Now that Buch is gone, is there any obvious replacement on the 40-man roster? Doesn't look like much of a roster crunch at this point.
Too Much Pitching? The 2017 40-man Crunch
- Thread starter Buzzkill Pauley
- Start date
So, yeah. I guess the Sox FO also thought they had too much pitching without options.
However, even without Buchholz, the 40-man roster still has one too many pitchers without options, who will either need to make the team out of Spring Training risk getting picked up by other teams when they get the old DFA.
Although, with the offloading of Buchholz, the Sox can now pretty easily rationalize their 25-man and 40-man rosters by trading one of Abad or Elias, DFAing Brentz, and optioning EdRo.
I think stashing EdRo in AAA should be considered as a necessary but unpopular move to provide the Sox with one high-quality arm to call up for the inevitable injury. Owens and Johnson are relatively unlikely to be that arm.
SP:
1. Sale
2. Porcello
3. Price
4. Wright
5. Pomeranz
RP:
6. Kimbrel
7. Thornburg
8. Kelly
9. Ross
10. Barnes
11. Elias/Abad
12. Hembree
C:
13. Leon
14. Vazquez
IF:
15. H. Ramirez
16. Sandoval
17. Pedroia
18. Moreland
19. Bogaerts
20. Rutledge
OF:
21. Betts
22. Bradley
23. Benintendi
24. Young
25. Holt
DL:
26. Smith
27. Workman
AAA:
28. Rodriguez
29. Owens
30. Johnson
31. N. Ramirez
32. Scott
33. Martin
34. Ysla
35. Swihart
36. Hernandez
37. Marrero
That'd still be only 16 position players, but against a mere 21 pitchers, and with +3 40-man spots to try finding a diamond in the rough that can be polished in Pawtucket.
It's a much more balanced roster today than when I started the thread, with room for a savvy pickup or two still to come.
Unless he's pitching poorly, Rodriguez is on the MLB roster and likely starting. Wright or Pom is in the pen. Yeah, we could lose another BP arm if we can't cut a trade in ST.
For SP depth, whichever of Pom or Wright doesn't make it, he's the long man waiting in the wings to start. They'll likely sign a guy to a nonguaranteed/mL deal for depth. Someone like Kris Medlen. Give him a 5/1 opt-out if he's not on the MLB roster by then. That hedges against an early season injury and buys time to see how guys are pitching.
For SP depth, whichever of Pom or Wright doesn't make it, he's the long man waiting in the wings to start. They'll likely sign a guy to a nonguaranteed/mL deal for depth. Someone like Kris Medlen. Give him a 5/1 opt-out if he's not on the MLB roster by then. That hedges against an early season injury and buys time to see how guys are pitching.
I expected disagreement on Rodriguez, who I would expect in the MLB rotation, in a vacuum.
But I don't think EdRo was anywhere near consistent enough with his slider last season to be a lock over two very worthy 2016 all-stars, and to send one to the pen.
Nor do I think it's as easy and seamless to convert a bullpen arm to a starter on-the-fly as it is to call up someone on a 5-day schedule already.
But reasonable minds can disagree on these points. And I'd say the Sox are now at a reasonable level of starting pitching surplus to head into Ft Myers.
But I don't think EdRo was anywhere near consistent enough with his slider last season to be a lock over two very worthy 2016 all-stars, and to send one to the pen.
Nor do I think it's as easy and seamless to convert a bullpen arm to a starter on-the-fly as it is to call up someone on a 5-day schedule already.
But reasonable minds can disagree on these points. And I'd say the Sox are now at a reasonable level of starting pitching surplus to head into Ft Myers.
I guess people will have to find something else to grouse about now, haha
I think Dombrowski's specific mention of having flexibility for in-season moves kind of means that was always his goal and Encarnación was an extreme long shot all along. I think Encarnación goes elsewhere, even if it means waiting for a spring training injury or for the Marlins to go all Marlins and throw a terrible contract at him.
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IDK, DD also was fairly specific in projecting what he saw his off season shopping list being...then went out and completely flipped last off-season's "predictable straight shooter" script by trading for Sale. I think if the Sale trade never happens he also just doesn't jump on Moreland so fast, and we are probably then left sitting here speculating the hell out of the developing EE situation right about now.
I'm just relieved I was right that he wouldn't get all cutesy with Buchholz and instead made the safe/conservative decision to move him early. Obsessing over depth is fine and all, but sometimes you really have to keep the bigger picture in focus while doing that. At least now if/when our 5-9 guys in the lineup are all OPS'ing sub-.800 next year I'll be able to look at EE's .900+ and not kick myself in the butt when I think about how else we spent that money this winter.
He was never going to sign EE and the Sale trade really had no impact on that. He's not giving up the draft pick and bonus pool money. It's that simple. If it wasn't Sale, he'd have gone after Quintana or someone else.
As to having an optionable SP in AAA, they can still make a small trade for another arm, they can sign an ML FA to a minor league deal (Tyson Ross for example) or they can just exploit the advantage of Wright being the one sent to the pen, as he doesn't need to be stretched out for a spot start or two like a normal SP would. There's plenty of arms out there if they decide they need a stopgap.
As to having an optionable SP in AAA, they can still make a small trade for another arm, they can sign an ML FA to a minor league deal (Tyson Ross for example) or they can just exploit the advantage of Wright being the one sent to the pen, as he doesn't need to be stretched out for a spot start or two like a normal SP would. There's plenty of arms out there if they decide they need a stopgap.
Heyman said today up to 20 teams are interested in Ross, and rumors are going around he has already committed to the Cubs, FWIW.
Jon HeymanVerified account @JonHeyman 8h8 hours ago
Cubs, rangers, Indians, padres, pirates among 20 or so teams showing interest in Tyson Ross. Report suggests he visited Chi
Sean Sears @sean_sears6 13h13 hours ago
I'm hearing a deal with the #Cubs and FA Tyson Ross could possibly be done already. Medical likely the hold up, but can't confirm that yet
He's at 1.130 ...... I know people think the 0 after the decimal place doesn't matter, but when it comes to service time it does. This means he has 1 year and 130 days. A full season is 172 days, so he would need to be on the major league roster for less than 42 days to control him for another year.
Ya - I'm 99% sure Edro is on the roster opening day. He had one start at 5er or more out of his last 12 - though a short stinker against the Yankees was also in there. His 2nd half was better than Price' and way better than Pomeranz'. He appeared "fixed."
Rodriguez - 3.49 FIP 3.24 ERA, 1.13 WHIP, and his k-rate improved from 15% to 25%.
Price - 3.86 FIP, 3.50 ERA, 1.22 WHIP.
Pomeranz - 4.78 FIP, 4.56 ERA, 1.37 WHIP.
Matt Barnes still has options, Elias is a non-factor and it's much more likely one of Abad and Hembree get moved. DD has built this team to win now and they are almost certainly going keep their 12 best pitchers up rather than futzing around over service time. There is very little history of them stashing guys to save money down the line when they are clearly deserving of a spot. Especially a playoff caliber team. I can see it if you're the Phillies or Braves.
Wright can be the Aceves type swing guy with a chance for a permanent spot if E-dro reverts to his first half performance level.
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A few weeks or more in AAA, however, would mean that Rodriguez isn't right at the usual borderline for super-2 arbitration status in 2018 (2.122 in 2013, 2.133 in 2014, 2.140 in 2015, 2.130 in 2016).
Not that I believe that fact should be a major factor of consideration. However, the reality is that there are three CY caliber pitchers ahead of him, two 2016 All-Stars competing with him for the last two rotation spots, and no one very likely to even put up a reasonably good MLB spot start above GCL/low-A.
I don't think it's a foregone conclusion, and I'm not suggesting the Sox have committed to any course of action except to dump Clay's salary. Sure, the talent is clearly there for EdRo to be an excellent pitcher. However, sending him to AAA still needs to be among the possibilities considered in the spring training competition.
I really don't think it's as easy for Wright to bounce back and forth from the bullpen as others do. He throws his mid-80s fastball with a greater frequency than a guy like Wakefield, and now has a history of shoulder injury, too. I guess that's why I'm of a different opinion about the marginal benefits of sending him to the pen.