Kevin Love News and Rumors

[repole]

The problem with Waiters is he passes the eye test with flying colors. You see him hit some difficult mid range shots, get in the lane off the dribble, and suddenly it becomes easy to view him as a good player.
 
But the guy is straight up awful. Horrible shot selection, doesn't get to the free throw line, doesn't shoot the 3 especially well, settles for tons of long twos, doesn't rebound, doesn't play defense, isn't much of a passer. He's the ultimate test of "does your front office value analytics at all," because there's no way one that does sees him as anything more than a lottery ticket that might figure things out. 

 

[swingin val]

Wiggins just signed. That mean its down to CHI and GS?

 

[Brickowski]

Wiggins just signed. That mean its down to CHI and GS?

They may need Wiggins' salary to make everything match. I expect that Saunders is willing to wait 30 days.

 

[MakMan44]

Yeah, the CHI offer couldn't be official for 30 days anyway.

 

[Devizier]

Davis wasn't on the 06-07 C's.  He was playing with KG in Minnesota, which may have helped motivate KG's desire to leave.  I thank him for that.  The Minnesota roster was an absolute trainwreck in 06-07.  As has been said before, it's hard to believe KG didn't murder Blount for his complete and total suckage.
 
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/d/davisri01.html

 
Jesus, you're right. That run of seasons was so awful that it just blurs together in my mind.

 

[Minneapolis Millers]

Serious question:  Is Gibson/McDermott/Mirotic better than Sullinger/Smart/Young and a couple of high upside #1s?  I can see MN preferring a Wiggins-based deal given his ceiling, but I'm not sure CHI is offering a likely future All Star in that group, any more than Boston would be.

 

[Brickowski]

Serious question:  Is Gibson/McDermott/Mirotic better than Sullinger/Smart/Young and a couple of high upside #1s?  I can see MN preferring a Wiggins-based deal given his ceiling, but I'm not sure CHI is offering a likely future All Star in that group, any more than Boston would be.

The Chicago offer was floated by the Wolves, not by the Bulls. So who knows what teams are offering (or have offered)?

Frankly in a league with a de facto hard cap, first round picks--especially lottery picks-- should be worth more now than before. But if Saunders doesn't want to delve into Danny's trove of first rounders and wants to gamble on Wiggins (who, as I've said before, has some Gerald Green in him), that's fine by me.

I also put a lot more value on Sullinger than MN apparently does. I guess he's not flashy enough for Flip. I'm delighted to keep Sullinger.

 

[luckiestman]

The Chicago offer was floated by the Wolves, not by the Bulls. So who knows what teams are offering (or have offered)?

Frankly in a league with a de facto hard cap, first round picks--especially lottery picks-- should be worth more now than before. But if Saunders doesn't want to delve into Danny's trove of first rounders and wants to gamble on Wiggins (who, as I've said before, has some Gerald Green in him), that's fine by me.

I also put a lot more value on Sullinger than MN apparently does. I guess he's not flashy enough for Flip. I'm delighted to keep Sullinger.

 
 
I dont get how people just use Sully as a throw in all the time. That kid played great. He had problems with Aldridge, Brook Lopez and Howard, but I thought he was fine for his first full season against everyone else.
 
He played against Boogie Cousins like it was a mirror. Check out this game's stats
 
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/201402070BOS.html

 

[DeJesus Built My Hotrod]

 
 
I dont get how people just use Sully as a throw in all the time. That kid played great. He had problems with Aldridge, Brook Lopez and Howard, but I thought he was fine for his first full season against everyone else.
 
He played against Boogie Cousins like it was a mirror. Check out this game's stats
 
http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/201402070BOS.html

 
I don't think Sullinger is thought of as a throw-in but as a necessary piece to entice the TWolves to trade Love to Boston.  As an Celtics and NBA fan, I love Sullinger's game and would be entirely happy to see the Celtics keep him as one of their building blocks.  

 

[mauf]

So the deal is Love to CLE for Wiggins and other pieces, and the Cavs needed Wiggins's rookie salary to make their preferred deal, right?

MIN needs to keep its other irons in the fire on the off chance CLE has a change of heart in the next 30 days, but if CLE is truly willing to deal Wiggins, I can't foresee any situation where that isn't the best deal for MN.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

So the deal is Love to CLE for Wiggins and other pieces, and the Cavs needed Wiggins's rookie salary to make their preferred deal, right?

MIN needs to keep its other irons in the fire on the off chance CLE has a change of heart in the next 30 days, but if CLE is truly willing to deal Wiggins, I can't foresee any situation where that isn't the best deal for MN.

Flip is playing his perfectly imo. He's gone from being up agaiant the ropes with little leverage to turn it around and have the Cavs up against the ropes with Wiggins to find him additional pieces. He's going to come out of this with Wiggins, Thad Young and at least one decent #1 pick. That's a helluva haul for Love who has to be moved.

 

[MakMan44]

Sam Amico of Fox Sports is reporting that Love may have requested he be traded to CLE through his agent. 

 

[Tony C]

I thought I saw Stephen A in a clip on ESPN saying that Love has told teams he'll only be signing with Cleveland, be it this year after a trade or next year. (He went on to add that Love shouldn't be provoking this....).
 
It's what I never got in the Melo situation, in particular -- if you're going to a team it's in your interest to drive down the price they have to pay. So no idea if this report is true, but even if Love would sign with a few teams, it makes sense for him to constrict Minn's trade options. Choose your #1 option and make it sound like it's your only option.

 

[Brickowski]

The Knicks reportedly made an offer for Love-- Stoudamire, Hardaway, Schumpert-- that was rejected. They have no picks to give until 2018.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

The Knicks reportedly made an offer for Love-- Stoudamire, Hardaway, Schumpert-- that was rejected. They have no picks to give until 2018.

I heard the actual offer was Stoudamire, Hardaway, Schum......Click!

 

[PedroKsBambino]

I heard the actual offer was Stoudamire, Hardaway, Schum......Click!

They could safely have hung up after they said they wanted to talk about Love...every non-Carmelo asset the Knicks have isn't enough to win the bidding (or even come close).

 

[MakMan44]

http://www.hoopsrumors.com/2014/07/wolves-kevin-talks.html
 
Cavs appeared posed to acquire Love in the near future. 
 
August 23rd is the earliest Wiggins can be traded FYI.
 

The question is no longer “if” Kevin Love will be traded to the Cavs, but “when” the deal will actually go down

 
 
 

League sources expect the Wolves to walk away from the Love saga with no less than Andrew Wiggins, Anthony Bennett, and a future first-round selection

 

[wutang112878]

Well played Flip, we'll played. He basically got the deal he could have got weeks ago and had Wiggins with his franchise for ~60 days But instead he lost those 60 days which is significant when your trying to get him coached up so he can actually play against NBA talent and get him bulked up with your training staff. It became that much tougher for Wiggins to develop with this clueless franchise. The Cavs minus Lebron were just as bad though.

 

[mauf]

I disagree. First, CLE wanted to make the deal without Wiggins; then, CLE decided they wanted to do the deal with Wiggins's salary. Flip had little choice but to wait them out.

Besides, I don't think either team was hurt by the delay: LBJ and Love weren't going to play Summer League, and the Wolves aren't going anywhere in 2014-15, so an uneven start for their new rookie is worth getting the deal right.

 

[wutang112878]

Are you saying they needed Wiggins salary to make it work? It's probably just my preference but if I am bringing a rookie along who isn't a "will be definitely able to compete right away" guy like Smart then I want to really make sure he doesn't lose confidence early on. Once a guy loses that I think it can be really hard to get back unless he is very mentally strong. I guess I don't know enough about Wiggins to be certain but I do think he has some of these risk factors so to me it did hurt Minny a little.

 

[Devizier]

Are you saying they needed Wiggins salary to make it work? It's probably just my preference but if I am bringing a rookie along who isn't a "will be definitely able to compete right away" guy like Smart then I want to really make sure he doesn't lose confidence early on. Once a guy loses that I think it can be really hard to get back unless he is very mentally strong. I guess I don't know enough about Wiggins to be certain but I do think he has some of these risk factors so to me it did hurt Minny a little.

 
Either the Cavaliers moved Wiggins' salary or they moved Waiters/Thompson. I can see why they wanted to move the salary, if only in terms of having warm bodies on the roster.

 

[mauf]

Are you saying they needed Wiggins salary to make it work? It's probably just my preference but if I am bringing a rookie along who isn't a "will be definitely able to compete right away" guy like Smart then I want to really make sure he doesn't lose confidence early on. Once a guy loses that I think it can be really hard to get back unless he is very mentally strong. I guess I don't know enough about Wiggins to be certain but I do think he has some of these risk factors so to me it did hurt Minny a little.

CLE had, by far, the richest offer. MIN was in no position to dictate timing. If CLE wanted to sign Wiggins instead of throwing in a veteran to make the numbers work, MIN had no practical choice but to go along.

 

[jon abbey]

The Cavs minus Lebron were just as bad though.

 
They were just as bad with LeBron, they just had LeBron to cover up a lot of it. 

 

[Statman]

NBA Store Discontinues Wiggins Cavaliers Jerseys.....

http://dimemag.com/2014/08/nba-store-discontinues-wiggins-cavaliers-jerseys/

 

[MakMan44]

http://www.twincities.com/timberwolves/ci_26265657/charley-walters-timberwolves-likely-trade-kevin-love-by?source=rss
 

The Timberwolves say now that they expect to trade disgruntled all-star Kevin Love and that a deal is expected Aug. 23 or Aug. 24. "I'm saying it's most likely because Kevin has made it pretty clear that that's what he wants to do," Wolves owner Glen Taylor told the Pioneer Press.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

Well played Flip, we'll played. He basically got the deal he could have got weeks ago and had Wiggins with his franchise for ~60 days But instead he lost those 60 days which is significant when your trying to get him coached up so he can actually play against NBA talent and get him bulked up with your training staff. It became that much tougher for Wiggins to develop with this clueless franchise. The Cavs minus Lebron were just as bad though.

This was very well played by Flip to receive maximum compensation for Love.....to include Wiggins and the other ancillary benefits. I'm not sure what effect 60 days of an offseason without organized team activities aside from a week of summer effect would have on an rookie. In 5 years maybe we can look back and say, "If only Wiggins had that one week of summer league practice and 5 summer league games with players not on our NBA roster things would have turned out so different."

 

[Auger34]

Windhorst was on ESPN Radio today and said that Cleveland and Minnesota have a hand shake agreement on a Wiggins, Bennett for Love trade. He also thought that MIN would then flip Bennett to PHI for Thad Young.
I am a little surprised that CLE seems more willing to include Bennett instead of Waiters. Waiters seems really redundant with the rest of that roster.
Also have to give it up to Flip. To get a Wiggins and Thad Young in exchange for a superstar that everyone and their mom knew was going to leave at the end of the season is a hell of a haul

 

[moly99]

I am a little surprised that CLE seems more willing to include Bennett instead of Waiters. Waiters seems really redundant with the rest of that roster.

 
Even if they kept Wiggins, Waiters would probably be the third guard. (PG when Irving is out, SG when Wiggins is out.)
 
I think this is a mistake, and couldn't be happier for Dan Gilbert. Seeing that guy win the Lebron sweepstakes twice and the lottery three times in four years is like seeing a cocaine addict winning millions in a casino and knowing the money will be gone in a month or two. Hopefully when Lebron realizes he is part of a big three where the other two guys don't play defense he will opt out and leave.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

 
Even if they kept Wiggins, Waiters would probably be the third guard. (PG when Irving is out, SG when Wiggins is out.)
 
I think this is a mistake, and couldn't be happier for Dan Gilbert. Seeing that guy win the Lebron sweepstakes twice and the lottery three times in four years is like seeing a cocaine addict winning millions in a casino and knowing the money will be gone in a month or two. Hopefully when Lebron realizes he is part of a big three where the other two guys don't play defense he will opt out and leave.

I'll give you a news alert......If this is the case it won't be LeBron who's leaving.

 

[inter tatters]

With Kevin Love and Tristan Thompson, Bennett would be, essentially, the 3rd PF on the roster, so it's no surprise the Cavs are including him in the deal. Best to trade out a former #1 pick before the "shiny new thing" tag completely fades, right?
 
I'm not sure if Minny will trade Bennett for Thad Young or not, but I think Bennett, now fully fit and lost a few pounds by all accounts, could be a good fit for someone. Maybe playing 25-30mins as the 4 in an up-tempo team with Rubio, Wiggins and no pressure might suit him?

 

[mauf]

I'm not surprised Bennett is on the block. I am surprised that he's going to MIN as essentially a throw-in. Seems like bad negotiating by CLE -- Wiggins alone clearly trumped the offers by CHI and GS, so I can't imagine the deal would have fallen apart if CLE insisted on holding on to Bennett (and then moving him in a separate deal).

 

[moondog80]

I'm not surprised Bennett is on the block. I am surprised that he's going to MIN as essentially a throw-in. Seems like bad negotiating by CLE -- Wiggins alone clearly trumped the offers by CHI and GS, so I can't imagine the deal would have fallen apart if CLE insisted on holding on to Bennett (and then moving him in a separate deal).

 
On the other hand, Cleveland has all sorts of pressure to win now, with LeBron on a two year deal, they're not going to let this fall apart over a draft bust who might only end up playing garbage minutes.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

I'm not surprised Bennett is on the block. I am surprised that he's going to MIN as essentially a throw-in. Seems like bad negotiating by CLE -- Wiggins alone clearly trumped the offers by CHI and GS, so I can't imagine the deal would have fallen apart if CLE insisted on holding on to Bennett (and then moving him in a separate deal).

Sure it would have and it did which is why Cleveland had to sign Wiggins last week. Flip didn't fall for the idea he had no leverage with Love under contract this year instead he "flipped" the pressure over to the Cavs who are the ones with no leverage since they need Love this year more than Minny needs to move Love.....and he will likely get more as well.

 

[Devizier]

Cleveland had to move Bennett or Thompson to make the salaries work.

 

[wutang112878]

Cleveland had to move Bennett or Thompson to make the salaries work.

 
This just got me thinking, have we seen a deal that has the salary work?  Cleveland is over the cap so they cant take on more money, Love is at $16M and Bennet and Wiggins get Cleveland to about $10M   So the guys that get Cleveland close are Kyrie, Thompson or Waiters and thats assuming Minny sends no one else back and I believe I read that they wanted to dump Martin or Barea (which as an expiring made no sense).  I'm pretty curious to see how they make that work.

 

[TheoShmeo]

Nonsubstantive Whiny Fanboy Comment Coming:
 
THAT LEBRON IS GETTING EVERYTHING HE WANTS AND A TEAM THAT WILL BE MORE THAN CAPABLE OF WINNING A TITLE IN CLEVELAND JUST SUCKS.
 
On the one hand, Joe Cleveland Sports Fan has suffered immensely so good for him.
 
On the other hand, puke.

 

[TroyOLeary]

They traded with Utah to get John Lucas and Erik Murphy's unguaranteed salaries which combine to around 2.5 million.
 
Getting the salaries to match for Love isn't a problem, it's only an issue if Minnesota wants to get rid of Martin.

 

[mauf]

Sure it would have and it did which is why Cleveland had to sign Wiggins last week. Flip didn't fall for the idea he had no leverage with Love under contract this year instead he "flipped" the pressure over to the Cavs who are the ones with no leverage since they need Love this year more than Minny needs to move Love.....and he will likely get more as well.

Both teams needed to make the move -- Flip would be finished if he moved Love to CHI or GS and Wiggins became a star elsewhere. Cheers to Flip for having the intestinal fortitude to hold out for extra value. And jeers to the Cavs' FO for not being similarly savvy -- they aren't so stacked that they can afford to forego a solid rotation player, which is what they could've flipped Bennett for.

 

[MakMan44]

Anyone mind answering if I should be more excited for Bennett or Thad Young? As far I can tell, Young might be leaving after next season anyway. 

 

[Vegas Sox Fan]

It might just be the UNLV fanboy in me but I really think Bennett is going to break out this year. He came in last year coming off shoulder surgery and basically no off-season work. To try to transition from college to the NBA as the "Number 1" pick with the pressure that comes with it on a crappy team like the Cavs was tough to do. Once he struggled to get out of the gate I think he got buried a little and was overwhelmed. I think he is refocused this year and in a new situation will thrive.

 

[Devizier]

They traded with Utah to get John Lucas and Erik Murphy's unguaranteed salaries which combine to around 2.5 million.
 
Getting the salaries to match for Love isn't a problem, it's only an issue if Minnesota wants to get rid of Martin.

 
John Lucas $1.6M
Erik Murphy $0.8M
 
Anthony Bennett $5.5M

 

[swingin val]

Word from a source out here in Mpls is that Brewer will also be going to Cle in the deal

 

[wutang112878]

Word from a source out here in Mpls is that Brewer will also be going to Cle in the deal

 
Any word on what Cleveland is sending back?  I dont see how they match Love + Brewer in salary

 

[TroyOLeary]

 
John Lucas $1.6M
Erik Murphy $0.8M
 
Anthony Bennett $5.5M

 
I didn't quote it, but I was responding to this:
 

 
This just got me thinking, have we seen a deal that has the salary work?  Cleveland is over the cap so they cant take on more money, Love is at $16M and Bennet and Wiggins get Cleveland to about $10M   So the guys that get Cleveland close are Kyrie, Thompson or Waiters and thats assuming Minny sends no one else back and I believe I read that they wanted to dump Martin or Barea (which as an expiring made no sense).  I'm pretty curious to see how they make that work.

 
 
But looking at the actual salaries, I don't think the unguaranteed deals are even needed, Wiggins+Bennett is just enough to get them into the allowable outgoing salary range for a Love trade.

 

[TroyOLeary]

 
Any word on what Cleveland is sending back?  I dont see how they match Love + Brewer in salary

 
According to:
 
http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q84
 
I believe the amount Cleveland would need to send back is (Love+Brewer-100,000)/1.25, which is $16,257,250.
 
They can get there with Wiggins+Bennett+Haywood(one year guaranteed)+Lucas+Dellavedova+Murphy(last three all unguaranteed); those contracts total $16,521,192.

 

[Auger34]

 
According to:
 
http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q84
 
I believe the amount Cleveland would need to send back is (Love+Brewer-100,000)/1.25, which is $16,257,250.
 
They can get there with Wiggins+Bennett+Haywood(one year guaranteed)+Lucas+Dellavedova+Murphy(last three all unguaranteed); those contracts total $16,521,192.

 
I don't see this happening. I think it's Love for Wiggins, Bennett, Lucas, and Murphy for Love. I don't see how MIN can expect more than that for a return nor do I see why CLE would take back more bad contracts for Minnesota.
Haywood's contract becomes really valuable next year and Cleveland can flip it for another asset (rim protector or a 3 and D guy most likely) so I think they will try very hard to keep it. I expect CLE to keep the MIA pick and Haywood out of this deal

 

[radsoxfan]

Anyone mind answering if I should be more excited for Bennett or Thad Young? As far I can tell, Young might be leaving after next season anyway. 

 
Young is likely better, but there is a reason Philly is giving him up for Bennett.  Young has 1 year 9M left on his contract then a 1 year player option.
 
Saying that the Wolves are getting "Wiggins and Young" is kinda silly, unless the Wolves are expecting to contend this year.  Seems odd to give up Bennett for him unless they think Bennett is totally useless (quite possible).

 

[MakMan44]

Thanks, appreciate the response. 

 

[HomeRunBaker]

 
Young is likely better, but there is a reason Philly is giving him up for Bennett.  Young has 1 year 9M left on his contract then a 1 year player option.
 
Saying that the Wolves are getting "Wiggins and Young" is kinda silly, unless the Wolves are expecting to contend this year.  Seems odd to give up Bennett for him unless they think Bennett is totally useless (quite possible).

This is part of what I do expect plus a pick from Philly......I feel the extra #1 is what Flip was waiting on which required a 3rd team. Minny gets a 1st rounder to swap Thad and Bennett.....which may even be beneficial to them if as you allude, Bennett turns out to be crap.

 

[wade boggs chicken dinner]

I'm sure DA has tried, but it's too bad we can't get Flip interested in one of our "Established Veterans" for Bennett.