Not accurate.
Had first round grade on Tom Brady.
Polian said they didn't consider him because they had Manning.
Had first round grade on Tom Brady.
Polian said they didn't consider him because they had Manning.
When you have another team's draft picks posted in a thread -- you are owned heart and soul.
Some of these posts are decent. Like the ones that say forget the Pats, the Jets need to worry about the Jets. And the one that recognizes the Pats needed talent upgrade to maintain their place relative to everyone else.
The interesting posts speculate that Pats are in GFIN mode, and that bailing on a strong draft is unPatlike. Don't think that is right, but it's also not crazy.
Edit. GG certainly not alone in the "shock and awe" take on our offseason. That was the take by that NFLN panel, and it's now dominant theme of ESPN football page. Reiss says it looks like GFIN.
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I don't see the Pats in GFIN mode, and here's why.
The average NFL career is basically 3 years. They made three trades, and one non-Pats FA signing:
- Patriots dealt a 4th round pick (#137) to Indy for TE Allen and Indy's 6th round pick (#200).
- Patriots dealt a 2nd round pick (#64) to Carolina for DE Ealy and Carolina's 3rd round pick (#72).
- Patriots dealt a 1st round pick (#32) and a 3rd round pick (#103) to New Orleans for WR Cooks and New Orleans' 4th round pick (#118).
- Patriots signed CB Gilmore.
So of these four players....
- Gilmore is signed for 5 years.
- Allen is signed for 3 more years.
- Cooks is signed for 2 more years.
- Ealy is signed for 1 more year.
You could argue that Ealy is a GFIN trade, except that for him, it only cost the Patriots 8 slots in the draft.
You can't argue that the Gilmore signing is a GFIN signing, because he was signed for a market value, they had a need, and he may be there if the plan is to trade Butler for picks, in which case they're just swapping Butler and picks for Gilmore and picks (and money), but they'd get to keep Gilmore longer.
You can't argue that the Allen trade is a GFIN deal, because he's around for 3 more years at very reasonable money AND that also included swapping draft picks, not simply giving one up.
The only acquisition here that could reasonably be considered a GFIN deal was the trade for Cooks. Only here for two more years. Gave up a lot to get him.
What I don't understand about the Cooks deal, is if the Patriots knew they'd have to forfeit the Saints pick, why didn't they just take on a 5th and 7th round picks, or a 5th this year and a 6th next year, which would mean they'd have to have forfeited their original fourth rounder (which is a worse pick than the Saints' pick), but they add two late picks instead.
Anyway, I don't see this as a GFIN kind of offseason. I just think they're making great moves to improve the team for 2017 and beyond.
Since this is a "celebrating" thread, I'll take the plunge to share my celebration, having no idea whether this will resonate with anyone else here and/or whether I'll receive whatever ridicule I'll earn. The Megillah reading for Purim this morning took on an additional meaning for me, as one theme of this religious day is to see how we are saved from evildoers in every generation. I saw Atty. Pash as the evil Haman, Commissioner Ginger as the foolish and easily influenced King Achashverosh, Robert Kraft as Mordechai the Righteous, and TB12 as, forgive me, Queen Esther commenting "If I perish, I perish" as she clings to truth and courage. I saw Grigson, Mortensen, Ted Wells, and Exponent functionaries among the sons of Haman who were also executed. The Purim concept of everything is turned upside down was fulfilled by Deflategate leading to Jimmy G. being showcased for a little while, Brady being less spent during the post-season, the Super Bowl drama, and now this amazing off-season of assembling even greater talent going forward.
...and to complete the picture of inspiration on a "realer"-life level (at some moment, we are always brought back from sports-reality to life-reality), I caught up on some j-man postings late last night and today. We have a community of exceptionally talented contributors, crossing the lines of rooting interests (pause to consider some delightfully malicious thing to utter about the Jets, but defer for this moment). ...and that certainly is a lot to celebrate!
We now take you back to your own celebrations.
...and to complete the picture of inspiration on a "realer"-life level (at some moment, we are always brought back from sports-reality to life-reality), I caught up on some j-man postings late last night and today. We have a community of exceptionally talented contributors, crossing the lines of rooting interests (pause to consider some delightfully malicious thing to utter about the Jets, but defer for this moment). ...and that certainly is a lot to celebrate!
We now take you back to your own celebrations.
Fair amount of discussion on that on WFAN the past few days as well, both callers and fleshed out by hosts.
I have the same reaction to the notion that the Pats are in some kind of special GFIN mode that Belichick had to the notion that Tom was trying extra hard last year.
Tom always gives full effort and is 100 percent focused on winning, and I think that Bill always has the twin goals of winning a Super Bowl and building for the future so he can sustain the winning.
Said differently, the Pats are always in GFIN mode, but never with any sacrifice of the future.
And that's not to say that winning last year wasn't in fact extra sweet for Tom. I just don't think he pushed any less the year before, and I don't think Belichick is putting anything more on next season than he did on every other one.
And that's another thing to celebrate: The constant focus on the present and the future.
Tom always gives full effort and is 100 percent focused on winning, and I think that Bill always has the twin goals of winning a Super Bowl and building for the future so he can sustain the winning.
Said differently, the Pats are always in GFIN mode, but never with any sacrifice of the future.
And that's not to say that winning last year wasn't in fact extra sweet for Tom. I just don't think he pushed any less the year before, and I don't think Belichick is putting anything more on next season than he did on every other one.
And that's another thing to celebrate: The constant focus on the present and the future.
Rich Cimini adds to the Jets's woes:
1. Bah, humbug: Close your eyes and imagine this, Jets fans: You wake up, look under your free-agent Christmas tree and find ...
One of the premier cornerbacks on the market -- a replacement for Darrelle Revis.
A tight end for your new West Coast offense.
A playmaking wide receiver to replace Brandon Marshall.
A speedy edge rusher to complement Leonard Williams and Muhammad Wilkerson.
A fantasy-football wish list? Not really. The New England Patriots made it a reality with an uncharacteristic display of early activity, acquiring cornerback Stephon Gilmore, tight end Dwayne Allen, wide receiver Brandin Cooks and pass-rusher Kony Ealy.
Bill Belichick is the Grinch who stole the Jets' Christmas ...
http://www.espn.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/67433/sobering-reality-for-jets-bill-belichick-is-dominating-the-offseason-too
1. Bah, humbug: Close your eyes and imagine this, Jets fans: You wake up, look under your free-agent Christmas tree and find ...
One of the premier cornerbacks on the market -- a replacement for Darrelle Revis.
A tight end for your new West Coast offense.
A playmaking wide receiver to replace Brandon Marshall.
A speedy edge rusher to complement Leonard Williams and Muhammad Wilkerson.
A fantasy-football wish list? Not really. The New England Patriots made it a reality with an uncharacteristic display of early activity, acquiring cornerback Stephon Gilmore, tight end Dwayne Allen, wide receiver Brandin Cooks and pass-rusher Kony Ealy.
Bill Belichick is the Grinch who stole the Jets' Christmas ...
http://www.espn.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/67433/sobering-reality-for-jets-bill-belichick-is-dominating-the-offseason-too
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You forgot... an exceptionally promising young, handsome QB, stashed away in BB's closet.
I don't get it. The Pats won the Super Bowl with a pretty young team, so how much room for many draft picks this year.? The receiving corps was relatively old, however, and BB moved to make it younger. The Pats going from a typical 0 on prominent FA signings to a 1 hardly indicates a major sea change.
"The Patriots," as an entity, are even more of a celebrity after the SBLI win than they were during Deflategate. They get celebrity coverage, particularly in NY-centric media. Every move is bigger than it is on paper; every storyline is given more gravitas than many of them deserve. It's the nature of the beast, and the times
Excellent, L-R! Haman's "ear" and a football's "air" sound pretty much alike - Mortensen's ear was deflated such that he couldn't hear the correct information about the ideal gas law's impact on innocent footballs. As regards the prunes, it is humor like yours that keeps this site going.
Dealing Butler would be opposite of GFIN. Instead, such a deal would be very much in line with Pats past SOP.
I believe that's what Stitch is saying. That the current GFIN palaver ends if Butler is dealt
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I would consider trading JG go for it now, and Butler business as usual. So trading them both for picks is kind of more mixed signals imo.
I think this is right. They've traded a bunch of draft picks, but the players they've added have been young. There's no reason to think anything they've done this offseason will negatively impact their ability to field a good team four or five years from now.
That said, the moves have been out of character. My suspicion is that while normally they feel like the bargains are found a few days after FA opens, with the increased cap space so many teams have, they figured the bargains would be early. We're seeing the sort of flattening in salary that the NBA has, where the superstars sign for X and the second-tier guys sign for 85% of X and the superstars actually become the bargain contracts at a lot of positions (to leave the Pats totally out of this, look at LT - Whitworth, Okung, Reiff, Kalil all signed for essentially the same AAV).
I don't know how to interpret them trading draft picks, but I do think the quality of the draft has been overblown. The Combine was not kind to the RBs, DLs, and edge rushers, three of the groups that were supposed to be strong. QB, OL, WR, and off-ball LB were already considered pretty weak. They may see this as 2013 redux. Or maybe they think they can find guys in the middle rounds they like just as much as the early rounds. Or maybe they think the rising cap means having 5 years of cost control on a first-rounder doesn't mean as much as it used to.
All possible. And also possible, they are weighting the next two years a little more than the subsequent 2-3. I don't think saying that requires one to believe in full GFIN hysteria---it just reflects a higher delta at QB slot as you get farther out in time, and given importance of the role a slightly higher discount rate for future years than they might have used in the past. So getting more sure-thing production next two years is worth a little more than in the past, and that's ok by me...there is clearly no huge dumping the future going on here to date.
When I look at the moves, Cooks is the only one I see as GFINy. Ealy cost them only 8 picks and he's replacing two older players (Long and Sheard). Swapping Bennett for Allen is the antithesis of GFIN, as Allen isn't quite as good as Bennett but is younger and cheaper. Swapping Ryan for Gilmore isn't really GFIN - it's a long-term investment in a better player who makes $3 MM / year more annually but is only six months older. I guess you could say re-signing Branch is GFIN given his age, but the contract is modest and he was really good. Ditto the modest deals for Develin and Harmon and Guy. And we still don't know what will happen with Hightower or Butler or Garoppolo.
EDIT: And the GFIN theory really weakens if you take a longer timeline than this offseason, considering they dealt away Jones and Collins in the last year, which created the cap room for doing all the stuff they've done this offseason and added draft picks / young players.
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Yes, my comment was about possibly weighting next couple years a little more than normal. That applies to Cooks, Ealy, Branch, and effectively Gilmore given their deals. One can argue otherwise on any of those too--just a possibility. Do not think there's logic to arguing they are in any full in GFIN status.
Feel like we are poisoning a joyous thread with a completely separate discussion. Clicking here should never result in me doubting BB. Ever.
New GFIN thread?
New GFIN thread?
Yeah that last banner is too cute by half...could we just stop with the remaking of the banner jokes. We get it..it isn't funny anymore..
That's the best part though.
Anyone who wants it to be GFIN can look and say "he's fucking going for it!", if they really want to.
Anyone who wants it to be "this is standard BB stuff, maximize chance to win, but always keep a long-term view."
He's Janus.
I had forgotten, until I watched the Wilfork video below, that the ButtFumble was actually the second time Wilfork had used a Jets lineman's ass to cause a scoring play fumble that year. In October he used Matthew Slauson's tush to disrupt a handoff between Sanchez and Green and get a safety. Of course in November he turned Brandon Moore into a human rump missile and dislodged the ball from Sanchez with a resultant TD. There's an excellent shot of the latter BF in the video below which really shows the extraordinary degree to which Wilfork maximized the acceleration of Moore's gluteus. The Jets plays commence at 2:58 but start at 2:45 to watch what Wilfork did to Donald Jones.
Thanks for this. I love Vince. Had to watch the whole thing, and then re-watch Donald Jones and the BF a few more times just for (kind of maniacal) giggles...
That whole video is 7 minutes of awesome. The bit with the Dolphin linebacker saying how he had a man crush on Vince was so great.
While I also miss Vince, I'm psyched it appears he did end up playing his last game in the NFL in Gillette.
While I also miss Vince, I'm psyched it appears he did end up playing his last game in the NFL in Gillette.
Two good articles from Patspulpit recently.
http://www.patspulpit.com/2017/3/23/14999704/new-england-patriots-nfl-draft-pro-bowl-all-pro-2000-bill-belichick-tom-brady-cowboys-49ers
This pulls from a tweet that some guy wrote up. Looks at total number of draft picks since 2000 per team that have made the pro bowl or AP 1st Team. Pats are tied for the most at 79. Of note is that the Patriots have had the second-most draft picks over that time frame.
http://www.patspulpit.com/2017/3/22/15020566/bill-parcells-thinks-nfl-just-getting-easier-for-patriots-head-coach-bill-belichick-jacoby-brissett
This pulls from an ESPN radio interview.
Great quotes from Bill Parcells where he says that he thinks life is getting easier for Belichick because of his experience. More than ever before, Belichick can interview and analyze players and more easily predict how those players will fit into Belichick's organization based on comparisons with past players who have done well in Belichick's system.
http://www.patspulpit.com/2017/3/23/14999704/new-england-patriots-nfl-draft-pro-bowl-all-pro-2000-bill-belichick-tom-brady-cowboys-49ers
This pulls from a tweet that some guy wrote up. Looks at total number of draft picks since 2000 per team that have made the pro bowl or AP 1st Team. Pats are tied for the most at 79. Of note is that the Patriots have had the second-most draft picks over that time frame.
http://www.patspulpit.com/2017/3/22/15020566/bill-parcells-thinks-nfl-just-getting-easier-for-patriots-head-coach-bill-belichick-jacoby-brissett
This pulls from an ESPN radio interview.
Great quotes from Bill Parcells where he says that he thinks life is getting easier for Belichick because of his experience. More than ever before, Belichick can interview and analyze players and more easily predict how those players will fit into Belichick's organization based on comparisons with past players who have done well in Belichick's system.
Thanks for those.
Also, a pair of Reiss posts - excerpts from BB's interview on Coach K's show
http://www.espn.com/blog/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4802073/bill-belichick-our-guys-played-like-champions-in-the-last-20-minutes
http://www.espn.com/blog/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4802054/bill-belichick-to-coach-k-working-with-young-people-keeps-me-young
I liked this
Also, a pair of Reiss posts - excerpts from BB's interview on Coach K's show
http://www.espn.com/blog/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4802073/bill-belichick-our-guys-played-like-champions-in-the-last-20-minutes
http://www.espn.com/blog/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4802054/bill-belichick-to-coach-k-working-with-young-people-keeps-me-young
I liked this
Finally, some confirmation that he's a vampire who perpetuates his own grotesque existence by consuming the souls of the young.
(and the social-media remarks are highly amusing to me personally)
Tom Brady has had more Super Bowl winning game-worn jerseys stolen than 10 teams have Super Bowl appearances.
Not sure where else to put this, but was reading an interesting article about how the 2013 draft had a horrible first round. That was the draft where BB traded the 29th pick to Minnesota in exchange for 52, 83, 102, and 229. Seemed like a questionable move at the time. Then BB took:
Collins at 52
Ryan at 83
Boyce at 102
Traded 229 along with Demps for LGBT
Steal.
Collins at 52
Ryan at 83
Boyce at 102
Traded 229 along with Demps for LGBT
Steal.
I dunno. Boyce really sucked. And the Vikings chose Cordarelle Patterson. Oops. Someone will need to compile a list of all these moves - always fascinating to revisit after the fact.
Are we really going to do this again? Of course Boyce sucked. That doesn't mean the Pats didn't have a good draft. And Cordarelle Patterson isn't that good. If he was, he would still be a Viking.