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Colon's Starts


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#1 LondonSox

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Posted 04 April 2008 - 02:54 AM

I've really been surprised how solid Colon has looked so far, a LOT of the talk out there was that he was done, and given the lack of pitching in so many places and the low asking price, I'm pretty amazed. It's like rumour won out. Was a great risk reward move and if he can give the Sox 100 innings, and some pitching depth in the starters again that's great. Given Buchholz's slow start no harm in having him work it out in AAA and get him up when he's doing his 2007 thing. If Colon is solid it sure eases the G38 injury, and the potential depth late in the season in a upside scenario is pretty fantastic.

#2 OttoC


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Posted 04 April 2008 - 07:56 AM

I've really been surprised how solid Colon has looked so far, a LOT of the talk out there was that he was done,

The question is whether he remains healthy. After missing most of the 2006 season with rotator cuff problems, he started the 2007 season by winning his first five starts (ERA 3.69). Then, he developed elbow problems.

#3 Kevin Youkulele


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Posted 04 April 2008 - 09:01 AM

The question is whether he remains healthy. After missing most of the 2006 season with rotator cuff problems, he started the 2007 season by winning his first five starts (ERA 3.69). Then, he developed elbow problems.

Even repeating this would be useful, as it would buy time for Buchholz to work out his issues and/or keep his innings limited early on, and perhaps keep his service time usefully low. Of course, the more production Colon gives, the better.

#4 MentalDisabldLst


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Posted 04 April 2008 - 11:30 AM

Theoretical best-case scenario late-season rotation:

Beckett
Matsuzaka
Healthy Schilling
Healthy Colon
Buchholz / Lester / Wakefield

That would be sweet, even if it's got about a 1% chance of occurring. But the optimism is huge. Colon hit 96 last night although he mostly worked around 92, and had (I believe) 1 H, 1 BB, 5 Ks in 5 IP.

Was anyone at the game who can give a firsthand account?

#5 The Flying Dutchman

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Posted 04 April 2008 - 12:12 PM

Best case scenario also includes some draft picks he could net us at the end of the year.

#6 rembrat


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Posted 04 April 2008 - 12:26 PM

Was anyone at the game who can give a firsthand account?


Colon- Had excellent command tonight considering the conditions. His breaking pitches were pretty sharp and he was in control of the hitters for his outing. AB touched on his velocity in his post. He seemed to have pretty good velocity for innings 1-3, but it trailed off in innings 4-5. Generated a good amount of swings and misses from the AAA hitters in the beginning innings, but they started fouling off a lot of his pitches as the outing went on. I saw him hit 95 on the stadium gun as pointed out, but I checked in with a Cubs scout sitting next to me and he had him at 92 on his gun for the same pitch. He had Colon at 88-91 for the outing with him dipping down to 87-88 in the 5th inning before reaching back to 92 on his last pitch. Overall, it was a positive outing for Colon, but I don't see the arm strength there as of yet and see it being another 2-3 outings before we see what he's really got.

- Clem21

I'm always iffy when I read that Colon touched 95 96 (first it was YES guns which are notoriously juiced and now it's a minor league gun, usually the same thing applies to them as well) but I would be happy hearing he sat 90-92, he can survive with that.

This is courtesy of clem21 from over at soxprospects.com. They do a great job with firsthand accounts.

#7 The Boomer

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Posted 04 April 2008 - 12:32 PM

Best case scenario also includes some draft picks he could net us at the end of the year.



Best case is that we are on the advent of a second coming of a marginally in shape and rotund Latino (former stud) pitcher recovered for a pittance from baseball's scrap heap to experience a pitching rennaisance nearer the twilight of an already much better than decent major league career. The best case is that Colon is about to become the Luis Tiant of the 21st Century.

#8 yecul


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Posted 04 April 2008 - 12:40 PM

This will be another couple starts down in AAA to get in form. The best case is that he is willing to be (somewhat) flexible with the opt-out date if he needs additional work or if Boston needs to wait an extra week or two.

Having him be a decent back of the rotation starter on an incentive based contract after coming to form in the minors is useful and valuable. He doesn't have to provide a lot for this to make a lot of sense.

Plus it would allow you to limit the use of Buchholz and/or Lester or cover for an injury, which also adds value.

Right now it's still more likely that he only gets a handful of bad/mediocre starts at the ML level topping out at decent. However, his basement used to be doesn't pitch at all and now it seems to be making a couple ML starts. That is improvement and he still has some time to upgrade that.

#9 MannysDestination


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Posted 04 April 2008 - 12:56 PM

There are so many injured pitchers this year already that I can't believe the Sox would allow him to opt-out given the effectiveness, however limited, he's shown so far. Atlanta and the Mets immediately come to mind, and there are plenty of other clubs with question marks in their rotation that it seems he'd be immediately picked up if available. Like yecul says, if he's able to just be decent and make some starts, he's more than paid for his contract this year.

He provides security against injury, rest for the youngin's, experience, and if the stars align and we get back to 7 effective starters (which is highly unlikely: Beckett, dice-k, schill, wake, lester, buch, and colon), he could even provide a nice return at the trade deadline.

Are opt-out clauses static for one date, or is there good-faith language on the part of the club included? What I mean is, can the sox call him up on April 30 and send him back down May 2? It would be blatantly rude and underhanded, and would probably engender so much negative goodwill that it wouldn't be worth it, but is it possible?

#10 Buzzkill Pauley


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Posted 04 April 2008 - 01:05 PM

Are opt-out clauses static for one date, or is there good-faith language on the part of the club included? What I mean is, can the sox call him up on April 30 and send him back down May 2? It would be blatantly rude and underhanded, and would probably engender so much negative goodwill that it wouldn't be worth it, but is it possible?



Colon, as an 11-year veteran, can't just be sent down again. If he simply refused assignment back to AAA he could be picked up by another team in a snap, thus making such a static opt-out clause unnecessary.

[edit - i cnat tpyr oday]

Edited by Buzzkill Pauley, 04 April 2008 - 01:06 PM.


#11 Rudy Pemberton


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Posted 04 April 2008 - 01:05 PM

Once they've called him up, I'm guessing he can't be sent down as he has enough service time to reject the assignment.

#12 MentalDisabldLst


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Posted 04 April 2008 - 02:05 PM

Looking at our schedule, it seems the first time we need to decide between Colon and someone else (including Wake) is 4/12.

4/1 @ OAK: Matsuzaka
4/2 @ OAK: Lester
--- 4/3 OFF
4/4 @ TOR: Wakefield
4/5 @ TOR: Buchholz
4/6 @ TOR: Beckett
--- 4/7 OFF
4/8 vs DET: Matsuzaka
4/9 vs DET: Lester
4/10 vs DET: Wake or Buchholz
4/11 vs NYY: Buchholz or Beckett
4/12 vs NYY: Beckett or Colon
4/13 vs NYY: Matsuzaka

Colon pitched on 4/3 so his next outing will be 4/8 vs LVY, lining up with Matsuzaka's next start. It would be pretty easy to go (starting on the 10th) Wake, Beckett, Colon and keep Buchholz out, if that's what we wanted to do.

#13 MannysDestination


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Posted 04 April 2008 - 02:38 PM

Colon, as an 11-year veteran, can't just be sent down again. If he simply refused assignment back to AAA he could be picked up by another team in a snap, thus making such a static opt-out clause unnecessary.


Thanks, I wasn't sure if the fact that he signed a minor league contract would cancel that out, apparently not.

#14 SoxScout


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Posted 07 April 2008 - 09:46 AM

The Red Sox will likely have more official word later, but Bartolo Colon has experienced some soreness on his right side. He's scheduled to make a start tomorrow in Pawtucket, but the organization is currently talking it over to see whether he may have to be pushed back a day or two.

What ever the soreness stems from does not appear to be serious.

http://www.boston.co...hows_colon.html

#15 Rough Carrigan


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Posted 07 April 2008 - 09:50 AM

So, contrary to conventional wisdom, you can pull fat.

#16 The Flying Dutchman

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Posted 07 April 2008 - 10:39 AM

Nothing is worse than a sore colon.

#17 Crazy Puppy

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Posted 07 April 2008 - 01:21 PM

Globe says it's a "minor oblique strain" that's likely to keep him from making his start tomorrow.

#18 Carmine Hose

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Posted 07 April 2008 - 01:59 PM

Who knew he even had obliques?

#19 Guest_Corsi Combover_*

Posted 07 April 2008 - 02:05 PM

BOSTON -- Bartolo Colon will be placed on the seven-day minor-league disabled list because of soreness in his oblique muscle, and will miss at least one start -- his scheduled start Tuesday at McCoy Stadium against Lehigh Valley -- for the Pawtucket Red Sox.

"It's not an oblique strain, but he does have some soreness in his oblique," said Red Sox manager Terry Francona today. "The training staff felt it was best to stop it now, because these things can linger."

Colon will report to Fenway Park on Tuesday to be examined by the team's medical staff, and a treatment program will be developed.

Source: http://www.projo.com...n.3f20741f.html

#20 SoxFanSince57


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Posted 07 April 2008 - 02:43 PM

Globe says it's a "minor oblique strain" that's likely to keep him from making his start tomorrow.


My reaction when I read the report this morning was "I have never heard of a "minor" oblique strain." When pitchers get these type of injuries doesn't it usually take a bit of time to heal?

#21 Carmine Hose

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Posted 07 April 2008 - 04:28 PM

From the front page links on boston.com

Red Sox Colon to be examined tomorrow


Someone slipped one past the editor. Nice.

#22 Grubbery

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Posted 07 April 2008 - 04:31 PM

Who knew he even had obliques?



I'm sure the pain must be acute to warrant skipping a start (sorry).

#23 The Four Peters


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Posted 07 April 2008 - 09:17 PM

Well as was stated in the first few posts in this thread, this is obviously his downside. I don't think anyone would deny he could provide some value when he's pitching. The question is how often will he pitch.

I would love to think that this is a minor speed bump in his comeback, however, oblique strains linger, especially for someone in less than optimal shape. Hopefully this clears up, however it's entirely possible the sox have to mix and match starts with Schilling, Colon, and Wakefield as the 5th starter. Which isn't necessarily terrible, as long as they're not all hurt at the same time.

#24 OCD SS


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Posted 08 April 2008 - 06:55 AM

If he's on the DL, can he still opt out of his contract if he's not on the ML roster? I'd have to think that what he's shown in ST would be enough to get him more money than the Sox are paying him even if he is on the DL, especially to a team like the Mets that is pitching hungry.

#25 Cuzittt


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Posted 08 April 2008 - 06:59 AM

If he's on the DL, can he still opt out of his contract if he's not on the ML roster? I'd have to think that what he's shown in ST would be enough to get him more money than the Sox are paying him even if he is on the DL, especially to a team like the Mets that is pitching hungry.


Of course he could. The contract specifies a date but (likely) not any other conditions. That being said, if Colon is still on the DL come the specific date (Likely 5/1), he may not want to opt out. After all, it appears the Sox do have a place for him in the Rotation if he stays healthy.

That being said, the Minor League DL is only 7 days. So, he may be back to pitching next week.

#26 Foulkey Reese


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Posted 09 April 2008 - 04:00 PM

The word on Bartolo Colon is his right oblique is still tender to touch. Terry Francona said Colon will not resume any activity until that tenderness is gone. Colon has had a couple of these oblique strains in the past. One kept him out seven days, the other 20. Colon is currently on the 7-day DL in Pawtucket. It also appears that Colon has dropped a few pounds.


http://www.boston.co...as/extra_bases/

#27 mabrowndog


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Posted 09 April 2008 - 10:03 PM

Tito postgame: "Colon had a very good exam. I believe the plan is to have him wait two more days before throwing again."

#28 rembrat


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Posted 23 April 2008 - 04:05 PM

An update on the hefty righty, that just doesn't sound as good as "hefty lefty", does it?

Bartolo Colon threw from 120 feet. Also battling the flu, but has managed to get all of his work in. The Sox are earmarking May 5 as a day when Colon might get back into a game. Colon has a May 1 exit clause but it doesn't appear that he was execute it given the medical care the Red Sox have shown with his strained oblique and overall conditioning....

Link