunn, while giving some average too).

My question is, would it make sense to put him back at catcher?

It seems as though he's average defensively at first, but BA suggested he was "adequate" as a catcher as well.



#59 Why Not Grebeck?

  • 202 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:24 PM

Am I the only one that is unexcited by catcher prospects pretty much every year? I haven't run the numbers to support it, but I feel like catching prospects seem to miss way more than the other position players.

#60 Jed Zeppelin


  • SoSH Member


  • 14926 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:26 PM

I think I'll actually be surprised if the Sox take one of the early catchers. The analysts are so obsessed with this dumb idea of "positional need" even though the Sox have spent the entirety of Jason Varitek's decline not drafting any catchers in the early rounds. There is approximately a 0% chance the FO is running around thinking "my goodness we NEED a catcher out of this draft!!!"

#61 SoxScout


  • Maalox Territory


  • 30160 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:29 PM

Am I the only one that is unexcited by catcher prospects pretty much every year? I haven't run the numbers to support it, but I feel like catching prospects seem to miss way more than the other position players.


See: ~25 of 30 MLB teams

Why do you think people want them so badly? Give me Susac and Swihart any day. Turn one into a legit prospect and you have your catcher or some of the best trade bait possible.

#62 Midre Cum Ingz

  • 117 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:29 PM

Goldstein latest mock

http://www.baseballp...articleid=14156

CJ Cron and Swihart

(I'll be blown away if they take Cron over Jed)

Bell at 24? fuck me!

Beede at 76 HAHAHAHAHA


Is KG trying to lose credibility?

Boston is locked on to Beede IMO.

Beede could drop to the 5th round or something a la Westmoreland.

If the Red Sox are the only team who he's willing to sign with then he could feasibly be taken much later than the 1st/sandwich rounds.

#63 Midre Cum Ingz

  • 117 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:30 PM

I think I'll actually be surprised if the Sox take one of the early catchers. The analysts are so obsessed with this dumb idea of "positional need" even though the Sox have spent the entirety of Jason Varitek's decline not drafting any catchers in the early rounds. There is approximately a 0% chance the FO is running around thinking "my goodness we NEED a catcher out of this draft!!!"


Especially when said catcher will take 5 years to reach the Majors.

#64 phragle


  • wild card bitches


  • 10807 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:31 PM

I think I'll actually be surprised if the Sox take one of the early catchers. The analysts are so obsessed with this dumb idea of "positional need" even though the Sox have spent the entirety of Jason Varitek's decline not drafting any catchers in the early rounds. There is approximately a 0% chance the FO is running around thinking "my goodness we NEED a catcher out of this draft!!!"

No you're absolutely right. Thing is Swihart has the bat and arm to be a top of the line RFer or maybe 3rd basemen. He could also be there in the sup round. He is the one if there is one (catcher).


I just asked Goldstein if he bumped his head. Which I chose over just calling him an idiot.


#65 TheGoldenGreek33

  • 1859 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:37 PM

Am I the only one that is unexcited by catcher prospects pretty much every year? I haven't run the numbers to support it, but I feel like catching prospects seem to miss way more than the other position players.

Naturally, it's the hardest position on the field.

#66 TheGoldenGreek33

  • 1859 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:46 PM

How so?

He's just not as polished as Bundy, who has three above-average/plus pitches he locates very well. I'm not saying I wouldn't love to have Bradley, but given the choice, give me Bundy any day.

#67 phragle


  • wild card bitches


  • 10807 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:46 PM

@alexspeierAlex SpeierAt the risk of stating the obvious: Meyer gave his consent to be re-drafted by the Sox.fullcount.weei.com/sports/boston/…

#68 Midre Cum Ingz

  • 117 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:55 PM

"outfielder Ryan Westmoreland — whom it viewed as one of the top 10 players in the 2008 draft class."


Wow, I did not know that.


I read somewhere a year or two ago that they regarded him as a 1st round talent but I had no idea they were talking top 10.


Actually, I think Speier is saying that based on Westy's signing bonus.

Edited by Midre Cum Ingz, 06 June 2011 - 12:58 PM.


#69 phragle


  • wild card bitches


  • 10807 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:55 PM

He's just not as polished as Bundy, who has three above-average/plus pitches he locates very well. I'm not saying I wouldn't love to have Bradley, but given the choice, give me Bundy any day.

Agree to disagree. I'll take Bradley's more prototypical power pitchers frame. Bundy will make it to the ML quicker, but I think Bradley is less risky. Also Bradley's hammer of a curveball is of the knuckle variety. It's better on the elbow.

#70 ji oh

  • 221 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:58 PM

Who are the should-be-drafted-after-19 talents that we want to (and might) see picked above 19 so that a Sonny Gray or Jed Bradley drops to us? Cron? Michael? Jose Fernandez? Tyler Anderson? I'd like to have a list in my head of people I'd be happy to see picked before 19 (and I guess another before 26).

#71 Midre Cum Ingz

  • 117 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 12:59 PM

Agree to disagree. I'll take Bradley's more prototypical power pitchers frame. Bundy will make it to the ML quicker, but I think Bradley is less risky. Also Bradley's hammer of a curveball is of the knuckle variety. It's better on the elbow.


Sure, Bradley has a better pitcher's frame, but Bundy has clear-cut better secondary stuff and command.

And Bundy's poise and work ethic are supposed to be otherworldly.

#72 phragle


  • wild card bitches


  • 10807 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 01:01 PM

Sure, Bradley has a better pitcher's frame, but Bundy has clear-cut better secondary stuff and command.

And Bundy's poise and work ethic are supposed to be otherworldly.

Yup, but you can't teach frame.

#73 Midre Cum Ingz

  • 117 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 01:04 PM

Who are the should-be-drafted-after-19 talents that we want to (and might) see picked above 19 so that a Sonny Gray or Jed Bradley drops to us? Cron? Michael? Jose Fernandez? Tyler Anderson? I'd like to have a list in my head of people I'd be happy to see picked before 19 (and I guess another before 26).


Those guys plus Cory Spangenberg, Javier Baez, Chris Reed, Joe Ross, Robert Stephenson, and Henry Owens. Andrew Susac, Brian Goodwin, and Alex Meyer.

#74 phragle


  • wild card bitches


  • 10807 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 01:06 PM

Who are the should-be-drafted-after-19 talents that we want to (and might) see picked above 19 so that a Sonny Gray or Jed Bradley drops to us? Cron? Michael? Jose Fernandez? Tyler Anderson? I'd like to have a list in my head of people I'd be happy to see picked before 19 (and I guess another before 26).


Maybe whoever the Padres draft at 10.

Whoever the Mets draft at 13, the Brewers draft at 15, and whoever the Dodgers draft at 16.

#75 TheGoldenGreek33

  • 1859 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 01:06 PM

Bundy will make it to the ML quicker, but I think Bradley is less risky.

That's contradictory. Define risky? Bundy is clearly ahead of Bradley in the developmental curve, as Bradley has spent his HS summers on the gridiron and not the diamond. His present lack of a change-up doesn't help his chances, either.

Who needs frame and projection when you've already got pure stuff and command with Bundy?

Edited by TheGoldenGreek33, 06 June 2011 - 01:16 PM.


#76 Midre Cum Ingz

  • 117 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 01:12 PM

Maybe whoever the Padres draft at 10.

Whoever the Mets draft at 13, the Brewers draft at 15, and whoever the Dodgers draft at 16.


I think the Mets are supposed to take Jed Bradley or Taylor Jungmann which hurts my feelings.

#77 phragle


  • wild card bitches


  • 10807 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 01:18 PM

That's contradictory. Define risky? Bundy is clearly ahead of Bradley in the developmental curve, as Bradley has spent his HS summers on the gridiron and not the diamond. His present lack of a change-up doesn't help his chances, either.

It's not contradictory. Bundy is more polished no doubt, and that is why he will make it to the bigs sooner. His smaller frame makes me wonder if he can throw 250 innings, stick as a starter, and avoid injury. Yes I know about his work ethic, and smooth delivery.

Those are not things to worry about with Bradley.

Edit: How many RH power pitchers that are 6'1" are aces right now?

Bradley will have a higher career WAR, want to bet?

Edited by phragle, 06 June 2011 - 01:22 PM.


#78 phragle


  • wild card bitches


  • 10807 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 01:26 PM

Law Chat: http://espn.go.com/s...sider-keith-law

#79 TheGoldenGreek33

  • 1859 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 01:30 PM

Bundy's 6'1 - 200 and holds his velo deep into games. You can tell me Bradley has better leverage and plane on his pitches, but that's the only argument I'll buy regarding the height difference. Agree to disagree.

Edited by TheGoldenGreek33, 06 June 2011 - 01:30 PM.


#80 Joshv02

  • 1380 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 01:36 PM

A bunch more good stuff from Speier ( http://fullcount.wee...t-with-the-sox/ ) including naming one of the players the Red Sox worked out at Fenway last week (who fits into the "reliever to starter" mold).

#81 Carl Everetts Therapist


  • yossarian


  • PipPip
  • 1558 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 01:53 PM

My dream draft is One of the Uconn kid's fall to 19

Bell at 26

Mahook at 36

But that's just me... catcher is no longer an organizational need with Salty locking up the position for the next 5 years

#82 Mugsys Jock


  • Longtime Member


  • 3668 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 01:57 PM

His Yankee pick

51. New York Yankees: Williams Jerez, OF, Grand Street HS (NY). The Yankees have been on this local product from Dellin Betances' alma mater for a long time. He's ultra-athletic and toolsy, but extremely raw.

Sounds about right. Get ready to listen to Yankee fans talk about his upside like he's already reached it, ignore his downside, and complain he's not ranked in the top 25.


I've seen Jerez play 3 times this year. While I'm rooting for him because my son got him to ground out once and that'd be a good story for the grandchildren, I have to say I wasn't all that impressed. Squared up very few balls in the dozen at-bats or so I saw, and not exactly against top-flight pitching. [Don't tell my son I wrote that.]

Edited by Mugsys Jock, 06 June 2011 - 01:57 PM.


#83 ehaz

  • 755 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 02:00 PM

I recently read a write up in BA that talked about Cron and I was very intrigued. Plus power and can hit for average (the magazine suggested he'd be drafted by the Nationals to replace Dunn, while giving some average too).

My question is, would it make sense to put him back at catcher?

It seems as though he's average defensively at first, but BA suggested he was "adequate" as a catcher as well.

According to K. Law he won't even stick at 1B and is a future DH. I'd rather stay away from drafting someone who is predetermined to be a DH, I don't care how he hits.

#84 ehaz

  • 755 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 02:40 PM

Rumor has it, Beede has a deal worked out with an unidentified team.

#85 ehaz

  • 755 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 02:43 PM


Frankie Piliere: Buzz: Rangers, according to sources, could be a landing spot for Josh Bell at the very end of the first


Might be that they gotta take Bell at 26 then if they want him. Which likely means no Nimmo as most mocks do not have him dropping to the supplemental.

#86 TheGoldenGreek33

  • 1859 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 02:50 PM

Rumor has it, Beede has a deal worked out with an unidentified team.

Link?

#87 ehaz

  • 755 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 02:53 PM

Link?

This K Law chat. Was also mentioned by Piliere in his live chat.

#88 ehaz

  • 755 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 02:56 PM

Good news for the Sox:


Frankie Piliere: Buzz: Ok, take this with a grain of salt, just a possibility but from strong sources. Brewers might be going with prep OF, Larry Greene. Hard to say which pick, but I would assume the unprotected one. Pre-draft deals are illegal so not saying that hearing they have have that one lined up.


With the Padres reaching too at #10 with Spangenberg, this could further the chances of one of the better college pitchers dropping to #19.

EDIT: new info

Frankie Piliere: Buzz: More sources weighing in on the Brewers. Some think it's Javier Baez that the Brewers have lined up. That would make a lot more sense.


Edited by ehaz, 06 June 2011 - 03:09 PM.


#89 TheGoldenGreek33

  • 1859 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 02:58 PM

This K Law chat. Was also mentioned by Piliere in his live chat.

I don't really understand how someone can have a pre-draft deal. What's stopping the other 29 teams from picking him first, despite his bonus demands?

Edited by TheGoldenGreek33, 06 June 2011 - 03:03 PM.


#90 CoRP

  • 3740 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 02:58 PM

Great article on how the Rays gamed the draft this year.

The Rays Have More Or Less Every Pick In Today’s MLB Draft

Might make a good thread on it's own.

#91 ehaz

  • 755 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 03:01 PM

I don't really understand how someone can have a pre-draft deal. What's stopping the other 29 teams from picking him first, despite his bonus demands?

Nothing, which is why pre-draft deals are usually reaches taken before their expected landing spots I'm guessing. Either that, or it's just more of "If you get to us, will you sign for XX million dollars?"

#92 RedOctober3829


  • SoSH Member


  • 14483 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 03:12 PM

Frankie Piliere:
Buzz: Cubs are going "way off the board" with their pick. Not exactly a surprised given last year but makes my job impossible trying to figure it out.



#93 ehaz

  • 755 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 03:12 PM

edit: beat to the cubs rumor.

I think we're all hawking over Piliere's chat hahaha.

Edited by ehaz, 06 June 2011 - 03:13 PM.


#94 TimScribble

  • 298 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 03:12 PM

Possible more good news for Sox:

4:11
Frankie Piliere: Buzz: Cubs are going "way off the board" with their pick. Not exactly a surprised given last year but makes my job impossible trying to figure it out.

Edit: Ehaz and Red said it.

Edited by TimScribble, 06 June 2011 - 03:13 PM.


#95 ehaz

  • 755 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 03:16 PM

Super dark horse possible day 1 pick. A cuban defector is eligible for the draft according to Callis

EDIT: Who woulda thunk it? Apparently this is the guy the Cubs want at #9

Frankie Piliere:
Buzz; Cubs on lefty Onelki Garcia Speck at #9


Edited by ehaz, 06 June 2011 - 03:18 PM.


#96 TheGoldenGreek33

  • 1859 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 03:16 PM



It's not often a player emerges as a pop-up candidate to go in the first round the day of the draft—especially in a year with this kind of depth—but such is the case this year with Onelki Garcia Speck, a lefthander who defected from Cuba. Garcia could go as highly as the back half of the first round.

Details on Garcia are fuzzy, but Baseball America has learned that he throws in the 92-95 mph range with an above-average curveball. An article (in Spanish) in The New Herald by Jorge Ebro from 2008 said Garcia Speck was 20 years old, which would make him 23 this year.

The agency representing Garcia, Miami Sports Consulting, LLC, has reportedly sent teams a fax demanding a major league deal, but as a Cuban that must be drafted instead of signed as a free agent, his leverage appears limited.




link

#97 RedOctober3829


  • SoSH Member


  • 14483 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 03:18 PM

Frankie Piliere:
Buzz; Cubs on lefty Onelki Garcia Speck at #9

WOW

#98 ehaz

  • 755 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 03:18 PM

Piliere: Cubs all over this kid.

#99 ItOnceWasMyLife

  • 1584 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 03:21 PM

Piliere: Cubs all over this kid.


103 years and counting. :gonk:

#100 Sox Pride

  • 43 posts

Posted 06 June 2011 - 03:22 PM

I think I'll actually be surprised if the Sox take one of the early catchers. The analysts are so obsessed with this dumb idea of "positional need" even though the Sox have spent the entirety of Jason Varitek's decline not drafting any catchers in the early rounds. There is approximately a 0% chance the FO is running around thinking "my goodness we NEED a catcher out of this draft!!!"


Exactly. No point drafting for "need" when a catcher isn't going to hit the bigs for another 3 years and with a well-developed farm system, you can _trade_ for ML talent.
BPA is always the right way to go in the MLB-draft