Kimbrel knee surgery

DaveRoberts'Shoes

Aaron Burr
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How long was Tek out with his meniscus tear?
Much different scenario, too - catchers have to go into a deep squat a couple hundred times a game and that's literally the last thing you're comfortable with after a knee scope, so if his recovery was on the longer side I wouldn't be at all surprised
 

Sandy Leon Trotsky

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So Ziegler is in... Gotta hope Kelly really finally gets it together as that 2 inning guy and Clay steps up in the pen
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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Much different scenario, too - catchers have to go into a deep squat a couple hundred times a game and that's literally the last thing you're comfortable with after a knee scope, so if his recovery was on the longer side I wouldn't be at all surprised
Spoiler alert! They actually find Dory.

Now make with the diagnosis. We all need to get on with our lives.
 

smastroyin

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I'm not sure what you guys are worried about, Eduardo Rodriguez came back from his knee thing perfectly fine...
 

DaveRoberts'Shoes

Aaron Burr
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To the question at hand, however...

It's entirely feasible that Kimbrel tore this shagging balls or whatever - it's not usually some huge trauma that results in a torn meniscus. Some patients (usually older) can't remember one discrete incident, so I don't think there's anything nefarious in terms of how this was reported. As for the surgery/recovery- it's the single most common orthopedic procedure that's performed (knee arthroscopy with partial meniscectomy, CPT code 29881 if you were wondering), and the vast majority of patients have a pretty smooth, predictable recovery. I'd estimate Kimbrel's return would be closer to 6 weeks than three - his return will be determined by his comfort with that knee when he lands during his delivery and his comfort with fielding. Long-term, tearing your meniscus does increase the risk of arthritis, but Kimbrel should be well into the stage of his life where he's coming back with the 2016 and 2017 alumni to celebrate their back-to-back World Series titles by then...
 

DaveRoberts'Shoes

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For more on meniscus tears and how I scope the shit our of them, don't forget to buy your Saberseminar tickets...
 

E5 Yaz

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To the question at hand, however...

It's entirely feasible that Kimbrel tore this shagging balls or whatever - it's not usually some huge trauma that results in a torn meniscus. Some patients (usually older) can't remember one discrete incident, so I don't think there's anything nefarious in terms of how this was reported. As for the surgery/recovery- it's the single most common orthopedic procedure that's performed (knee arthroscopy with partial meniscectomy, CPT code 29881 if you were wondering), and the vast majority of patients have a pretty smooth, predictable recovery. I'd estimate Kimbrel's return would be closer to 6 weeks than three - his return will be determined by his comfort with that knee when he lands during his delivery and his comfort with fielding. Long-term, tearing your meniscus does increase the risk of arthritis, but Kimbrel should be well into the stage of his life where he's coming back with the 2016 and 2017 alumni to celebrate their back-to-back World Series titles by then...
I've seen this movie once this year. Hope the sequel is better
 

Soxfan in Fla

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Is hearing a "pop" generally consistent with a meniscus tear?
I had a co-worker today fall after he said he heard his knee pop. Went to the hospital and after MRI and X-Rays the initial diagnosis was a ligament tear. I always thought a pop was more in line with a ligament.
 

benhogan

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Are you serious? You Anti Farrell Folks are taking things to extremes..Sometimes things happen. If Kimbrel suffered a bloody nose while blowing his nose and then tripped on his blood and suffered an ACL tear you all would want John's scalp.
well in all fairness he does have a fine head of hair
 

HriniakPosterChild

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As for the surgery/recovery- it's the single most common orthopedic procedure that's performed (knee arthroscopy with partial meniscectomy, CPT code 29881 if you were wondering), and the vast majority of patients have a pretty smooth, predictable recovery.
What's the code for the procedure to stitch the meniscus back together--the one that requires 4+ weeks in a cast, using non weight bearing crutches, and leaves your leg so stiff that you need to get put under anesthesia so the doctor can make your leg bend again?
 

YTF

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To the question at hand, however...

It's entirely feasible that Kimbrel tore this shagging balls or whatever - it's not usually some huge trauma that results in a torn meniscus. Some patients (usually older) can't remember one discrete incident, so I don't think there's anything nefarious in terms of how this was reported. As for the surgery/recovery- it's the single most common orthopedic procedure that's performed (knee arthroscopy with partial meniscectomy, CPT code 29881 if you were wondering), and the vast majority of patients have a pretty smooth, predictable recovery. I'd estimate Kimbrel's return would be closer to 6 weeks than three - his return will be determined by his comfort with that knee when he lands during his delivery and his comfort with fielding. Long-term, tearing your meniscus does increase the risk of arthritis, but Kimbrel should be well into the stage of his life where he's coming back with the 2016 and 2017 alumni to celebrate their back-to-back World Series titles by then...
Figured I would wait for the professional before I added my 2 cents. What DRS describes to us here is very familiar to me. I've undergone partial meniscectomies on both knees, the latest being last Sept. Both times there was no specific incident to point to as the moment my meniscus tore. The first time I was 48, the most recent, 54. Having gone through the process without having the expectations of professional athlete, I couldn't see any way possible for Kimbrel to return in 3 weeks. My first procedure had me out of work for 6 1/2 weeks, my second for 5. I wasn't required to throw of a mound or field batted balls, but I was on my feet for the entire shift, constantly moving on concrete floors. I also need to get DRS as an in service provider on my PPO 'cuz $10 co-pays.
 

soxhop411

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“@EvanDrellich: Koji Uehara finds closing emotionally easier: “Maybe I was overthinking when I was in the eighth inning”
https://t.co/GwOiYEf4bF

Interesting comments from Koji.


NEW YORK — Maybe there is something gained for Koji Uehara by pitching in the ninth instead of the eighth, at least indirectly.

Filling in for the injured Craig Kimbrel as the Red Sox endgame reliever, Uehara looks as steady as he has at any point this season.

He needed just seven pitches, five of them strikes, for a 1-2-3 inning in Saturday's 5-2 win over the Yankees.

Uehara closed out both of the team’s wins to start the second half, and has four strikeouts, no walks and one hit allowed in his last three appearances.

“There isn’t a huge difference but maybe I was overthinking when I was in the eighth inning,” Uehara said yesterday through translator C.J. Matsumoto. “I think the biggest difference is that getting ready emotionally is easier, because I know when I’m going to be in the game.”
 

g0wave

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It can sometimes be difficult to distinguish between hearing and feeling a pop. Other people hearing a pop is a really bad sign.
I've torn the meniscus in each knee. I recall feeling a "pop" in one but dont recall hearing it. The other, candidly I don't know when or how I did it.

Recovery wise, it's a rapid recovery to be walking and walking briskly within a couple weeks for some. Both were very quick recoveries for me - was in my 30s at the time - but of course I wasn't relying on my comfort either pushing off or landing on the leg while throwing a 90+ mph fastball.
 

geoduck no quahog

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I don't understand the theory about Koji. I believe it - I just don't understand it.

Andrew Miller knows when he's coming into a game. The Royals pen was famous for assigned roles. This year it was supposed to be Tazawa/Smith in the 7th, Koji in the 8th and Kimbrel. Mentally it's an 8 inning game with the "pre-closer" doing his job if the team is ahead by a couple of runs in that inning. The 8th inning guy should know as well as the closer does what his call will be in any given game.

It's got to be more than that, if true.
 

Average Reds

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I don't understand the theory about Koji. I believe it - I just don't understand it.

Andrew Miller knows when he's coming into a game. The Royals pen was famous for assigned roles. This year it was supposed to be Tazawa/Smith in the 7th, Koji in the 8th and Kimbrel. Mentally it's an 8 inning game with the "pre-closer" doing his job if the team is ahead by a couple of runs in that inning. The 8th inning guy should know as well as the closer does what his call will be in any given game.

It's got to be more than that, if true.
This sums up my feelings almost perfectly.

There should be absolutely no difference between the 8th and the 9th in terms of a relief pitcher's mental approach. And yet, there is.

Delicate flowers, these closers.
 

Lowrielicious

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This sums up my feelings almost perfectly.

There should be absolutely no difference between the 8th and the 9th in terms of a relief pitcher's mental approach. And yet, there is.

Delicate flowers, these closers.
That's not entirely true. A closer knows exactly how many runs he can give up and still win the game. 8th inning guy doesn't have that luxury.
 

wilked

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Or he is just pitching better, and mentally constructed a story to fit the data
 

shaggydog2000

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Or he is just pitching better, and mentally constructed a story to fit the data
It's almost as if players aren't complete experts on figuring out what makes their performances work or not work. Like they're only a bit less in the dark about performance variance than we are.
 

geoduck no quahog

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As inexplicable as it sounds, there's too much anecdotal evidence concerning reliever usage. Closers who come into "non-save" situations, for example (which makes no logical sense). Relievers who are slaves to routine. Guys who get up, sit down, get up again versus guys who once up - must be used. I believe that a reliever might have more success with one routine rather than another - but (aside from the warming up thing) it's 90% mental. Why? I'm not a pitcher.

There's a reason MLB closers aren't brought in for high leverage non-9th inning situations where a game can actually be won or lost. There's a reason some relievers do better with a clean inning rather than coming in with men on base. I just don't know what it is, other than habit and routine.
 

Harry Hooper

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As inexplicable as it sounds, there's too much anecdotal evidence concerning reliever usage. Closers who come into "non-save" situations, for example (which makes no logical sense). Relievers who are slaves to routine. Guys who get up, sit down, get up again versus guys who once up - must be used. I believe that a reliever might have more success with one routine rather than another - but (aside from the warming up thing) it's 90% mental. Why? I'm not a pitcher.

There's a reason MLB closers aren't brought in for high leverage non-9th inning situations where a game can actually be won or lost. There's a reason some relievers do better with a clean inning rather than coming in with men on base. I just don't know what it is, other than habit and routine.
There's habit and routine, and then there's the confidence aspect. Just as with cornerbacks in the NFL getting burned for TDs, you'd like relievers to have short memories when things blow up. I think some guys struggle with this, so the habit and routine evolve out of the "better" memories over time. It may be somewhat coincidental at first, but then the relievers believe they've identified the keys to success for them.
 

teddykgb

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I've always felt that the 9th inning gave the pitcher the benefit of hitter aggressiveness that doesn't exist in the 7th and 8th. Down to 3 outs, teams are there trying to score runs and guys with deception or big fastballs can capitalize on that aggressiveness. Especially with a guy like Koji, if he can get that first out and leave a team with only two left in the game it probably gets really hard to lay off that diving split.

In reality, of course, teams would be wise to lay off it in the 8th or 9th as baserunners are incredibly valuable of course but I think closers with plus pitches or stuff can really exploit that aggression
 

E5 Yaz

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Scott Lauber ESPN Staff Writer
Two weeks after having minor surgery on his knee, Craig Kimbrel threw about 20 pitches off a mound, as expected. The plan is for him to repeat this exercise later in the week, and if all goes well, manager John Farrell said Red Sox can discuss the next step, probably a short minor-league rehab assignment.
 

Byrdbrain

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I saw the tweet and then just heard them play a clip of this on the radio. I've not heard of them doing this before but it makes sense and I thought it was interesting.

Pete Abraham ‏@PeteAbe 3m3 minutes ago
The #RedSox had Kimbrel throw his bullpen off the main mound so the pitch tracking system could evaluate his arm angle, release point, etc.
 

YTF

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Scott Lauber ESPN Staff Writer
Two weeks after having minor surgery on his knee, Craig Kimbrel threw about 20 pitches off a mound, as expected. The plan is for him to repeat this exercise later in the week, and if all goes well, manager John Farrell said Red Sox can discuss the next step, probably a short minor-league rehab assignment.
I find this to be astounding. I hope this goes well.