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The Celtics' 2nd-round draft picks

Discussion in 'Mark Blount's Port Cellar: Celtics Forum' started by amfox1, May 17, 2017.

  1. amfox1

    amfox1 Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Assuming Fultz is picked #1, and assuming no trades before the draft, I would think the Celtics would be focused on the following players in the 2nd round:

    37. One of the rebounders should fall here from among Kyle Kuzma, Ivan Rabb, Jordan Bell, Ike Anigbogu, Johnathan Motley, Cam Oliver and Caleb Swanigan. Given the roster construction, this player has a shot at being on the 15-man roster.

    53/56. Hard to say, but with the new "two-way contracts" for the developmental league, I'd expect both picks to be ticketed there. Guys I like at that spot: Jonathan Jeanne, Frank Mason III, Wesley Iwandu, any of the players listed as possibilities at 37.
     
  2. bosox79

    bosox79 Member SoSH Member

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    I'd guess almost any 2nd rounder would be a guy they could stash overseas. Barring that, they will probably trade the picks for future 2nd rounder or cash.

    With Yabu, Zizic, Fultz and Jaylen, they have enough young developing guys.
     
  3. JakeRae

    JakeRae Member SoSH Member

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    I think this is pretty accurate. A lot depends on their approach in FA. If they go all in for a max contract, they aren't going to be able to add much else. So, while they are going to have a lot of youth flowing into the team, those guys need minutes, so I'm not sure how much interest they'll draw from the vets.

    My one disagreement with your post is that I strongly believe that if Jeanne drops to 37, he is a must draft there. I don't expect him to though. Depending on the way the draft is shaping up, I could also see them drafting someone like Thornwell at 37 and hoping one of the group you name drops to the 50's. Draft Express has us drafting Cam Oliver at 53 right now. I think that's low for him, but would be thrilled with the pick as he's one of the second round bigs with NBA range. (I hate Lessort for this same reason, most of the other guys, like Bell and Motley, can at least make FT at a respectable rate.)
     
  4. Sprowl

    Sprowl gentleman, scholar, slumpbuster and glutton Dope

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    Split from the omnibus 2017 draft thread

    ***

    Ainge went for the Eurostashes in 2016 to soak up the Celtics' excess of low-value first-round draft picks. Can 2nd rounders be Eurostashed?
     
  5. Eddie Jurak

    Eddie Jurak Go Leafs Go Lifetime Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    On the Ringer's High Upside podcast, Kevin O'Connor named Jeanne as "guy most likely to be a surprise lottery pick".
     
  6. Big John

    Big John lurker

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    Well, yes. Marcus Thornton was stashed in Australia, Semih Erden was stashed and so was Colton Iverson. And that's just the Celtics.
     
  7. chilidawg

    chilidawg Member SoSH Member

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    There doesn't seem to be a lot of Europeans in the second round mix available as stashes. Lessort looks to be the best bet at 37, and looks like an intriguing guy, a little taller version of Yabusele, maybe with a less polished outside game. I like Motley in that range too, although the latest DE mock has him dropping to late in the 2nd round.
     
  8. nighthob

    nighthob lurker

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    The reason for stashing/dealing off #2s last year was the roster crunch. One of the guys they drafted had to be cut as there just wasn't room for him on the final 15.

    Next year the rosters expand to 17 and Boston is going to be clearing out all the non-guaranteed guys and probably trading some of the rostered guys to create room for a max free agent signing. So there's going to be room for the second rounders if Ainge thinks the players available will develop in the G-League.
     
  9. bosox79

    bosox79 Member SoSH Member

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    17 man roster changes everything. Does that factor into the cap somehow too though? 2 more league minimum contracts?
     
  10. Lose Remerswaal

    Lose Remerswaal Leaves after the 8th inning Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    17 man roster would be a huge change. I know it was under discussion--did it go into effect? I couldn't find it on a quick search.
     
  11. HomeRunBaker

    HomeRunBaker bet squelcher SoSH Member

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    In todays day and age the 37th pick will receive a multi-year guaranteed deal with some team option years on the end. This has been the trend leading up to last year and is now the norm. This player will either be a stash or will be on the 15-man roster next season.....those guys don't get cut like they did back when teams had 12 and 13 man rosters.

    I'd got Alec Peters, Josh Hart, and Swanigan as the guy at 37. I expect most that you list above will be gone by then. PJ Dozier is going to play and play well in this league but I expect us to go for experienced size at this spot like Peters or Swanigan.

    53/56 - These are the two-way guys or in other words......players who will likely never play in a meaningful game for the Celtics. Jeanne is on your list here but I don't even see him being around at 37 (or else he's my guy there) as I have him going around 20-25. No need to even discuss guys here imo as we could rattle off 20 guys who will be like Abdel Nader and Marcus Thornton, the William & Mary version. One name I will mention here is former Providence and Oregon recruit Brandon Austin, a 6-6 combo guard with a sweet shot who had lottery potential coming out of HS before two sexual misconduct claims got him booted from both schools. He was never charged with a crime. Austin is an ideal two-way contract guy for somebody.
     
    #11 HomeRunBaker, May 18, 2017
    Last edited: May 19, 2017
  12. wade boggs chicken dinner

    wade boggs chicken dinner Member SoSH Member

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    3 and D guys are so valuable these days and seem like they should be relatively easyto scout, I'm surprised more teams don't just draft those guys after pick 20 or so.

    Speaking of whom, but Devin Robinson sounds like he's going to be a longtime 3 & D guy at worse. http://www.nba.com/article/2017/05/19/florida-devin-robinson-strengthens-defense-help-nba-stock/. Insane measurables (6'8" with 7'0" wingspan; 40+" vertical leap; committed to defense; improved on shooting every year), he sounds like a guy to target in R2.
     
  13. nighthob

    nighthob lurker

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    Has he gotten over his predilection for group sex yet?
     
  14. jhp64

    jhp64 Well-Known Member Silver Supporter SoSH Member

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    Maybe they could make it a three-way contract, then.
     
  15. HomeRunBaker

    HomeRunBaker bet squelcher SoSH Member

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    So what you're saying is he'll be a perfect fit for the Knicks?
     
  16. nighthob

    nighthob lurker

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    Is there any player that could use D-Rose's mentoring more?

    On a serious note, I'm expecting the centers (the ones with actual potential anyway) to be gone by 37, so I have two lists of guys that I would be looking at for the second round.

    The forwards that I see out there that could be solid rotation pieces when the Dead President era finally ends are D.J. Wilson, Thomas Bryant, Caleb Swanigan, Jordan Bell, and Cam Oliver (admittedly he's a binky of mine, I think he'll eventually turn into a solid NBA starter). Those guys are all going in the 25-40 range

    Guys that I think are intriguing, but don't really do a lot for me; Alec Peters, John Motley, Tony Bradley. Those guys are all going to be in that same range, but I'd prefer not to see them in Boston as I think they're more likely to be the next Jordan Mickey than the next Jae Crowder.

    In the perimeter player category, the guys I really like in the second round are Josh Hart (I think he's going to be this draft's Courtney Lee, the SG that ends up with a 12 year career as a solid NBA player), P.J. Dozier (I really like him, and I think he'd make hay in Philly), Dillon Brooks (single position player, but man the flopwork is just so much fun to watch), Sindarius Thornwell (pure 3 & D SG, but he'll be good at it), and Dwayne Bacon (if he could shoot at all, he'd be a lottery pick, whoever gets him needs to hire a coach to break down his form and make him relearn to shoot).
     
  17. Eddie Jurak

    Eddie Jurak Go Leafs Go Lifetime Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    How abotu a slightly different question - is there a guy who will go in the mid to late first round who the Celtics should try to acquire a pick for? They certainly have the assets to do this.
     
  18. nighthob

    nighthob lurker

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    You mean the 12-20 range or so? I kind of see that as this draft's weak spot, which is to say that if you're tiering it off as

    1. Potential top 10 players
    2. Potential All Stars
    3. Potential quality starters
    4. Roleplayers (i.e. top eight rotation guys)
    5. Wild cards/depth charges
    Then the midle of round one is where you hit tier 4. But for injury reasons OG Anunoby probably falls into that 12-20 range, as do guys like Donavan Mitchell. I think SU's Tyler Lydon probably goes in the 15-25 range, and he's one player I'd consider using an asset on as a Kelly Olynyk replacement.
     
  19. chilidawg

    chilidawg Member SoSH Member

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    That's funny because I keep seeing great value in the mid first big men available. One of Allen, Collins, Adebayo, Anibogu, or Hartenstein would be great to pair with Zizic moving forward.

    Along the same vein, DE has workout videos of Adebayo and Anibogu up. Two guys with similar size and athleticism, although Anibogu has a longer wingspan and reach. Adebayo surprised me with his fluid ball handling and shooting, which I didn't see at all during the college season.
     
  20. nighthob

    nighthob lurker

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    I should probably have been clearer, I think the fourth tier starts in the 13-15 range, so your odds of finding a diamond in the rough are as good at 40 as 15, and those guys drafted in the mid first are going to be long term projects.

    I do like Wake Forest's John Collins, though. I think he's going to end up being a decent NBA starter on his second deal.
     
  21. Eddie Jurak

    Eddie Jurak Go Leafs Go Lifetime Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    I wouls assume that, were the Celtics inclined to deal into the latter half od round 1, they would do it with a specific player in mind, in a draft day deal (like their deal with Phoenix to get Rondo). So it wouldn't be about the overall strength of the draft, necessarily, so much as whether a specific guy is there.
     
  22. HomeRunBaker

    HomeRunBaker bet squelcher SoSH Member

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    I'm not sure I agree with this. You'll have all the foreign guys like Hartenstein, Lessort, Ferguson, and my binkies Jeanne and Pasecniks all selected before 40. That doesn't even account for the Patton's and Diallo's, the latter of whom has already worked out for the Celtics after posting a vertical 3" higher than Zach LaVine along with a 7-foot wingspan for a 2-guard. (Someone earlier mentioned about Diallo the kid who didn't play for Kentucky this year......he's really intriguing)

    I love Calipari's advice he gives to his kids.....straight from the heart based on his experiences like when he told Cauley-Stein he was crazy to return to UK for a 3rd season. His quote regarding Diallo, “They don’t know (how you play). Well, don’t show them,” Calipari said. “They all like you without watching you. Good. The more you don’t play, the more they like you, the more they’re impressed.”
     
  23. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    Ham Diallo is really intriguing, but I really think he'll go in the bottom of the 1st round if he stays in the draft. I don't think he should stay in. He should go back to Kentucky, play this season, and be a top-10 pick. Of course if he stays in he'll be a year closer to his 2nd contract.
     
  24. HomeRunBaker

    HomeRunBaker bet squelcher SoSH Member

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    What if he doesn't mature quickly as a player similar to Gerald Green though? Had Green struggled in college for a year or two he's a mid-2nd rounder at best had he not shown any growth. Look how far Harry Giles stock has fallen after not getting run in college due to his suckitude. If Diallo can get a guarantee in the 1st or even the 2nd now that these guys get guaranteed money on multi-year deals he could be an ideal "two-way" player for someone without taking up a 15-man roster spot. His physicals are ridiculous and he's a NYC kid so you know he isn't soft. Perfect example of a kid needed to be in a Spurs or Celtics organization as opposed to a Kings or Nets. Fit is ultra important to his future.
     
  25. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    Harry Giles didn't drop because he stunk. His knees are made of glass. He torn his ACL, MCL, and meniscus in his left knee 4 years ago, tore the ACL in his right knee right before his senior year of HS, and had another knee surgery just before this season.

    Diallo had a knee injury this year but it wasn't serious. He would benefit from another year in a college weight program and playing for Calipari before he enters the NBA.
     
  26. Kliq

    Kliq Member SoSH Member

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    I know everyone wants to swing for the fences with second round picks so you take raw athletes or European teenagers to stash overseas. I look at it the opposite way and see guys that played for three or four years in college that were really good. Draymond is the prime example but guys like Malcom Brogdan, Yogi, etc. who slip only because of their age but turn out to be contributing players. Of course, the Cs have a deep roster of contributing players and are better off probably stashing those guys.
     
  27. nighthob

    nighthob lurker

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    Sure, if what you want is a really raw Eurocenter then you probably need to trade into the bottom third of the first round. But here's the thing, if they all end up going in the first then there are other raw players that are still going to be there in the second.

    The larger point is that the fourth tier starts at the end of the lottery, and that early range is where you end up with the James Youngs of the NBA.
     
  28. HomeRunBaker

    HomeRunBaker bet squelcher SoSH Member

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    Sure there were reasons for Giles to stink.....but he did stink when he played which is why his stock is dropping. If he didn't return to play for Duke he'd go much much higher. OG Anunoby is an example of teams presuming an ACL will result in a full recovery and his stock may have gone UP since being injured. When you show your flaws on the court is when you drop.....otherwise as Cal states about Diallo, teams remain mesmerized by what they think you are capable of doing.

    Maybe Diallo would benefit.....or maybe his flaws would show and he wouldn't get minutes. If it is the latter than his stock will drop. It all depends on what guarantees he can get following his workouts.
     
  29. finnVT

    finnVT Member SoSH Member

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    I love Sindarius Thornwell in the 2nd, although given SC's run in the tourney this year he's shot way up some mocks. If the C's end up moving AB (or another guard) to make room for a FA, I'd love to add him to the back of the guard rotation. He killed it in all the categories you'd look at with a guard-- .395 3pt%, 83% FT, 2.1 stl/game, 1.0 blk/game, 7.2 rb/game, 21+ pts/game, >8 FTA/game. Good shooting, good defense, well rounded game. Granted playing as a SR, but in a major conference he still outperformed just about every other senior guard.

    I've made this point before, but statistically, he had one of the more remarkable seasons in recent NCAA history this year, in terms of impressive stats across a wide range of categories. Since 2000, only 7 players have had a season with 38%+ 3pt, 80%+ FT shooting, 1.8+ stl/game and 0.9+ blk/game. The only other one to do it from a major conference was Durant in 06-07, though of course he did it as a Freshman. You can play with the cutoffs to get more or fewer players included, but any way you slice it, it was a pretty incredible season.
     
  30. wade boggs chicken dinner

    wade boggs chicken dinner Member SoSH Member

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    Interesting story on Chris Boucher here: he's the guy from OR that tore up his knee in the Pac-12 semifinals. Apparently, five years ago he was working fast food in Montréal. He's 6'8-ish, maybe 175 pounds but has a 7'4'' wingspan and a really high motor. Plus, he is apparently just the third major-conference player of this decade to average at least 17 points, 10 rebounds and 4 blocks per 40 minutes with an offensive efficiency rating of at least 120. - the other two players being Anthony Davis and Karl-Anthony Towns.

    Averaging 2.7 blocks in just 24.8 minutes a game while shooting 34% from 3P land should be enticing to some team in the second round.
     
  31. benhogan

    benhogan self-effacing SoSH Member

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    Any cares in talking about 2nd round interest?

    Josh Hart and Sindarius Thornwell are my Malcolm Brogdon sleepers.

    and Bigs later on:
    Bryant
    Kaba (stash)
    Brimah - shot blocking wizard
    Kornet - 3pt shooting 7 footer

    Any other guys projected in the 2nd round that could be something down the road?

    I like the idea of a defensive big that we could use for 5-10 minutes a night to pound the other teams center (Brimah) or a 7 footer that can spread the floor like Kornet that would give us 5-10 mins a night?
     
    #31 benhogan, Jun 20, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2017
  32. Kid T

    Kid T Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    2nd round Sleeper (just from listening to podcasts and reading draftniks opine on sleepers:


    Harry Giles - many have him going somewhere in the middle of the 1st due to his potential, but he was not very good last year and has a history of injury problems. He is going to be a gamble no matter where he is picked and has huge bust potential.

    Jordan Bell - Not really an offensive threat, but more of an active guy who is like a Tristan Thompson type who rebounds and plays good defense without whining for touches

    Jonah Bolden - a 3-and-D guy

    Nik Slavika - A serb who might be a good draft-and-stash guy
     
  33. MarkBT

    MarkBT lurker

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    I like a lot of the names mentioned already - Jordan Bell, Ivan Rabb, Caleb Swanigan, Josh Hart - so let me add a few more.

    Btw, I fully expect DA to take a draft-and-stasher... but it would also be nice to improve the depth with someone who can be useful in Portland and Boston (as needed) a la Demetrius Jackson and Abdul Nader. Won't pretend I have any Europeans to suggest, so here's a few NCAAers I was impressed with that project in Round 2:

    Tyler Lydon, F, Syracuse - Good size and decent rebounder at Syracuse. Will not be much of an NBA defender.. but he has one elite skill that will keep him in the league: 3 pt shooting

    Jawun Evans, G, OK State - I'm convinced he becomes a valuable, pace-changing backup guard. Not a great shooter (yet) from range, but can get to the paint at will and makes plays. Aggressive leading the fast break

    VJ Beachem, F, Notre Dame - Versatile, athletic wing, who easily fits as a 3 and D reserve player. Saw a lot of ACC action this year, and Beachem stood out. I admire Mike Brey's program, and know this guy has been coached really well over his four years
     
  34. Minneapolis Millers

    Minneapolis Millers Member SoSH Member

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    As a Michigan fan, I loved Derrick Walton. Excellent shooter and distributor. Undersized, but bigger than IT4! Worth a late 2d round flyer.
     
  35. MillarTime

    MillarTime lurker

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    Love me some Josh Hart. Think he's a rotation guy from Day 1.
     
  36. HomeRunBaker

    HomeRunBaker bet squelcher SoSH Member

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    I don't expect Lydon to be available at 37. My guy is Alec Peters out of Valpo. He was one of the countries best offensive players last year. A knockdown 3-point shooting stretch-4 who got to the line 7.5/40 and he's complete with Olynyk's wingspan to replace him off the bench.

    He's my 2nd round Caris LeVert and Spencer Dinwiddie of this draft. Guys who were surefire 1st rounders who due to injuries couldn't workout for teams in full. Great value here for a guy who when healthy is a 1st rounder and an NBA player.
     
  37. Big John

    Big John lurker

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    One guy who hasn't been mentioned is Aleksandar Vezenkov, the lefty from Bulgaria. Very quick release and great range on his shot. Rest of his game is blah, but so is Korver's.
     
  38. Cellar-Door

    Cellar-Door Member SoSH Member

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    An idea that Giovny at draft express had for San Antonio @59 would make sense for Celtics w/ one of their picks in the 50s.



    Jonathan Jeanne is still draft eligible, why not take his rights in case he like Austin eventually can return to basketball?
     
  39. JakeRae

    JakeRae Member SoSH Member

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    Cameron Oliver and Sindarius Thornwell are toward the top of my list. Oliver is one of the only 2nd round bigs with a real 3 point shot and a solid FT%. Thornwell has one of the highest steal rates in this draft class. I also like Frank Jackson and Tony Bradley as guys who might still be there at 37. Spending one of the picks in the 50s on Jeanne is an interesting idea and I wouldn't be opposed to it.
     
  40. Sprowl

    Sprowl gentleman, scholar, slumpbuster and glutton Dope

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    Eurostash update:

    Tankathon's mock draft has moved Anžejs Pasečņiks into the first round, as HRB expected. Mattias Lessort climbs to 34, out of the Celtics' reach at 37. Jonah Bolden (43), Vezenkov (49), and Alpha Kaba (52) might fall to the Celtics at 53 or 56.

    A rebounder, a 3-and-D guy (Devin Robinson?), and a stash would be a decent haul for the second round picks. Ideally, of course, they end up as throw-ins in a more consequential trade.
     

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