113 replies to this topic

[xjack]

I just got back from Yankee Stadium, where I went to tonight's game with my father and a couple friends. It was the worst game I've ever been to, and I'm not talking about what happened on the field.

For the record, I've been going to Sox-Yankees games at the Stadium since 1994, and while it's always been a rough crowd for Sox fans -- I stopped wearing Sox caps and jerseys to night games years ago -- my feeling, until tonight, was that it had been getting better -- that the Yankees' stepped-up security was making a difference.

Boy was I wrong. We were sitting in the upper deck, section 25, and it was just shocking to me how much beer-throwing, peanut-tossing and obscenity-hurling went on there. Now I know that Fenway isn't a walk in the park for Yankees fans, but I've never seen it get as in-your-face at Fenway as it was tonight at the stadium. And I was just a bystander.

Security people showed up in our section for good around the 6th inning, but that was only after a mini-brawl broke out three rows in front of me... A drunk girl threw a beer cup at a Sox fan, but missed and hit a drunk Yankees fan. She stumbled over to apologize, but the guy was too angry to listen. He started mouthing off at her, the girl's boyfriend got involved, punches were thrown, and next thing I notice was that the girl had a bloody face and her boyfriend was pushed down two rows on top of some poor schmuck. Of course, the guy who threw the punch managed to leave the scene before the police showed up.

All in all, there had to have been 15 people removed from my immediate vicinity from the sixth inning on. Of course, if there had been a security presence from the start of the game -- as there was at both of the '04 ALCS games I went to -- I doubt it would have gotten so bad towards the end.

Now I know what the reaction from some quarters is going to be to this stuff: It's Red Sox-Yankees: what did you expect? .... Thing is, I'd like to be able to take my 7-year-old twins to a Sox-Yankees game at the Stadium some day, but that's never going to happen if the Yankees front office continues to tolerate the kind of drunken, abusive behavior that was rampant there tonight.

Edited by xjack, 22 May 2007 - 08:49 AM.

[Matty005]

Maybe when they open their new ballpark in 2009, things will improve. I know in Philly, ever since they opened Citizens Bank Park, things got much better (less fights, etc).

[Hatcher Steals Home]

I had a friend there last night and as soon as the game ended he gave me a call. In his section, he thought the ushers and security people actually made things worse. According to him (he's also a Red Sox fan) 5 or 6 Red Sox fans were thrown out in his section, and none of them seemed to be causing problems. One guy was pointing to the Red Sox lettering on his shirt during a mini 'Boston Sucks' chant and an usher ran up to him and gave him a warning. The next time the guy stood up, the usher ran up to him and gave him "warning number 2." Finally the guy took his jersey off, only to have a Matsuzaka t-shirt on. When the usher saw that, he threw him out; he was the first person thrown out in that section, and things escalated from there, as people were first booing the usher, then those ignorant of the situation were booing, I guess for the sake of booing.

Edited by Hatcher Steals Home, 22 May 2007 - 06:31 AM.

[bmacfarlane]

I sat upstairs in section 30 along with my son in full Red Sox gear and had no problems, I never do. Three mfy fans got tossed but I don't know why. I was surrounded by mfy fans and the ball busting was great fun we all shook hands, gave a semi-quiet asshole cheer to one another and left, promising to battle another day.

[AcroBrat]

I just got back from Yankee Stadium, where I went to tonight's game with my father and a couple friends. It was the worst game I've ever been to, and I'm not talking about what happened on the field.

For the record, I've been going to Sox-Yankees games at the Stadium since 1994, and while it's always been a rough crowd for Sox fans -- I stopped wearing Sox caps and jerseys to night games years ago -- my feeling, until tonight, was that it had been getting better -- that the Yankees' stepped-up security was making a difference.

Boy was I wrong. We were sitting in the upper deck, section 25, and it was just shocking to me how much beer-throwing, peanut-tossing and obscenity-hurling went on there. Now I know that Fenway isn't a walk in the park for Yankees fans, but I've never seen it get as in-your-face at Fenway as it was tonight at the stadium. And I was just a bystander.

Security people showed up in our section for good around the 6th inning, but that was only after a mini-brawl broke out three rows in front of me... A drunk girl threw a beer cup at a Sox fan, but missed and hit a drunk Yankees fan. She stumbled over to apologize, but the guy was too angry to listen. He started mouthing off at her, the girl's boyfriend got involved, puches were thrown, and next thing I notice was that the girl had a bloody face and her boyfriend was pushed down two rows on top of some poor schmuck. Of course, the guy who threw the punch managed to leave the scene before the police showed up.

All in all, there had to have been 15 people removed from my immediate vicinity from the sixth inning on. Of course, if there had been a security presence from the start of the game -- as there was at both of the '04 ALCS games I went to -- I doubt it would have gotten so bad towards the end.

Now I know what the reaction from some quarters is going to be to this stuff: It's Red Sox-Yankees: what did you expect? .... Thing is, I'd like to be able to take my 7-year-old twins to a Sox-Yankees game at the Stadium some day, but that's never going to happen if the Yankees front office continues to tolerate the kind of drunken, abusive behavior that was rampant there tonight.

Posting about it here is fine, but try writing a letter to the Yankees front office – I'd be shocked if they didn't care. I know our own FO will bend over backwards for fans that have had a negative experience at the park -- as they should: it's good business. I don't know what will come of it, but these guys realize that dollars are at stake, and they are providing entertainment. If their venue is unsafe, that should be a serious (and avoidable) problem.

[V.I. Tessie]

Posting about it here is fine, but try writing a letter to the Yankees front office – I'd be shocked if they didn't care. I know our own FO will bend over backwards for fans that have had a negative experience at the park -- as they should: it's good business. I don't know what will come of it, but these guys realize that dollars are at stake, and they are providing entertainment. If their venue is unsafe, that should be a serious (and avoidable) problem.

Worth a try, but I seriously doubt he'll get a response.

I had very similar experiences to exjack's the last two times I went to Yankee Stadium which was in the late 80's. Crap thrown at us, cursing, etc. We actually asked for help from security guards and got laughed at. We ended up leaving early both times and I vowed never to return to that dump again. Not good times at all.

After the last incident, I wrote to the Yankee FO and told my story. I never heard back from them. Nothing, not a peep.

[StatGeekNY]

As a girl who generally attends games with at least one male Yankee fan, I think I have it a little easier at the stadium. If anything, they usually get on the guy I'm with for bringing a Sox fan to the game (nevermind that it's usually me who planned the trip).

The one time I had serious trouble was after Game 6 of th 2004 ALCS. I had driven to the game and my friend took the subway. He offered to walk me back to my car, but I declined, saying I'd be fine. I was on the upper level of the parking garage right next to the Stadium when I got cornered by 6 guys who threatened to "rip that Red Sox shit" right off me and rape me. I have never been so afraid for my personal safety. Luckily, they were drunk and I could run faster and in a straighter line than they could, so I made it to my car with no harm done.

I wrote a letter about this incident to the Yankees and to the company that manages the parking garage and never got a response. I'm sure the Yankees figured it wasn't technically on their property, but I think if they took better control of things at the game, it wouldn't spill out like this into the surrounding area.

I think fans on both sides need to realize this is just a game, and it wouldn't be any fun if everyone liked the same team.

[The Gray Eagle]

The way Gammons and the Glob guys used to bash Sox fan behavior back when Duquette was the GM, you'd think they'd decry obnoxious Yankee fan behavior as well. Just out of fairness, if nothing else.

[PseuFighter]

They're not going to care. I wrote a "complaint letter" - at customer service before leaving the toilet - about an incident that took place (that I wrote about somewhere on here) during the subway series last year. I still haven't heard back.

[TheoShmeo]

Not only do the people who run the Toilet not care, but they seem to have a policy that Sox fans get tossed on a no-fault basis if there is an incident of any kind with a Yankee fan. "Policy" may be too strong a word, but I've seen evidence of that several times over the past few years, and there were a few times when it was just ridiculously unfair in my view.

That said, I guess it's where you sit and luck of the draw. My perspective is that Yankee fans have been a lot more subdued since the events of October, 2004 and they lost their favorite "19-18" toy. Yeah, there are always idiots in every ballpark, but on the whole they've seemed more calm to me recently. That's especially so after Sox wins; they used to walk out with defiance -- "see you in October" -- and now it's pretty quiet.

[86spike]

I usually get to one Yanks/Sox game in the Bronx each summer and have never had much of a problem beyond the usual heckling, which I'm fine with. It's no different from what I've seen at Fenway, so let's not pretend Sox fans are better to Yanks fans than vice versa.

Maybe this long spring of sub-.500 baseball has made the assholes angrier.

[xjack]

It's no different from what I've seen at Fenway, so let's not pretend Sox fans are better to Yanks fans than vice versa.

This may be a function of where you sit.

I've never seen behavior at Fenway half as bad as what I saw last night at the Stadium. For that matter, I used to live in Philly, and I never saw anything that bad at Veterans Stadium, which supposedly had the rowdiest fans in baseball.

It may have something to do with layoout of the upper deck -- the extreme slope of the stadium seating in the upper deck basically allows you to mouth off and throw things at fans 10 rows down. You can't do that at Fenway.... Then again I usually sit in good box seats at Fenway, but when I go to the Stadium, I'm always in the upper deck.

Edited by xjack, 22 May 2007 - 08:14 AM.

[SouthPaw21]

This is not Red Sox vs. Yankees related but I thought it was rather appalling either way. I was at a Yankees vs. A’s game last summer and sitting in the upper deck at Yankee Stadium. It was a very mixed crowd in our section, but right next to each other were a group of 10 very drunk men, and a family of 4. These drunk morons managed to sneak a full bottle of Jack Daniels into the ballpark somehow, and were passing it amongst each other for the first few innings until it was gone. Upon finishing their bottle of ‘Jack’ most of them began smoking in their seats. The family with their two young children had a problem with it and asked them to please stop. The men wouldn’t stop, so security was brought over, but since none of them were dumb enough to be smoking when security got there nothing was done, other than a warning.

The plea to stop smoking only seemed egg these guys on because as soon as security left they all lit up and began blowing smoke directly at these people. Some off the men began taken pictures of themselves (cigarette in one hand and empty bottle of Jack in the other) harassing this family. Other people in the surrounding area attempted to persuade these men to stop, but instead fights broke out between the “peacemakers” and these drunken idiots.

Finally the family was forced to leave the game in about the 7th inning. They must have called security on their way out the door because the men were given another warning soon after the family was gone. Ultimately nothing was done to these guys, and after the game they left behind an empty handle of Jack Daniels, and a bevy of cigarette butts.

[Smiling Joe Hesketh]

I have not yet been to Yankee Stadium, but these stories are reinforcing my conviction that when I do go it will not be for a Red Sox game. I'll see the Angels or the Tigers beat up on the Yankees instead. I don't need this crap in my life.

Rape threats? Continued game-long harrassment? I'll pass, thanks.

[Jethro Q. Walrustitty]

I sat upstairs in section 30 along with my son in full Red Sox gear and had no problems, I never do.

Maybe it's just me, but I wouldn't wear Red Sox gear in Yankee Stadium. Unless I wanted to attract negative attention on myself because I was in a mood to dish out and receive abuse. I mean, I'm going to be cheering for the Sox anyway, which will tip off anyone around me who I'm rooting for, but why make it easy and obvious for the oblivious drunks?

No one deserves to be physically threatened, and I'm not condoning violence, but this seems like a case of two wrongs making an even worse wrong.

[Phil Plantier]

I haven't been to the Stadium in a while, but I did have a friend who got a response, and some very nice tickets, after a bad experience led him to write a letter to the Yankees front office.

He was a Tigers fan, though, so maybe not mentioning your allegiance will produce a more favorable response.

[Shelterdog]

I live in NY and go to a few sox-MFY games a year in Yankee stadium.

Two anecdotal observations:

1.) The nicer your seats, the fewer problems you have. The ad execs and bankers with their kids and clients in the fourth row really won't heckle you or get in a fight. In the upper sections, well, you will get heckled.

2.) It's much, much worse when the Yankees are losing or when they're having a bad season. There's real anger and hostility towards the Sox fans this year that goes beyond the normal taunting.

[Rudy Pemberton]

I've been to Yankee Stadium tons of times over the year, and only had a problem during Opening Day '05. Otherwise, I generally wear a Sox hat and keep to myself...you get the lame insults hurled at you, but it's like anything else, if you don't show that it bothers you than the clowns stop. Of course the ushers are going to throw out the Sox fans, there are a lot fewer and often times it may be for your own protection. If you are cheering for the Red Sox loudly (which ideally, you would be able to do of course) something will probably happen.

I will caveat this by saying that I will never sit in the bleachers again...as it is like a zoo out there, complete with feces throwing monkeys. The people who sit out there would rather start a fight than watch a game, and they'll try. Sit in the upper deck though, and you'll largely be fine if you keep to yourself. Sad that it is that way, and I probably wouldn't bring children to the game, but it is what it is.

Unless with your a pretty big group, I agree that it's probably best to leave the jersey at home and stick to a hat. Does that suck? Sure, but lets not pretend that Yankee fans are welcomed with open arms in Fenway. It's all about knowing your surroundings.

[Razor Shines]

One staggering difference between the two stadiums is the way female fans of the opposing team are treated.

In Yankee Stadium, a girl wearing Sox gear will have P&G-type stuff shouted at her as she walks up the isle to her seat. You don't really hear that type of thing in the Fenway bleachers. (Male fans wearing enemy gear are treated pretty equally in both venues, IMO).

The upper-deck of the Toilet is much worse than the bleachers, most likely due to the no-beer policy of the bleachers.

[riveraulwick]

I agree with Rudy in that the bleachers should be avoided. I've been fortunate to never have a problem at the toilet when sitting anywhere other than the bleachers. Last game I went to there was in Sept. 2003, when the Sox spanked Clemens (in what was supposed to be his last game against the Sox in a NY uniform.)

I was with 3 guys, we all wore Sox jerseys and weren't at all quiet about how the game was going. Not a peep from anyone. At the end of the game some people actually congratulated us for the win. I think that experience and the rape threat pretty much constitute the full range of experience one can have at Yankee Stadium.

[jose melendez]

Quick Story: Lushess255 and I went to Game 3 of the 2004 ALCS at Fenway, and there were these two guys next to us who seemed nice enough. As the Sox get beat worse and worse, they get drunker and drunker and louder and louder.

In around the seventh or so they start screaming at these two MFY fans, a guy and a girl sitting near us that they hate the fucking Yankees and they're going to gang rape his girlfriend.

Security grabbed the guys right after that and dragged one of them, who would not go quietly, out with his face literally going along the pavement. On the one hand, I was glad security intervened, on the other hand, this asshole made me almost ashamed to be a Sox fan.

I actually went over to the two Yankees fans after this and apologized for that asshole on behalf of all Red Sox fans.

[drtooth]

1.) The nicer your seats, the fewer problems you have. The ad execs and bankers with their kids and clients in the fourth row really won't heckle you or get in a fight. In the upper sections, well, you will get heckled.

That could be said for Yankee games at Fenway, though probably not at the level of rape threats. Went to the Friday night game this year and the Yankee fans were abused but took it in stride and had fun with it, so there were no problems. Went to the Sept 2005 Friday night MFY game in the Monsters and had a few Yankee fans but they received far less verbiage.

Edited by drtooth, 22 May 2007 - 08:54 AM.

[djhb20]

I went to a Sox-Yankees game earlier this season. A lot of shouting, etc. occurred between drunk Red Sox and Yankee fans above us (in the upper deck, behind 3B), and to my surprise, when security came, they eject 3 Yankee fans and left the Red Sox fans alone. The Yankees fans were throwing trash and making physical threats, but the most involved Sox fan was pretty drunk and was definitely actively participating, although he was not throwing anything or swearing or threatening. Rather, he was just pointing at his Sox jersey, and brushing them off with arm motions, etc. (And standing up and looking at them while they harassed him.) Still, I was shocked that he didn't get tossed.

I always wear my Sox hat. I've worn an Ortiz jersey, and this year a Dice-K t-shirt. I figure it's going to be clear I'm rooting for the Sox anyway, so I might as well show it. I've never had a real problem, some popcorn thrown at me, "Boston Sucks" and profanities my way, and all that, but nothing major. But I don't drink, and I just ignore what's going on. There's generally enough Sox fans there that there will be one around that wants to fight/argue/etc, so I can fly a little more under the radar. So I thank all you guys for that.

That said, once I have kids, I would never bring them, unless I was sitting in the lower boxes, which I hope would be filled with corporate wannabes that are too busy checking their Blackberries.

[xjack]

That said, once I have kids, I would never bring them, unless I was sitting in the lower boxes, which I hope would be filled with corporate wannabes that are too busy checking their Blackberries.

For me, this is the big thing. I wouldn't mind bringing my kids if the experience meant dealing with some ribbing and back-and-forth with the guy sitting next to me or behind me. After all, not many people are going to start throwing things or mouthing off to a family sitting one row away from them. But when the distance is 10 rows instead of one, somehow this emboldends drunk MFY fans to behave in the most wretched ways imaginable.

I actually think it's gotten worse since 2004. I'm convinced there's a segment of Yankees' fans who had a big chunk of their sense of self-worth tied up in the idea that the Yankees would never lose to the Red Sox.

Edited by xjack, 22 May 2007 - 09:03 AM.

[glennhoffmania]

I just got back from Yankee Stadium, where I went to tonight's game with my father and a couple friends. It was the worst game I've ever been to, and I'm not talking about what happened on the field.

For the record, I've been going to Sox-Yankees games at the Stadium since 1994, and while it's always been a rough crowd for Sox fans -- I stopped wearing Sox caps and jerseys to night games years ago -- my feeling, until tonight, was that it had been getting better -- that the Yankees' stepped-up security was making a difference.

Boy was I wrong. We were sitting in the upper deck, section 25, and it was just shocking to me how much beer-throwing, peanut-tossing and obscenity-hurling went on there. Now I know that Fenway isn't a walk in the park for Yankees fans, but I've never seen it get as in-your-face at Fenway as it was tonight at the stadium. And I was just a bystander.

Security people showed up in our section for good around the 6th inning, but that was only after a mini-brawl broke out three rows in front of me... A drunk girl threw a beer cup at a Sox fan, but missed and hit a drunk Yankees fan. She stumbled over to apologize, but the guy was too angry to listen. He started mouthing off at her, the girl's boyfriend got involved, punches were thrown, and next thing I notice was that the girl had a bloody face and her boyfriend was pushed down two rows on top of some poor schmuck. Of course, the guy who threw the punch managed to leave the scene before the police showed up.

All in all, there had to have been 15 people removed from my immediate vicinity from the sixth inning on. Of course, if there had been a security presence from the start of the game -- as there was at both of the '04 ALCS games I went to -- I doubt it would have gotten so bad towards the end.

Now I know what the reaction from some quarters is going to be to this stuff: It's Red Sox-Yankees: what did you expect? .... Thing is, I'd like to be able to take my 7-year-old twins to a Sox-Yankees game at the Stadium some day, but that's never going to happen if the Yankees front office continues to tolerate the kind of drunken, abusive behavior that was rampant there tonight.

I saw all of that, as well as several other incidents. I usually wear a Sox hat to the toilet and while I get some comments, it's never usually that bad because I laugh it off instead of further instigating them. But overall, the behavior of these idiots is horrible. Besides the fights, threats and verbal abuse, there is absolutely no common decency or courtesy.

In the last series, I saw a guy get into a fight with a drunk moron because he was swearing at his 10 year old kid who was wearing a Sox jersey. Last night, I was sitting behind a guy who, despite being surrounded by mostly Sox fans, would stand up at least once per half inning and try to get everyone to stand up with him and cheer, despite everyone around him telling him to sit his ass down and get out of their way. He didn't care.

I'm going tonight (with crappy seats again) but I think this will be my last visit unless I'm able to get seats in the lower deck where it seems relatively normal.

[drleather2001]

Since 1999 I think I've been to the Stadium about 15 times, mostly for Sox games but also for some others (I had a luxury box during the 22-0 rout by the Indians in '04. That felt good; "You mean I get to watch this pitiful performance AND get free beer?")

Anyway, I've found that if you don't act like an asshole and show a little self-depreciation, you're generally ok but you can still expect some verbal abuse. Earlier this year, in my upper deck section, a Sox fan got thrown out for being the target of a thrown beer and verbal abuse, which was absurd, and that seemed to embolden the Yanks fans around me. It was the Matsuzaka game that they got routed in, so once the game got out of hand they turned up the venom a little bit. I made friends with the group of 5 guys behind me, and we made a pact that they could make fun of me all they wanted, but had to leave my fiancee alone. It worked out pretty well, although I did get an "asshole" chant directed at me from farther away for no reason other than I was wearing a Sox hat and walking up the isle with a beer. I smiled and waved and sat down and it fizzled out.

That being said, I would not let my fiancee go wearing Sox stuff if I wasn't there with her.

[xjack]

From lurker stevman17:

Just a lurker here, but I definitely think where you sit is the main problem. I consistently get behind home plate type seats at Yankee Stadium and I wear my Ortiz home jersey. I stopped wearing it just because I feel bad for the Yankee fans who get kicked out for harassing me. It appears to me, at least in the expensive seats and I am a pretty big guy, that the Yankee security and NYC cops are overaggressive in stopping people from doing the things you describe.

[PseuFighter]

This topic makes me wonder why people go to sporting events in general with the intent to make life miserable for their peer-paying fans. While I'm not suggesting that a major sporting rivalry is akin to an evening at the New York Philharmonic, I also don't believe that one should ever feel threatened by a common paying customer at any form of entertainment. Want to root for your team and throw back a few beers, go right on ahead, but what does one achieve by harassing complete strangers for seemingly no purpose whatsoever? The douchemonkey in the nosebleeds would probably have a far better time and spend far less money doing the same to an equally intelligently-challenged crowd at his neighborhood dive bar without acting like some zoo animal to those around him there to enjoy a night at the game.

[PseuFighter]

I know in Philly, ever since they opened Citizens Bank Park, things got much better (less fights, etc).

I heard that they sometimes kick out entire rows (with little kids!) at the new Philly park.

[sittingstill]

I was at Yankee Stadium with a buddy for the April 28 game this year. We're both women, we both wore Sox gear, we did have good seats (Main Championship), we got maybe a little verbal taunting but nothing I'd worry about. The guy who yelled "1918!" on the way to the subway afterwards was priceless.

That said, I don't think I'd wear Sox gear in the bleachers.

I've brought a female Yankee fan buddy to Fenway numerous times in the last year and she hasn't been hassled. A Sox fan did refuse a light from her lighter--that's as bad as it got.

One thing I will say about Yankee Stadium is that you can get hard liquor there, even waitress service in our seats (the equivalent of home plate loge box at Fenway), and that the guys in front of us 4/28 were two-fisted drinking Johnnie Walker the whole game, so I can see where things might get out of hand faster there. (They were enthusiastic, but they also had about eight Yankee fans and two Sox fans in their group, so they were pretty self-contained.)

I heard that they sometimes kick out entire rows (with little kids!) at the new Philly park.

FWIW Philly seems to have more of a zero-tolerance policy with regard to behavior that will get you thrown out--e.g. they don't distinguish between jumping onto the field and accidentally sliding over the wall trying to get a foul ball.

[bmacfarlane]

I guess I've been lucky. Normally I sit in the bleachers at the toilet and wear a Sox hat and jersey or Sox windbreaker and have a great time. Yeah there's an asshole or two but the majority are a lot of fun and the ball busting is hilarious. I'll be in the bleachers Wed. night, Section 41, wearing the usual. To be honest, I've seen mfy fans get absolutely raked at Fenway on a more consistent basis than vice versa at the toilet.

[In my lifetime]

As an imbedded RS fan in Yankee territory, we have had the opportunity to go with our kids and their friends to about 40 RS-MFY games over the last 4 years at Fenway and at the Toilet. IMHO, the main problem is the tremendous amount of over-serving that goes on in Yankee Stadium. I was appalled to see fans, who could barely walk yet were still served 4 beers at a time. To the vendors credit, the patrons' mouths were working fine, that is at least the volume aspect of their mouths if not the clarity.

Other then $, I am not sure why the Yankees don't institute a similar serving policy as in Fenway. Although maybe this is the income they need to generate to afford Clemens.

Unfortunately, it is probably just a matter of time until a serious incident occurs as a result of this over-serving and then maybe the Yankees will change their policy.

Edited by In my lifetime, 22 May 2007 - 09:53 AM.

[PseuFighter]

language possibly not safe for work:

[StatGeekNY]

I should add that I have been back to Yankee Stadium (my first return trip was the next night for Game 7) and will continue to go back and wear Sox gear. I'm just a little more careful about where I go, and I try not to be anywhere by myself. I'm not going to let a few idiots ruin my enjoyment of a game.

[5belongstoGeorge]

I've been to the Toilet one time in my life, last year, and was treated well by most everyone even while wearing a Sox hat. I was there alone and had a seat about 15 rows behind home plate. The people sitting around me were all baseball fans and we had some fun discussions and all was well. Boomer Eisiaison (sp?) was sitting way at the front of my section. It was an excellent seat. The only disappointment was that the Sox lost that night.

Two anecdotes from that night:

Before the game I went to a food concession and was standing in line waiting for a burger (it turned out to be an excellent burger, by the way) and some punk behind the counter started yelling at me about my Red Sox hat. I mean he was making a scene from behind the counter for about a minute and a half non-stop and people were starting to turn heads. I let him get it all out and then I said "Hey, the trash can over by the mustard is full." and half the people in line laughed out loud. The woman in line next to me (if I recall correctly, she was kind of a hottie) leaned over and told me I was welcome at Yankee Stadium anytime.

I stayed for the whole game even though the MFY won by 5 or 6 runs. As I was trying to take the subway back to Midtown my pay-card was wrong and I was holding up a huge after game line waiting to get to the train. This giant black dude in full MFY gear just handed me his card and pushed me through the turnstile without a word. I tried to give him money after we got through and he waved me off. I obviously looked like I was not from the city... a true good Samaritan Yankee fan. I hope I get to return the favor to an MFY fan in need someday.

[biollante]

Having been to both, Yankee Stadium is much worse than Fenway Park for fan violence and for "feeling safe" both inside and outside the park. Outside of Yankee Stadium has improved somewhat. It used to be really dodgy. Inside is a crap shoot. Usually, it has little to do with "fans" and everything to do with drunk people. Alcohol helps pay everyone's in MLB's salary so they need to improve polite security. The upper deck at Yankee stadium can get wild west like. For Sox/Yanks games they have to increase security.

[PseuFighter]

Not to single out our dear friends in the YS bleachers, but does anyone else find their continual juvenile ribbing/bashing/heckling/harassing with gay, (SPAM filter), faggott, a song entitled "why are you gay?" sung to the tune of "ymca" plus crotch-chops just slightly disconcerting? Not that I'm passing judgment on our distinguished colleagues across the aisle...

What's that? More evidence needed?

Here's what happens when the "Section 39 Crew" invades Fenway:



and again:



Look at them now on the subway:



And here are our boys now, singing their tragically hip "Why Are You Gay?"

[SawxSince67]

In the late 90’s and up until 2004, MFY fans would travel to Boston in droves, basically take the place over and rub Fenway’s nose in any losses. People were frustrated and the ugliness towards obvious MFY fans around Fenway was undeniable. (If you act like those freaks in the Youtubes--and I've seen it--you should expect to get stomped. There's always someone who'll call you on it.)

While they mostly kept quiet, my MFY fan friends were arrogant enough to wear their Yankee gear to Fenway and in the surrounding bars. “Arrogant” because they KNEW how much shit they’d receive but they were so secure in their smugness during the MFY “run” they somehow felt above Red Sox fans.

I’ve had to physically intervene because one local or another took exception to their Yankee gear. Badness. I grew tired of it and insisted that they no longer wear the MFY gear as I invariably wound up being security and/or the mediator between them and whatever pissed off Sox fan they’d attract.

One night, while in Who's on First (always a bloodbath waiting to happen—haven’t been in there since), I had to stand between them and a monstrous dude who clearly just wanted to beat people up. That sucked greatly. Meanwhile, the DJ was instigating the “Yankees Suck” thing over the PA.

My obvious rule: I can neither go to jail for an assault nor get the shit beat out of me over baseball. Frankly, I’m lucky I haven’t experienced either. I hate that part of the deal.

[ibrewbeer]

It might have been a year or two ago...

I went into Fallujah wearing a "Jesus Saves" tee-shirt.....

[GriffinDoerr]

Perhaps instead of directing complaints to the Yankee organization, a letter to MLB would be looked upon more seriously? Just a thought.

[86spike]

the booze obviously fuels nearly all of the over-the-top behavior.

The problem is, even if they served less in the park, those who want to get wasted will just tank up at the bars before the game and remain just as trashed.

[DosEquisMatsuzaka]

I have had several experiences with MFY fans at the toilet, but they have ever gotten out of hand. That may be because I am a rather large individual and I have no intention of starting anything and others tend not to want to start with me.

In 2004 I did witness something in the bleachers at the toilet that I may not have been able to stop myself from retaliating had it happened to me. This one yankee fan was repeatedly getting right in the face of a sox fan and screaming at him. The "security" was watching it happen and let the MFY fan antagonize this guy, who by all appearances was trying to ignore the MFY fan. It was clear that the "security" was going to allow the MFY fan to do whatever he wanted as long as he did not physically assault the Sox fan and the MFY fan took full advantage of it getting as close as he could to the Sox fan and yelling right in his face (I could see the spittal flying from his mouth as he yelled). I guarantee if the Sox fan had done anything to retaliate he woudl have been escorted from the stadium.

[Yaz4Ever]

I've been to over 20 MLB ballparks at least once each and, in many cases, several times. I've seen "Yankees Suck" chants begin at NFL games in Phoenix. No matter where you go, there will always be a group of people who seem more interested in ruining things for others (their idea of fun) than in paying attention to the game. Most often, however, fans are normal well-adjusted people like most of us. It should be obvious that what people are saying above about where you sit dictating the level of abuse you may face / violence you may witness, though. It's simply common sense.

The worst incident I've seen personally was when I took my then 7-year-old daughter to a game in Oakland with the A's hosting the Braves - we were in the area and it was the only MLB park in California she hadn't yet been to. We were seated down the third-base line about halfway between the bag and the foul pole. A very nice, very quiet family of 4 was sitting nearby with Braves hats on. They never once said anything to anyone, but applauded when the Braves did something well. A group of obvious felons (yes, you could tell just by looking at these animals) decided it would be a good idea to start mouthing off to the family who just sat there and took it quietly. Another Braves fan 4-5 rows ahead of them stood up and told the animals to be quiet and just enjoy the game. That didn't sit well and a brawl broke out when one of the hoodlums ran down and sucker-punched the lone Braves fan. He was immediately followed by several of his friends who felt it necessary to literally kick this guy while he was down. Before we knew it, all hell had broken out in our section and it seemed as though there were more people fighting than there were not fighting although I'm sure it wasn't really the case. The family of four was able to get away, but my daughter and I were trapped in the ruckus - luckily, no one bothered us directly. The things my young daughter was forced to witness, however, disturb me to this day. LARGE quantities of sawdust were used to soak up the blood in and around our area, countless people taken away by security (many of them fighting security on the way out), etc.

I remember another incident that happened in Philly in 1992. My wife and I took a trip to Philadelphia and I convinced her to attend a game with me (a chance to hit a park I hadn't yet hit). She had a great time, even though there were rowdy people all around us. No one was attacked personally, it was just a rowdy group and most everything was funny not offensive. That's until the rain started and the seats began to clear. My wife and I chose to tough it out in our seats as the covered areas were already crowded beyond belief anyhow and the game was not yet called. Suddenly, a guy a section over decided it would be good to get naked and run around the stands. If we had kids then and our kids were with us I would've been really pissed off. Because we didn't have kids and my wife found it funny (he had certain shortcomings), I had no problem with it. He was taken away be security, but received a rousing round of applause from those who witnessed his act. I guess it all comes down to context - if I'm with my kids, I'm inclined to feel one way about something that I'll feel differently about if my kids (and others) aren't around.

I have a friend who drops f-bombs in nearly every sentence. If we're in line at the grocery store, he'll think nothing of talking to me as though we're the only two people there. I've asked him more than once to watch his language in front of older women, small children, etc but he rarely does. To him it's not a big deal and people like him will never get why it is a big deal to change your actions based on your surroundings to people like me. When the morons at Fenway Park, Yankee Stadium, or Camden Yards (it doesn't matter where you are) are told to watch their mouths when families are around and they become more beligerent, it makes people choose not to bring their families as often (or at all). This results in fewer families being in the stands and the inhibitions become even less prevalant. The result is that those families or older couples who do attend are surrounded by more and more people who feel that the $30 they spent on a ticket allows them to act however they'd like.

I have zero problem with ball-busting. I hardly ever miss a chance to give a Yankee fan a hard time in a one-on-one situation - usually something stupid but harmless like "did the police ever catch those guys", "what guys?", "the ones that held you down and made you were a Yankees hat" or "were they out of Red Sox gear when you got to the store?" - stuff like that that embarrasses my wife but causes no harm. I would never be so stupid as to do something like that in Yankee Stadium or to a group of drunk Yankee fans anywhere. Anyone who is that stupid almost deserves what they get. Almost. Most of the grief I've gotten from Yankee fans over the years has been of a similar, completely harmless nature.

The behaviors we've all witnessed at sporting events won't change until fewer people tell their wives to "just be quiet, don't make eye contact" and more people stand up to the offenders (in a non-threatening, but serious way). If these jokers only get grief from a couple of people, they've got targets now for the rest of the game. If they are made to feel that the majority of people around them don't want to hear their crap, they might get the message. Sadly, too many people are afraid to say anything because none of us knows how the other guy will react - will he mock me, will he become quiet and remorseful, will he leave, or will he literally attack me? I've asked people to knock it off before when I've seen obviously uncomfortable families in the area, but I also make sure to give the dad in the group a look like "was that really too hard for you to do for your kids?"

I would hope MLB teams would contact people who write to them even if it's just a stock apology letter with no offer of tickets or anything - just something to acknowledge that they're aware of the situation. Not responding to a near rape or some other serious incident - regardless of whether you sign your letter Number One Red Sox Fan in the World or not - is borderline criminal in my opinion.

[Yaz4Ever]

Perhaps instead of directing complaints to the Yankee organization, a letter to MLB would be looked upon more seriously? Just a thought.

That and their sponsors. If the Yankees, Red Sox, etc heard from their sponsors that they needed to do something to protect their customers (and potential customers of the sponsors) or they'd pull their sponsorship, that might help.

[LTF]

Watching the videos Pseu posted makes you bristle, but having been to numerous Sox-Yankee games (regular season and playoffs) at both the Stadium and Fenway (and having been involved in my own, uh . . . confrontations), I can tell you we're just as ugly and unruly.

In Game 4 of the 1999 ALCS, I watched (and yeah, giggled) as Sox fans serenaded two female Yankee fans in our section with non-stop chants of "Knoblauch sucks cock" and "Jeter's a peter eater." When one of the women made a comment about how she would never bring any of her two kids to such a vulgar place as Fenway, the chants changed to "Fat bitch with two kids." And this was all before the "phantom tag" call, when things really got ugly. Conversely, I was at Game 1 of the 2003 ALCS in the Bronx wih Nip and some others, and didn't have a problem.

Obviously, alcohol fuels all of it, but as 86spike said, limit the amount at the park and folks compensate at the neighborhood bars beforehand. Short of an approach akin to what they do in European soccer (visiting fans entering through separate entrances, sitting in separate sections, and sometimes forced to remain at the venue for an allotted time afterwards to avoid the exiting home fans), I really don't know what the solution is.

Edited by LawTown Fool, 22 May 2007 - 11:31 AM.

[8slim]

I'll echo a few other comments that most potentially ugly incidents can be avoided by being the bigger man (or woman) and diffusing things. I've dodged a few possible fights (or at least nasty incidents) by shaking a guy's hand and making some self-depricating (or team-depricating) jokes. Its when both sides get their hackles up and won't back down that confrontations tend to ensue.

Alcohol fuels the aggression, but there is absolutely no way to stop the drinking.

[The Gray Eagle]

I feel threatened by fan behavior at the Boston Symphony nowadays. Just shows that there are so many jerks who don't know how to comport themselves that this sort of thing can break out anywhere.

There are many utter assholes of epic proportions on both sides of the Munson-Nixon line. Things would be improvd if someone would rent out Yankee Stadium and adveritse a special fight-to-the-death cage match between Schilling and Jeter, with free unlimited Budweiser for anyone in attendance. And once the stands were filled with idiots, padlock the doors and let the idiot fans be the ones to fight to their deaths. Leave the place locked up for a year at least. Thin the herd.

[86spike]

the Munson-Nixon line.

Did you just make that up? If so, brilliant!

[LynnRoyalRooter]

2 cents...
I have been to the Toilet about 15-18 times over the last 5-6 years and have sat in the bleachers (mostly with 4+ Sox fans wearing Sox stuff) almost every time. I haven't had many issues, mostly the people yelling at me and stuff like that. However, if I was with kids (I don't have any, but can imagine) this stuff would be over the line I think, but since it's just me and my buddies, it's no big deal.

The only game that was shaky was Game 2 of the 03 ALCS. Me and 1 buddy (Wearing Sox gear) were in the upper deck on the 3rd baseline and by the end of the game we were SOAKED with beer...it was ridiculous that some one would spend 10 dollars on a beer and throw 5 bucks worth on someone. That offends me in more ways than I can count.

Outside the park is like an occupied area with hundreds of cops - NEVER have a problem out there. I can't imagine what it used to be like in the 70s and 80s. That must have been scary to go in there as a Sox fan...or to go there at all to be honest with you.

[sittingstill]

That and their sponsors. If the Yankees, Red Sox, etc heard from their sponsors that they needed to do something to protect their customers (and potential customers of the sponsors) or they'd pull their sponsorship, that might help.

Not entirely the same issue, but when Pedro came back to Fenway as a Met, WEEI (the main sponsor, at least) was handing out signs outside the park that read PAY-DRO. The sponsor advertising on the bottom of the sign was Modell's. I took a sign, folded it up, and sent it to Modell's the next morning with a note that while I expected this kind of crap out of EEI (well, I didn't say it quite that way), I was disappointed that they had also sponsored it--that I thought Red Sox fans were overwhelmingly happy to see him again and that that sort of taunting was meanspirited, out of place and totally unnecessary. I promptly got a very nice note back that may have started as a form letter but was definitely customized, apologizing for a lack of attention to the specifics of the local programs in which they participate with a promise that they would look into it. And $50 in gift certificates. Did my letter have any effect? Darned if I know... but I do know it was read and that I made a point as a consumer.