246 replies to this topic

[cshea]

Kaymer's meltdown continues on 15 where he misses a 4 footer to drop a hole. Donald is about to close this thing out on 16.

[Lupe Whalewatch]

Really an amazing week of golf for Luke Donald. Six match play victories, and never even played the 18th hole.

[WayBackVazquez]

Really glad Luke Donald was finally able to win on the PGA Tour for the first time in 5 years, but seriously, I wish I would never have to hear about the World Golf Rankings again. Lee Westwood, Luke Donald, and Martin Kaymer? Seriously? With one major between them, these are the top 3 golfers in the world, and the last 2 #1s?

You may as well tell me Real Madrid and Olympia Milano are the #1 and #2 ranked basketball teams in the world.

Edited by WayBackVazquez, 27 February 2011 - 06:18 PM.

[BigMike]

Really glad Luke Donald was finally able to win on the PGA Tour for the first time in 5 years, but seriously, I wish I would never have to hear about the World Golf Rankings again. Lee Westwood, Luke Donald, and Martin Kaymer? Seriously? With one major between them, these are the top 3 golfers in the world, and the last 2 #1s?

You may as well tell me Real Madrid and Olympia Milano are the #1 and #2 ranked basketball teams in the world.

I agree you have an argument with Luke Donald. Talented player, but hard to believe he is the #3 ranked player in the world at the moment. He's never done much in majors, and really hasn't won that much anywhere.

Westwood on the other hand is a Great player. He has avergaed more than 2 wins a year for the last 15 years. Last 5 majors he entered he has finished 3rd, 3rd, 16th, 2nd, 2nd.

And Martin Kaymer is absolutely justified in being the #1 ranked player in the world right now. He has been the best player alive the last 12 months. He has finished in the top 10 in 11 of his past 23 European tour events. He has 4 wins and a 2nd in his last 11 tournaments. He's been top 10 in 5 of his last 7 PGA tour events including 2 top 10s in majors, plus a PGA championship, and a runner up this week.

[WayBackVazquez]

I agree you have an argument with Luke Donald. Talented player, but hard to believe he is the #3 ranked player in the world at the moment. He's never done much in majors, and really hasn't won that much anywhere.

Westwood on the other hand is a Great player. He has avergaed more than 2 wins a year for the last 15 years. Last 5 majors he entered he has finished 3rd, 3rd, 16th, 2nd, 2nd.

And Martin Kaymer is absolutely justified in being the #1 ranked player in the world right now. He has been the best player alive the last 12 months. He has finished in the top 10 in 11 of his past 23 European tour events. He has 4 wins and a 2nd in his last 11 tournaments. He's been top 10 in 5 of his last 7 PGA tour events including 2 top 10s in majors, plus a PGA championship, and a runner up this week.

Lee Westwood has played in over 50 majors and never won a single one. He's missed the cut more often in majors than he's made the top 10. He has won ONE tournament in the last 15 months, and 3 in the last 3+ years. Only ONE on the PGA Tour. He's one of the biggest Sunday chokers in recent golf history.

Martin Kaymer has done fairly well on the European tour, beating people like Christian Nilsson and Danny Willett...just as Real Madrid has done in the Spanish league, Olympia Milano has done in the Italian league, and Yomiuri has done in Japanese baseball. None of those teams are the best in the world, and neither is Martin Kaymer the best golfer in the world. There will probably be at least 5 golfers favored over him in every major he plays this year, and most likely he'll not finish in the Top 5 in any of them.

The world golf rankings are absurd. Kaymer certainly has a lot of talent, and his PGA Championship can't be taken away from him. I just think if you're going to be the #1 golfer in the world, you should be playing against the best in the world on a weekly basis, or if not, when you do play against them, you need to win more than one time. For example, if Paddy Harrington had been ranked number one in the world at the end of 2008 (and I know he was a member of both tours), I would have no argument against it -- he had won 3 majors in 2 years. But somehow, he couldn't get higher than 3rd. And yet Lee frickin' Westwood can be number 1? I'm sorry, there's something horribly wrong with that.

Edited by WayBackVazquez, 28 February 2011 - 11:21 AM.

[Lupe Whalewatch]

Martin Kaymer has done fairly well on the European tour, beating people like Christian Nilsson and Danny Willett...just as Real Madrid has done in the Spanish league, Olympia Milano has done in the Italian league, and Yomiuri has done in Japanese baseball. None of those teams are the best in the world, and neither is Martin Kaymer the best golfer in the world. There will probably be at least 5 golfers favored over him in every major he plays this year, and most likely he'll not finish in the Top 5 in any of them.

In my opinion, I think you are grossly underestimating the talent on the Euro tour these days. While certainly not nearly as deep as the PGA tour, there are alot of very, very good golfers over there on a weekly basis. In his last win over there- the HSBC-he beat Rory McIlroy, Goosen, McDowell, Molinari, Scwartzel, Paul Casey, Phil Mickelson, and Henrik Stenson to name a few. Not sure if Christian Nilsson and Danny Willett were around for that one.

Who do you think is deserving of the number one ranking right now?

I will gladly take the other side of that bet that he finishes top five in at least one major.

[BrotherMouzone]

Lee Westwood has played in over 50 majors and never won a single one. He's missed the cut more often in majors than he's made the top 10. He has won ONE tournament in the last 15 months, and 3 in the last 3+ years. Only ONE on the PGA Tour. He's one of the biggest Sunday chokers in recent golf history.

Martin Kaymer has done fairly well on the European tour, beating people like Christian Nilsson and Danny Willett...just as Real Madrid has done in the Spanish league, Olympia Milano has done in the Italian league, and Yomiuri has done in Japanese baseball. None of those teams are the best in the world, and neither is Martin Kaymer the best golfer in the world. There will probably be at least 5 golfers favored over him in every major he plays this year, and most likely he'll not finish in the Top 5 in any of them.

The world golf rankings are absurd. Kaymer certainly has a lot of talent, and his PGA Championship can't be taken away from him. I just think if you're going to be the #1 golfer in the world, you should be playing against the best in the world on a weekly basis, or if not, when you do play against them, you need to win more than one time. For example, if Paddy Harrington had been ranked number one in the world at the end of 2008 (and I know he was a member of both tours), I would have no argument against it -- he had won 3 majors in 2 years. But somehow, he couldn't get higher than 3rd. And yet Lee frickin' Westwood can be number 1? I'm sorry, there's something horribly wrong with that.

There won't be at least five golfers favored over Kaymer in every major this year. In case you forgot, he fucking won one last year at the ripe old age of 25. He also finished in the top 7 in two other majors. Name one player who is better than Kaymer right now.

[WayBackVazquez]

There won't be at least five golfers favored over Kaymer in every major this year. In case you forgot, he fucking won one last year at the ripe old age of 25. He also finished in the top 7 in two other majors. Name one player who is better than Kaymer right now.

Settle down, Francis. You might want to rethink your brilliant plan of gaining membership by bouncing into the golf thread and flexing and dropping f-bombs.

Yes, he won one last year. He also missed the cut in one. Six of the last 8 have been won by guys who'd never won one before. That's great that he won a major at 25. I guess I should just accept that he and Ben Curtis will be trading victories from here on out.

There are about 10 guys I'd gladly take even money on over him at the Masters. Let's see if this is the year he can make the cut.

[BrotherMouzone]

Settle down, Francis. You might want to rethink your brilliant plan of gaining membership by bouncing into the golf thread and flexing and dropping f-bombs.

Yes, he won one last year. He also missed the cut in one. Six of the last 8 have been won by guys who'd never won one before. That's great that he won a major at 25. I guess I should just accept that he and Ben Curtis will be trading victories from here on out.

There are about 10 guys I'd gladly take even money on over him at the Masters. Let's see if this is the year he can make the cut.

Could care less about gaining a membership. I asked you to name one player who is better than Martin Kaymer right now. Do you have one?

[WayBackVazquez]

Could care less about gaining a membership. I asked you to name one player who is better than Martin Kaymer right now. Do you have one?

Jim Furyk, Tiger Woods, Phil Mickelson, Ernie Els, Padraig Harrington, Rory McIlroy...my list goes on. I would take any of these men in a heads up match in the Masters, and then I'd let you chase your money double or nothing in the U.S. Open and then one more time in the British. Nothing you can cite will "prove" he's the best player in the world.

Golfers currently favored over Kaymer (20-1) in the U.S. Open: Tiger (3-1); Phil (6-1); McIlroy (12-1); Westwood (15-1). Tied with Kaymer: Els, Harrington, Rose, Casey, Kim.

Golfers currently favored over Kaymer (23-1) in the British: Tiger (4-1); Westwood (10-1); McIlroy (12-1); Mickelson (18-1); Harrington (20-1); Rose (20-1).

And after he drops another 76 as he's done every year on Thursday or Friday at Augusta, there will be more names on those lists.

[BrotherMouzone]

Jim Furyk, Tiger Woods, Phil Mickelson, Ernie Els, Padraig Harrington, Rory McIlroy...my list goes on. I would take any of these men in a heads up match in the Masters, and then I'd let you chase your money double or nothing in the U.S. Open and then one more time in the British. Nothing you can cite will "prove" he's the best player in the world.

Golfers currently favored over Kaymer (20-1) in the U.S. Open: Tiger (3-1); Phil (6-1); McIlroy (12-1); Westwood (15-1). Tied with Kaymer: Els, Harrington, Rose, Casey, Kim.

Golfers currently favored over Kaymer (23-1) in the British: Tiger (4-1); Westwood (10-1); McIlroy (12-1); Mickelson (18-1); Harrington (20-1); Rose (20-1).

And after he drops another 76 as he's done every year on Thursday or Friday at Augusta, there will be more names on those lists.

Don't know where you're getting your odds. The sportsbook I went to, bet365, has Kaymer second in the British (12-1 and tied with Westwood) behind Tiger at 9-2. He's also the favorite European to win a major this year, along with Westwood (4-1).

If you think that Harrington (who hasn't won on either the PGA or Euro Tour in three years) or Mcilroy (who's won once on either tour in the last year) are better right now than Martin Kaymer, than this argument is fruitless. All I know is the last major that was completed, Kaymer came in first. The last WGC event that was completed, Kaymer finished in second. He already won a star-studded field in Dubai this year by eight strokes.

[WayBackVazquez]

Don't know where you're getting your odds. The sportsbook I went to, bet365, has Kaymer second in the British (12-1 and tied with Westwood) behind Tiger at 9-2. He's also the favorite European to win a major this year, along with Westwood (4-1).

If you think that Harrington (who hasn't won on either the PGA or Euro Tour in three years) or Mcilroy (who's won once on either tour in the last year) are better right now than Martin Kaymer, than this argument is fruitless. All I know is the last major that was completed, Kaymer came in first. The last WGC event that was completed, Kaymer finished in second. He already won a star-studded field in Dubai this year by eight strokes.

Yeah, he won at Dubai, came in second in an unusual format where he was the higher seed, melted down in the final, and won the semi because his opponent melted down. He also played pretty much like crap in his other 2 events where everyone expected him to move to #1. Like I said, I would happily take any of those guys I mentioned even money heads up at the masters.

And the odds are from betus.com, which also has him as only the third favorite Euro to win a major this season.

Edited by WayBackVazquez, 01 March 2011 - 11:45 AM.

[FL4WL3SS]

You're an idiot.

[FL4WL3SS]

I mean seriously, I can't even get over this - Furyk? Harrington? Els? What is this, 2003? And you didn't even mention Matt Kuchar, who might be the best American right now.

And citing betting odds to validate your point is asinine. You realize betting lines are created to entice betting, right?

BTW - you realize neither Woods nor Mickelson has won in a year, right? Woods hasn't won in a year and a half. Do you even watch golf? I can't stop asking questions, I need answers.

Edited by FL4WL3SS, 01 March 2011 - 04:27 PM.

[WayBackVazquez]

I mean seriously, I can't even get over this - Furyk? Harrington? Els? What is this, 2003? And you didn't even mention Matt Kuchar, who might be the best American right now.

And citing betting odds to validate your point is asinine. You realize betting lines are created to entice betting, right?

BTW - you realize neither Woods nor Mickelson has won in a year, right? Woods hasn't won in a year and a half. Do you even watch golf? I can't stop asking questions, I need answers.

You're right, flawless. You're always right about golf. Didn't you play competitive golf? I think I forget, because you haven't mentioned it in a few weeks. I don't know why we don't just ban anyone but you from posting in this forum. Moron.

Yes, Matt Kuchar, who has one about 2 times in the last 10 years is better than Mickelson because he hasn't won since last year's MASTERS. And yes, it must be 2003, because Jim Furyk has only won 3 PGA events including the Tour Championship in the last 11 months. It makes PERFECT sense that Furyk should be ranked 11th, while Lee Westwood and Luke Donald, who combined have won only as many PGA events in the last decade as you've read non-picture books are ranked 2 and 3. I guess I misremembered Els winning 2 events last year, and top 20ing 3 of the 4 majors. And yes, I guess it is is asinine to cite betting odds to refute a statement that there won't be any golfers favored over Kaymer.

Now shut the fuck up.

Edited by WayBackVazquez, 01 March 2011 - 07:10 PM.

[Lupe Whalewatch]

I believe the original question was who you think the number one golfer in the world should be, or who is playing better golf at this moment? Tiger Woods may very well finish ahead of Kaymer in the Masters, but his body of work over the past 12 months pales in comparison to Kaymer's, or Kuchar's for that matter. If you think the world golf rankings are a joke, please tell us who you think the number one golfer in the world is right now.

[WayBackVazquez]

I believe the original question was who you think the number one golfer in the world should be, or who is playing better golf at this moment? Tiger Woods may very well finish ahead of Kaymer in the Masters, but his body of work over the past 12 months pales in comparison to Kaymer's, or Kuchar's for that matter. If you think the world golf rankings are a joke, please tell us who you think the number one golfer in the world is right now.

Please explain the basis for your understanding that the "body of work over the past 12 months" is or should be the determinative calculus as to who the world's best golfer is.

The fact is, of course, that the world golf rankings don't just consider the past 12 months. If they did, then Jim Furyk, who has won 3 events in that span, would not be ranked 11th in the world. 12 months is arbitrary, as is 2 years. And the rankings are a joke because it's impossible to fairly compare players who are playing against different competition each week. Some of these players beat up on inferior competition at inferior events, and choke in majors or against the best competition (hello, Mr. Westwood). Other players play almost ONLY against the very top players. Some players amass stockpiles of points by being consistently good, but never winning (Hi, Matt and Luke). I'm sorry, but I have every right to believe someone who WINS tournaments should be ranked higher than someone with a bunch of top 10s.

By the way, what if I told you there is a guy who has SEVEN wins and 19 top 10s in his last 34 PGA events, including 8 top 10s in his last 11 majors (including two Top 5s last year)? I can't think he's the best golfer in the world, but Matt Kuchar has a case because he won once last year?

Edited by WayBackVazquez, 01 March 2011 - 07:52 PM.

[FL4WL3SS]

You're right, flawless. You're always right about golf. Didn't you play competitive golf? I think I forget, because you haven't mentioned it in a few weeks. I don't know why we don't just ban anyone but you from posting in this forum. Moron.

Yes, Matt Kuchar, who has one about 2 times in the last 10 years is better than Mickelson because he hasn't won since last year's MASTERS. And yes, it must be 2003, because Jim Furyk has only won 3 PGA events including the Tour Championship in the last 11 months. It makes PERFECT sense that Furyk should be ranked 11th, while Lee Westwood and Luke Donald, who combined have won only as many PGA events in the last decade as you've read non-picture books are ranked 2 and 3. I guess I misremembered Els winning 2 events last year, and top 20ing 3 of the 4 majors. And yes, I guess it is is asinine to cite betting odds to refute a statement that there won't be any golfers favored over Kaymer.

Now shut the fuck up.

Why don't you keep citing Kaymer not playing well in the Masters as the basis for your argument against him. Why not mention Mickelson's historic inability to do anything at the British? You can argue all you want, but it won't make you right.

You think Kaymer folded at the WGC last week? How about he got beat by a guy who put up an historic showing in match play competition (won 6&5 twice, 5&4 once, never went to 18 holes on any of his matches and never trailed once in any of his matches).

You're still an idiot.

[FL4WL3SS]

Please explain the basis for your understanding that the "body of work over the past 12 months" is or should be the determinative calculus as to who the world's best golfer is.

The fact is, of course, that the world golf rankings don't just consider the past 12 months. If they did, then Jim Furyk, who has won 3 events in that span, would not be ranked 11th in the world. 12 months is arbitrary, as is 2 years. And the rankings are a joke because it's impossible to fairly compare players who are playing against different competition each week. Some of these players beat up on inferior competition at inferior events, and choke in majors or against the best competition (hello, Mr. Westwood). Other players play almost ONLY against the very top players. Some players amass stockpiles of points by being consistently good, but never winning (Hi, Matt and Luke). I'm sorry, but I have every right to believe someone who WINS tournaments should be ranked higher than someone with a bunch of top 10s.

By the way, what if I told you there is a guy who has SEVEN wins and 19 top 10s in his last 34 PGA events, including 8 top 10s in his last 11 majors (including two Top 5s last year)? I can't think he's the best golfer in the world, but Matt Kuchar has a case because he won once last year?

You still aren't arguing against Kaymer. I've heard arguments against everybody else besides Kaymer (Kuchar, Donald, Westwood), but you haven't justified why Kaymer shouldn't be #1. He won 4 times last year including one major and two top-10 finishes in two other majors.

[Lupe Whalewatch]

Please explain the basis for your understanding that the "body of work over the past 12 months" is or should be the determinative calculus as to who the world's best golfer is.

The fact is, of course, that the world golf rankings don't just consider the past 12 months. If they did, then Jim Furyk, who has won 3 events in that span, would not be ranked 11th in the world. 12 months is arbitrary, as is 2 years. And the rankings are a joke because it's impossible to fairly compare players who are playing against different competition each week. Some of these players beat up on inferior competition at inferior events, and choke in majors or against the best competition (hello, Mr. Westwood). Other players play almost ONLY against the very top players. Some players amass stockpiles of points by being consistently good, but never winning (Hi, Matt and Luke). I'm sorry, but I have every right to believe someone who WINS tournaments should be ranked higher than someone with a bunch of top 10s.

By the way, what if I told you there is a guy who has SEVEN wins and 19 top 10s in his last 34 PGA events, including 8 top 10s in his last 11 majors (including two Top 5s last year)? I can't think he's the best golfer in the world, but Matt Kuchar has a case because he won once last year?

Ok, so you think Tiger should still be ranked #1 in the world. This is the same Tiger Woods who lost in the Accenture to a guy who strongly considered retiring from competitive golf his play has been so poor. You are right, 12 months is a completely arbitrary number I threw out there. I just don't really have a huge problem with the world golf rankings the way they are. They are trying to identify the best golfer in the world right now. As I mentioned earlier, your view of the Euro tour is a little different than mine, so maybe that is where the problem lies. Is Kaymer definitely the world's best golfer right now? I don't know, but he's right up there, close enough where I wouldn't call the system a joke. If you think Tiger Woods is the world's best golfer right now, you are wrong...it is really that simple.

[WayBackVazquez]

Ok, so you think Tiger should still be ranked #1 in the world. This is the same Tiger Woods who lost in the Accenture to a guy who strongly considered retiring from competitive golf his play has been so poor. You are right, 12 months is a completely arbitrary number I threw out there. I just don't really have a huge problem with the world golf rankings the way they are. They are trying to identify the best golfer in the world right now. As I mentioned earlier, your view of the Euro tour is a little different than mine, so maybe that is where the problem lies. Is Kaymer definitely the world's best golfer right now? I don't know, but he's right up there, close enough where I wouldn't call the system a joke. If you think Tiger Woods is the world's best golfer right now, you are wrong...it is really that simple.

I absolutely don't think Kaymer being number 1 is what makes the system a joke. I don't think he's the best golfer in the world. To me, that means in every tournament if you let me have that guy, and I let you pick anyone else in the field, I'm getting the best of it. I just don't feel that way about Kaymer, but as I've said, I can't take the PGA away from him, he's played very well in Europe, and reasonable minds can disagree.

Lee Westwood and Luke Donald as numbers 2 and 3 in front of Tiger, and Furyk sitting at #11 is another story altogether.

Edited by WayBackVazquez, 01 March 2011 - 08:20 PM.

[Lupe Whalewatch]

I don't think he's the best golfer in the world. To me, that means in every tournament if you let me have that guy, and I let you pick anyone else in the field, I'm getting the best of it. I just don't feel that way about Kaymer,

Very interesting point. I think a lot of people feel that way now, and I think Tiger Woods is 100% responsible for it. I certainly don't remember doing the whole #1 vs the field before Tiger Woods, but that was a long long time ago, so could be wrong. The near decade of Tiger dominance is something I doubt we see ever again in the sport of golf. Tiger was expected to win every time he went out. I don't remember if it was that way when Norman, Couples, Faldo or whoever else held the spot before him.

Also I will give you the Westwood #1 thing as well...he was very much at the right place at the right time, ie: Woods shitting the bed, him doing very well without any form of dominance.

Again, I think Kaymer is probably playing the best, and most consistent golf in the world right now. What's great about it right now, is you have a bunch of young great players who now with Tiger somewhat out of the way, feel they have a chance to grab that spot as well. It will be an interesting year.

[WayBackVazquez]

Very interesting point. I think a lot of people feel that way now, and I think Tiger Woods is 100% responsible for it. I certainly don't remember doing the whole #1 vs the field before Tiger Woods, but that was a long long time ago, so could be wrong. The near decade of Tiger dominance is something I doubt we see ever again in the sport of golf. Tiger was expected to win every time he went out. I don't remember if it was that way when Norman, Couples, Faldo or whoever else held the spot before him.

No, I don't mean #1 vs. the field; that's really not fair, and the fact that Tiger made it a close proposition was just absurd. What I mean is #1 vs. any one guy I pick. I would have no problem taking Tiger or Phil to finish higher than Kaymer at the Masters for even money.

[BigMike]

Sure the World Golf Rankings are basically meaningless. They aren't used for seeding at events like they are in tennis. They are largely just for bragging rights, etc. Maybe there are some tournaments which use it for invites.

When trying to pinpoint who is the best in a sport at doing something in the current moment it only makes sense to use recent results. Golf uses a 2 year ranking system. I believe Tennis uses 1 year. The rankings are designed so that the more important tournaments give more points, so it's not like Kaymer is #1 because he won a few second tier Euro tour events.

You say Kaymer has choked away previous chances to take over #1. Well how many times in the last year did we hear about Mickelson having a chance to take over #1, and then throw a lousy Sunday up on the board (several times last year)

You complain about Jim Furyk's #11 ranking. I like Jim a Lot, He had a very good 2010, winning 3 times. Kaymer has 4 top 10's in his last 5 majors. Furyk has 5 top 10's in his last 30 Majors, none in the last 7

[The Four Peters]

What I mean is #1 vs. any one guy I pick. I would have no problem taking Tiger or Phil to finish higher than Kaymer at the Masters for even money.

And I'm sure many people would have no problem taking Kaymer over Tiger or Phil at the British Open. But obviously the rankings should be designed to agree how WayBackVazquez, internet poster, would bet on only the first major of the year. I mean, that's certainly what determines the best golfer in the world.

It's been pretty clearly laid out why the rankings aren't out of left field while also agreeing that they're not definitive. Your most common response has been to say that your betting opinion at one major disagrees with the rankings, so clearly they suck.

As a casual watcher of golf (i.e. the majors and random tournaments when it's on), I've been incredibly impressed with Kaymer over the last year. He's not a clear cut #1, but it's tough to pick someone who is definitively playing better golf than him over the past year or so.

[WayBackVazquez]

And I'm sure many people would have no problem taking Kaymer over Tiger or Phil at the British Open.

And as I've said, Kaymer is at 23-1 to win that tournament, while Tiger is 4-1. So those many people should get an incredible price. Unfortunately, I won't be able to get even money on Tiger vs. Kaymer, because no bookie or sports book would be willing to take my bet.

[FL4WL3SS]

Kaymer on the leaderboard again; one week after taking over the #1 spot. Looks like he might be there to stay for a while.

[Bob Montgomery's Helmet Hat]

Kaymer on the leaderboard again; one week after taking over the #1 spot. Looks like he might be there to stay for a while.

He seems to have a nice combination of talent, cockiness, and cyborg mentality. I think he can handle being the hunted(unlike Westwood).

[Clears Cleaver]

Meanwhile, Tiger becomes less and less relevent each week. Hard to write him off, bhut this new swing is an abomination and his short game has no confidence behind it. There's a good chance he's never going to be the best golfer ever again

[cshea]

Consistency is Tiger's biggest problem. He can't string together 4 holes, let alone 4 rounds of a tournament. The 74 yesterday all but takes him out of contention in the weekend. I think he just needs to play a lot more tournaments. He's not going to get in a rhythm if he's taking 2-3 weeks off between each competitive event.

Anyway, strong leaderboard at Doral. This should be a fun weekend. Hunter Mahan has the lead at -9, but there's a real strong group of players sitting 2-3 shots back, including Martin Kaymer.

Edit: Exhibit A on Tiger's inconsistency...nice birdie on 12, then he follows it up with a 3 putt bogey on 13.

Edited by cshea, 12 March 2011 - 01:13 PM.

[Clears Cleaver]

Johnny miler just killed Tiger, who hit a driver 122 yards this week and a 3-wood 188 yards. Said swing is a mess and that he should go back to fundamentals rather tahn this new move with coach Foley.

[WayBackVazquez]

Johnny miler just killed Tiger, who hit a driver 122 yards this week and a 3-wood 188 yards. Said swing is a mess and that he should go back to fundamentals rather tahn this new move with coach Foley.

That means quite a lot coming from Johnny Miller. He's never spouted nonsense about Tiger before.

Farrell Evans, writer-reporter, Sports Illustrated: I've always thought Johnny Miller was a little cuckoo in the best sense of the word. He has a brilliant golf mind as well as the great potential to be completely wrong. On Tiger and Phil, he's wrong.

Hack: Seems to me like there is some history between Tiger and Johnny, otherwise Johnny wouldn't keep making these off-the-wall statements. I'm glad Roger called him on it.

Read more: http://www.golf.com/...l#ixzz1GQDuDWwV

Johnny Miller's ego is infinitesimally bigger than his IQ.

Tiger has not played particularly well this week, but if even a third of the putts that burned the lip this week had dropped, he'd be among the leaders.

Edited by WayBackVazquez, 12 March 2011 - 04:11 PM.

[Lupe Whalewatch]

That means quite a lot coming from Johnny Miller. He's never spouted nonsense about Tiger before.

Tiger has not played particularly well this week, but if even a third of the putts that burned the lip this week had dropped, he'd be among the leaders.

and if Hunter Mahan made a few more putts he'd have a 4 shot lead, but that's golf. You are right, Johhny Miller does have a huge ego, but he is correct about Tiger's performance...he has been mediocre at the very best this week, at or near the bottom of the field in driving accuracy, putting, and scrambling. I would say it's almost impossible for a tour pro to hit a driver 122 yards if they were blndfolded. His swing is a mess.

[WayBackVazquez]

and if Hunter Mahan made a few more putts he'd have a 4 shot lead, but that's golf. You are right, Johhny Miller does have a huge ego, but he is correct about Tiger's performance...he has been mediocre at the very best this week, at or near the bottom of the field in driving accuracy, putting, and scrambling. I would say it's almost impossible for a tour pro to hit a driver 122 yards if they were blndfolded. His swing is a mess.

You know very well that's "not golf." Tiger is 2 under for the tournament. Last I checked, the unflappable cyborg world #1 was 5 under. And that's primarily because on Thursday I think he had 22 putts. That doesn't mean he's the world's greatest putter and Tiger is the World's worst. Sometimes the close ones fall and sometimes they don't. There is a large amount of variance when it comes to putting.

Johnny Miller, in addition to not liking Tiger, loves Butch Harmon. If you do some googling, you'll see that Johnny said the same thing back in 2003-04, that Tiger should just "get down on his knees" (he actually used these words today) to Butch Harmon and go back to him. Tiger didn't win a major for 10 straight starts in that period and was 3rd and 4th on the money list. I'd say he deserves the benefit of the doubt on whether a swing change will be ultimately beneficial.

Edited by WayBackVazquez, 12 March 2011 - 04:37 PM.

[cshea]

I find it pretty remarkable that Tiger's -2 in a tournament while shanking shots like the ones referenced above. He'll be fine once he gets his consistency back. He also was using a new putter today, which he switched after yesterday's round. It's the first time I can ever remember him not using a Scotty Cameron putter.

Edit: Not that it means much since they both suck right now, but Phil was a thousand times worse than Tiger today.

Edited by cshea, 12 March 2011 - 04:49 PM.

[Lupe Whalewatch]

You know very well that's "not golf." Tiger is 2 under for the tournament. Last I checked, the unflappable cyborg world #1 was 5 under. And that's primarily because on Thursday I think he had 22 putts. That doesn't mean he's the world's greatest putter and Tiger is the World's worst. Sometimes the close ones fall and sometimes they don't. There is a large amount of variance when it comes to putting.

Actually it is. That same conversation is had at every clubhouse after every round of golf...."if i could have only hit my irons a little better, if only i could have made a few more putts" Thats the way the game works. Players generally don't lose tournaments because of bad luck, you add em up at the end of four rounds and the most consistently solid guy wins. Johnny Miller may very well loathe Tiger Woods, but if he said that Tiger stinks right now he is not far off. The guy duck hooked a driver 122 yards and popped up a 3 wood 188 yards and will deservingly be 10 + shots out of the lead after three rounds. Its great you love Tiger, I think the tour needs him back. When he is at the top of his game, I would rather watch him play a practice round then the majority of the rest of these guys. But he isn't close right now, and because Johnny MIller doesn't like him doesn't make it untrue.

[WayBackVazquez]

Actually it is. That same conversation is had at every clubhouse after every round of golf...."if i could have only hit my irons a little better, if only i could have made a few more putts" Thats the way the game works. Players generally don't lose tournaments because of bad luck, you add em up at the end of four rounds and the most consistently solid guy wins. Johnny Miller may very well loathe Tiger Woods, but if he said that Tiger stinks right now he is not far off. The guy duck hooked a driver 122 yards and popped up a 3 wood 188 yards and will deservingly be 10 + shots out of the lead after three rounds. Its great you love Tiger, I think the tour needs him back. When he is at the top of his game, I would rather watch him play a practice round then the majority of the rest of these guys. But he isn't close right now, and because Johnny MIller doesn't like him doesn't make it untrue.

The simple fact is, Tiger is in the Top 10 in GIR in this tourney. I've seen his three rounds, and he has just missed a ton of putts, and that's why he's not high on the leaderboard. Meanwhile, Kaymer is outside the top 20 in GIR. He had a super-hot putter on Thursday.

That's golf.

[cshea]

Nice meltdown by Nick Watney on 18. He drove it into the water and looked absolutely shell shocked.

It looks like Dustin Johnson is going to have a 2-shot lead headed into the final round. He fired a pretty impressive 65 today.

[Bob Montgomery's Helmet Hat]

All the focus on Tiger is taking the heat off of Phil, who really is playing like total crap.

[cshea]

Tiger's playing well today. 2 under on the front. 3 birdie's, 1 bogey. He seems to be hitting fairway's and he's been dialed in with his wedges. Tough to get a read on his putter because he's either missing the green or sticking it to within 3 feet.

[Bob Montgomery's Helmet Hat]

Meanwhile, Phil has been in 11 bunkers through 14 holes. That's a whole lot of crooked shots.

EDIT--13 bunkers in 17 holes. That would be a shitty day for me.

Edited by Bob Montgomery's Helmet Hat, 13 March 2011 - 01:41 PM.

[Lupe Whalewatch]

Jeff Overton and Anthony Kim were the first group out this am and played their round in 2:06...that's a hell of a pace.

[TheYellowDart5]

Back-to-back birdies for Tiger on 11 and 12. If it weren't for that 74 on Friday, he could be right in the thick of this.

[Bob Montgomery's Helmet Hat]

Jeff Overton and Anthony Kim were the first group out this am and played their round in 2:06...that's a hell of a pace.

It's not atypical for the first group out on the Sunday of an event like this to see how fast they can play.

[Freddy Linn]

Jeff Overton and Anthony Kim were the first group out this am and played their round in 2:06...that's a hell of a pace.

Overton loves to do this. From last year's PGA:

Playing alone in the first group off when ailing Ian Poulter withdrew, Overton walked 18 holes at Whistling Straits in 2 hours, 9 minutes, to break the PGA Championship record for quickest round.

I bet they knew what that number was.

[cshea]

Tiger finishes up with an impressive 66 today. It's amazing what he can do when he keeps the ball in the fairway off the tee. I believe he's off next week, but will be playing at Bay Hill in 2 weeks. Let's see if he can build off today's round.

Edit: As for the leader's, Kuchar and Mahan have been on fire early on and are tied with Dustin Johnson at -14.

Edited by cshea, 13 March 2011 - 03:01 PM.

[Bob Montgomery's Helmet Hat]

Fowler is absolutely tearing it up, 7 under through 13 holes to bring him to -11. Probably started too far back, but if he could post
-13, who knows.

[Freddy Linn]

I love this leaderboard.

[cshea]

Hunter Mahan is really putting on a show here at #12.

Edited by cshea, 13 March 2011 - 04:02 PM.

[johnmd20]

Hunter Mahan is really putting on a show here at #12.

Yeah, he wasn't in control but at least he hit the putt for 6.

Edit - and he doubles 13. Probably just stuck the nail in the coffin there.

Edited by johnmd20, 13 March 2011 - 04:17 PM.