Cheesesteaks vs. Chowdah Part I - The Sixers/Celtics Series Thread

[wade boggs chicken dinner]

According to this report, the Lakers can create $69M in cap space by getting rid of Randle and stretching Deng. In addition to the players listed above, they could then bring back Frye and IT.

If LBJ goes to LA, it's more than about basketball. Apparently, one of the big reasons LBJ is considering LA (and the reason he has two houses there) is to be close to the movie/film business to set up his post-basketball businesses, which people expect will be heavily focused on media.

 

[Van Everyman]

I have to think at this point the 76ers would be thrilled to get Rondo out of Fultz. He could end up being a better player, but he also may never come close to that level. Who knows? His confidence might be permanently shot, and ironically, you're comparing him to a player who's had an over-abundance of confidence since his rookie campaign. I think his floor is much worse considering what we've seen.

Two thoughts. First, isn't Fultz's floor being a complete bust? And second, how hilarious would it be if the Sixers end up moving him next year only for him to end up being an Evan Turner-y success story on the C's under Stevens? I feel like this would be the ultimate stake in the heart of the Process.

 

[Marbleheader]

 

[Soxfan in Fla]

That’s awesome. Lol.

 

[Manzivino]

As WBCD says, LeBron to LA would be more about non-basketball reasons. I don’t think it happens because from a basketball sense it just puts him in wars with GS/Houston before the Finals instead of in them.

I’d have to look into the cap a little more closely but if they buy he’s healthy Philly could conceivably trade for Kawhi (picks + Fultz/Covington and Fultz/Bayless/filler both work) and still have max space.

 

[Jed Zeppelin]

Fultz is untradeable until anybody knows if he can shoot. Or play.

 

[southshoresoxfan]

Shocking outcome to that game w Brothers and Foster. The NBA is annoyingly obvious at times.

Vet move to balance the calls once the game was out of hand too. Oh well.

 

[DeJesus Built My Hotrod]

Shocking outcome to that game w Brothers and Foster. The NBA is annoyingly obvious at times.

Vet move to balance the calls once the game was out of hand too. Oh well.

Well, some takes have the Celtics treating this game if it was already theirs from the tip and essentially not showing up to play. I don't agree with that view and I do think the way the game was called favored Philadelphia's style of play this evening.

That said, the Celtics didn't hit their open shots and their rebounding deficiency worked strongly in the 76ers favor. On the flip side, their defense was pretty solid - the Sixers shot worse than Boston at 40.4 from the field and 26.9 from deep - so if they can sustain that effort back home, you have to feel good about their chances. Saric and McConnell got what they wanted tonight but the rest of the team was pretty well contained. If either or both those guys regress, this series likely ends Wednesday night. If they get off again, this series may end up going the distance.

 

[chilidawg]

McConnell out playing Rozier will have to change if the Celtics want to win the next game. Complain all you want about the refs, but Philly was the aggressor from the start and took the C's out of their offensive flow.

 

[heavyde050]

McConnell out playing Rozier will have to change if the Celtics want to win the next game. Complain all you want about the refs, but Philly was the aggressor from the start and took the C's out of their offensive flow.

I do agree with the general premise, but it is easy to be the aggressor when the refs don’t call the fouls on your team. Conversely, the Celtics couldn’t be too aggressive with all the foul trouble.

 

[LondonSox]

To anyone who says how would Fultz fit with Philly, this is a pretty good example.
TJ on Rozier was a good move and trying to use their size advantage inside also.

I'm glad they didn't lay the egg the raptors have and it could of been a fun series if they didn't puke down their own leg on every key moment in game 3.

I don't see it going past 5 but hey we shall see

 

[wade boggs chicken dinner]

The talent level between the two teams seems pretty even to me and frankly, this series should probably be tied 2-2. But it isn't, thank God, so the Cs still have a margin for error and PHI does not.

 

[soxin6]

McConnell out playing Rozier will have to change if the Celtics want to win the next game. Complain all you want about the refs, but Philly was the aggressor from the start and took the C's out of their offensive flow.

Both players feed off the crowd and the Celtics will be at home. I expect that Rozier will play much better than he did in game 4 and that the Celtics close the Sixers out.

 

[benhogan]

To anyone who says how would Fultz fit with Philly, this is a pretty good example.
TJ on Rozier was a good move and trying to use their size advantage inside also.

I'm glad they didn't lay the egg the raptors have and it could of been a fun series if they didn't puke down their own leg on every key moment in game 3.

I don't see it going past 5 but hey we shall see

Starting TJ was a ballsy (and right) call by Brett Brown. TJ delivered as he has all series, nice playoff adjustment by the coach.

Hopefully, the home whistle continues in this series and the Celts finish this off on Weds. The last thing we want (as Celtic fans) is the Lebrons comfortably sitting back and watching Embiid & Co use our guards as bowling pins for 3 more games.

I don't understand what you are saying about Fultz fit and equating it to TJ's play tonight? I have to think Markelle's '17-18 rookie season has concluded w/his 6th straight DNP.

 

[djbayko]

Wow, Vegas is not giving the Celtics any respect in this series. The spread is currently +1.5...as in they're underdogs...at home.

 

[BigSoxFan]

Wow, Vegas is not giving the Celtics any respect in this series. The spread is currently +1.5...as in they're underdogs...at home.

That’s about as good of a chance to make some coin as you’ll have in sports betting.

 

[BaseballJones]

That’s about as good of a chance to make some coin as you’ll have in sports betting.

I'd never bet on sports but that's the kind of line that could actually tempt me.

 

[biff_hardbody]

That says a lot about how Vegas expects game 5 to be officiated, no?

 

[Red Averages]

That says a lot about how Vegas expects game 5 to be officiated, no?

It says far less about that and more that they have favored Philly in every game. Games 1 & 2 they were favored by about 5 points. The fact that it is down to 1 means that Vegas is starting to adjust but haven’t come all the way.

 

[bosockboy]

That says a lot about how Vegas expects game 5 to be officiated, no?

Yep, it scares me.

 

[Light-Tower-Power]

Wow, Vegas is not giving the Celtics any respect in this series. The spread is currently +1.5...as in they're underdogs...at home.

May need to take an emergency trip to Vegas.

 

[mt8thsw9th]

Wow, Vegas is not giving the Celtics any respect in this series. The spread is currently +1.5...as in they're underdogs...at home.

It's been easy money (nearly) all series.

 

[Jed Zeppelin]

That says a lot about how Vegas expects game 5 to be officiated, no?

This is not my area of expertise at all but based on what I’ve read here in BBtL, it has nothing to do with this and a lot to do with where the bets are coming from.

 

[Soxfan in Fla]

Before this series I didn’t have much of an opinion of Embiid. This series has created a healthy dislike of him and also exposed the fact that he is terribly inefficient, or at least has been in this series.

 

[chilidawg]

This is not my area of expertise at all but based on what I’ve read here in BBtL, it has nothing to do with this and a lot to do with where the bets are coming from.

You're disrupting the narrative here. It's all about the refs.

 

[nighthob]

You're disrupting the narrative here. It's all about the refs.

"Celtics have lost their last 7 playoff games officiated by Tony Brothers"

 

[Saints Rest]

Any word on Larkin? Looked like a separated (not dislocated) shoulder (i.e. AC joint) to me. If so, I would guess he's done for the series, and maybe the year. The way he went right to the locker room without even letting a trainer look at it made me think it was pretty severe.

 

[Saints Rest]

PS: I can't believe we could be worried about Shane Larkin. When he was signed, there was some doubt as to whether he would even make the active 12.

 

[djbayko]

It says far less about that and more that they have favored Philly in every game. Games 1 & 2 they were favored by about 5 points. The fact that it is down to 1 means that Vegas is starting to adjust but haven’t come all the way.

Yeah, this is correct. Vegas loves Philly and has been favoring them all series, even after the Celtics exposed them in Games 1 and 2. Sometimes Vegas is stubborn and really slow to adjust, like with the Jags and Rams this past season.

It's been easy money (nearly) all series.

Yes, I've made a lot of money on this series, mostly on series handicaps. The odds the have been giving for the Celtics to win just one more game in the series have been ridiculous. I've already cashed big twice and hope to do it one more time.

 

[wade boggs chicken dinner]

PS: I can't believe we could be worried about Shane Larkin. When he was signed, there was some doubt as to whether he would even make the active 12.

Imaging today.

It's amazing that Shane Larkin was playing meaningful minutes in the playoffs for the Cs when he was signed to be the fourth ballhandler.

 

[mauf]

Well, some takes have the Celtics treating this game if it was already theirs from the tip and essentially not showing up to play. I don't agree with that view and I do think the way the game was called favored Philadelphia's style of play this evening.

I don’t think the C’s mailed it in, but when you get outrebounded and only force 4 turnovers in the first 42 minutes, people are going to say things like that.

 

[JCizzle]

I don’t think the C’s mailed it in, but when you get outrebounded and only force 4 turnovers in the first 42 minutes, people are going to say things like that.

To me it was more the C's turnovers than lack of forcing any. Philly was certainly playing more aggressive on ball handlers than in previous games (likely emboldened by the zebras to some extent), but Smart and others also had a couple of very lazy passes. I know Philly can run off misses in addition to turnovers, but limiting the latter seems to be the easiest thing to control.

 

[Red Averages]

Lots of turnovers, bad shooting, out rebounded and some bad foul trouble. Fortunately, none of that carries over from game to game and they can refocus and come out strong for game 5. Philly feeds off of turnovers, just avoid the sloppiness and we should be fine.

 

[joe dokes]

To me it was more the C's turnovers than lack of forcing any. Philly was certainly playing more aggressive on ball handlers than in previous games (likely emboldened by the zebras to some extent), but Smart and others also had a couple of very lazy passes. I know Philly can run off misses in addition to turnovers, but limiting the latter seems to be the easiest thing to control.

I think one adjustment will be to defend McConnell like they do Simmons. Off him enough to give him the 3 if he wants to take it, but not so far that he can build up the head of steam on a drive. They seemed to be playing him more like Redick, when McConnell much prefers driving to 3's.

 

[JakeRae]

To me it was more the C's turnovers than lack of forcing any. Philly was certainly playing more aggressive on ball handlers than in previous games (likely emboldened by the zebras to some extent), but Smart and others also had a couple of very lazy passes. I know Philly can run off misses in addition to turnovers, but limiting the latter seems to be the easiest thing to control.

Several of those "turnovers" we're the product of repeated hacking of the arms of the person with the ball on the Celtics. Others were cheap offensive fouls. The turnover story, as with so many things, isn't something you can necessarily disentangle from the way the game was called.

 

[DJnVa]

Yes, I've made a lot of money on this series, mostly on series handicaps. The odds the have been giving for the Celtics to win just one more game in the series have been ridiculous. I've already cashed big twice and hope to do it one more time.

At this moment I can get either:

The Celtics to win series in 5 at +100 or the Celtics +1 for game for -110.

 

[AimingForYoko]

Yeah, this is correct. Vegas loves Philly and has been favoring them all series, even after the Celtics exposed them in Games 1 and 2. Sometimes Vegas is stubborn and really slow to adjust, like with the Jags and Rams this past season.

Not to go full conspiracy theorist but I hope this is just what it is. The fact that Philly is still favoured tomorrow is making me think something is afoot.

 

[reggiecleveland]

The Sixers are really good, and the Celtics will need to play really well to beat them. I feel game 5 is almost must win for the Celtics.

 

[johnmd20]

Not to go full conspiracy theorist but I hope this is just what it is. The fact that Philly is still favoured tomorrow is making me think something is afoot.

There's nothing afoot, Sherlock. Philly is a pretty good team and the Celtics have been playing above their heads, due to Philly's inexperience and the wonderful Brad Stevens. These ref conspiracy theories are just impossible to believe. If there was a concerted effort to fix a professional NBA basketball playoff game, it would leak, and the league would be potentially ruined.

Why would the NBA ever do that? I think the simplest answer is the right one. Philly has a good team and the Celtics are without their two best players.

 

[Soxfan in Fla]

There's nothing afoot, Sherlock. Philly is a pretty good team and the Celtics have been playing above their heads, due to Philly's inexperience and the wonderful Brad Stevens. These ref conspiracy theories are just impossible to believe. If there was a concerted effort to fix a professional NBA basketball playoff game, it would leak, and the league would be potentially ruined.

Why would the NBA ever do that? I think the simplest answer is the right one. Philly has a good team and the Celtics are without their two best players.

Then let’s just go with the refs were horrific and totally let the Philly Home crowd influence them for the last two games.

 

[LondonSox]

There's nothing afoot, Sherlock. Philly is a pretty good team and the Celtics have been playing above their heads, due to Philly's inexperience and the wonderful Brad Stevens. These ref conspiracy theories are just impossible to believe. If there was a concerted effort to fix a professional NBA basketball playoff game, it would leak, and the league would be potentially ruined.

Why would the NBA ever do that? I think the simplest answer is the right one. Philly has a good team and the Celtics are without their two best players.

Not to mention the league isn't exactly pro the sixers success, they hate the process and jumped in to get Hinkie removed.
The idea they would be in favour of the sixers is a bit much. They may be in favour of a longer series of course but the simplest explanation is that the sixers were more agressive in a home game and bad refs are more influenced by a loud home crowd than good ones.

I honestly think the ref shows are typically just that, not great referees being influenced by the home crowd.

Now if the sixers get all the calls in Boston we can discuss again.

 

[tims4wins]

Celts were superior in game 1. Game 2 was fairly even. Game 3 was fairly even. Game 4 was more Sixers. This could not only be tied 2-2, it could easily be 3-1 Sixers.

 

[JCizzle]

Then let’s just go with the refs were horrific and totally let the Philly Home crowd influence them for the last two games.

There's something... weird about losing 8 straight playoff games with Tony Brothers. Reddit detective listed the games and one was a coinflip. One huge blowout loss to LBJ. Multiple home games. At some point the odds have to catch up, I hope.

https://www.reddit.com/r/bostonceltics/comments/8hswo6/here_are_the_8_straight_celtic_playoff_games/

Round 2, Game 4 @ Philly 103-92 LOSS

Round 1, Game 6 @ Milwaukee 97-86 LOSS

Round 3, Game 2 vs Cleveland 130-86 LOSS

Round 2, Game 6 @ Washington 92-91 LOSS

Round 1, Game 6 vs Atlanta 104-92 LOSS

Round 1, Game 2 @ Atlanta 89-72 LOSS

Round 1, Game 4 vs Cleveland 101-93 LOSS

Round 3, Game 6 vs Miami 98-79 LOSS

 

[Red Averages]

The Sixers are really good, and the Celtics will need to play really well to beat them. I feel game 5 is almost must win for the Celtics.

The Celtics are 2-0 at home and 1-1 vs Philly on the road this series. Why would game 5 be a must win?! The 76ers would have maybe a 30% shot to win the series even if they won game 5. Even game 6 wouldn't be a must win. Game 7 is the only time we would have a must win.

 

[LondonSox]

Sixers have their own Tony Brothers hate, as do most teams. He just fucking sucks.

The best call I saw all season vs us was his calling a shot clock violation with like 2 seconds left on the shot clock.

The guy is just shit.

 

[AimingForYoko]

Not to mention the league isn't exactly pro the sixers success, they hate the process and jumped in to get Hinkie removed.
The idea they would be in favour of the sixers is a bit much. They may be in favour of a longer series of course but the simplest explanation is that the sixers were more agressive in a home game and bad refs are more influenced by a loud home crowd than good ones.

I honestly think the ref shows are typically just that, not great referees being influenced by the home crowd.

Now if the sixers get all the calls in Boston we can discuss again.

I don't think they're in anyone's favour but it wouldn't shock me if they just wanted to avoid having sweeps everywhere after last year. I realize that I now sound like Charlie Kelly (or JtB) but Scott Foster should not have a job in professional sports after the Donaghy thing. But the league wanted to say it was one rogue ref so they swept it away and here we are all these years later. But as you say, I want to see how Game 5 goes before I go full Illuminati.

 

[BigSoxFan]

The Celtics are 2-0 at home and 1-1 vs Philly on the road this series. Why would game 5 be a must win?! The 76ers would have maybe a 30% shot to win the series even if they won game 5. Even game 6 wouldn't be a must win. Game 7 is the only time we would have a must win.

Yeah, the Sixers are going to have to play incredibly well to take 2 straight home games from Boston, including a Game 7 where the home team wins about 80% of the time. As a Celtics fan, I'm ecstatic to be up 3-1 at this point.

 

[Van Everyman]

I don't think they're in anyone's favour but it wouldn't shock me if they just wanted to avoid having sweeps everywhere after last year. I realize that I now sound like Charlie Kelly (or JtB) but Scott Foster should not have a job in professional sports after the Donaghy thing. But the league wanted to say it was one rogue ref so they swept it away and here we are all these years later. But as you say, I want to see how Game 5 goes before I go full Illuminati.

Dare I ask what Scott Foster did?

BTW IIRC, Donaghy himself said that one of the biggest bones officials had to pick was with a player who never, ever got the benefit of the doubt or calls from any officials because they hated him.

That player was... Allen Iverson.

 

[jasail]

Not putting the Sixers away yesterday was a bummer, but not entirely unexpected. Brown made some good counter-adjustments with getting the ball to Saric in the post and upping TJ's usage. On the other side, the C's couldn't counter, made a ton of sloppy plays, had poor shot selection and got out rebounded.

However, it's hard not to feel pretty good heading home up 3-1. C's are in the catbird seat. They may not be the more talented team, but they are tougher and better coached and only need to win one more. Brad will have time to make counter-adjustments. Role players tend to struggle on the road and Philly will need big nights from 2-3 these guys because the C's have proven to be able to effectively contain JoJo and Ben. The Garden crowd will be rocking and Philly is a soft front running group.

Plus, in G4 you got the Brothers/Foster Zebra Hit Unit. They put the C's in foul trouble early, which in turn made them less aggressive. Concurrently, they allowed the Sixers to play mauling defense on the other end and got the Sixers off front running with the home crowd into it. I can't expect the whistles will go like that again in Boston.

It's be nice to get Mook going like he was at the start of the Bucks series. Not only will his scoring be an asset, but he's the type of player that can goad JoJo into being dumb.

 

[Red Averages]

Dare I ask what Scott Foster did?

Well for starters, he received 134 phone calls from Donaghy during the season in which Donaghy was caught. The only person he called more (150) was the middleman for the operation.