Kevin Love News and Rumors

Reardon's Beard

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Minnesota is going to begin actively shopping Kevin Love, and there are few teams with the kind of assets that Boston could offer. What say you?
 
The Kevin Love free agency drama (Love Fest? Summer of Love?) has officially begun. The Timberwolves star is set to be a free agent a year from now in the summer of 2015 but after whispers of him forcing his way out due to being unhappy in Minnesota for a year, the rumor mill started running full-speed Saturday night.
 
First, from the New York Daily News:
 

Kevin Love's people reiterated to the Timberwolves this past week that they had better trade him or else he'll leave via free agency when his contract is up after next season. With Love looking to exit, there's your No. 1 reason the T-wolves have not been able to find a head coach to take over for Rick Adelman. Love wants to play for the Lakers but he's also open to coming to the Knicks.
 
via James Dolan and Dan Gilbert meddling is hazard to Knicks and Cavs' health - NY Daily News.
 
Then Yahoo Sports followed up with this Saturday night:

 
"For the first time, [Saunders] sounds like looking at deals for [Love] is an option," one rival executive told Yahoo Sports.
The Boston Celtics, Golden State Warriors, Los Angeles Lakers and Phoenix Suns are among many teams determined to make hard runs at trades for Love, league sources said. Boston and Los Angeles plan to make high-lottery picks in the 2014NBA Draft available in offers for Love, sources said.

 
via Sources: Sam Mitchell emerges as Minnesota candidate with Kevin Love's future undecided - Yahoo Sports.
 
That's two independent reports indicating first that Love wants out and two that the Wolves are starting to thaw on the idea of trading him. Minnesota has been flat adamant that they're not going to go the route of trading Love before they lose leverage in a deal, that instead they'll wait til the very last possible moment before dealing with them. They want to convince him to stay, but trying to find ways to make this roster good enough to compete in a summer just isn't feasible.
 
So now the Wolves have to either hope things come together magically or bit the bullet and deal him. They'll get the best return on value right now, but they only way you can trade him is if you're sure you can't keep him. It's got to be 100 percent. The Lakers, Celtics, and Suns are in the lottery, with a chance to package a possible top-three pick to Minnesota in a loaded draft. This gets more perilous if the Suns somehow jump Minnesota (their chances are abysmal), which would then send Minnesota's pick to Phoenix, leaving the Wolves facing Love in an expiring contract year without a draft pick.
 
The Celtics, meanwhile, could put together a package featuring Jared Sullinger, expiring contracts, and their top pick. The Lakers could do something similar, though it gets tricky with how few of their players are on contract past July 1st.
 
Someone or someones obviously wanted to get the wheel turning on stories like this one about Love wanting out. Whether that winds up being the case or if this is just ambient noise from competing forces remains to be seen. But it's an ominous sign that 13 months from Love becoming a free agent, this story has hit this level of anonymous sourcing. There are dark clouds forming over Minnesota, and how they handle this will define Flip Saunders' tenure as head of basketball operations.
 
 

RedOctober3829

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There's a report that Flip Saunders is going to coach Minnesota. That would indicate to me that Love's stance won't change and he'll be traded soon.

Edit: Saunders confirms that he's the head coach.
 

TheDeuce222

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Marc Stein        ✔ @ESPNSteinLine
Flip Saunders just confirmed to ESPN he is indeed the new coach of the Minnesota Timberwolves


 
Flip Saunders has officially indicated he is taking the job.  I agree with RedOctober - Love is very unlikely to commit to play for Flip.  Will be interesting to see what happens.  Obviously, the Celtics have the most draft picks to offer in a trade, but if Chicago does make a Butler/Gibson/1st rounder offer, I could see Saunders preferring that.  
 

MakMan44

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RedOctober3829 said:
There's a report that Flip Saunders is going to coach Minnesota. That would indicate to me that Love's stance won't change and he'll be traded soon.
I don't know a whole lot about coaching but this seems like a dumb move. 
 

E5 Yaz

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Why does a player have a right to be frustrated?
 
Flip, you're part of the problem
 

Cellar-Door

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I liked comparing it to something he said to Kevin Garnett who had to leave town to win because the team around him was always terrible
 

Auger34

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So they trade pick 11 for Afflalo? Magic would have 3 of the top 12 picks in the draft. I imagine they go something like Exum, Saric, and Stauskas. Pretty good haul for them if possible.
That Nuggets offer is not a bad offer although it seems like Flip would be running to get to the exact same place he is in right now. Does a line-up of Rubio/Afflalo/Chandler/Faried/Pekovic make the playoffs? It's definitely possible but they would be a 7 or an 8 seed and would be a first round exit. I just don't know how you could logically look at that situation and not decide to trade Love for the "blow it up" package (multiple picks and young players)
 

Cellar-Door

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tbb345 said:
So they trade pick 11 for Afflalo? Magic would have 3 of the top 12 picks in the draft. I imagine they go something like Exum, Saric, and Stauskas. Pretty good haul for them if possible.
That Nuggets offer is not a bad offer although it seems like Flip would be running to get to the exact same place he is in right now. Does a line-up of Rubio/Afflalo/Chandler/Faried/Pekovic make the playoffs? It's definitely possible but they would be a 7 or an 8 seed and would be a first round exit. I just don't know how you could logically look at that situation and not decide to trade Love for the "blow it up" package (multiple picks and young players)
Saunders is a part owner as well as GM and coach, he'd probably take the 8 seed playoff money over a rebuild.
That isn't a terrible deal, Minny could probably even make DEN eat Budinger's deal for Brooks. They money works that way.
Rubio/Afflalo/Chandler/Faried/Pekovic with Martin as the 6th man, add in 13, Dieng, and a bunch of okay end of rotation guys, that might be a 7 or 8 seed. It'll be strong defensively for sure.
 

knucklecup

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Get busy living or get busy dying. No matter how many Bulls, Warriors, or now Nuggets fans try to paint the narrative in their favor... Nobody in their right mind -- assuming Saunders is a sane individual -- would choose average, overpriced talent on their 2nd and 3rd contracts (Taj Gibson, Jimmy Butler, David Lee, Klay Thompson, Kenneth Faried, Aaron Afflalo, etc) over a plethora of high end first round picks.

These guys do absolutely nothing for their bottom line. So they trade Love for a two year window of being a long shot to make the playoffs? Then have nothing to show for Love two years from now except a late first round pick from a Denver or Chicago team that will be flourishing most likely?

As a Wolves fan, I would be fuming at almost any other package than the one the Celtics are offering because none of the others make any sense financially or from a basketball standpoint.

Personally, I think all these news and rumors are being planted by Boston and Minnesota people, and it's a matter of time before a deal gets done between the two. It's all posturing.

The only other team who could make a dent is Cleveland offering up the number one. Other than them, the Celtics are the only team that makes sense.
 

RedOctober3829

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Simmons after the Embiid injury broke.
 
Bill Simmons ‏@BillSimmons 4m
Also - major ramifications for Boston's potential Kevin Love deal. Can't see them giving up the farm for Love if Embiid might fall to 6.
 
My take is this: why would you take a chance on a player who might not ever be healthy for you over a known quantity in Love? 
 
Also, might this actually help the Celtics chances of trading for Love?? If there's the chance that Embiid is available at 6, doesn't that make Boston's package look stronger? 
 

E5 Yaz

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gmogmo said:
 
Marc Stein ‏@ESPNSteinLine  1m
ESPN sources say Golden State has indeed made Klay Thompson available to Wolves, greatly increasingly Warriors' hopes of getting Kevin Love
 
Not good for C's
 
 
Was just coming here to post this one. It might come down to how Minnesota values draft picks vs established players. And whether the Flipster really does want to stick it to Danny
 

RedOctober3829

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E5 Yaz said:
 
Was just coming here to post this one. It might come down to how Minnesota values draft picks vs established players. And whether the Flipster really does want to stick it to Danny
We'll see what rumors are actually true and what rumors came from people who have certain agendas.
 

E5 Yaz

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RedOctober3829 said:
We'll see what rumors are actually true and what rumors came from people who have certain agendas.
 
Since I usually find Marc Stein reliable, what agenda am I missing?
 

bowiac

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E5 Yaz said:
Was just coming here to post this one. It might come down to how Minnesota values draft picks vs established players. And whether the Flipster really does want to stick it to Danny
Also depends on how Minnesota values Klay Thompson in particular. He's not an especially polarizing player, but opinions on him differ pretty strongly.
 

Auger34

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Are you kidding me?! That trade is highway robbery for the Warriors. Broussard must be missing something because that trade can't be right
 

dylanmarsh

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Statman said:
 
The salaries don't even match up according to RealGM's trade checker.
 
I think the Richard Jefferson trade exception would help get the deal done.  When does that expire, BTW?
 

Cellar-Door

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Statman said:
 
The salaries don't even match up according to RealGM's trade checker.
It would be 2 deals likely. Love and Barea for Thompson and Lee
Martin into the Richard Jefferson TPE
 

Statman

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dylanmarsh said:
 
I think the Richard Jefferson trade exception would help get the deal done.  When does that expire, BTW?
 
Good catch.  I'd forgotten about that.  The Jefferson exception expires on 7/10/14.
 

RedOctober3829

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Minnesota only getting Klay Thompson and David Lee for that package?  That would be a horrible, horrible, horrible return for what they give up.  They'd be giving up 1 and possibly 2 All-Stars depending on who #13 is, a proven scorer in K-Martin, and a quality PG in Barea. 
 
I'd absolutely take the Boston package if those were the two choices in front of me.
 

ALiveH

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no one will come close to Sully + #6 + #17 if the wolves are serious about rebuilding with young players.
 

Cellar-Door

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RedOctober3829 said:
Minnesota only getting Klay Thompson and David Lee for that package?  That would be a horrible, horrible, horrible return for what they give up.  They'd be giving up 1 and possibly 2 All-Stars depending on who #13 is, a proven scorer in K-Martin, and a quality PG in Barea. 
 
I'd absolutely take the Boston package if those were the two choices in front of me.
Yeah, have to assume either the 13 isn't in there or Harrison Barnes is.
Martin and Barrea are salary dumps, well Barea is for sure, he's awful now.
 

Devizier

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Flip sends the 13th in addition to Love and Martin for the right to pay Klay? Either bullshit or Flip is a completely useless idiot.
 

Auger34

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Devizier said:
Flip sends the 13th in addition to Love and Martin for the right to pay Klay? Either bullshit or Flip is a completely useless idiot.
This trade is really going to tell us a lot about Flip and how honest with himself/intelligent he really is. If he does this GSW trade (let's take out the 13 since there is no way that shit is happening) he is basically guaranteeing a run of 8-10 seeds in the West. A string of non-playoff/1st round exits and picks in the 12-16 range every year. Basically basketball purgatory.
I don't know how any rational person could look at the MIN situation/roster and not see that the team is going nowhere fast. The only prudent thing would be to blow up the team and acquire as many young assets/picks as possible
 

MakMan44

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So exactly the same situation the Wolves have been in since KG left? I agree that the trade above probably isn't the best path to take but you have to take into account that Flip is probably very aware that fans are tired of watching them rebuild. That's not the intelligent way to approach this trade but I'm just pointing out what he's likely thinking. 
 

ALiveH

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well, if the wolves hadn't squandered the 6 assets we sent them 7 years ago they wouldn't be in this situation again.
 

Auger34

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MakMan44 said:
So exactly the same situation the Wolves have been in since KG left? I agree that the trade above probably isn't the best path to take but you have to take into account that Flip is probably very aware that fans are tired of watching them rebuild. That's not the intelligent way to approach this trade but I'm just pointing out what he's likely thinking. 
I agree with what you are saying but I think that is just an incredibly dumb approach.
With that trade the team is worse than last year....when they didn't make the playoffs. The absolute upside of that team (let's say they get Klay and Lee for Martin, Barea, and Love.) is a 7 or an 8 seed and then getting slaughtered in the first round. Now I understand why that approach has some appeal to Flip (as part owner) because even if you get crushed in the playoffs you still make extra money and revenue for the appearance. That team, constructed that way, is maxed out in basketball purgatory. Continually on the bubble of making the playoffs, continually getting picks in the 12-16 range, no real chance at winning anything.
I think the general fan isn't given enough credit these days. I believe it would be easier to sell the general Minnesota fan on picks and hope for the future (picking and growing their own superstar, maybe winning the lottery) than selling them on continued mediocrity for the cycle of the Klay Thompson era (however long that may be).
 

knucklecup

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If the Timberwolves give up Kevin Love to build around Klay Thompson on a max deal for the next five years, it could go down as the single worst trade in the history of sports.

This isn't hyperbole. Any trade of Thompson would be a blessing in disguise for Golden State who wouldn't be forced to give a replaceable player a max deal.

It's hard to take seriously the rumors floating around currently.
 

Auger34

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jon abbey said:
 
Chris Broussard ‏@Chris_Broussard  8m
Sources: Nuggets offering Kenneth Faried, Wilson Chandler and 11th pick for Kevin Love and Kevin Martin
 
Why is Flip even considering these trades? Is he that enthused about becoming the perennial 8th seed in the West with no hopes or prospect for upward mobility? Anything other than blowing it up for multiple picks is a failure on his part
 

PedroKsBambino

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jon abbey said:
 
Chris Broussard ‏@Chris_Broussard  8m
Sources: Nuggets offering Kenneth Faried, Wilson Chandler and 11th pick for Kevin Love and Kevin Martin
 
 
It's kind of a philosophical question---in terms of 'expected value' this is good value in that Faried and Chandler are solid NBA players and the discounted present value of the (say) 6th pick is limited.
 
But, when you're Minnesota and can't attract free agents can you really win with a model that you chase a bunch of solid guys and hope to get a star somewhere?  Or are you better off trying to get a star (or really two) in the draft, and accepting that you'll crap out while trying in many scenarios?  Generically I'd say the second, though after the Kevin Love situation they may be feeling otherwise
 

Auger34

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PedroKsBambino said:
 
It's kind of a philosophical question---in terms of 'expected value' this is good value in that Faried and Chandler are solid NBA players and the discounted present value of the (say) 6th pick is limited.
 
But, when you're Minnesota and can't attract free agents can you really win with a model that you chase a bunch of solid guys and hope to get a star somewhere?  Or are you better off trying to get a star (or really two) in the draft, and accepting that you'll crap out while trying in many scenarios?  Generically I'd say the second, though after the Kevin Love situation they may be feeling otherwise
 
Its being forgotten that the reason it got to this point was because Kahn basically saved the team's max contract for Rubio. While he didn't come outright and say it, Love isn't an idiot and realized that was what Kahn was trying to do. That disrespect probably didn't help enhance Love's value of the franchise (in addition to the fact they have been a sorry team that didn't surround him with talent his entire career)
 

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(Moved from draft thread)
 
Regarding the Klay Thompson/Kevin Martin comparison:
 
They're very similar in terms of career FGA/possession and Ast%, which is a little disconcerting for Thompson, since he's been playing alongside one of the most efficient perimeter players in the league so I'd expect him to be a more willing passer than KMart during his years with an offensively bereft Kings team.  The thing that really separates Martin offensively was his ability to get to the line- he's at 9.9 FTA per 100 possessions for his career.  Klay was at 3.2/100 last year, which is his best.  That's a big part of Martin's excellent TS% (.591 for his career, Thompson's .555 last year would've been basically tied for the third worst of Martin's career).  Martin was much more of a slasher who could get to the rim.  He progressed at this skill his first couple of years, and it's possible that Thompson could too, but he's still starting out well behind KMart.
 
Thompson is a very good spot up guy, who can post up a bit.  He suits the Warriors very well, but I really wonder how much his game will suffer without Curry, especially if he ends up in a backcourt with Rubio.  He's undoubtedly better defensively than Martin defensively, but it's tough to see him as the offensive focal point, which he'd be in Minnesota. 
 
[SIZE=12.727272033691406px]I just don't really get the attraction of a Rubio/Klay/Brewer/Lee/Pekovic team.  Even if Dieng blossoms into the guy some people think he is, that's guaranteed purgatory in the west.   Maybe a known entity like Thompson or Faried is more palatable to Wolves fans, but if they actually want to compete in the medium term, I think they're better off stockpiling assets.[/SIZE]
 

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Admitting that I have several dogs in this fight (as a C's fan and someone who follows the Warriors pretty closely) in advance, I can see how Saunders might find a package of Thompson and Lee palatable.  
 
DD's post above is excellent in his assessment of how Thompson is similar to Kevin Martin statistically, but they are very different players.  Thompson can guard the one through fours on most opposing teams and while he isn't a slasher, he made a bit of a leap last season in not only going to the rim but also finishing.  He is still somewhat limited as a player -  he disappears for stretches and he isn't a fantastic athlete by NBA standards - but he has shown steady improvement since coming into the league.  As has been stated in this thread, a max deal for him won't feel good given his skill set but I am reasonably certain someone will give him one.
 
A package of him and Lee, who can replace a decent chunk of Kevin Love's production (David Lee is a horrible defender but he is a well above average offensive player), would definitely put the Wolves in a position to compete for the seven or eight seed in the West.  For a team that has little chance of attracting elite or even above average NBA free agents, its not a horrible strategy.  As has been stated in this forum, drafting in the lottery isn't a way to guarantee future success so its easy to see how getting two above average NBA assets for Love might work for Minnesota.    
 
Is a GS package of Thompson/Lee superior to a six and seventeen plus Sullinger?  Not in terms of "assets" but if the T-Wolves want to be relevant anytime soon, its a better deal.