420 replies to this topic

[Bruno's Catch]

Where are the numbers from? MLB has him at .324/.378/.500 at the Toilet last year, w/comparable #s for 2006. Not terrible by a longshot, but if the Yanks want to bet he can keep his OPS north of .850 for four years, I'll be happy to send him my heartfelt thanks for his time here along with some good restaurant recommendations in Manhattan. And he won't have the pleasure of hitting against Mussina or Pettitte anymore, either.

Baseball-reference.com. My bad, I was looking at the Yankees generally last year, not just at the Stadium. Thanks for correcting tha.

[HatcherStoleHome]

That is a bit misleading as it includes Lowell's 2005 season which is an outlier for his career.

So was 2007.

[esaslaw]

This board and the main board show a new attitude from the teeth gnashing over Pedro and Damon which probably comes from watching what had hapened with the them while we won another world championship. I agree with the sentiment that 3 years in the 40 range is generous by about a year, but worth it almost as thanks for a great 2007. But the idea is to move ahead and not get too weepy about free agents who want to leave. I hope very much that Mike stays. The team and the city are good fits for him, and quite possibly for a post playing days career as well. He will never be as valuable and significant anywhere else and, as I have noted before, that people like Fred Lynn and Jim Lonborg have settled here well after the playing days are over should say a lot. Lonnie had no real choice in leaving, but Freddy did, and regretted it almost immediately even though he had All Star years away from here. But here was where he was remembered for all those great catches, for slamming into the triangle in the famous game 6 (the good one), for his timely hitting and for being the catalyst as one of the "Gold Dust Twins" of 75. Mo Vaughn wishes he stayed, too, I am sure, because nowhere else was he the guy he was here. Luis Tiant, for crying out loud, was spectacular before he got here, but has chosen Boston as the place to stay because of the way we feel about him (I still want him on the mound, in 1975-1978 form, to pitch the most important game of all time, though I would "settle" for Beckett of today, Roger of the late 80s, Pedro of the early Sox years, or Lonnie of 1967 if I had to) and even the Eck---really a guy who became the best at what he does far away from here---has found that he is adored nowhere other than here.

So, stay, Mike, stay. But if you want to go and make more money elsewhere, go with out thanks, but not a 4 year contract (at least as a player)

[Canary]

So was 2007.

Nope. It was on the high side of his career numbers, but he hit ever so slightly better in 2003 by OPS, with more dingers.

Everyone repeat after me: Lowell did well in 2007 but he has done that well before and so it is not a career year!

One minor side-benefit of the very distinct possibility that we wind up Lowell for A-Rod via free agent signings is that we basically move up a few positions with our #1 pick. If we sign A-Rod and they sign Mike, then we get their first pick and they get ours -- net gain for us (barely)

Edited by Canary, 12 November 2007 - 10:04 PM.

[Moped]

I agree that the sox should not go past three years for Mike Lowell. I am guessing they offer to overpay him a little for 3 years and then it's up to him.

What I dissagree with the idea that sentimentality has nothing to do with it and the impression of some people that the sox made him an offer knowing he'll reject it as a PR move so they can go after ARod. That's the kind of thing Hank Steinbrenner does and I'm looking forward to him keeping it up.

I think his numbers in Boston have something to do with fenway, and playing with a group of guys that he obviously enjoys. he likes his job, he performs better. It's like that anywhere. He's got a chance to win, he performs better. He's appreciated and he performs better. I think he'll be fine for 3 years, some regression from this year, and maybe a noticeable decline in his third. Or maybe not, I wouldn't be surprised if he's the kind of guy who can step up and have a great year at 36. Look a posada this year, how old is he? The idea that he's on the fast decline is based strictly on numbers, which don't tell the whole story. The human factor can skew numbers immensely in any given period of time. For example, I think baseball was not JD Drews top priority this year and I'm looking forward to him carrying some of his playoff confidence into 08..

Regarding the past lack of sentimentality: Pedro was a circus and had a rotator cuff hanging by a thread. And he wanted 4 years. Damon's carefree spirit was great to distract attention from the montrosity sometimes called the curse, but other than that he wasn't some beloved guy in the club house. And he handled his own PR upon leaving like a selfish dick. I mentioned his dancing (more air drums) because it illustrated his attitude towards being a rock star ball player. He is not a serious person and it's was clear that his risk taking playing style could very well catch up with him. Nomar, if you recall, was a moping loner in 04. He seemed like he'd rather be with his wife somewhere else. There was all kind of speculation that he was juicing earlier in his career. He was never the same after his wrist injury and was not late 90s nomar by any stretch.

Mike was just your MVP on a wire to wire first place World Series winning team and everyone has their goodbye letter ready for a a signiature. We tried Mike, but sorry you wanted the money. Now lets give Arod 30 Mill!

this team puts alot of focus on "makeup" with young talent, I suspect they put just as much focus on it with veteran signings. I don't think the Sox obvious affection for each other and appreciation for playing in boston is an accident. Maybe Arod could put up his numbers and not have a negative impact to the team. It could very well happen, if it does, Manny, Ortiz Arod would be a site to see. But at the same time, I don't think we need it to win, and I am not sure it's worth the risk of making this team about ARod.

I think it's a valid opinion, so anyone here pretending they are getting paid for this, as opposed to posting in a minor leagues internet forums please lay off the insults.

thank you.

[HatcherStoleHome]

Nope. It was on the high side of his career numbers, but he hit ever so slightly better in 2003 by OPS, with more dingers.

Everyone repeat after me: Lowell did well in 2007 but he has done that well before and so it is not a career year!

One minor side-benefit of the very distinct possibility that we wind up Lowell for A-Rod via free agent signings is that we basically move up a few positions with our #1 pick. If we sign A-Rod and they sign Mike, then we get their first pick and they get ours -- net gain for us (barely)

He had an unsustainable .342 BABIP in 2007.

I didn't say it was a career year.
I said it was an outlier.

We need to keep a little perspective.

[January]

I suspect they put just as much focus on it with veteran signings. I don't think the Sox obvious affection for each other and appreciation for playing in boston is an accident. Maybe Arod could put up his numbers and not have a negative impact to the team. It could very well happen, if it does, Manny, Ortiz Arod would be a site to see. But at the same time, I don't think we need it to win, and I am not sure it's worth the risk of making this team about ARod.

I think it's a valid opinion, so anyone here pretending they are getting paid for this, as opposed to posting in a minor leagues internet forums please lay off the insults.

thank you.

Honestly, I think Boston is one of the few places A-Rod could play have a chance of the team NOT being about A-Rod. Depends on weather he considers that a plus or a minus. I'm beginning to think it's a plus, as if he wanted more money, his best bet would have been to squeeze the Yankee's for an extension with the Ranger subsidy by threatening to opt out.

He had an unsustainable .342 BABIP in 2007.

I didn't say it was a career year.
I said it was an outlier.

We need to keep a little perspective.

I think he was a little lucky this year, but not as much as people think. .342 isn't all that high, Manny has a career BABIP of .337 over 15 years and almost 2000 games, after which point it ceases to be luck. Good hitters can usually increase their BABIP a little by going the opposite way, going with pitches, that sort of thing. Observationally, it look like Lowell was hitting a little smarter, using the field better, etc.

He could have been lucky this year, but it's also possible he learned something and the hitting coach deserves a bonus(Papi seems to have had a similar effect, which is why I think it could be an actual improvement.) If the adjustment takes, his BABIP could regress to the 320-330 range and he could still do pretty well.

Anyway, I think it's possible Lowell hit similar(probably a little less) to this year next year, although I think his age might catch him in about 2 years.

Edited by January, 12 November 2007 - 11:08 PM.

[HatcherStoleHome]

I think he was a little lucky this year, but not as much as people think. .342 isn't all that high, Manny has a career BABIP of .337 over 15 years and almost 2000 games, after which point it ceases to be luck. Good hitters can usually increase their BABIP a little by going the opposite way, going with pitches, that sort of thing. Observationally, it look like Lowell was hitting a little smarter, using the field better, etc.

He could have been lucky this year, but it's also possible he learned something and the hitting coach deserves a bonus(Papi seems to have had a similar effect, which is why I think it could be an actual improvement.) If the adjustment takes, his BABIP could regress to the 320-330 range and he could still do pretty well.

Anyway, I think it's possible Lowell hit similar(probably a little less) to this year next year, although I think his age might catch him in about 2 years.

.342 is high if you are Mike Lowell and your career BABIP is .293 and your previous high was .304 in 2001.

Of course, Manny is a future HOF.

Lowell was an absolute joy this year but we need to have very modest expectations for 2008 and beyond.

Bill James projects .282-17-81 with a .349/.459/.809.

Someone is going to give him 4 years and I would hesitate to offer 3.

I know this is a turd in the punch bowl but his age plus the large disparities year to year and even half to half need to be taken into account.

[marsrover21]

Thanks, for, the mem-ories.

Thanks Mike for a great season and taking us the WS, but it looks like the Sox are going to look elsewhere for their third baseman in 2008.

Mike Lowell's agents and Theo Epstein could not reach an agreement about an hour before the midnight deadline in which the Red Sox had exclusive rights to negotiate with Lowell.

Lowell will now be a complete free-agent and can negotiate with other teams.

Link.

I think we've seen in years past that the Red Sox will not resign their free agents after the exclusive bargaining window expires. So, so long Mike Lowell.

Now, A-Rod or Cabrera?

[chester]

Thanks, for, the mem-ories.

Thanks Mike for a great season and taking us the WS, but it looks like the Sox are going to look elsewhere for their third baseman in 2008.
Link.

I think we've seen in years past that the Red Sox will not resign their free agents after the exclusive bargaining window expires. So, so long Mike Lowell.

Now, A-Rod or Cabrera?

I dont think its over over...at least I hope its not.

Please not AfRod

[HCMarvel]

So what are you guys predicting now as far as Lowell goes?

4/52 from the yanks?

[Asterisk]

And the clock strikes midnight...


Thank you Mike Lowell! You're a classy dude coming off an unbelievable season but Theo is pragmatic and robotic (as he should be) in his line of work. Now, I know this is going to get scathing criticism but...

Sign A-Rod!

Sure, he's kind of a bitch, but all hot girls are bitches. Doesn't make using them for your pleasure any less awesome. He's already one of the 10 best players to ever take the field and may end up in the top 3 when all is said and through. Be the robot, Theo. Make the move!

[SugarDaddy38]

It's been stated time and again here and else where: unless the RS front office was willing to cave on the 4 years, Lowell was AT LEAST going to test the waters of FA...

That being said, I cannot argue with him for at least giving it a go. If he can't get the deal, the RS will sign him to the original offer. If he can, he finishes off his career with whomever after 4 years guaranteed. You have to love your team and their players (as I do the Sox and Lowell), but this is a business and, unlike Schill, Mike has some serious years in his career and some more time to make an impact and $$$.

And I'll say this- even if he DOES go to the Bronx, I'll still root for him and thank him when I go there to see the Sox play the Yank. Unlike Damon, he never said he WOULDN'T play for them.

Oh, last point- just because he didn't sign by midnight doesn't mean we won't still land him... Theo knows what he's doing (a.k.a Lowe, Pedro, Garciapara, Damon, etc.)- I gotta trust that he knows what he's doing and did'nt start caving to player demands that might compromise us in the future with other players...

[Walpole Joe's Neighbor]

And the clock strikes midnight...
Thank you Mike Lowell! You're a classy dude coming off an unbelievable season but Theo is pragmatic and robotic (as he should be) in his line of work. Now, I know this is going to get scathing criticism but...

Sign A-Rod!

Sure, he's kind of a bitch, but all hot girls are bitches. Doesn't make using them for your pleasure any less awesome. He's already one of the 10 best players to ever take the field and may end up in the top 3 when all is said and through. Be the robot, Theo. Make the move!

I'll throw up in my mouth if they sign AFraud. He's not worth the money. Spend it on pitching. Go get Santana and pay him but not a guy who can't deliver in the postseason. The numbers don't lie. He's the anti- Papi come the playoffs.

Having said that I wouldn't pay MIke Lowell 14 milion for 4 years coming off a career year. He's good for about .280 20 and 85 RBI's. That's not 14 million dollars worth of value. Love his defense and he's a classy professional but if the money is of paramount importance..which it usually is, then good luck to him and gold bless him for being fortunate enough to have this season before entering free agency. 14 million and 3/4 years for Mike Lowell after last season would have elicited alot of "are you &$A# kidding me?

[HCMarvel]

14 million and 3/4 years for Mike Lowell after last season would have elicited alot of "are you &$A# kidding me?

this is an excellent point. People who want Lowell back at any cost/length need to ask themselves: Is it more likely his avg year over the next four years more closely resembles his 2006 or 2007 season?


My guess would be 2006...and possibly worse. Remember, 3 years ago he had one of the worst seasons any regular has had this decade

Edited by HCMarvel, 13 November 2007 - 12:24 AM.

[cleanfloor]

globe reporting no deal:
Mike Lowell's agents and Theo Epstein could not reach an agreement about an hour before the midnight deadline in which the Red Sox had exclusive rights to negotiate with Lowell.
Lowell will now be a complete free-agent and can negotiate with other teams.
Both sides agreed there's still room for an agreement to be reached and they'll continue to stay in touch. Lowell will now be able to determine whether there's a four-year market out there for his services. Indications are that the Sox would not move off three years.

[Metrician]

All four TV stations sounded extremely pesimistic. Both LA teams along with Phily and mfy being mentioned so that's probably the reason why. I'm guessing this won't take long.
Somebody will offer a take-it or leave-it deal and Mike's going to take it. We'll probably hear sometime in the PM.

[dynomite]

A friend in San Diego said buzz in the Padres FO is that the Yankees are going to make a big offer to Lowell. (They're worried it's going to set the market too high for the CFers, Andruw and Hunter) Rumors of 4/60ish.

As an aside, I would think you can cross the Dodgers off the list of destinations for Mike: they already have Laroche, and Torre wants ARod.

I really hope Mike's not in NY next year; it would be awful to have to root against him. Let's hope the two sides find a way to work something out.

[Stuffy_McInnis]

A friend in San Diego said buzz in the Padres FO is that the Yankees are going to make a big offer to Lowell. (They're worried it's going to set the market too high for the CFers, Andruw and Hunter) Rumors of 4/60ish.

As an aside, I would think you can cross the Dodgers off the list of destinations for Mike: they already have Laroche, and Torre wants ARod.

I really hope Mike's not in NY next year; it would be awful to have to root against him. Let's hope the two sides find a way to work something out.

You would think they'd have learned their lesson with the Damon signing. Perhaps they have, and they're just trying to drive up the price to make it tough for Boston to resign him. Then again, with Jeter's lack of range at SS, maybe they really do want him.

[LargeFather44]

A friend in San Diego said buzz in the Padres FO is that the Yankees are going to make a big offer to Lowell. (They're worried it's going to set the market too high for the CFers, Andruw and Hunter) Rumors of 4/60ish.

As an aside, I would think you can cross the Dodgers off the list of destinations for Mike: they already have Laroche, and Torre wants ARod.

I really hope Mike's not in NY next year; it would be awful to have to root against him. Let's hope the two sides find a way to work something out.

If that rumor turns out to be true they can have him. He was great this year, but id be way more excited about his year from a statistical standpoint if Mike was 28 instead of 33. He'll be 34 by opening day and i doubt if hes gonna be worth what the Yanks want to offer him, 15 mill per year, when hes 38. Hes a good player who just had a great year for us and i love the way he plays the game, but i just don't think he will be worth all of the money coming to him from the Yanks or another team. For right now i say kudos to Theo for not budging on a seemingly sentimental fourth year, and kudos to Mike for wanting to get paid.

[hrbrendan]

Mike Lowell is to the FO nothing more than a free agent Mike Lowell coming off the same year on the Kansas City Royals. People need to remember that. If Mike Lowell had the same year on the f'ing Royals that he had this year on the sox, and was a free agent, he would be number 4-5 on the radar and probably wouldn't have 5 threads devoted to him. He hits in the playoffs. He plays third base. He's also a Boston Red Sox's version of A-Rod if the yankees had decent pitching the last few years. For the love of god, people are clamoring for the Red Sox FO to spend money that isn't theirs on a guy who isn't in the same ballpark as, let alone the same class as A-Rod because of like 12 games of his multiple MVP seasons on the Yankees. If the RS FO steps up and pays for A-Rod, be f'ing happy about it, and at least know your $8 beer is going towards putting the best players available on the field. Ellsbury, Youkilis, Ortiz, A-Rod, Manny, Drew, Varitek, Lugo, who f'ing cares. Let the pitcher bat, that lineup with good pitching puts you in the postseason.

-b

Edited by hrbrendan, 13 November 2007 - 04:47 AM.

[CapeCodsBabyBull]

"A-Rod, be f'ing happy about it"

Where in this thread has this been a big discussion about not being happy with arod, let's try to keep it to Lowell..

he would be number 4-5 on the radar

Who are the other 4 that are available and would be a better option. Besides Arod please fill us in..

[Igosplut]

A friend in San Diego said buzz in the Padres FO is that the Yankees are going to make a big offer to Lowell. (They're worried it's going to set the market too high for the CFers, Andruw and Hunter) Rumors of 4/60ish.

Channel 7 Boston repeated again this morning that the Yankees were going to offer Lowell 4/60ish. They said this yesterday so the rumor has got some legs.

I'm glad the FO didn't shoot the moon as I agree with the posters in here that a 4 year deal is shooting yourself in the foot.

That being said plan B should prove to be very interesting.....

[CapeCodsBabyBull]

Dynomite thanks that's some inside info for the box.


Agreed this is going to be extremely interesting, Are we sure there's no Shea Hillenbrand hiding somewhere in the minors as a nice filler because it may be coming down to something like that

[homeofthesuttons]

If Lowell goes to the MFY, then his crap gets thrown out of my house and onto the street. If he goes anywhere else, my family will keep his shirts and remember him fondly as a member of the Red Sox. BTW, Damon's crap got dropped off at Good Will. Boggs? Never got his shirt. Clemens? Damn, I'm still trying to get rid of that shirt...

[Igosplut]

After thinking about it this morning I believe Mike will end up with the MFYs. He came up through their system and I'm remembering reading somewhere (sorry, no link) early this year that he said he enjoyed his time in NY and wouldn't mind maybe returning to them at some point. Obviously this was before the season when people still viewed his contract as a dump so there was little flap over the statement. And add to the fact that maybe he views himself as being able to contribute solidly after the third year and would like to play for management that believes in him (for more than three). And of course there's the money.

And of course my irrational MFYs hate makes me want to see them get stuck with another Damon-esk contract......

[Jibaholic]

I think letting Lowell go is the right thing to do for reasons already mentioned. I also hope that he goes to the Yankees so that the Sox get their draft pick and the Yankees get the 4 year contract.

[SoxEquity]

If Lowell goes to the MFY, then his crap gets thrown out of my house and onto the street. If he goes anywhere else, my family will keep his shirts and remember him fondly ...

This Interests Me ALOT. We give Standing Ovations to Trot. Same To Millar, and others, and we boo the hell out of Damon. Is the reason simply b/c he went to MFY or b/c he swore he wouldn't and did anyway?

With Lowell... I'm very curious ... IS it your opinion that the Sox offered a fair deal, and if he doesn't take it ....so be it .... or did the Sox lowball him? Also...... If he goes to the MFY ... does he get the Damon treatment .. or because he is a classier guy than Damon does he get the standing O that is afforded to the other members of the '04 squad?

[Jibaholic]

This Interests Me ALOT. We give Standing Ovations to Trot. Same To Millar, and others, and we boo the hell out of Damon. Is the reason simply b/c he went to MFY or b/c he swore he wouldn't and did anyway?

With Lowell... I'm very curious ... IS it your opinion that the Sox offered a fair deal, and if he doesn't take it ....so be it .... or did the Sox lowball him? Also...... If he goes to the MFY ... does he get the Damon treatment .. or because he is a classier guy than Damon does he get the standing O that is afforded to the other members of the '04 squad?

I'm curious too. People are almost setting themselves up for a double standard with Lowell, maybe because he doesn't run his mouth the way Damon did. I'd like to see Red Sox fans boo anyone who goes to the Yankees for the rest of their career.

[mcq0823]

I have to think the odds of Mike Lowell coming back to the Sox now that the exclusive negotiating window has passed is significantly lower. Lowell was pretty clear that he wanted to be in Boston but with no agreement in sight I can't believe the Sox will be able to (more like want to) compete with the 4 year offers that are bound to happen.

I think we need to start talking about what plan B is for the Sox. I highly doubt they will go after A-Rod and invest so much of their payroll into one player, and I am unsure of any options that sound reasonable, appealing and likely to happen.

I think this was pretty big news in Red Sox Nation. I will be very surprised if Lowell comes back. As a business man I highly doubt he could turn down a 4/52-56 to come play for the Sox for 3/40+ from the Sox.

[homeofthesuttons]

Is it a fair deal? Absolutely. Mark this down, Lowell's best year ever was last year (and God bless him). I'm happy for him for taking the opportunity and making it happen. Here's a guy who was viewed as sharkbait when we picked him up in the miracle trade of '05 with the Marlins and ended up two years later, almost to the day, a World Series MVP.

But a standard is a standard. I will boo anyone that goes to the Yankees, classy or not. You leave the Red Sox, you leave the family trust. Anywhere else - I'll tip my hat to him.

I do like Lowell, but if he goes, he goes. Right now, Lowell is still, in my eyes, a member of the Red Sox. To Jibaholic's point, we should boo him. Besides, it will be easy since he'll no longer have facial hair.

[jthursto]

This Interests Me ALOT. We give Standing Ovations to Trot. Same To Millar, and others, and we boo the hell out of Damon. Is the reason simply b/c he went to MFY or b/c he swore he wouldn't and did anyway?

With Lowell... I'm very curious ... IS it your opinion that the Sox offered a fair deal, and if he doesn't take it ....so be it .... or did the Sox lowball him? Also...... If he goes to the MFY ... does he get the Damon treatment .. or because he is a classier guy than Damon does he get the standing O that is afforded to the other members of the '04 squad?

Personally, I can't blame him if he goes to the Yankees or anywhere else for that matter. He's really at a point in his career where this next contract represents his last chance for a big payday. I think those fans with some sense of perspective recognize this and wouldn't be inclined to boo him if he shows up in pinstripes. The contrast to Damon is interesting. First, Damon was celebrated and beloved by the Sox fanbase in a way that Lowell is not. The intensity and emotion following the 04 Championship was greater. That magnified and distorted the reaction to Damon. I think for many, there was recognition that Damon fled to the Yankees almost as much to feed his ego on the New York stage as for the money. That particular narcissistic aspect to his defection rubbed a lot of fans the wrong way, and the fans felt jilted. With Lowell, a much more mature and respected player albeit not beloved; I think he gets a pass if it's New York. Plus, there's a sense that the Yankees are receding in the rear view mirror.

[CodPiece XL]

It would be kind of ironic if, as a result of Lowell signing elsewhere, the Red Sox were "forced" into signing Arod who happens to be the best player in baseball.

[meghan]

This Interests Me ALOT. We give Standing Ovations to Trot. Same To Millar, and others, and we boo the hell out of Damon. Is the reason simply b/c he went to MFY or b/c he swore he wouldn't and did anyway?

With Lowell... I'm very curious ... IS it your opinion that the Sox offered a fair deal, and if he doesn't take it ....so be it .... or did the Sox lowball him? Also...... If he goes to the MFY ... does he get the Damon treatment .. or because he is a classier guy than Damon does he get the standing O that is afforded to the other members of the '04 squad?

Not officially knowing the exact terms of the offer right now, I think the Sox probably lowballed him, probably mostly on salary. They knew he liked Boston and probably wanted to see just how much. My opinion on this may change when all of this info is officially disclosed but judging from the comment about how Mike should find the offer acceptable if he wants to stay in Boston, it seems like they had a number in mind, possibly from before he won WS MVP, and they weren't going to budge. I think if they had offered a 4th as an option or raised the salary slightly for 3 it might have happened. And it's not a done deal yet although the chances of him returning are significantly decreased...

And I won't boo him if he goes to the Yankees. He's already been a Yankee (and should have a ring with them for 1998, right?). Unlike Damon, he has never insisted that he wouldn't go there, and he has said that he still knows many people within the organization that played large roles in his development as a player. I think everyone would prefer that, if he doesn't return, that he sign with someone besides the MFY, but I don't feel that him signing there would be as much of a slap in the face to RSN as the Damon signing was, so I think it should be treated differently.

Edited by meghan, 13 November 2007 - 10:22 AM.

[January]

Question: Was Lowel's 2005 ever explained, like was he injured that year or something? He had an incredible down year, was traded, bounced back a little in '06 and returned to normal in '07.

If he has some sort of injury, that might have been a red flag. I assume it was an injury, as it's hard to see someone having a down year of that magnitude for no reason without coming to Boston.

[homeofthesuttons]

Personally, I can't blame him if he goes to the Yankees or anywhere else for that matter. He's really at a point in his career where this next contract represents his last chance for a big payday. I think those fans with some sense of perspective recognize this and wouldn't be inclined to boo him if he shows up in pinstripes. The contrast to Damon is interesting. First, Damon was celebrated and beloved by the Sox fanbase in a way that Lowell is not. The intensity and emotion following the 04 Championship was greater. That magnified and distorted the reaction to Damon. I think for many, there was recognition that Damon fled to the Yankees almost as much to feed his ego on the New York stage as for the money. That particular narcissistic aspect to his defection rubbed a lot of fans the wrong way, and the fans felt jilted. With Lowell, a much more mature and respected player albeit not beloved; I think he gets a pass if it's New York. Plus, there's a sense that the Yankees are receding in the rear view mirror.

He can't get a pass - and I understand the sentiments as to why he should get one. He may get a howdy from the Red Sox fans once he is announced, but once he's at the plate for that first time batting against us, I'm going to pray that he's a wiffer from that point on.

If he does go to the MFYs, and he truly is the classy guy we have come to know, then this is one of the potential scenarios that would endear him to the Red Sox fans and make him legendary - and give him a lifetime pass:

Yankees /Sox, Fenway Park, series opener '08. Lowell's name is announced. A vaguely familiar looking clean shaven guy, who used to be a Red Sox third baseman, strolls to the plate dressed up as a MFY. In the background, he hears the awkward, almost obligatory ovation. He touches his helmet, yanks on his striped shirt and takes a couple of swings. He holds his hand up and asks for time. He steps back from the plate. He looks up at the stands and slowly turns around. He stares at the jacklegs in the MFY dugout, and drops his bat. He then drops to his knees and rips off his shirt. He then stands up, invigorated by the freedom, and runs past the MFY dugout and gives them the finger. He then mosh dives into the left field bleachers and the fans go crazy. Fireworks go off. Life is good...

[njingles3]

He then mosh dives into the left field bleachers and the fans go crazy.

So are they opening the new Fenway in '08 or does Mike Lowell suddenly have a 40 foot vertical leap?

[meghan]

Question: Was Lowel's 2005 ever explained, like was he injured that year or something? He had an incredible down year, was traded, bounced back a little in '06 and returned to normal in '07.

If he has some sort of injury, that might have been a red flag. I assume it was an injury, as it's hard to see someone having a down year of that magnitude for no reason without coming to Boston.

This isn't my opinion, but I know there was some speculation amongst the media, and even people here (read the Beckett signing thread in the archives) that his decline in 2005 was due to stricter testing and harsher penalities for using banned substances in the wake of the BALCO raid.

Mike Lowell comes over as a $9 million liability for the 2006 and 2007 seasons (he is guaranteed $18 million). Lowell's production significantly dropped last year, when he hit .236 with 8 home runs and 58 RBIs. The previous 3 seasons he averaged just fewer than 28 home runs, 94 RBIs, and a .282 average. Interesting how the three-time All-Star's numbers dropped dramatically after Major League Baseball's original steroid policy came into play. Bostonist can only hope that the right handed hitter can utilize the Green Monster in left to bring him back to the prominence of the 2002-2004 seasons. Time will tell.

http://bostonist.com...kett_lowell.php

He seems like the textbook definition of "stand-up guy" so I don't believe that at all, but just thought it was worth noting. And one would be a complete idiot to do anything like that after having testicular cancer, so he likely just had an off year. As far as injuries go, most of the stuff I'm finding indicates that he had a few one-time things like strains. He apparently has some condition called fibrous dysplasisa, a bone disorder...I'd never heard anything about that until just now when I found the article.
http://espn.go.com/m...21/1583862.html

Edited by meghan, 13 November 2007 - 11:10 AM.

[homeofthesuttons]

So are they opening the new Fenway in '08 or does Mike Lowell suddenly have a 40 foot vertical leap?

Sorry about that. I left out one slight detail. He's wearing his new, Mike Lowell branded super springy $15 cleats that propels him over the Monster...

[doc]

Yankees /Sox, Fenway Park... He then mosh dives into the left field bleachers and the fans go crazy. Fireworks go off. Life is good...

Do you watch alot of professional wrestling?
Do you believe it's real?

Damon earned the crap he gets by opening his mouth too much, he said he would never go to the Yankees and he did. You can't say that stuff in Boston then say alot more stupid stuff and expect people not to notice.

Lowell came here in a trade and has never been a free agent if he chooses to end his career in NY making the extra cash so be it. I think it sets a nice precedent of players coming to Boston for a ring then ending their careers in NY awash in cash.

[Sinistas]

If it was professional wrestling, he'd rip off his MFY jersey to reveal a Sox one underneath, and then beat down the entire dugout.

[Doctor G]

Lowell has earned the right to go back to the team he came up with if they want him back. I personally would not consider this situation similar to Damon who left in the middle of the night like the Baltimore Colts. The Red Sox had a figure and duration of contract determined for Lowell before the playoffs. That evaluation was probably about the same as the general consensus around here at the time.

[marsrover21]

This Interests Me ALOT. We give Standing Ovations to Trot. Same To Millar, and others, and we boo the hell out of Damon. Is the reason simply b/c he went to MFY or b/c he swore he wouldn't and did anyway?

With Lowell... I'm very curious ... IS it your opinion that the Sox offered a fair deal, and if he doesn't take it ....so be it .... or did the Sox lowball him? Also...... If he goes to the MFY ... does he get the Damon treatment .. or because he is a classier guy than Damon does he get the standing O that is afforded to the other members of the '04 squad?

I'd like to think we were booing Damon's two-faced-ness and not his laundry. For Lowell, I don't think I could bring myself to boo the guy. For Damon, I would do it again in a minute. The guy epitomizes sell-out. He goes from a free-loving, fun clubhouse to the morgue that is Yankee stadium and shaves off his beard. Is it just me, or does he look terribly unhappy whenever the camera is on him in the dugout?

If it was professional wrestling, he'd rip off his MFY jersey to reveal a Sox one underneath, and then beat down the entire dugout.

Yes! This would be the greatest sports moment of all time.

Edited by marsrover21, 13 November 2007 - 12:21 PM.

[doc]

If it was professional wrestling, he'd rip off his MFY jersey to reveal a Sox one underneath, and then beat down the entire dugout.

Yeah he'd beat Jeter with a folding chair, Tito would attack Giardi with a hidden object and BB would jump out of the stands with the entire Patriots squad and beat Hank with the 2008 Lombardi

[doc]

I'd like to think we were booing Damon's two-faced-ness and not his laundry. For Lowell, I don't think I could bring myself to boo the guy. For Damon, I would do it again in a minute. The guy epitomizes sell-out. He goes from a free-loving, fun clubhouse to the morgue that is Yankee stadium and shaves off his beard. Is it just me, or does he look terribly unhappy whenever the camera is on him in the dugout?

It will be funny because Damon would have just got roundly boo'd again and he will have a very confused look on his face for half the season. Damon is not very smart.

[homeofthesuttons]

I'd like to think we were booing Damon's two-faced-ness and not his laundry. For Lowell, I don't think I could bring myself to boo the guy. For Damon, I would do it again in a minute. The guy epitomizes sell-out. He goes from a free-loving, fun clubhouse to the morgue that is Yankee stadium and shaves off his beard. Is it just me, or does he look terribly unhappy whenever the camera is on him in the dugout?
Yes! This would be the greatest sports moment of all time.

Bottom line, for me and those like me, we boo all of 'em. They are still the MFY less we forget.

Do I like Lowell. Absolutely. Do I respect Lowell? Absolutely. Will I boo him if he goes to the MFY? Absolutely.

Damon, it is a little different. Do I like him? No. Do I respect him? No. Will I boo him? Absolutely. Will I give him the finger from deep down in my heart and soul? Absolutely.

[homeofthesuttons]

Yeah he'd beat Jeter with a folding chair, Tito would attack Giardi with a hidden object and BB would jump out of the stands with the entire Patriots squad and beat Hank with the 2008 Lombardi

Wow. Will the real professional wrestling fan please stand up...

[Jeekinz]

What both Damon & Lowell have in common is: They were both offered a decent contract and refused it. That's why they get booed. Millar, Nixon et al, were not given that chance.

[Igosplut]

Yeah he'd beat Jeter with a folding chair, Tito would attack Giardi with a hidden object and BB would jump out of the stands with the entire Patriots squad and beat Hank with the 2008 Lombardi

HA!

Maybe the Patriots could be on rollerskates to give it that "rollerderby" feel too.....

[SoxEquity]

Bottom line, for me and those like me, we boo all of 'em.... They are still the MFY less we Will I give him the finger from deep down in my heart and soul? Absolutely.

I'm a diehard. Been one since birth. And My Dad before me. And his dad before him.

I have very conflicting feelings on this.... I happened to throw in the 2004 RedSox boxset and watched the bonus DVD (the one narrated by Dennis Leary) ..and forgot how much I enjoyed Damon that year. I've had hatred for him since he's left. But watching that '04 DVD was pretty special.

My 2 cents is this: Lowell gets his standing O. He becomes part of the 'free dinner for life' club in Beantown regardless of him ending up an MFY. I saw this guy go balls out for the Sox too many times .. and I believe him (unlike Damon) when he says he wanted to remain a member of the RedSox. If he does not come back .. I believe it is b/c Theo and co. lowballed him too much, but .. This is Their RIGHT. 2 World Series in 4 years means that the Front Office gets a lot of rope in signing and letting players go. On a lowball offer, he must be given the Millar/Trot treatment regardless of the uniform.