263 replies to this topic

[Manny's Hammies]

Def. foul. Let's see if they call it right.

[MentalDisabldLst]

REPLAY!

My wet dreams are answered.

And if A-Rod has a HR taken away, all the sweeter.

[Fratboy]

ARE YOU KIDDING ME??!?!

Instant replay and they get it WRONG.

[asection8]

Can't argue. Automatic ejection.

[wibi]

Wow ... just wow

Way to botch the usage of replay MLB

[NYCSox]

Are you fucking kidding me? That was definitely foul. Only MLB can fuck up instant replay like this.

[MentalDisabldLst]

you know, it struck the catwalk in foul territory, but it may have gone past the actual foul pole in fair territory.

[desertrat75]

Did it not hit the screen to the right of the foul pole? Who cares what happens to it after that?

[Drew7]

ha replay fails ion its 1st try. it was foul

[JulE6]

what's the point of that elevated foul pole if they're just gonna blow it come replay time? wow, that's embarassing

[asection8]

Replay isn't saving too much time...are they changing pitchers?

[jayhoz]

Fucking umps can't even get an instant replay right. Holy crap!

[Zedia]

That vertical yellow line the Rays guys are talking about doesn't really mean anything, does it? The ball could have hooked to the left of that after going around the foul pole.

[nycdoc999]

FUCK!

Game over.

Bastards decide to sack up and start winning AFTER the season's lost...

[DukeSox]

go here:

http://mlb.mlb.com/m...mp;mode=gameday

check out the red dot for Arod's homerun

shit. it WAS all the way in the upper left hand corner right under "Field Controls"

Edited by DukeSox, 03 September 2008 - 09:25 PM.

[foulkehampshire]

More Cameras!

[jtn46]

I think it was fair. If that pole extended all the way to the top, I think it would have just hit it.

[asection8]

I didn't think I would ever see anything as disgusting as Giambi licking his stach.

[NomarRS05]

I think it was fair. If that pole extended all the way to the top, I think it would have just hit it.

Well just like in football, some replays are also inconclusive.

Two outs now in Toronto, bases still loaded bottom 10.

[staz]

Shockingly, the Yes announcers are jerking off to the replay system.

[patinorange]

That vertical yellow line the Rays guys are talking about doesn't really mean anything, does it? The ball could have hooked to the left of that after going around the foul pole.

It's pretty dumb not to extend the pole to the roof. You are right. Looks to me like it was fair then hooked left of the secondary pole.

Not sure what the ruling is there..be interesting to see what the ump says after the game.

Another meaningless bomb by A rod.

[dividius]

I have no idea if that was fair or foul, but whatever they ruled, it wasn't going to change. From my understanding, the rule is the same as in football: if it's not conclusive, the ruling on the field stands. I didn't see any angle that conclusively showed it was foul. And they can't use Rick Sutcliffe's retarded logic of "I know it was foul because A-Rod didn't immediately leave the batter's box" to overturn it.

[Zedia]

Disappointing they don't have a better camera setup. Now I gotta listen to the anti-replay guy at my work saying "See, replay doesn't work!"

[JulE6]

actually the more i think about it, the more retarded that secondary pole near the catwalk seems...the ball did go over the real pole, which by definition is the boundary and therefore shoulda been fair...which in the end it was. good call imo

[nycdoc999]

I think Veras and Edwar are gonna have arm trouble...

Come to think of it, didn't Veras have an arm injury that kept him out of much of the season last year?

[jtn46]

I have no idea if that was fair or foul, but whatever they ruled, it wasn't going to change. From my understanding, the rule is the same as in football: if it's not conclusive, the ruling on the field stands. I didn't see any angle that conclusively showed it was foul. And they can't use Rick Sutcliffe's retarded logic of "I know it was foul because A-Rod didn't immediately leave the batter's box" to overturn it.

In Sutcliffe's defense, he's half in the bag.

[Freddy Linn]

I think there should be a reality show where Rick Sutcliffe acts as someone's lawyer, doctor, or financial advisor for a day. His judgment/assessment/analysis is mind-numbingly authoritative and incorrect at the same time.

[jayhoz]

Why would they have a foul pole on the catwalk if wasn't....you know....there to determine fair/foul? The ball hit to the left of the foul pole on the catwalk. Therefor it is a foul ball.

[stanleysteemer]

I think I've figured it out.

Losing the division to T.B. would be disappointing. Home field certainly seemed important last year. I'd be bummed. If TB Wins this probability increases slightly.

Losing the Wild Card to the MFY would be devastating. I'd want to take a bat to my house and vehicles. It would be horrible to see the joy in MFY land and hear about it year after year. If the MFY win, this probability increases though only very slightly.

So the economist in me sees this as an expected value calculation. The tiny probability of an MFY wild-card is multiplied by the sheer horror of this event and that overtakes the larger probability of a TB division multiplied by the minor disappointment of this event.

I'm all for TB tomorrow with no reservations.

On the plus side I do not have to root for the stache or any of the other horrible entities on that team.

[MentalDisabldLst]

"it's not a MUST win tomorrow, but it's a nice-to-win... ... you know, with Toronto coming here on Friday, with Roy Halladay..."

what a bunch of morons.

[JulE6]

Why would they have a foul pole on the catwalk if wasn't....you know....there to determine fair/foul? The ball hit to the left of the foul pole on the catwalk. Therefor it is a foul ball.

stupid catwalk pole aside, isn't this essentially the same thing as a ball lined down the third base side...ball goes over bag fair, rolls foul, but because it went over the bag fair, fair ball

ball goes over pole (boundary), lands beyond boundary foul, but fair ball anyways

[Drew7]

relayed info from o'brien:
"The second pole is meant to be a guide for the umpires. It's not an official foul pole."

[jayhoz]

Here are the groundrules for that god forsaken shit hole Tropicana Field if anyone is interested.

A batted ball that hits the catwalk, lights or suspended objects in foul territory will automatically be ruled a dead ball and it shall be called a strike.
A batted ball that hits a catwalk, lights or suspended objects in fair territory shall be judged fair of foul in relation to the striking point on the ground or where it is touched by the fielder. If the ball hits the catwalk, lights or suspended objects in fair territory and lands in the field in fair territory or is touched by a fielder in fair territory, it shall be judged a fair ball. If the ball strikes the catwalk, lights or suspended objects in fair territory and is caught by a fielder in fair or foul territory, then the batter is out and the base runners run at their own risk.
A batted ball that hits the catwalk, lights or suspended objects and remains on or in the catwalk, lights or suspended objects in foul territory is a foul ball and it shall be called a strike.
A batted ball that hits the catwalk, lights or suspended objects and remains on or in the catwalk, lights or suspended objects in fair territory is a fair ball and it shall be called a double.
A batted ball that hits either of the lower two catwalks, lights or suspended objects in fair territory is a home run.
Any pitched ball that lodges in the padding behind home plate - one base.
Any thrown ball that lodges in the padding behind home plate - two bases.

[Zedia]

Why would they have a foul pole on the catwalk if wasn't....you know....there to determine fair/foul?

The foul pole is the foul pole -- they can't have a ground rule that makes the "real" foul pole 50 feet from the actual foul pole... can they??

[jayhoz]

stupid catwalk pole aside, isn't this essentially the same thing as a ball lined down the third base side...ball goes over bag fair, rolls foul, but because it went over the bag fair, fair ball

ball goes over pole (boundary), lands beyond boundary foul, but fair ball anyways

No, because they have a pole designating what is fair or foul on the catwalk.

[Al Zarilla]

Why would they have a foul pole on the catwalk if wasn't....you know....there to determine fair/foul? The ball hit to the left of the foul pole on the catwalk. Therefor it is a foul ball.

Fair/foul is determined by where the ball is when it gets exactly to the foul pole. The best angle they had showed it going directly over the foul pole, ergo, fair ball. If he hadn't hit it so hard, it would have hit the foul pole, and that's always an HR.

Edited by Al Zarilla, 03 September 2008 - 09:40 PM.

[sachmoney]

To arrive late to the show, that camera angle down the line made it look fair, but then the angle from the side which shows it clearly hits the left of the catwalk made it look foul because of the guideline foul line. I was wondering about that because the Trop has some weird ground rules. I thought it was fair. I maintain it was fair even after the replays. I think it went over the pole, it was that crushed. No inconclusive, I don't think they BLEW it though. It was a tough call no matter what.

[jayhoz]

relayed info from o'brien:
"The second pole is meant to be a guide for the umpires. It's not an official foul pole."

That has to be the dumbest thing I have ever heard. Take that stupid thing down. In fact...blow up that dump and the 10,000 morons who show up there on a nightly basis.

[JulE6]

No, because they have a pole designating what is fair or foul on the catwalk.

but they can't possibly use that thing as the official foul pole...because it's not at the boundary of the field (fancy term for fence)...like if it were to hook around the pole and pass it fair but land over the fence in what would be foul territory, it's still a HR, which is what that thing looks like it woulda done

[Zen]

Why would they have a foul pole on the catwalk if wasn't....you know....there to determine fair/foul?

Are you kidding? The foul pole on the catwalk is there so the umps can have a yellow line extending above the foul pole for their line of sight. Once the ball travels into the stands, it's either fair or foul.

Stupid placement, and they'd definitely be better off by just extending the actual foul pole... but, no, the ball doesn't have to land on the fair side of that line.

[Zedia]

No, because they have a pole designating what is fair or foul on the catwalk.

It shouldn't matter if the catwalk is BEYOND the fence (and the field of play). As someone mentioned above, it's a guide.

[foulkehampshire]

looks like the Yankees are poised for another great September run...

[Crazy Puppy]

Division deficit down to 3, and if the Jays can plate this runner from 3rd with nobody out, the wild card lead will be up to 5.

[MentalDisabldLst]

I think I've figured it out.

Losing the division to T.B. would be disappointing. Home field certainly seemed important last year. I'd be bummed. If TB Wins this probability increases slightly.

Losing the Wild Card to the MFY would be devastating. I'd want to take a bat to my house and vehicles. It would be horrible to see the joy in MFY land and hear about it year after year. If the MFY win, this probability increases though only very slightly.

So the economist in me sees this as an expected value calculation. The tiny probability of an MFY wild-card is multiplied by the sheer horror of this event and that overtakes the larger probability of a TB division multiplied by the minor disappointment of this event.

I'm all for TB tomorrow with no reservations.

On the plus side I do not have to root for the stache or any of the other horrible entities on that team.

I love your analysis, but here's my thinking:

- The chance of a single game vs TB making the difference in the wild-card race is miniscule. If we collapse so hard that we lose the WC, AND Minnesota/Chicago also collapse similarly, it will be a truly bizarre occurrence
- Whereas each TB loss actually considerably adds to the probability the Red Sox take over the division lead
- There are plenty of other games for the Yankees to play and to lose, and I shall lustily root for their demise in each of them

I think the fact that the 2nd-most-likely team to get the WC is Minnesota... followed probably by Chicago... should change your calculus slightly.

[SemperFidelisSox]

looks like the Yankees are poised for another great September run...

They own TB right now, with Seattle up next and then Anaheim. They could very easily finish this road trip 8-2/7-3 even with Rasner, Ponson and Pavano making four more starts on it. The offense seems that locked in. Then a 10 game homestand.

Another crushing loss for Minnesota tonight, and Tampas schedule is brutal. They already look tight and it's September 2nd. Is it really that far fetched to think that the Twins and Rays will have tough Septembers?

[Drew7]

is anyone else nervous about the yanks making a serious run?
just taking the temp...

[jayhoz]

is anyone else nervous about the yanks making a serious run?
just taking the temp...

Not in the slightest.

Table

	Projected Wins
Red Sox	95.519
Rays	98.154
Yankees	85.924
Twins	90.045
White Sox	90.167

*Does not include today's outcomes.

[nycdoc999]

They own TB right now, with Seattle up next and then Anaheim. They could very easily finish this road trip 8-2/7-3 even with Rasner, Ponson and Pavano making four more starts on it. The offense seems that locked in. Then a 10 game homestand.

Another crushing loss for Minnesota tonight, and Tampas schedule is brutal. They already look tight and it's September 2nd. Is it really that far fetched to think that the Twins and Rays will have tough Septembers?

Don't the Twins have an easier schedule than anyone else?

@ Tor (1)
vs Detroit (3)
vs KC (3)
@ Balt (3)
@ Clev (3)
@ TB (4)
vs CWS (3)
vs KC (3)


Gotta figure they can go 14-9, right?

91 Wins might win the division, but won't win the WC. The Rays will have to win 7 games and lose 18. That's not happening.

[nycdoc999]

Not in the slightest.

Table

	Projected Wins
Red Sox	95.519
Rays	98.154
Yankees	85.924
Twins	90.045
White Sox	90.167

*Does not include today's outcomes.

I would caution that with one remark - "past performance does not guarantee future results."

However, it's obvious that the Yankees are done. They're not catching the Red Sox, with all the home games the Sox have left. And even if the Rays go 10-15, the Yankees would have to win 19 games and lose 4 to catch them.

Ovah.

Edited by nycdoc999, 03 September 2008 - 10:17 PM.