Regardless, there was plenty of reason for informed, non-reactionary people not to be calm about their play. That was my point. Also, urgent desire is often a good creator of focus. Taking a team lightly—or allowing fear of losing to distract you from your focus are both functions of insufficient desire. At least in my book they are.Bongorific said:
What evidence is there that the B's took them lightly? It's all baseless speculation.catomatic said:
yea the defense was not the main problem in this series. Yes, they had their breakdowns, but they were also without two of their usual starters. Get Bartkowski out of the lineup and you improve drastically. I also think Hamilton is developing very well as well.kenneycb said:
I don't think they took anyone lightly, I don't see how it's possible really. I think Clode probably told them to keep emotions out of the equation, and it turns out that may not have been the right approach. I can't really blame Clode for thinking that, though.catomatic said:
Yeah I agree here. First goal was on Bart, second goal on Miller for icing a pass against a spent MTL D pairing and third was on Bart for being an idiot after gaining the zone.Smiling Joe Hesketh said:
Largely the same core went to the SCF finals last year and had the best record in hockey this year. But I understand that's not much up against 120 minutes of their worst hockey.Smiling Joe Hesketh said:
My point isn't even the D being the problem. The way the team is structured it's dumb to trade any of the cheap guys. People talking about improving the D are really just talking about improving the 4/5 guys on the team, which pretty much every franchise wants to do. Because there's a reason they're 4/5's.BoSoxFink said:
moving Krejci is an awful decision I think. He's still their most talented offensive forward and I think thisis still something this team lacks. Obviously not this year, but you could make a case during their two long playoff runs he was their MVP, save for Thomas in 2011kenneycb said:
Oh yay the experience card. Resume: 22 years of watching and playing hockey. None of which was above the college club hockey level. Which is why I'm not making bullshit claims about heart and desire. If you played on the AHL, IHL or NHL, I apologize but I'm guessing you don't have any greater insight into a locker room than I do.catomatic said:
How about 7 games of their worst hockey?Myt1 said:Largely the same core went to the SCF finals last year and had the best record in hockey this year. But I understand that's not much up against 120 minutes of their worst hockey.
Not necessarily advocating it but adding up all the facts, he'd be the easiest to move given what they could get back. Maybe Marchand but Krejci would fetch a good amount more.BoSoxFink said:
McQuaid is useless given Miller basically does the same at a similar skill level for less money. Love Quaider but so goes the business.RedOctober3829 said:
Doesn't really make sense. He's young, reliable, and pretty cheap for the production he brings. They pretty much need him given Chara is already in his decline phase and the uncertainty with Seidenberg.RedOctober3829 said:
Dude, really.kenneycb said:
I never said anything about the locker room dynamic. I suggested that what I saw on the ice was a team that was playing not to lose (Lucic said as much the other night). Playing not to lose is, in my opinion, experience—and observation in this series—a function of insufficient desire. That's it, no more and no less. You asked me what evidence I had, I gave you the context for my opinion which you challenged. That's a little different than randomly playing the experience card. I don't do that and I haven't done that—been deliberate about it.kenneycb said:
No I'm actually not at all. I'm just not looking at the result through in a doom and gloom blow it all up prism because, as I said, that's just sheer idiocy. But to say they choked is basically the definition of a hot sports take. They got outplayed and beat by a team they didn't match very well against. It happens. It sucks. And it's annoying. I apologize for not using hyperbole in this post.Kenny F'ing Powers said:
I'm just pissed they don't show Brutus the Barber Beefcake as the celebrity fan anymore. I miss those halcyon days when they didn't have enough heart to finish out Carolina or Philly at home. Unfortunately the only significant changes were 86ing Brutus and look where we stand now! The team has cap space, a youngish core is locked up and they just won the President's Cup. Bit dammit, the loss of Brutus really showed tonight.Ed Hillel said:
I dont think they should blow it up.kenneycb said:
Unforced errors all over the ice throughout the series that had nothing—nothing to do with what their opponents were doing in that moment. That's beating yourself. That's not having your head screwed on right. Clear, unobstructed (by fear) desire—screws your head on right. I don't know from Brutus.kenneycb said:
The mental game, in general, is mostly locker room prep. There on ice stuff but that generally refers to keeping your cool and those things. You are saying they didn't get into the correct state if mind. IMO, and in my personal experience, that comes with getting yourself right leading up to the game. Putting the burden of proof on me to prove they didn't want it is dumb because it's an unanswerable question. They're pro athletes and are more competitive than 99.9% of the population. They also have three of the most well respected players in the game (Z, Bergy, Iggy) as well as a bunch of hour guys like Thornton, Campbell and an injured Kelly. Oh and Humpty Dumpty behind the bench and a mother fucking crazy man in the executive suites. Now I can't quantify desire, nor can you, but I can look at these qualitative factors, as well as the games, and say I think your point is overblown.catomatic said:
Sums it up, for me. I understand this is a game thread on the night of an absolute soul crushing series loss, but the extremes that have been discussed these last couple of hours are a little outrageous. We had multiple defensive gaffes. We missed multiple open nets. We hit multiple posts. We had multiple starters injured. We had multiple forwards play with their heads in their own asses. Our Vezina-level goalie wasn't at his best, nor was our Norris-level captain. There were 1,000 variables that added up to us losing to what happens to be the shittiest professional sports team on the planet. It sucks mounds of dick. I refuse, however, to believe that one of those losing variables was a lack of desire or heart or character. This is basically the same team that came back against Toronto last year and a large portion of the team that kept sacking the hell up in 2011. Can't win them all, I just hate it was against those twats from Montreal.kenneycb said:
I'll be honest, I have no idea what you're saying but I see you're taking my quoted post way too seriously.catomatic said:
This post is very rational. Sadly the playoffs aren't always rational. So it goes.Kenny F'ing Powers said:
Nor was I. I simply suggested rotating the Dmen to keep the important ones fresher at the end. I admitted to spitballing on how to do that. Were there other problems? Fuck ya. I dont know how to to tell Marchand, Krejci, etc "dont suck," but keeping Chara with some energy seems like something approachable with the roster currently. Do I think Claude will?? No, Chara probably starts next year as D1. But coming up with ideas seems reasonable (because we all know Claude trolls SoSH for ideas.)kenneycb said:
There's no problem with bitching. And there will be changes because that happens every year. I take umbrage with the hyperbole and saying this was an epic choke job or something of the like. Because, at least IMO, it wasn't even close to Philly or Carolina. It wasn't a good loss but it's not anything that needs to signal widespread change or anything from a young team that was 1.5 minutes from playing in a do or die for the Cup 10 months ago.Jungleland said:
