40 replies to this topic

[knucklecup]

per Rotoworld.

[mabrowndog]

per Rotoworld.

Sweet. Plenty of discussion/hopeful speculation on this here the past few days.

I'm really, really stunned that so many teams passed on the guy.

I'm guessing they'll waive either Mark Wagner or Matt Fox to clear a roster spot, though some have suggested Nava is an extraneous OF now and could get the boot from the 40-man.

Edited by mabrowndog, 05 January 2011 - 04:30 PM.

[Bongorific]

Sox finally get their man. It would be great if one of Max or Salty pans out to be a legitimate long-term catching option. Still confused why the Rangers DFA him. Perhaps they just had cold feet in general taking on Lowell?

[JMDurron]

Sox finally get their man. It would be great if one of Max or Salty pans out to be a legitimate long-term catching option. Still confused why the Rangers DFA him. Perhaps they just had cold feet in general taking on Lowell?

It would be great if Buchholz could end up pitching to both Salty and Ramirez at some point while all 3 are in a Red Sox uniform. Doubly so because that would be a sign that both are MLB-capable catchers in the team's eyes.

[mabrowndog]

Matt Fox DFA'd per Rotoworld

[Alternate34]

Neat.

Positives: Basically free. Has generally high IsoD, especially in his stints in the majors (though that is only 140 PAs). Had a studly 2008 in AA. Even adjusting his BABIP down would make that year studly.

Negatives: Has stalled in AAA the last two years. His IsoD looks good, but he lost his power, and his OBP looks good only when he has BABIP fueled rage.

Hey, we need catchers and catchers are often late bloomers because of the myriad responsibilities they have. The biggest positive is that he cost almost nothing.

[czar]

Jim Callis weighs in:

Interesting bat, not really a C, more of a 1B/DH. @willwoodboston: quick scouting report on new #RedSox prospect Max Ramirez?

[xjack]

This could be fun. Ramirez vs. Salty will be the first significant battle for a starting job that the Red Sox have had in spring training in some time.

[SaveBooFerriss]

Red Sox fans have to accept that this guy is not a C. This is why he was DFA'd. He is worth a look, but Callis is right that he is a 1b/DH type.

[graffam198]

Interesting pick up. Could he have been DFA'd b/c the Rangers don't see him as a catcher? His number up to AA looked great, but he has fallen off the cliff offensively. Additionally, his caugh stealing percentage has dropped from a mid 20's range (24% on average) to 16% last year in AAA (6 caught in 31 chances). He only threw out 18% at the big league level, again not a large sample size (8 caught in 36 chances).

[Trlicek's Whip]

Jim Callis weighs in:

We got ourselves our own Montero!

A promising 2008 tearing up the minors, going Rk > AA > AAA and then getting a cup of coffee in TEX at 23 years old. Wrist issues in 2009, so maybe that plus limited exposure and development at the higher levels means there's potential. He's only got 500 career at-bats at AAA spread over the last three years, and only 115 career AB's with TEX (in 2008 and 2010, bookended around zero ML at-bats in 2009). Could TEX even accurately have assessed him given SSS sprinkled with the herk-and-jerk of inconsistent AB's and injury?

I'm optimistic if he can provide passable defense, they can see if the snap in his bat (and power) returns at all post-wrist. Though he's a big whiffer with a CT% under 70%. A lottery ticket and post-Ortiz plan for DH?

Edited by Trlicek's Whip, 05 January 2011 - 05:35 PM.

[graffam198]

I'm optimistic if he can provide passable defense, they can see if the snap in his bat (and power) returns at all post-wrist. Though he's a big whiffer with a CT% under 70%. A lottery ticket and post-Ortiz plan for DH?

Post wrists. Soreness in the right wrist followed by tendonitis in the left wrist in 2009. I think he has potential, but probably needs a full season in AAA, if not two. He hit the cover off the ball during the 2009 winter ball season, slugging .486 with 13 home runs in 210 plate appearances but couldn't translate that into AAA success. From everyhting I have read, his swing is too long. I am wondering if he is having a hard time with turning his wrists over, if there is still some lingering injury there.

[Vegas Sox Fan]

So I guess this means at 1B/DH rotation of Anderson and Ramirez in Pawtucket with each trying to take Papi's spot next year?

[E5 Yaz]

mlbtr: Before the 2010 season, Baseball America wrote that Ramirez is "a plus hitter who works the count and drives the ball to all fields" when healthy. However, the publication described the catcher as a below-average defender with below-average arm strength and well below-average running speed.

Not a catcher, but maybe an interesting bat

[Rough Carrigan]

I hope they sit him down and read him the riot act and tell him that he's been pissing away his chance at a decent career. Get him to API in Arizona with Pedroia and Youks and see what he can do in 2011.

[Buzzkill Pauley]

So I guess this means at 1B/DH rotation of Anderson and Ramirez in Pawtucket with each both trying to take Papi's spot next year?

I would think yes, so long as Theo's willing to accept a platooned DH for $800K. Uses up 2 roster spots but if Ramirez can catch Lackey it would give the team its backup catcher and backup 1B, in addition to the starting DH.

Not sure what the pickup immediately adds to what the Sox have with Lavarnway, but I have to laugh that the price on these two fell from Buchholz + Lowell to virtually nothing, within two years.

[chrisfont9]

I hope they sit him down and read him the riot act and tell him that he's been pissing away his chance at a decent career. Get him to API in Arizona with Pedroia and Youks and see what he can do in 2011.

Wait, what? Is there some evidence of an attitude problem that I missed? Not being snotty, I just haven't seen the "pissing away" part yet.

[Doug Beerabelli]

Do the Sox and Rangers split the check on Lowell's next meal at Applebees as part of this transaction?

[bosockboy]

All we need is Teagarden to complete the trifecta...all three of Texas' prized catching trio.

Ceiling for us is likely a backup 1B/DH type...bench role. Not bad for free.

[AlNipper49]

If it makes the Rangers feel better they're still welcome to take Lowell

[Buzzkill Pauley]

If it makes the Rangers feel better they're still welcome to take Lowell

If I got to choose, at this point I'd offer Lawrence instead.

[Rough Carrigan]

Wait, what? Is there some evidence of an attitude problem that I missed? Not being snotty, I just haven't seen the "pissing away" part yet.

I was thinking of it in the sense that he wasn't in the best shape he could be, not that he was an attitude problem and hence the admonition to go to API.

[wyatt55]

Seen him play at AA Frisco, where he absolutely hosed a guy at 2B, but that was a couple years ago. Wish I saw more of his Defense recently.

Could be a poor man's V. Martinez. I do not see him being a Papi replacement.

[Rudy Pemberton]

Can still be an asset as a part time catcher....a guy who can hit, play 1b, and play catcher, even if only once in a while, would be incredibly valuable as a 25th man on the roster. Certainly think he'll be in the minors to start the season and so the Sox get a better since of where his future lies, but a pretty intriguing pick him up. Surprised he got all the way to the Sox, no crappy teams wanted to take a flyer?

[SoxFanSince57]

Can still be an asset as a part time catcher....a guy who can hit, play 1b, and play catcher, even if only once in a while, would be incredibly valuable as a 25th man on the roster. Certainly think he'll be in the minors to start the season and so the Sox get a better since of where his future lies, but a pretty intriguing pick him up. Surprised he got all the way to the Sox, no crappy teams wanted to take a flyer?

If his wrist heals, I agree that he can play a meaningful bench role for the Sox as a C/DH/1B/PH in 2012. He might be a third-stringer in all those positions, but as 25th man with upside at bat, he is a welcomed addition to the Sox depth-chart. Max could "rake" before he hurt his wrist.

Edited by SoxFanSince57, 06 January 2011 - 09:42 AM.

[Eric Van]

Can still be an asset as a part time catcher....a guy who can hit, play 1b, and play catcher, even if only once in a while, would be incredibly valuable as a 25th man on the roster.

He's a free Mike Napoli Light. This is almost exactly the role I wanted Napoli for (except with even less catching).

Now the question is whether Ramirez or Darnell McDonald would be a more valuable 25th guy. There are not that many times when two of three outfielders will be out of the lineup but Papi will be in it.

The other impact this has -- when the Oki deal is official they will have to move either Coello or (much more likely) Nava. Hopefully they can get him to a team that is thin in the OF where he won't be the third best guy in AAA.

I actually think you'll see Linares in the Pawtucket OF before long, and it would be good to make room for him; in the meantime, there's Bell and Bates and maybe even Daeges.

Bottom line is that this one move for a potential 25th guy may have spelled the organizational end for both our starting LF and CF from last year. How strange is that?

[Eric Van]

So I guess this means at 1B/DH rotation of Anderson and Ramirez in Pawtucket with each trying to take Papi's spot next year?

He's out of options, which is why he was waived.

He'll compete with McDonald for the last bench spot. If he looks bad in ST there's a pretty good chance of sneaking him through waivers at the right time, but not if he looks good and healthy.

[mabrowndog]

He's out of options, which is why he was waived.

PeteAbe confirms this. It also explains why so many teams passed on claiming him.

In response to a number of questions from readers, new Red Sox catcher Max Ramirez is out of minor-league options. So if he does not make the team out of spring training, he would have to be designated for assignment.

That does not necessarily mean he would be lost to another team, however. That the Red Sox were able to claim Ramirez means a significant number of teams passed on him. They very well could DFA him and outright him to AAA.

So Ramirez being out of options should not be a signal he will make the team. Beyond his roster status, this is a guy with a career batting average of .217 who has been traded twice and designated once. They're not exactly at risk of losing Johnny Bench.

[sox junky]

I wonder if the delay with formally announcing the Oki signing is related to Ramirez? Maybe the Sox intend to clear room for Oki by DFA'ing Ramirez. Otherwise, it's hard to figure how they clear space for Oki...

[mabrowndog]

I wonder if the delay with formally announcing the Oki signing is related to Ramirez? Maybe the Sox intend to clear room for Oki by DFA'ing Ramirez. Otherwise, it's hard to figure how they clear space for Oki...

I'm glad you mentioned Okajima, because I'd completely forgotten he hasn't been added to the 40-man yet.

Edited by mabrowndog, 08 January 2011 - 04:57 PM.

[Foulkey Reese]

I wonder if the delay with formally announcing the Oki signing is related to Ramirez? Maybe the Sox intend to clear room for Oki by DFA'ing Ramirez. Otherwise, it's hard to figure how they clear space for Oki...

Yep.

brianmacp Brian MacPherson
To make room for Okajima, the #RedSox placed Max Ramirez on waivers, and he was claimed by the Cubs.

[mabrowndog]

The Cubs weren't able to claim him prior to the Garza trade, but moving their cavalcade of prospects to the Rays created 2 vacancies on their 40-man. As of right now they have 15 position players and 24 pitchers.

[travis bickled]

http://www.boston.co...as/extra_bases/

Bye Max...ohh well...No suprise right?

Edited by travis bickled, 10 January 2011 - 03:27 PM.

[Eric Van]

http://www.boston.co...as/extra_bases/

Bye Max...ohh well...No suprise right?

I would much rather they traded their 8th outfielder, Daniel Nava, for anything at all, including the various proverbial demeaning things, than lose an interesting guy like Ramirez.

[bd11]

I would much rather they traded their 8th outfielder, Daniel Nava, for anything at all, including the various proverbial demeaning things, than lose an interesting guy like Ramirez.

Totally agree. Assuming he was on the 40 man roster, this is a somewhat puzzling move. Nava is filler.

[Joshv02]

I would much rather they traded their 8th outfielder, Daniel Nava, for anything at all, including the various proverbial demeaning things, than lose an interesting guy like Ramirez.

Why lose Nava now if they may have to place Ramirez on waivers in a few months anyway (as he is unlikely to make this team)?

[mabrowndog]

Why lose Nava now if they may have to place Ramirez on waivers in a few months anyway (as he is unlikely to make this team)?

Yup. This is a case of Theo trying to sneak a guy with no options -- and who went unclaimed by most of the AL last week -- through waivers again, while keeping other prospects with options as assets. If it had to be done, now was the time to do it.

And in looking at the Cubs' situation, even though they had room on the 40-man, they're even less likely to keep Ramirez on the 25-man when they break camp than the Sox would have been. So it's not like we can hang Theo out to dry for not considering that the Cubs might claim him.

[chrisfont9]

http://www.boston.co...as/extra_bases/

Bye Max...ohh well...No suprise right?

Can we still get in on Taylor Teagarden? Might as well work the trifecta.

[Bowlerman9]

Can we still get in on Taylor Teagarden? Might as well work the trifecta.

That joke would have been funnier had it not been made already, one page earlier.

[wyatt55]

Why lose Nava now if they may have to place Ramirez on waivers in a few months anyway (as he is unlikely to make this team)?

Not so sure he wouldn't with Salty's injury history. But, as posted above, this was the time to try and sneak him thorugh.

Who knows? Maybe we'll be trading Nava for Ramirez straight up in April.

[OCD SS]

Were the Sox able to get any further medical info by claiming him? It may be as simple as not liking what they saw there, after a closer look.