You of all people know the appeal of an undefeated record.Marciano490 said:
I'd pick Mayweather over Pacman.
So, uh, Brady... IS THE GREATEST QB OF ALL TIME NOT EVEN CLOSE SCREW YOU MONTANA
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I'd pick Mayweather over Pacman.
Kenny F'ing Powers said:
On this site of all places, with all the discussion of park and league factors, etc., I'd think we'd realize that Manny's record of 57-5-2 against the likes of Morales, Margarito, Barrera, and prime Marquez is more impressive than Mayweather's undefeated record against old Oscar, Hatton, old Mosley, etc.
ALiveH said:
If he retired tomorrow he would definitely be a top 5 all time NBA'er. 4 MVP's is behind only Kareem, Bill Russell, Wilt Chamberlain, and Jordan. 2 Championships and 4 finals trips, winning Finals MVP for each victory. 8 all NBA first team selections, the leader has 11.
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This whole page of comments could probably be its own P&G or General Sports thread.
The inclusions of Mia Hamm and Brett Favre are farcical. Derek Jeter is far too high, Lionel Messi far too low. The exclusion of other top MLB stars (Bonds #19, Jeter #10, and... that's it?). And the long list of stars in every sport that they should have included but didn't. Frankly, I'm amazed they found room for 2 tennis players, since ESPN doesn't broadcast the grand slams.
I did like that they included Armstrong and Bonds. Those things they did all happened, and everyone watched.
The inclusions of Mia Hamm and Brett Favre are farcical. Derek Jeter is far too high, Lionel Messi far too low. The exclusion of other top MLB stars (Bonds #19, Jeter #10, and... that's it?). And the long list of stars in every sport that they should have included but didn't. Frankly, I'm amazed they found room for 2 tennis players, since ESPN doesn't broadcast the grand slams.
I did like that they included Armstrong and Bonds. Those things they did all happened, and everyone watched.
You can only beat the man they put in front of you. Marciano gets dogged because he didn't beat any headliners either, but he still won all his fights.Marciano490 said:
Manny's slate of matches is more impressive than Floyd's, but Floyd took care of business and most fights were never that close.
Do you think Mayweather should have bounced around more weight classes to find a tougher opponent?
Edit: my "you of all people" line was directed at your username, not you.
No I got that, 49-0 and all! I love Marciano but his resume makes it tough to claim him as the GOAT. Luckily, the Manny-Floyd debate will be resolved in 29 days.Kenny F'ing Powers said:
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The 1999 team? Sure. But her career body of work wasn't exactly an object of consistent public spectacle, admiration and widespread coverage. If they just needed a 2nd woman to put on the list with Serena, they could have gone with Venus, or Sue Bird or Diana Taurasi or something.
Just playing devil's advocate: that team, and Mia Hamm in particular, launched women's/girls' soccer in the United States into the stratosphere. She may have a larger tangible impact on youth athletics than anybody else on that list, which is as good a measure of importance as any. Also, that influence is still felt today as girls who grew up idolizing Hamm are winning medals for the U.S. Team.
It's not a great argument, but it's not egregiously wrong. I agree that the team is more deserving of acclaim than Hamm as an individual, though.
It's not a great argument, but it's not egregiously wrong. I agree that the team is more deserving of acclaim than Hamm as an individual, though.
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I know little of boxing; how representative will this fight be of their true boxing abilities since they are 36 and 38 years old respectively. Aka I assume neither is at their peak anymore.Marciano490 said:
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you might want to look at the Manny-Floyd thread in General Sports, rather than the Tom Brady thread.McBride11 said:
You're missing out, come join in. But to answer your question in a way relevant to this thread, how old is SB MVP Tom Brady? Manny and Floyd are still the top two fighters in the game right now.McBride11 said:
Meh. Comparing players across eras is incredibly difficult in soccer so these questions are irresolvable. But the game is so much faster and more tactically sophisticated now that I'm pretty comfortable saying Lionel Messi is the greatest soccer player who ever lived. If Cruyff or Maradona or Di Stefano or whoever had played in this era, they might have been just as good or better. But they didn't.Eric1984 said:
Messi definitely has an argument for GOAT, and LOL at putting George Best ahead of him.Eric1984 said:
I'll concede Best and say there's a good argument to put him ahead of Beckenbauer and Cruyff (though I don't see it). But how would you argue that he's better than Pele and Maradona? He's had incredible club success but he's never won a World Cup. And you can't hold it against Pele that he never got to play club football in Europe -- his government wouldn't allow it.
Maradona at his peak was as good or better than anybody but he squandered a lot of his talent. Pele is an iconic figure known largely for 15-20 World Cup games who played 99% of his professional career against relatively poor competition in Brazil.Eric1984 said:
Messi is still in the middle of his career so it's probably best to say that he is on course to be the GOAT. He's been the most dominant player in the world for seven years now while playing at the very highest levels during an era in which the players and tactics are better than ever before. His peak is already longer than Maradona's. Again, maybe a guy like Pele would have been even better than Messi if he was a young kid playing today who started his career at Barcelona. But he didn't. The game is just faster, smarter, and better now. If you're choosing teams in a hypothetical pickup game where you can pick Pele from 1962 or a Messi from 2012, only a fool picks Pele.
Edit: And winning the World Cup is an awful criterion for GOAT. It may be the most prestigious tournament but it is not the highest level of play or even close. Plus every player gets 2-3 chances and a huge amount just depends on luck - the quality of their team, their coaches (ahem, Maradona), and the luck of the game. If Rodrigo Palacio could finish, Messi might be world champion.
Poor competition in Brazil? The brazilian national team dominated international soccer between 1958-1970 using only players who were active in the domestic league. Brazilian football, up until the mid-80's when the exodus to Europe began, could go head to head with any international league. That's a bad argument against Pelé.
Eric1984 said:
Maybe so, but we'll never know. If Johnny Unitas was born in 1980, would he have been the GOAT QB? If Bill Tilden was born in 1985, would he have been better than Federer and Nadal?
rodderick said:
OK, to say "poor competition" is probably unfair. But the competition in any domestic league like that is going to be hugely weaker than the competition in one of the better European leagues from the 1980s onward that draws players from all over.
You guys can argue over whether Messi is better than Pele or Maradona, but I have to ask: Did any of them take their teams to 6 Super Bowls? No? Point: Brady!
Soccer is the most popular sport in the world. Brazil dominates soccer. Gisele is Brazil's most popular person. She thinks Tom Brady is the best.
Do the math, bitches.
Do the math, bitches.
I'm certainly no mod, but shouldn't this conversation about people who play kick the ball back and forth be somewhere else. This is a conversation about THE ONLY GOAT. The argument for greatest "Footballer", fashion icon, goat cuddler, sex machine ends with TB12.
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1918stabbedbyfoulke said:
I have a feeling that if the mods wanted to break out the stuff starting at the top of page 18, they'd have done so already. In the meantime, the rest of us are just shooting the shit, wherever it lands.
O EM GEE:
New England Patriots @Patriots · 1h 1 hour ago
Check this out - Brady & @45PedroMartinez just did a little batting practice at Fenway:
https://twitter.com/Patriots/status/587700187839275009
New England Patriots @Patriots · 1h 1 hour ago
Check this out - Brady & @45PedroMartinez just did a little batting practice at Fenway:
https://twitter.com/Patriots/status/587700187839275009
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Guys, I think something's wrong with Brady's arm.
Hold me.
(guessing he took one for the team - I wouldn't have wanted to see Kraft throw that)
Hold me.
(guessing he took one for the team - I wouldn't have wanted to see Kraft throw that)
MentalDisabldLst said:
I think he's fine. He just felt pressure coming from the defense because the offensive line and playcalling is so bad. Effing McDaniels.
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