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8/8 Sox @ Yanks Analysis Only Game Thread


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#101 Fratboy


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:24 PM

QUOTE (Tudor Fever @ Aug 8 2009, 05:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Anyone got the answer to the tiriva question? Here's my guess:

I totally missed it - what was the question?

#102 Blacken


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:25 PM

QUOTE (Fratboy @ Aug 8 2009, 05:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I totally missed it - what was the question?
Team with the most 10-or-more-HR players in a season.

Edited by Blacken, 08 August 2009 - 04:25 PM.


#103 EvilEmpire

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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:25 PM

QUOTE (glennhoffmania @ Aug 8 2009, 05:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I think it could. Was it Jimy who used to screw around with the lineups on a constant basis? It drove me nuts. Everyone is different, but I know when I played I liked to know if I was playing, where I was playing, and where I was hitting. Intellectually it doesn't seem like it should matter, but it certainly can.


Just because the fans don't know what the lineup is going to be each day doesn't necessarily mean the players are in the dark too. It is certainly possible, but I think it more likely that Francona plans ahead and keep his players informed.

#104 Sprowl


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:27 PM

Buchholz's fastball command issue seems to come up primarily when pitching from the stretch. The walks always follow a hit.

#105 glennhoffmania


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:27 PM

QUOTE (EvilEmpire @ Aug 8 2009, 05:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Just because the fans don't know what the lineup is going to be each day doesn't necessarily mean the players are in the dark too. It is certainly possible, but I think it more likely that Francona plans ahead and keep his players informed.


Sure, but even if they are told the night before, just the fact that they can't get into a normal schedule or rythym can fuck you up.

#106 cshea


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:27 PM

QUOTE (Blacken @ Aug 8 2009, 05:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Team with the most 10-or-more-HR players in a season.


2003 Red Sox must've had a ton. They hit a lot of home runs that year.

Edit: Ramirez, Ortiz, Millar, Varitek, Nixon, Mueller, Walker, Nomar and Damon...I think they all had 10, not sure about Todd Walker though.

Edit 2: Clay's PC at 67. Should be able to get into the 6th, but he's got to work through the top of the order in the fifth.

Edited by cshea, 08 August 2009 - 04:32 PM.


#107 Fratboy


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:32 PM

I have to say I'm really impressed with Buchholz today. Beckett and Clay have done their jobs, and it's the bats' turn to hold up their end of the bargain here.

#108 Blacken


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:33 PM

QUOTE (cshea @ Aug 8 2009, 05:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
2003 Red Sox must've had a ton. They hit a lot of home runs that year.

Edit: Ramirez, Ortiz, Millar, Varitek, Nixon, Mueller, Walker, Nomar and Damon...I think they all had 10, not sure about Todd Walker though.

Edit 2: Clay's PC at 67. Should be able to get into the 6th, but he's got to work through the top of the order in the fifth.
The Yankees have 9 players at or over 10 HR this year...I don't think it's them.

That last changeup from Buchholz was absolutely gorgeous. Melky looked very silly.

#109 Dogman2


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:33 PM

By my count, Clay has thrown 5 curves, 3 for in the zone strikes and the Molina chase.

Sprowl, is that correct?

Edited by Dogman2, 08 August 2009 - 04:35 PM.


#110 RedOctober3829


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:35 PM

So, CC Sabathia has a perfect game going? It hasn't looked any harder than a leisurely walk in the park. Martinez worked him a bit in the last inning, but other than that it's been another horrid effort by the bats.

#111 absintheofmalaise


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:36 PM

His change is really effective today. What was it like the last game?

#112 Fratboy


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:37 PM

Why yes, I believe McCarver has announced that Sabathia does in fact have a perfect game going today against the Red Sox.

How do ya like THEM apples?

#113 Barbara

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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:40 PM

QUOTE (Fratboy @ Aug 8 2009, 05:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Why yes, I believe McCarver has announced that Sabathia does in fact have a perfect game going today against the Red Sox.

How do ya like THEM apples?

And not only does he announce it, he waxes poetic about why is it such a no-no to even mention it.

#114 Tudor Fever

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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:40 PM

I like how he trashed the "don't say 'no-hitter'" tradition as though he were Copernicus.

#115 cshea


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:40 PM

Good AB for Papi working the count. I'd really love to just get a baserunner and get Sabathia into the stretch. Maybe that throws him off his game a bit.

Edited by cshea, 08 August 2009 - 04:41 PM.


#116 khgiddon

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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:40 PM

That pitch to Ortiz looked perfect.

#117 Blacken


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:41 PM

Bye bye, Perfecto. Thank you, Mr. McCarver.

On the other hand, Gameday had that as a pretty solid strike.

#118 Fratboy


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:41 PM

Trivia Answer:

1998 yankees

Edited by Fratboy, 08 August 2009 - 04:41 PM.


#119 Jnai


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:41 PM

QUOTE (Dogman2 @ Aug 8 2009, 04:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
By my count, Clay has thrown 5 curves, 3 for in the zone strikes and the Molina chase.

Sprowl, is that correct?


I'm not Sprowl, but the answer is 4 unless I'm missing a pitch.

#120 RedOctober3829


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:41 PM

QUOTE (Fratboy @ Aug 8 2009, 05:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Why yes, I believe McCarver has announced that Sabathia does in fact have a perfect game going today against the Red Sox.

How do ya like THEM apples?


Ball 4 to Ortiz was 1.5 inches inside.

#121 Fratboy


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:42 PM

QUOTE (khgiddon @ Aug 8 2009, 05:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
That pitch to Ortiz looked perfect.

Not gonna fly here - want more than reactions in this thread.

#122 Dogman2


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:42 PM

QUOTE (Jnai @ Aug 8 2009, 03:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I'm not Sprowl, but the answer is 4 unless I'm missing a pitch.



I would have asked you but I didn't know you were around. I thought his first was to Teixiera, no?

#123 Jnai


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:44 PM

QUOTE (Dogman2 @ Aug 8 2009, 04:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I would have asked you but I didn't know you were around. I thought his first was to Teixiera, no?


Like I said, might be missing a pitch, but:
http://brooksbasebal...f...&v_size=500

The four pitches in the lower right are curves, including the one that's slipped (that was the pitch that hit A-rod's bat earlier)

#124 Smiling Joe Hesketh


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:44 PM

QUOTE (Fratboy @ Aug 8 2009, 05:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Not gonna fly here - want more than reactions in this thread.


They were saying in the other thread that Pitch F/x had it about 1.5 inches inside.


#125 Tudor Fever

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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:44 PM

QUOTE (Fratboy @ Aug 8 2009, 05:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Trivia Answer:

1998 yankees
Makes sense. That was perhaps the most well-rounded and deep team in history.


#126 Dogman2


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:45 PM

QUOTE (Fratboy @ Aug 8 2009, 03:42 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Not gonna fly here - want more than reactions in this thread.


Why yes, I believe McCarver has announced that Sabathia does in fact have a perfect game going today against the Red Sox.

How do ya like THEM apples?



#127 cshea


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:46 PM

The bad news is we still have no runs and no hits.

The good news is the hitters did a nice job bleeding the counts, and CC is up to 81 pitches. If we can work the count in the 6th, we could get him up over 100 in the 7th.

#128 Blacken


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:47 PM

QUOTE (cshea @ Aug 8 2009, 05:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The bad news is we still have no runs and no hits.

The good news is the hitters did a nice job bleeding the counts, and CC is up to 81 pitches. If we can work the count in the 6th, we could get him up over 100 in the 7th.
Anybody know how many pitches CC has been throwing per start? I don't know where to go look for this.

#129 Sprowl


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:47 PM

QUOTE (Dogman2 @ Aug 8 2009, 02:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
By my count, Clay has thrown 5 curves, 3 for in the zone strikes and the Molina chase.

Sprowl, is that correct?

Sorry, I was away for a while. It looks like 4 curves and 6 sliders, along with the fastball-change combination.


#130 jon abbey


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:48 PM

QUOTE (cshea @ Aug 8 2009, 05:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The good news is the hitters did a nice job bleeding the counts, and CC is up to 81 pitches. If we can work the count in the 6th, we could get him up over 100 in the 7th.


He's good for 120 today, I'd say, just FYI. Girardi is going to get all he can out of him today, especially when he's pitching like this.


#131 Dogman2


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:48 PM

QUOTE (Jnai @ Aug 8 2009, 03:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Like I said, might be missing a pitch, but:
http://brooksbasebal...f...&v_size=500

The four pitches in the lower right are curves, including the one that's slipped (that was the pitch that hit A-rod's bat earlier)



I don't think you did, I think it is my mistake. The Teixiera pitch I was talking about may have been a change but had more vertical movement then horizontal.

#132 Jnai


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:48 PM

QUOTE (Sprowl @ Aug 8 2009, 04:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Sorry, I was away for a while. It looks like 4 curves and 6 sliders, along with the fastball-change combination.


Curve and slider look really funky today. Curve has dropped a few mph and slider has gained a few.

#133 cshea


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:48 PM

QUOTE (Blacken @ Aug 8 2009, 05:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Anybody know how many pitches CC has been throwing per start? I don't know where to go look for this.


B-ref has him at averaging 105 per start.

http://www.baseball-....01-pitch.shtml

Edit: Go to Sabathia's B-Ref page, then click "more stats" and scroll down.

Edited by cshea, 08 August 2009 - 04:50 PM.


#134 Sprowl


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:50 PM

QUOTE (Blacken @ Aug 8 2009, 02:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Anybody know how many pitches CC has been throwing per start? I don't know where to go look for this.

Baseball-reference's gamelogs give the pitch number (Sabathia's anywhere from 96 to 123), and link to pitchfx charts for those games too.

#135 Dogman2


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:52 PM

QUOTE (Jnai @ Aug 8 2009, 03:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Curve and slider look really funky today. Curve has dropped a few mph and slider has gained a few.



Does his release point look different today then his last start in Baltimore?

#136 Stuart Scott's Lazy Eye


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:53 PM

Don't know if this was posted yet:

Jim Joyce
Home Team Record: 11-10
Strike %: 61.54%
SO/game: 13.5
Walks/game: 8.3


#137 RedOctober3829


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:54 PM

They need to get Reddick in the game. Youkilis is butchering left field today. It's not like anyone is hitting today. Move Youkilis to 3rd and get Lowell out.

#138 Sprowl


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:54 PM

QUOTE (Jnai @ Aug 8 2009, 02:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Curve and slider look really funky today. Curve has dropped a few mph and slider has gained a few.

The slider is surprisingly effective, with visible movement. The slider-sinker combination is really working well for him today. He's getting a little bit more of the inside&outside alternation that Halladay gets from his sinker and cutter.

Let's hope that's Youks last outfield experience for a while. I like using Martinez behind the plate for a change, but it would help if Buchholz and Penny had good defenses out there to help them survive a little longer into the games.

#139 NomarRS05

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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:54 PM

QUOTE (Sprowl @ Aug 8 2009, 05:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Baseball-reference's gamelogs give the pitch number (Sabathia's anywhere from 96 to 123), and link to pitchfx charts for those games too.


The good news is that he hasn't thrown over 122 pitches in a start this season. At this rate he may not make it to the ninth.

#140 Blacken


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:55 PM

QUOTE (Dogman2 @ Aug 8 2009, 05:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Does his release point look different today then his last start in Baltimore?
I was wondering about this earlier. Someone mentioned earlier that Buchholz was not pitching according to his usual major league MO, and I floated the idea that, with Varitek not behind the plate, he might be pitching his way rather than the way Varitek has been calling. Maybe he's changed his release point again, too.

Also...I know we need bats, but please, Youk needs to be back at first base and Reddick needs to be out there. He's visibly uncomfortable, and with Buchholz having a history of going nuclear after defensive issues, we really shouldn't be risking it.

#141 Sprowl


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:56 PM

And again Buchholz loses fastball command while pitching from the stretch, walking a batter following a hit.

#142 ToeKneeArmAss


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:57 PM

I actually don't mind seeing him pitch around Teix to get to A-Rod and get the righty-righty matchup


#143 NomarRS05

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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:57 PM

83 pitches for Buchholz. How much rope does he get today assuming things go reasonably well?

#144 Stu Nahan

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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:58 PM

QUOTE (RedOctober3829 @ Aug 8 2009, 05:54 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
They need to get Reddick in the game. Youkilis is butchering left field today. It's not like anyone is hitting today. Move Youkilis to 3rd and get Lowell out.


It would make much more sense to pull Kotchman and move Youk to 1B.

#145 Blacken


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:59 PM

QUOTE (NomarRS05 @ Aug 8 2009, 05:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
83 pitches for Buchholz. How much rope does he get today assuming things go reasonably well?
If he gets through six innings, I'll be ecstatic. They can then trot out some permutation of the bullpen brigade for an inning apiece.

#146 Dogman2


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:59 PM

QUOTE (ToeKneeArmAss @ Aug 8 2009, 03:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I actually don't mind seeing him pitch around Teix to get to A-Rod and get the righty-righty matchup



Do you have freeze frames of Buchholz's release points from his last start and this one, similar to Byrd's?

Edited by Dogman2, 08 August 2009 - 04:59 PM.


#147 Sprowl


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:59 PM

QUOTE (Dogman2 @ Aug 8 2009, 02:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Does his release point look different today then his last start in Baltimore?

No, they are pretty much the same.

#148 Smiling Joe Hesketh


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 04:59 PM

QUOTE (Sprowl @ Aug 8 2009, 05:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
And again Buchholz loses fastball command while pitching from the stretch, walking a batter following a hit.

This happens with far too much regularity to be random. I would have to assume it's some sort of mechanical issue he is having problems with. It's really odd that he loses command of the fastball, though; I would think he'd have trouble with the breaking pitches out of the stretch given the torque one has to apply on them out of the uncomfortable pitching motion.

#149 cshea


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 05:01 PM

QUOTE (NomarRS05 @ Aug 8 2009, 05:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
83 pitches for Buchholz. How much rope does he get today assuming things go reasonably well?


I think he gets to start the 6th, with someone warming behind him.

All in all though, I think this start has been a big step forward for Clay. Worked around damage. Both self inflicted damage, and poor defense in left. On the big stage of a FOX game, in New York , matched up with CC Sabathia, he hasn't given an inch.

Edited by cshea, 08 August 2009 - 05:01 PM.


#150 Blacken


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Posted 08 August 2009 - 05:03 PM

QUOTE (cshea @ Aug 8 2009, 06:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I think he gets to start the 6th, with someone warming behind him.

All in all though, I think this start has been a big step forward for Clay. Worked around damage. Both self inflicted damage, and poor defense in left. On the big stage of a FOX game, in New York , matched up with CC Sabathia, he hasn't given an inch.
I'd agree. With the offense as it is, that one run might hang him, but I can't even fault him too much for it: if a couple of little things had gone the other way (Kotchman, I'm looking at you), it'd still be zeroes.