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Celebrating What Is

Discussion in 'Blinded by the Lombardis: Patriots Forum' started by mwonow, Sep 14, 2015.

  1. BaseballJones

    BaseballJones goalpost mover SoSH Member

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    Awesome stuff. I think it shows that the most important skills for a QB are: (1) Ability to read and understand a defense, and to know what the right play is, and (2) throwing an accurate ball.

    It's not that arm strength and foot speed are unimportant or unhelpful. But if you have (1) and (2) above, you can be very very successful in the NFL. And Brady obviously has both in spades.
     
  2. E5 Yaz

    E5 Yaz Transcends message boarding Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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  3. Jim Ed Rice in HOF

    Jim Ed Rice in HOF Red-headed Skrub child SoSH Member

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  4. simplyeric

    simplyeric aggressively nonsensical SoSH Member

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    I love how modest that boat is.
    I mean, except for the name.
    Edit: Covered hours earlier in the other thread. Hmph.
     
    #3804 simplyeric, Feb 11, 2019
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2019
  5. bootymfg

    bootymfg lurker

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    Before we go ascribing Intangibles (and welcoming comparisons to Bonds), how much of this trend is attributable to league-wide changes? How has league average ANY/A changed over that time?

    I don't see a league adjusted version ANY/A, but just looking quickly, Eli was 20th this year with a 6.21. That would have ranked 5th in 2001 (with a sizeable gap over #6 Peyton with 5.88). In 2010, it would have ranked 12th, coming in just ahead of 2010 Eli, who had 6.09. So Brady isn't the only one whose ANY/A is better these days than back in the day.

     
  6. InstaFace

    InstaFace MDLzera

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    Well, I gave a lot more stats, including year-by-year assessment context for both statistics, over in the Brady thread. We can take it over there.

    ...except first, I'll echo one point from over there: There was a jump from 2003 to 2004 of almost a full ANY/A yard among the entire top 20 QBs in the league. Just an extraordinary degree of change. Wonder how that happened.

    (also, PFR has league-indexed, 100-mean stats for passers in like 10 different categories, including ANY/A and passer rating, so you can peruse those if interested - I go into that in the other post)
     
  7. Dogman2

    Dogman2 Yukon Cornelius Dope

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    13,542
    Let's add to the discussion instead of posting memes or every thought that pops into your head.

    Thanks.
     
  8. tims4wins

    tims4wins PN23's replacement SoSH Member

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    I get where you are coming from, but I am genuinely curious whether instaface was being serious with his "not sure how that happened" comment.
     
  9. InstaFace

    InstaFace MDLzera

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    I was not. I guess the italics was still too subtle.
     
  10. Jimbodandy

    Jimbodandy Member SoSH Member

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    Dumb question perhaps, but was that the implementation of the Polian rules?
     
  11. johnmd20

    johnmd20 literally like ebola Lifetime Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    Yes. And yes.
     
  12. mwonow

    mwonow Well-Known Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    So there are almost as many threads on BB as DJT, but I feel like we need to include another BB shoutout here.

    From Mic'd Up - there's a great moment at 29:18 where BB looks at the way the Rams D is aligned (1:1 on Gronk on the outside) and mutters, "we might have a shot here." At 32:46 he sees Goff throw a duck and states what should happen next: "Intercept it." And at the point at which this clip is supposed to pick up (30:26), where BB says to his D "They can't beat us....if we're on it (or is that "honest"?), they don't got anything."

    BB, for who football is like a clear glass windowpane - he sees right through it.
     
  13. snowmanny

    snowmanny Well-Known Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    Posting this over here from the NFL rules thread. 3/3 taking the ball in OT and winning is a remarkable achievement that I haven't heard mentioned enough.

    Also, in addition to the 15 play/61 yard game-winning drive vs Oakland, the 8 play/75 yard game-winning drive vs. Atlanta, and the 13 play/75 yard game winning drive vs. KC, Brady of course had the drives to win Pats-I and Pats-II Super Bowls (9 plays/53 yards vs STL and 6/37 vs CAR). This gives him and the Pats five playoff games they took the ball after a kickoff and ended up with a walk-off win.
     
  14. tims4wins

    tims4wins PN23's replacement SoSH Member

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    Technical point but XXXVIII it wasn't the last play of the game - the Pats had to kick off.
     
  15. snowmanny

    snowmanny Well-Known Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    You're right I totally forgot that. So only the four walk offs.
     
  16. Old Fart Tree

    Old Fart Tree the maven of meat Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    And He Hate Me took the kick like it was a preseason game. It was weird.
     
  17. dynomite

    dynomite Member SoSH Member

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    It was completely bizarre.

    I just found this oral history from Vinateri and Smart about the end of that Super Bowl, and while Vinateri’s awesome it still doesn’t explain what the hell Smart was thinking. Here’s the closest he comes:

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sb...vinatieri-rod-smart-game-winning-kick-houston

    This reminds me of that clip of McDaniels at halftime in the Falcons Super Bowl down 21-3 where he gathers the running backs and says “Do you guys believe we’re going to win? Great, me too, but don’t try to do anything you can’t do. Just take it one play at a time.”

    Smart was trying to do the impossible with no trickery or attempt to confuse the Patriots on that last play, literally just playing hero ball.
     
  18. tims4wins

    tims4wins PN23's replacement SoSH Member

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    https://www.rotoworld.com/article/goal-line-stand/nfls-best-coaches-2019

    1. Bill Belichick
    Career Record: 261-123 (.680)
    With The Patriots Since: 2000
    Last Year’s Ranking: 1

    2018 was the Patriots’ worst regular season since 2009. They went 11-5. The last time Bill Belichick’s team notched fewer than 10 wins was 2002. They have averaged 13 victories since 2003. As head coach of the New England Patriots, Belichick has won 11.3 percent of the Super Bowls ever played. The last three times he lost a playoff game, he hoisted a Lombardi the following year. Belichick’s death star has no design flaws. There are only strengths to be improved upon. On the rare occasions Belichick loses control, order is immediately restored. Seth Wickersham exposed some nasty behind-the-scenes dysfunction in January 2018. Belichick’s response? Make the Super Bowl twice in the next 13 months. Challengers come and go. Occasionally, a Nick Foles or David Tyree pulls a fast one. More typical is what happened to Andy Reid and Sean McVay’s “future of football” in the postseason. Reid and McVay really are moving the game forward, but it’s to a place Belichick has already been. He is the sport’s all-seeing eye. Only he will decide when to close it.
     
  19. InstaFace

    InstaFace MDLzera

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    I will never tire of seeing articles that link to that salty-as-seaweed Ray Ratto deadspin piece, nor this bit from said piece:

    That's a Diablo 2 reference, isn't it?
     
  20. Rough Carrigan

    Rough Carrigan reasons within Reason Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Yeah, we typically want our super bowls to be filled with whimsy.
     
  21. SMU_Sox

    SMU_Sox loves his fluffykins SoSH Member

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    @InstaFace There is no cow level. Come on now ;)
     
  22. Al Zarilla

    Al Zarilla Member SoSH Member

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    We’re lucky he didn’t ride off into the sunset after the 2014 or 2016 or 2018 seasons. Same with Tom.
     
  23. BaseballJones

    BaseballJones goalpost mover SoSH Member

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    Just because I was going over the Super Bowl again.... looking at the box score...wow the Patriots really dominated the game.

    First downs: NE 22, LA 14
    Rush yards: NE 154, LA 62
    Pass yards: NE 253, LA 198 (including sacks)
    Total yards: NE 407, LA 260
    TOP: NE 33:10, LA 26:50

    And that all includes the Rams' last drive which was kind of garbage time (of sorts), in which they gained 45 pretty useless yards. Without that, the Rams are held to just 215 total yards, which is pretty amazing.
     
  24. Van Everyman

    Van Everyman Member SoSH Member

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  25. Super Nomario

    Super Nomario Member SoSH Member

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    I wrote about this for ITP; the game really should have been a blowout, but the Pats couldn't do anything offensively on LA's side of the field, and Johnny Hekker kept flipping field position with his punts so the Patriots couldn't even get FGs out of their yardage edge: http://insidethepylon.com/nfl/teams...ots/2019/02/07/super-bowl-liii-blowout-wasnt/
     
  26. BaseballJones

    BaseballJones goalpost mover SoSH Member

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    Good article. I know that LA had the two chances to Cooks that he dropped and/or had the Pats break up. Plus the FG attempt late. Otherwise, they didn't really have any other scoring chances.

    The Patriots definitely stalled.

    Pats' possessions (not counting kneel downs)
    First possession: Marched right down the field to the LA 34 and then had the Brady interception.

    Second possession: Marched right down the field to the LA 33 and had a first and ten there, but then stalled and Ghost missed a FG.

    Third possession: Marched from the NE 19 to the LA 40, but the drive stalled and they punted.

    Fourth possession: Marched from the NE 37 down to the LA 24 and kicked a FG.

    Fifth possession: Three and out, ended up punting.

    Sixth possession: Drove from the NE 27 all the way to the LA 32. Instead of kicking another FG, they went for it on fourth down and failed to convert.

    Seventh possession: Drove from the NE 8 to the NE 49 - thus gaining 41 useful yards before stalling and punting.

    Eight possession: A penalty, but essentially a three and out for a punt.

    Ninth possession: Moved from the NE 25 out to the LA 44, but couldn't convert a 3rd and 4 and punted.

    Tenth possession: 69 yard touchdown drive.

    Eleventh possession: 72 yard drive ending in a game-clinching FG.

    So yeah, other than basically two possessions (their 5th and 8th), they moved the ball well and put themselves in a position to score. They really should have scored a minimum of 6 more points (missed FG and the failed fourth down conversion), but had opportunities for a lot more points, despite only running one play in the red zone. LA was classic bend but don't break, allowing the Patriots to move the ball all night, changing field position, but rarely giving up points.

    It would have worked too, except that NE's defense was even better.
     
  27. rbeaud

    rbeaud Member SoSH Member

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    Was there something special about the LA kicking game that made Edelman play catches (or not) the way he did? For example, on that SB record punt a free catch would have saved several/many yards. It seemed that Edelman had a couple like that one. Maybe a few less yards to drive on one or two plays leads to more points.
     
  28. InstaFace

    InstaFace MDLzera

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    MVP posts from the super bowl gamethread.
     
  29. DennyDoyle'sBoil

    DennyDoyle'sBoil Found no thrill on Blueberry Hill SoSH Member

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    The missed FG and the turnover on downs were effectively like turnovers and so even though the game goes down in the books as 1:1 it was more like 3:1.

    The question I think is interesting to explore for the ITP type folks and others who understand Xs and Os is whether there was something about how the Rams played that contributed to bend but don't break. Just off the top of my head it seems like the open parts of the field were over the middle and it seemed relatively easier for the Patriots to take advantage of long fields but harder when the fields started to get more compressed.
     
  30. biff_hardbody

    biff_hardbody lurker

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    The Patriots haven't missed a Super Bowl since trading Jamie Collins. Today, he was released by the Browns.
     
  31. brandonchristensen

    brandonchristensen mad photochops SoSH Member

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    The Chiefs was the same IMO.

    The stats were bonkers.
     
  32. Rook05

    Rook05 Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    I love that whenever the NFL Network plays “Super Bowl Classics” there’s a good chance the Pats will be winning again.
     
  33. Super Nomario

    Super Nomario Member SoSH Member

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    That was more understandable because the Pats had two costly turnovers that represented almost a 14- point swing.
     
  34. Al Zarilla

    Al Zarilla Member SoSH Member

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    Or Top Ten Super Bowls (I don’t think it’s the same thing) now always has like 4 Patriots ones, and you just have to fast forward through that disgusting one, you know (I usually record and watch later).
     
  35. simplyeric

    simplyeric aggressively nonsensical SoSH Member

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    The Scottish Game.
     
  36. Bellhorn

    Bellhorn Lumiere SoSH Member

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    The record punt was a line drive on which he had to make a quick judgment call. And he may have been the slightest bit skittish after the near miss in KC
     
  37. Smiling Joe Hesketh

    Smiling Joe Hesketh All Hail King Boron Dope

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  38. PedroKsBambino

    PedroKsBambino Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Agreed. I know a lot of Pats-haters and that column more or less encapsulated where they all were after the game: unhappy with the game and the outcome, but with utmost respect for Belichick (first and foremost) and the Patriots and what they continue to accomplish.

    It is for me the greatest accomplishment of this team: they have won the respect of almost all of their most fervant haters. If I were Sptgy33 I'd say it's like a real-life version of the end of Rocky IV...
     
  39. Smiling Joe Hesketh

    Smiling Joe Hesketh All Hail King Boron Dope

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    Also, Ratto's first piece over at Deadspin was titled one thing but surprised me by coming to the conclusion in an entirely unexpected way:

    https://deadspin.com/hate-the-patriots-for-the-right-reason-1832130758

    Money quote:

     
  40. Al Zarilla

    Al Zarilla Member SoSH Member

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    Ratto is that way (salty or sarcastic, rarely complimentary) all the time, especially with the Bay Area teams he’s covered all his career. I like the guy.
     
  41. Al Zarilla

    Al Zarilla Member SoSH Member

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    Right. I prefer to not even acknowledge it with that handle.
     
  42. simplyeric

    simplyeric aggressively nonsensical SoSH Member

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    Oh it was salty as hell. Admiring, definitely. Begrudgingly admiring. But in what I felt to be (mostly) a fun way.
    edit: I mean "salty" in the sense of a cranky sports fan venting his frustration, not "salty" in the sense of tasty tears. They are definitely different.

    So, the Scottish Name for the...y'know...
     
  43. SumnerH

    SumnerH Malt Liquor Picker Dope

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    The Hebridean Game?
     
  44. Bergs

    Bergs Member SoSH Member

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  45. Al Zarilla

    Al Zarilla Member SoSH Member

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    You’ve snowed me again.
     
  46. simplyeric

    simplyeric aggressively nonsensical SoSH Member

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    No one is worried about the Hebrides.
     
  47. koufax32

    koufax32 He'll cry if he wants to... SoSH Member

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    Well, except for people who won’t make cakes for them.
     
  48. streeter88

    streeter88 Well-Known Member Silver Supporter SoSH Member

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    So funny, and so wrong at the same time.
     
  49. InstaFace

    InstaFace MDLzera

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  50. drleather2001

    drleather2001 given himself a skunk spot SoSH Member

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    “Bell, Brown and Ben formed the most famous WB, WR, RB combo since the 90s cowboys”

    I mean...not really? Kurt Warner, Isaac Bruce, Marshall Faulk and Manning, Edgerrin James, and Marvin Harrison were all, on par, more accomplished and famous than the three from Pitt.

    They are really good (well, BR is fine whatever) but I think the writer is begging the question a little bit. Or maybe just proceeding from a false premise. Don’t shoot me.
     

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