98 replies to this topic

[Gene Conleys Plane Ticket]

For the moment, Wigan, Blackpool, and Birmingham are all drawing their games. If any of them lose, they'd be a point behind Wolves.

Well, Spurs just scored. Up 1-0. Could be the death sentence for Birmingham, then, since they haven't even been trying to score in this game.

[ossie schreckengost]

wall-to-wall relegation porn. i love it.

[SoxFanInCali]

Blackpool lead at Old Trafford!

[SoxFanInCali]

Man U tie it up, Blackpool still safe but dependent on other results again.

[SoxFanInCali]

Wolves are currently surviving because they have more goals scored than Wigan.

16 Blackpool -21 40
17 Wolves -22 40
18 Wigan -22 40
19 Birmingham -21 39
20 West Ham -26 33

Blackpool are hanging on for their lives at Old Trafford at the moment.

[SoxFanInCali]

And Blackpool just put it into their own net! Poor Ian Evatt.

Blackpool and Birmingham now set to go down.

Edited by SoxFanInCali, 22 May 2011 - 11:36 AM.

[shawnrbu]

Birmingham have their equalizer.

[SoxFanInCali]

Birmingham equalize, and Wigan score! Now it's Wolves and Blackpool.

Edited by SoxFanInCali, 22 May 2011 - 11:43 AM.

[shawnrbu]

Wigan lead 1-0 on a Rodallega header.

[SoxFanInCali]

Man U score again, looking very bad for Blackpool.

[SoxFanInCali]

Wolves score. Still down 3-2, but it allows them to jump out of the zone, Birmingham back in.

[SoxFanInCali]

Spurs score in the last second. Birmingham are fucked.

[SoxFanInCali]

The Wolves fans swarm the pitch at Molineaux, and Wigan celebrate. Blackpool and Birmingham are down.

[SoxFanInCali]

15 Blackburn -13 43
16 Wigan -21 42
17 Wolves -20 40
18 Birmingham -21 39
19 Blackpool -23 39
20 West Ham -27 33

It turned out that GD didn't come into it, but if Spurs hadn't scored at the death, Wolves would have stayed up just because of goals scored, with the same points and GD as Birmingham.

That was crazy to watch, the teams in the zone must have changed 5 or 6 times during the last 20 minutes of the season.

[JayMags71]

Is it unusual for Birmingham to be in the Europa League after relegation? Has anything like that happened before?

[SoxFanInCali]

Pompey would have been in Europe a couple of years ago despite going down, if they didn't lose their spot due to nearly going bankrupt.

Millwall got into Europe a few years back by getting to the FA Cup final despite finishing mid-table in the Championship.

[MarkInLondon]

Is it unusual for Birmingham to be in the Europa League after relegation? Has anything like that happened before?

FA Cup winners used to go into the Cup Winners Cup, so Sunderland and West Ham went in as Div 2 teams.

[SoxFanInCali]

Is it unusual for Birmingham to be in the Europa League after relegation? Has anything like that happened before?

It may have happpened twice this season. Word on Twitter (completely unconfirmed) is that Blackpool may get into the Europa League next season through the Fair Play League. Fulham did get a red card today, it may have cost them.

[Gene Conleys Plane Ticket]

It may have happpened twice this season. Word on Twitter (completely unconfirmed) is that Blackpool may get into the Europa League next season through the Fair Play League. Fulham did get a red card today, it may have cost them.

Somehow, it just seems to me that this system needs to be revised. First, UEFA absolutely must award a Champions League place to the Europa League winner. Why they don't is baffling to me. It would immediately turn the Europa League into a desirable, meaningful competition.

Second, I think its absurd that a lower-division team plays in Europe at all. Again, it just points to the ridiculousness of the Europa League. I would think at least a team should be active in its domestic league's top flight in order to qualify for the EL.

Finally, Birmingham really deserved to go down based on their play today. I'm a Spurs fan, so I was happy with the result. But Birmingham spent most of the game in an extremely negative position, not even really trying to score goals. If you can't play an exciting game when your very league survival is at stake, you haven't earned your place in the (for my money) world's most exciting league.

[DLew On Roids]

It may have happpened twice this season. Word on Twitter (completely unconfirmed) is that Blackpool may get into the Europa League next season through the Fair Play League. Fulham did get a red card today, it may have cost them.

There were rumors last week that Fulham would intentionally get bookings to avoid the Europa League. The big downside is that the Fair Play entry goes into the first preliminary round, which starts on--get this--June 30. But once a team has obtained a UEFA license for the following season, it has to take the Europa League spot if its offered (all 20 EPL teams received a license last month).

[Tony the Pony]

Second, I think its absurd that a lower-division team plays in Europe at all. Again, it just points to the ridiculousness of the Europa League. I would think at least a team should be active in its domestic league's top flight in order to qualify for the EL.

This is why the Cup Winners Cup was fuckin great!

The best games I've seen in Europe were those in the EC2, and making it possible for anybody to qualify as long as they win their domestic cup, was the biggest reason for that.

Instead of all this Europa League bullshit with prelim-qualifiers, groups stages and what-not; it would be great if the UEFA reinstates the Cup Winners Cup. every domestic cup winner gets in, plus the fair play winner (or cup final loser?) of the top 12 (?) countries in the UEFA coefficient rankings to round out the field to 64 (the UEFA has 50-55 member countries I think).

No seedings, no group stages. 64 teams in a bowl, draw names and just play kock-out football for old times' sake.

[Billy R Ford]

Glad Blackburn stayed up, I want to see if their owners go on the massive spending spree they've promised.

[Gene Conleys Plane Ticket]

This is why the Cup Winners Cup was fuckin great!

The best games I've seen in Europe were those in the EC2, and making it possible for anybody to qualify as long as they win their domestic cup, was the biggest reason for that.

Instead of all this Europa League bullshit with prelim-qualifiers, groups stages and what-not; it would be great if the UEFA reinstates the Cup Winners Cup. every domestic cup winner gets in, plus the fair play winner (or cup final loser?) of the top 12 (?) countries in the UEFA coefficient rankings to round out the field to 64 (the UEFA has 50-55 member countries I think).

No seedings, no group stages. 64 teams in a bowl, draw names and just play kock-out football for old times' sake.

Yeah, the CWC was a great idea and it's a shame they discontinued it in favor of the watered-down Europa League. I mean, if they absolutely must have a competition that includes cup winners, fifth and sixth place teams and "fair play" qualifiers (another ridiculous idea; I mean, I'm all for rewarding teams that "play fair," but wouldn't a nice cash prize do the trick?) -- I'd rather see one, giant 96-team knockout competition, seeded so that the top teams are more likely to make it deep into the tourney, but always with the chance of a huge upset in the early rounds or a Cinderella team that goes on a hot streak.

Now that I describe it, it sounds like the NCAA basketball tournament. But maybe there's a reason that tournament works so well.

Anyway, anything's better than the EL as currently structured.

[Titans Bastard]

Second-division participants in the Europa League are rather uncommon, but not entirely rare. In addition to the aforementioned Millwall, in the past decade we've also had Alemannia Aachen (Germany), En Avant Guingamp (France), Atvidabergs (Sweden) and just this past season Lausanne-Sport (Switzerland). Lausanne somehow knocked off Lokomotiv Moscow(!!) Let's not forget the 2000 Coupe de France, when an amateur fourth-division team was thisclose to European qualification.

IIRC, the end of the old European Cup and the establishment of the Champions League format played a significant part in the demise of the Cup Winners' Cup. In the old days, the EC was a straight knockout tournament, two legs, until there was just one club left. One country, one club -- plus the defending champion. When the CL was established and the larger countries entered multiple clubs into the tournament, the overlap between CL entrants and domestic cup champions grew. The Cup Winners' Cup quickly became the Cup Final Losers' Cup.

So the CWC was folded into the UEFA Cup, which was later re-branded and re-formatted as the Europa League. The Europa League is indeed a tedious competition at times and could use some alterations to its format. I'm not sure if you can change the qualification method; if you shut the cup winners out of European play, domestic cups will become utterly irrelevant. Perhaps a competition like the FA Cup, which carries a lot of historical weight/tradition/inertia would be okay, but in most places cups would transition from an anachronistic annoyance to an outright waste of time.



Ultimately, though, the CWC and UEFA Cup/EL were hurt by the expansion of the Champions League more than anything else. They were deprived of the #2, #3, #4 teams of the top countries and the next tier down doesn't provide for as compelling a competition in the end.

Edited by Titans Bastard, 23 May 2011 - 12:43 PM.

[AusTexSoxFan]

I'm still in shock that Deportivo is going down. The 1999-2000 La Liga champs, 2004 CL semifinalists and 2002 Copa del Rey winners will play next season in the Segunda. All across Spain people were feeling for their fans, expect for anyone in Vigo of course.

Celta look doubtful to emerge out of the Segunda playoff so looks like the Derbi Gallego will be back in effect next year, albeit in the Segunda.

[DLew On Roids]

Check out Sid Lowe's lamentation for Deportivo in today's Guardian.

I was afraid I was the only person who missed the CWC. Drawing in domestic cup winners for a knockout tournament was an anachronism upon anachronism. As a fan of the bizarre, it was f'ing great. But then I think the Intertoto is cool, too.

[MarkInLondon]

Check out Sid Lowe's lamentation for Deportivo in today's Guardian.

I was afraid I was the only person who missed the CWC. Drawing in domestic cup winners for a knockout tournament was an anachronism upon anachronism. As a fan of the bizarre, it was f'ing great. But then I think the Intertoto is cool, too.

Talking of anachronisms...a Champions League where around two-thirds of the teams aren't champions.

[Titans Bastard]

Check out Sid Lowe's lamentation for Deportivo in today's Guardian.

I was afraid I was the only person who missed the CWC. Drawing in domestic cup winners for a knockout tournament was an anachronism upon anachronism. As a fan of the bizarre, it was f'ing great. But then I think the Intertoto is cool, too.

Ah, the Intertoto. Often you'd see a 15th place club from England or Italy entered because mid-table clubs simply had no interest in a mid-summer tournament, even if there were UEFA Cup entries in the mix. The Intertoto was basically folded into the early UEFA Cup qualification rounds when it changed format and became the Europa League. Now the minnows get 1 team in the CL qualification rounds and 3 in the EL, whereas before they had one in each of the four competitions.

[Gene Conleys Plane Ticket]

According to this article on Fox Soccer, the richest game in soccer was not played on Saturday. It's being played right now. Either Swansea or Reading is looking at a $150 million (U.S.) "purse" for winning the Championship Playoff Final today.

I can't even imagine the pressure involved in this game. I mean, Man United lost the Champions League Final so maybe their egos are a little bruised but they're still Man United. Butthe loser of this game gets consigned to what amounts to the minor leagues for yet another season.

[Zomp]

Swanswa was up 3-nil inside 40 minutes, but Reading have nicked 2 back in the first 15 minutes of the second half.

30 minutes left, Swansea 3 Reading 2.

[Zomp]

Reading hit the bar!!!!

[mic99]

Swanswa was up 3-nil inside 40 minutes, but Reading have nicked 2 back in the first 15 minutes of the second half.

30 minutes left, Swansea 3 Reading 2.

Incredible start to the 2nd half...

Game is on FSC

[MarkInLondon]

Reading give away an absolutely insane penalty.

[LTF]

I've said this before, but as someone relatively new to all this I always root for clubs I haven't seen yet. New grounds, new kits, new players. Three-for-three this season.

[Spacemans Bong]

Llongyfarchiadau Abertawe pel-droed.

Cardiff must be seething...all that funny money to try and buy their place in the top-flight and Swansea get there first.

[MarkInLondon]

Sipia 'i Caerdydd!

[Tony the Pony]

There have been a few surprise relegated teams this year; Sampdoria, La Coruna, Eintracht Frankfurt, Monaco, Lens, Charleroi. Newcomers include teams like Betis Sevilla, Rayo Vallecano (by far the best thing to ever come out of Madrid), Atalanta Bergamo and Ajaccio.

Another club that gained promotion, is FC Augsburg. For years the incorrect trivia regarding the largest European city without first-flight football popped up from time to time (no, it has never been Hull; it was Augsburg), and that will die a silent death now, I assume. Hertha also back in the 1. Bundesliga.

[BelgianSoxFan]

Another club that gained promotion, is FC Augsburg. For years the incorrect trivia regarding the largest European city without first-flight football popped up from time to time (no, it has never been Hull; it was Augsburg), and that will die a silent death now, I assume.

I thought it was Antwerp

[SoxFanInCali]

Crazy to think that Monaco has gone from Champions League runner-up to Ligue 2 in 7 seasons.

[Titans Bastard]

Another club that gained promotion, is FC Augsburg. For years the incorrect trivia regarding the largest European city without first-flight football popped up from time to time (no, it has never been Hull; it was Augsburg), and that will die a silent death now, I assume. Hertha also back in the 1. Bundesliga.

I thought it was Antwerp

It's not Antwerp, nor has it ever been Augsburg or Kingston-upon-Hull. The largest city in a UEFA country that has never had a top division team is Omsk (1.15m), shortly followed by Chelyabinsk (1.13m). Omsk and Chelyabinsk are in Asia, so if you want to rule them out, the title would pass to Ufa (1.06m).

Omsk (1.15m) -- Asia
Chelyabinsk (1.13m) -- Asia
Ufa (1.06m)
Krasnoyarsk (974k) -- Asia
Izhevsk (628k)
Ulyanovsk (614k)
Barnaul (612k) -- Asia
Irkutsk (587k) -- Asia

...

You could list approximately another two dozen cities in Russia who have never had top division teams before getting down to Augsburg's size (264k).


Until this past RPL season (2010), the answer was Novosibirsk, a city of about 1.5m and the largest in Russia outside of Moscow and St. Petersburg.

[Tony the Pony]

Yeah - I think a bunch of those Russian places were mentioned a few years ago when we talked about that (in the Hull thread? - I'm going to look it up).

Too much work to look those shitholes up, though. Much easier to go with Hull and Augsburg ;-)

EDIT. (not mentioned)

Edited by Tony the Pony, 01 June 2011 - 11:51 AM.

[AusTexSoxFan]

There have been a few surprise relegated teams this year; Sampdoria, La Coruna, Eintracht Frankfurt, Monaco, Lens, Charleroi. Newcomers include teams like Betis Sevilla, Rayo Vallecano (by far the best thing to ever come out of Madrid), Atalanta Bergamo and Ajaccio.

Amen on the Rayo thing. That is truly a 'barrio' team. Stadium is always rocking. Great fans. Went to a game there a few weeks ago and remembered why I like being there better than the Bernabeu or Vincente Calderon.

By the way, The Segunda playoffs begin next week in Spain. Granada, Elche and Celta are in. Valladolid and Xerez battling it out for the last spot. Valladolid will get in with just a point in their finale versus Alcorcon.

If I were to bet right now, I'd say Elche go up. They are the team playing the best futbol right now and their coach, Pepe Bordalas, has done a helluva job. They are the team best equipped to go on the road and get a result in the playoffs.

[AusTexSoxFan]

Segunda playoffs are set.

Celta - Granada
Valladolid - Elche

First legs will be played Wednesday and Thursday with the return legs this weekend.

Celta have to win in Balaidos because beating Granada at Las Carmones is just about impossible. Many are picking Valladolid but I really like Elche in this one. Should be some great matches.

One other note.... Two teams from the Segunda B have been promoted to the Segunda: Real Murcia and Sabadell. Murcia were in the Primera a mere three years ago but were relegated after the 2008-2009 season and then dropped down to the Segunda B last year. They have climbed their way back to the Segunda now.

Two other spots still to be filled. Former UEFA Cup darling Alaves is still alive but neeed a result in Galicia this weeknd against Lugo.

[AusTexSoxFan]

Elche-Granada for the last ticket to the Primera. First leg Wednesday, second leg on Saturday.

The semis were incredible. Granada-Celta on Saturday was a classic. Went to extra time with Granada winning eventually on PKs only after Michu missed his penalty that would have won it for Celta.

A combined five shots either hit the post or crossbar. Also, Granada's Dani Benitez missed two PKs called during the match.... and then converted during the penalties.

Elche needed three goals to come back and beat Valladolid yesterday and did just that scoring in the 43rd, 45th and 57th.

[AusTexSoxFan]

So Granada are the third and final team to get promoted to the Primera.

Their first leg match with Elche ended in a 0-0 draw in Andalucia and Saturday's second leg saw Granada get the 1-1 result on the road. It was not without controversey though as Elche had a first half goal disallowed that should have stood stood. But nonetheless, Granada, after getting promoted last year from the Segunda B to the Segundfa, are now in the Primera for the first time in 35 years.

Just five years ago they were in the Tercera (fourth level) so their ascension is pretty stunning.

If you wanna keep tabs on any young player in Spain it would be Dani Benitez. He's a left winger for Granada and punishes right backs for 90 minutes. The guys never stops running and is a fantastic playmaker.

[AusTexSoxFan]

Alcoyano and Guadalajara become the last two teams to be promoted from the Segunda B (3rd level) to the Spanish Segunda Division.

Odd fact - Guadalajara is the only team from La Mancha in Spain's top two divisions.

Nine other teams were promoted from the Tercera to Segunda B over the weekend.

I think with that we can finally close the 2011 Promotion/Relegation thread.

[Dick Pole Upside]

This is pretty incredible (the hundred-year thing, not the riot thing)...

River Plate goes down... bedlam ensues

Vancouver's ugly example strikes again!

[Zososoxfan]

This is pretty incredible (the hundred-year thing, not the riot thing)...

River Plate goes down... bedlam ensues

Vancouver's ugly example strikes again!

As a gallina (staunch supporter of River Plate), I beg to differ with this comment. Argentine hooligans are a much older and more violent institution than those canadian nancies that started a couple of 'hearths' in the city streets. That was child's play compared to what usually goes down in Buenos Aires in the name of futbol.

[Tony the Pony]

As a gallina (staunch supporter of River Plate)...

Fuckin fantastic that River Plate is finally going down. Should have relegated back in 1983.

EDIT: And if Boca is not careful, they may very well end up in the same situation next year.

Edited by Tony the Pony, 27 June 2011 - 02:49 PM.