sittingstill said:
You're right. It was the first time it had happened since Affirmed/Spectacular Bid about a decade earlier, but not the first time in history. May have been only the 1st or 2nd time it happened in the Breeders Cup Classic though.
Horse Racing/Triple Crown Thread
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You're right. It was the first time it had happened since Affirmed/Spectacular Bid about a decade earlier, but not the first time in history. May have been only the 1st or 2nd time it happened in the Breeders Cup Classic though.
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That's not bending the rule at all, IMO. If Point Given can't be in the "this close" conversation, then why would a Derby loser ever run in the Preakness. I don't recall any good explanation for Swale's bad Preakness, but he's got a claim in the "this close" category, too.sittingstill said:
Wasn't Spectacular Bid a really, really big horse? I seem to remember him that way. (And was Ferdinand auctioned to a Japanese guy and likely, umm, err, slaughtered?)
If American Pharoah pulls it off, again with a slow time, would he be ahead of Spectacular Bid? Sham? Ahead of Alydar? Other than great performance as an older horse (Cigar, John Henry) can any non-triple crown winner have a claim as better than a triple crown winner?
Well, Derby losers don't run in the Preakness just to be in a Triple Crown conversation. Each race in the Triple Crown is a Grade 1 stakes in its own right--winning even one carries a lot of prestige and being a Classic winner is its own honor. Heck, Samuel Riddle refused to enter Man O'War in the Derby, believing it was too early in the year for a three year old to go a mile and a quarter, which ought to settle any question of whether a non-triple-crown winner can claim to be better than a winner.
It's not a perfect analogy, I know, but judging a horse's career by the Triple Crown is a bit like awarding Hall of Fame status for ROY plus a batting title the same year. It's five weeks of a three-year-old's life. It can absolutely indicate greatness, but no shortage of truly great horses haven;t won it. Spectacular Bid may be the best recent example--from the link I posted above:
American Pharoah winning the Triple Crown will in no way make him as great as the Bid.
I know you gave a bit of an allowance for older horses, but that's much more of the sport of horse racing than those five weeks in the spring. Kelso didn't even race at three until after the Triple Crown races. Forego ran fourth to Secretariat in the Derby in '73... and went on to be Horse of the Year in 1974, 1975 and 1976.
It's not a perfect analogy, I know, but judging a horse's career by the Triple Crown is a bit like awarding Hall of Fame status for ROY plus a batting title the same year. It's five weeks of a three-year-old's life. It can absolutely indicate greatness, but no shortage of truly great horses haven;t won it. Spectacular Bid may be the best recent example--from the link I posted above:
American Pharoah winning the Triple Crown will in no way make him as great as the Bid.
I know you gave a bit of an allowance for older horses, but that's much more of the sport of horse racing than those five weeks in the spring. Kelso didn't even race at three until after the Triple Crown races. Forego ran fourth to Secretariat in the Derby in '73... and went on to be Horse of the Year in 1974, 1975 and 1976.
Now that American Pharoah is being fueled by Monster, I really don't want him to win.
http://nypost.com/2015/06/03/monster-energy-inks-deal-with-triple-crown-hopeful/
http://nypost.com/2015/06/03/monster-energy-inks-deal-with-triple-crown-hopeful/
I'm really tempted to just blindly throw down a $1 exacta box on the field other than Pharoah and see what happens, but looking at the rest of the field, wow it looks weak.
DanoooME said:
That's a $42 bet. Last year, in an 11-horse field, the winner went off at 12:1, and 2nd was 27:1, and a $1 exacta only paid $174. You can expect less than that this year in an 8-horse field.
If you want to get paid 3:1, there are probably better ways to bet it.
Posted to the ticket forum, but --
I have an extra to the Belmont. $165 (face). Section 3N, Row E (fifth row, second tier), basically at the finish line. Great seat.
If you'd like it, please let me know. Sooner the better.
I have an extra to the Belmont. $165 (face). Section 3N, Row E (fifth row, second tier), basically at the finish line. Great seat.
If you'd like it, please let me know. Sooner the better.
PseuFighter said:Posted to the ticket forum, but --
I have an extra to the Belmont. $165 (face). Section 3N, Row E (fifth row, second tier), basically at the finish line. Great seat.
If you'd like it, please let me know. Sooner the better.
What's your mode of transportation to the track? My one trip to the Belmont a few years ago was an absolute nightmare on the LIRR (and that was supposedly nothing compared to last year's shitshow). I don't think I'd ever do it again.
lirr. trick out is walking to jamaica or taking the lirr from bellrose or floral park. i'm planning to stay for the whole event and hitting the 9:30 LIRR at bellrose.
Ho Lee Shit. First time in forever and there was NO question about it. Absolute dominance. Wire to wire.
Yeah, he looked like he was getting a little restless going into the final turn. I thought he was pushing to run too early, but damn.
Zayat's son with the Monster hat looks like a massive douche. Probably because I am quite jealous of him right now.
I just timed the gap between 1st and 2nd from a youtube video. The 31 lengths in that race was approximately 4.3 seconds. So Secretariat wins today by about 19 lengths. That's nuts.Greg29fan said:
Never looked like he was struggling even at the halfway point just looked like a nice leisurely run. Glad a horse finally got another Triple Crown
Secretariat won the 3 Triple Crown races 42 years ago, and still has the record time in all 3. Think about that for a minute.PaulinMyrBch said:
2:24 is not only the record for the Belmont, it's the 1.5 mile record for any horse on any dirt track ever.
Big Red is the GOAT. No debate. We're hard pressed to find an "athlete" as dominant in his/her sport as Secretariat remains in thoroughbred racing.SoxFanInCali said:
But AP is a generational champion, and proved more than worthy of the TC mantle.
I was watching a stream on my phone and it cuts out just as they reached the end of the final turn. Man, I was pissed. It came back on maybe 3 seconds after they crossed the finish line. Just watched the replay and I have to say I was impressed with that finishing kick. He had the easy trip so there were no excuses if he didn't win.
SumnerH said:
Man o' War had the greatest racing career of any thoroughbred, but no horse that has ever run would have beat Secretariat in the 1973 Belmont.
Dan Murfman said:
Yes he will. At least a couple more times. Barring a health concern between now and then, he won't retire until after the BC Classic.Greg29fan said:
Out of curiosity, how much could he possibly win in subsequent races? How does that compare to the risk of him having an injury that means he has to be put down and can't stud?
I know next got nothing about horse racing, so I'm asking in earnest.
I know next got nothing about horse racing, so I'm asking in earnest.