Training Camp News and Notes

Jed Zeppelin

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I don’t know if my impression of Tate is still consistent with reality but my sense is that he would be great in this offense as a strong route runner with hands. Same reason I’d prefer Sanders over Thomas from Denver. Having been slightly cheated out of the juggernaut receiving corps with which we entered preseason last year, I’d be in favor of some aggression here.
 
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RedOctober3829

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I don’t know if my impression of Tate is still consistent with reality but my sense is that he would be great in this offense as a strong route runner with hands. Same reason I’d prefer Sanders over Thomas from Denver. Having been slightly cheated out of the juggernaut receiving corps with which we entered preseason, I’d be in favor of some aggression here.
They have a first, 2 2nds, and 3 3rds in 2019 so they have the draft capital to make a big trade if they want to.
 

EL Jeffe

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I could also see a Malcom Brown <> Golden Tate swap making sense for both sides. Detroit's depth chart at DT is pretty uninspiring and Patricia obviously has a background with Brown; Tate would be a big upgrade at receiver for the Patriots. With Shelton, Guy, Butler and Valentine, Brown is somewhat expendable.
 

BigSoxFan

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I don’t know if my impression of Tate is still consistent with reality but my sense is that he would be great in this offense as a strong route runner with hands. Same reason I’d prefer Sanders over Thomas from Denver. Having been slightly cheated out of the juggernaut receiving corps with which we entered preseason last year, I’d be in favor of some aggression here.
I think Golden Tate would be perfect in this offense. 90+ catches last 4 years and 1000+ yards in 3 of 4. Incredibly versatile. Just turned 30 so not a long-term play. A 3 WR set of Edelman/Tate/Hogan would be quite nice with Dorsett serving as depth and Patterson getting his gadget plays.

Get it done, Theo.
 

dcmissle

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I spent years wishing to see Anquon Boldin in our uniform. Tate gives me the same vibe.
 

DJnVa

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Golden Tate is awesome and he would dominate as a Patriot. He would fit this team like a glove.
Yeah, I like him too, but I'd like to get him here with some time to run some routes with Brady.

Make it so Bill.
 

RedOctober3829

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TheoShmeo

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Bedard talked to 3 GMs and they all said either sign Dez or trade for Josh Gordon. He then puts this list together of likely candidates in order of impact/likelihood.

--Emmanuel Sanders
--Josh Gordon
--Kevin White
--Brandon Marshall
--Michael Floyd
--Bernard Reedy
--Tommylee Lewis
--Golden Tate

https://www.bostonsportsjournal.com/2018/08/29/hunting-deals-viable-options-patriots-bring-receiver/
Josh Gordon, assuming he stays clean, stands out. If he’s available....
 

BigSoxFan

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Bedard talked to 3 GMs and they all said either sign Dez or trade for Josh Gordon. He then puts this list together of likely candidates in order of impact/likelihood.

--Emmanuel Sanders
--Josh Gordon
--Kevin White
--Brandon Marshall
--Michael Floyd
--Bernard Reedy
--Tommylee Lewis
--Golden Tate

https://www.bostonsportsjournal.com/2018/08/29/hunting-deals-viable-options-patriots-bring-receiver/
Tate, Sanders, or Gordon. Everyone else on that list can go home.
 

dcmissle

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Josh Gordon, assuming he stays clean, stands out. If he’s available....
The three GMs are trolling — or they are stupid.

Let’s see — the poor guy has to back off from training camp because of anxiety issues that put his recovery in peril. In Cleveland, where he (a) knows the offense and (b) has a support group in place.

Welcome to New England kid — here’s the playbook; there’s Tom. Get to it; the opener is in a week.
 

Maximus

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Emmanuel Sanders would be a great add but I don't think Elway would trade him to us.
 

RedOctober3829

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Interesting quotes from Jalen Ramsey on Gronk.

"Earlier this month, Jaguars cornerback Jalen Ramsey gave an interview to GQ where he criticized a number of NFL quarterbacks.

Now, in an interview with ESPN The Magazine, he has tight end Rob Gronkowski in the cross-fire.

“I don’t think Gronk’s good,” Rasmey told Mina Kimes. “Let me say — I don’t think Gronk is as great as people think he is.”

Why does he think that?

“Any time Gronk has been matched up with a corner, he’s had a very bad game, and that corner has had a very good game," Ramsey said."

https://weei.radio.com/blogs/ryan-hannable/jacksonville-jaguars-cornerback-jalen-ramsey-doesnt-think-rob-gronkowski-good
 

Kliq

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Well Jalen Ramsey got cooked by Danny Amendola in the AFC Championship game, so maybe Jalen Ramsey isn't as great as people think he is.
 

joe dokes

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Interesting quotes from Jalen Ramsey on Gronk.

"Earlier this month, Jaguars cornerback Jalen Ramsey gave an interview to GQ where he criticized a number of NFL quarterbacks.

Now, in an interview with ESPN The Magazine, he has tight end Rob Gronkowski in the cross-fire.

“I don’t think Gronk’s good,” Rasmey told Mina Kimes. “Let me say — I don’t think Gronk is as great as people think he is.”

Why does he think that?

“Any time Gronk has been matched up with a corner, he’s had a very bad game, and that corner has had a very good game," Ramsey said."

https://weei.radio.com/blogs/ryan-hannable/jacksonville-jaguars-cornerback-jalen-ramsey-doesnt-think-rob-gronkowski-good
IF this is true (and who knows or who cares), the wide receiver matched up with the not-corner who would have been on Gronk probably had a good game. And if they played several corners, Brady probably switched to a successful running play. That's the thing that observers dont really take into account. If teams triple-cover Gronk AND the WRs and White (yes I know, math) Brady *will* throw to a wide open James Develin 35 straight times. And no one on the team will complain about it.
 

BaseballJones

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Interesting quotes from Jalen Ramsey on Gronk.

"Earlier this month, Jaguars cornerback Jalen Ramsey gave an interview to GQ where he criticized a number of NFL quarterbacks.

Now, in an interview with ESPN The Magazine, he has tight end Rob Gronkowski in the cross-fire.

“I don’t think Gronk’s good,” Rasmey told Mina Kimes. “Let me say — I don’t think Gronk is as great as people think he is.”

Why does he think that?

“Any time Gronk has been matched up with a corner, he’s had a very bad game, and that corner has had a very good game," Ramsey said."

https://weei.radio.com/blogs/ryan-hannable/jacksonville-jaguars-cornerback-jalen-ramsey-doesnt-think-rob-gronkowski-good
Ramsey is tremendous. If they put him on Gronk all the time, fine. That opens up a delicious matchup elsewhere on the field, which I'm sure Brady would be happy to take advantage of.

It's all about TEAM success, Ramsey. Not about individual success.
 

ShaneTrot

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There are 3 positions in football besides QB that are full of divas, WR, DL and CB. I like Ramsey, you need to play that position with extreme confidence or a short memory. But this is bullshit, whenever the Pats really need to score they go to Gronk and he usually delivers, no matter who covers him. Think of these drives: last drive of 2016 AFC championship game, last drive vs Pittsburgh last year, drive coming out of the half in Philly SB.
 

BigSoxFan

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Teams never single cover Gronk with a corner. That corner is also getting safety help so Ramsey's comment is pretty funny. But I love it. We're talking about a guy who was considering retirement a few months ago. I want more of these comments to get Gronk's juices flowing again.
 

RedOctober3829

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Teams never single cover Gronk with a corner. That corner is also getting safety help so Ramsey's comment is pretty funny. But I love it. We're talking about a guy who was considering retirement a few months ago. I want more of these comments to get Gronk's juices flowing again.
When he says that about a corner who the hell could cover him 1-on-1? Revis?
 

PaulinMyrBch

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The only real defense for Gronk in single coverage is illegal holds or picks. If he's singled and not being held, he's a target.
 

Super Nomario

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When he says that about a corner who the hell could cover him 1-on-1? Revis?
I remember Bradley Roby did a good job on Gronk a few years ago.

Ramsey's statements are kind of dumb on their face, but there is some merit to what he's saying; a lot of Gronk's worst games have come with a CB matched up on him. If he had to play a regular WR role, he wouldn't be that good. But he's not a regular WR, he's a TE, and he's awesome. As others have noted, putting a CB on Gronk means sacrificing elsewhere.
 

RedOctober3829

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I remember Bradley Roby did a good job on Gronk a few years ago.

Ramsey's statements are kind of dumb on their face, but there is some merit to what he's saying; a lot of Gronk's worst games have come with a CB matched up on him. If he had to play a regular WR role, he wouldn't be that good. But he's not a regular WR, he's a TE, and he's awesome. As others have noted, putting a CB on Gronk means sacrificing elsewhere.
There's less than a handful of CB's who could handle Gronkowski without any safety help. I seem to remember a lot of Gronk's subpar games were with either a corner or LB and a safety over the top.
 

Super Nomario

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There's less than a handful of CB's who could handle Gronkowski without any safety help. I seem to remember a lot of Gronk's subpar games were with either a corner or LB and a safety over the top.
I don't see this as meaningful a distinction as you do. The Patriots are pretty unusual in their dedication to double-teams. In most standard defenses, you have safety help over the top by definition, at least in the middle of the field where Gronk typically lines up.
 

BigSoxFan

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Source: the Patriots and TE Dwayne Allen have agreed to reworked contract, reducing his compensation for 2018. Allen was previously due $4.5M with a $5M cap number, which will now be lowered.
Probably related to Gronk’s increased figure, no?
 

scottyno

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When he says that about a corner who the hell could cover him 1-on-1? Revis?
Eric Berry in the Chiefs blowout win to start last season was mostly 1 on 1 I Think, though he's a safety (also one of the best of all time which kind of defeats Ramseys point if it takes a super elite guy to do it)
 

Harry Hooper

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This makes a ton of sense for both sides.
Yes, Pats really needed him to play a meaningful role, but they needed him at a lower number.

Eric Berry in the Chiefs blowout win to start last season was mostly 1 on 1 I Think, though he's a safety (also one of the best of all time which kind of defeats Ramseys point if it takes a super elite guy to do it)
The joke is that game's probably exactly what Ramsey had in mind, though not a CB as noted. Even Berry probely benefited from Gronk having had limited preseason game action.
 

Ed Hillel

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Was there a salary cap (or other) benefit to waiting this long? This was always going to be what was going to happen.
Belichick probably wanted to see how Gronk handled camp, after all his juvenile BS prior.
 

BaseballJones

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Eric Berry committed blatant holding for the entire game. If that is allowed, covering Gronk is possible.
Glad I read the whole thread before replying, because you said exactly what I was going to say. They let Berry literally grab Gronk's jersey on every single play and called nothing. So yeah, if the refs are going to allow players to do that, lots of guys can cover Gronk one-on-one.