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Bruins in 18-19

Discussion in 'Rick Middleton's Pron 'Stache: Bruins Forum' started by RedOctober3829, May 6, 2018.

  1. kenneycb

    kenneycb Hates Goose Island Beer; Loves Backdoor Play SoSH Member

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    For their sake I hope the latter.
     
  2. The Napkin

    The Napkin wise ass al kaprielian Dope SoSH Member

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    Cassidy said something about giving them a day to get some vitamin D so I'm assuming they stayed in Phoenix and there were many golf clubs packed. I'm also assuming we're going to see "sun-burned" Brick Wednesday night.
     
  3. Lose Remerswaal

    Lose Remerswaal Leaves after the 8th inning Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Globe datelines today are "Scottsdale"
     
  4. joe dokes

    joe dokes Member SoSH Member

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    His ability to stay tanned is exceeded only by Eckersley.
     
  5. veritas

    veritas Member SoSH Member

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    Interesting 5v5 goalie metric by Micah McCurdy:



    Showing Halak having a great season, and Tuukka being average so far, neither of which is surprising. The expected goals per shot the Bruins are allowing is really low, which kind of surprised me given the injuries they've had on defense.
     
  6. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Some news...

    Kalman is hearing bad news on Kevan Miller.



    Also, Divver says Jan Kovar could practice with the NHL team.

     
  7. TheRealness

    TheRealness Don't make him go all Lucic on your ash SoSH Member

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    Of fucking course on Miller. This season sucks so far.

    As for Kovar, let us also note that despite those stats he was still a -11 in those same 12 games. Not ideal.
     
  8. LogansDad

    LogansDad Member SoSH Member

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    Fuck shitballs on Miller.

    I don't know who Kovar is, but (honest question) couldn't that -11 be driven a bit by having worse defensive players and worse goaltending in Providence than they have in Boston? They certainly need to find some offense up front.
     
  9. veritas

    veritas Member SoSH Member

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    I haven’t seen Kovar play, but from what I’ve heard (and the limited stats seem to show), he’s maybe a slightly more responsible/experienced Donato?

    They don’t have the answer at center on the roster. I don’t know what the trade market is like now, but if they’re gonna have to overpay for a center, might as well do that now and get a bigger chunk of the season. But right now it might have to be an NHLer for NHLer trade.

    Krug and DeBrusk for Nugent-Hopkins, Nurse, and a pick/prospect? Chiarelli is probably too scarred and scared to do something like that, but it’d be a win-win for both teams.
     
  10. lexrageorge

    lexrageorge Member SoSH Member

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    The trade would work, except for the fact that the timetables for MacAvoy, Urho, Carlo, Chara and now Miller are all uncertain right now. Going from Krug to Nurse is a big drop-off that they cannot easily work in right now.
     
  11. veritas

    veritas Member SoSH Member

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    Krug to Nurse is a big drop off offensively, upgrade defensively, and Nurse is much more versitaile. Overall, I don’t think it’s huge. I also think that a Chara/Krug/Grz left side is completely unsustainable. They’re all injury prone, only one can kill penalties, 2 are very short. But they all have tons of value. Just not together.

    I’m assuming the asset Edmonton is returning is significant enough to include in another move. Just spitballing here, but I feel like Chia’s history is the only thing stopping a Krug RNH trade from happening. Throw in their desperate need for a winger...
     
  12. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Donato is back:

     
  13. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Miller sufffered a cartilidge injury to the larynx. He’ll be re-evaluated in 5 weeks.

    On the bright side, Carlo is practicing today.
     
  14. TheRealness

    TheRealness Don't make him go all Lucic on your ash SoSH Member

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    No no no. I want no part of trading DeBrusk unless it's for someone like Panarin, and definitively not for RNH.

    Oh for fuck sakes. This season can go die in a fucking fire already.
     
  15. Haunted

    Haunted The Man in the Box Silver Supporter SoSH Member

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    I have a bit of a crush on Jake DeBrusk but what's with the negativity on RNH? He seems to be about a .7 ppg guy for his career, and while he isn't the biggest player on the ice I thought he skated well? I admit to not seeing him all that often.

    What's the knock on him?
     
  16. RIFan

    RIFan Member SoSH Member

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    I've seen Kovar play twice. Strong on the puck with a good shot and seems to see the ice really well based on his passing. I'm not sure he'll keep up with the NHL pace and I'd suspect he'll end up in the dog house if he doesn't back check aggressively.
     
  17. TheRealness

    TheRealness Don't make him go all Lucic on your ash SoSH Member

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    He's basically a left handed version of Krejci with mediocre possession numbers and overrated offense. Hard pass for someone like DeBrusk. Moreover, he makes $6m a year and is basically a 50 point player.

    I would trade him for a Krejci package, but we know that won't happen.
     
  18. Haunted

    Haunted The Man in the Box Silver Supporter SoSH Member

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    Ah, I didn't realize his stock dropped that quickly. He was another one of Edmonton's "can't miss superstar" #1 picks.
     
  19. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    I think the coaching change was the last bullet for Chiarelli to fire. I don’t think the Oilers will let him make any major roster moves the rest of the year. He’s a lame duck.

    Sweeney told Friedman he’s looking for help “up front, certainly.” The other day. Not exactly earth shattering news, but it confirms they’re poking around. The Pacific and Metro are shitty enough that there aren’t many teams clearly out of it yet, so the list of sellers is short. LA is done, so they’re one. They don’t have much to offer. Tyler Toffoli is probably their best trade chip. 26 years old, $4.6 million AAV this year and next. Mostly a winger, but would certainly fit on the 2nd line.

    STL is another team that is close to punting, and Friedman says they are “open for business.” Some smoke around Tarasenko, but I can’t see the Bruins ponying up in that kind of deal. Brayden Schenn is interesting to me as a Bruin target. 27 years old, plays center, $5.6 million AAV for this year and next. The Blues added O’Reilly and Bozak over the summer to play C, plus they have rookie Robert Thomas at C who was one of the highest rated prospects heading into the season. Maybe Schenn could be had? He is certainly better than anything the Bruins have tried at 3C. They’d have 2 runs with Bergy/Krejci/Schenn down the middle with would match them up better with TOR and TBL.

    Chicago, Ottawa, NJ, Detroit and Florida are living on the edge and my end up being sellers, but there isn’t much interesting. Maybe Stone and Duchene from Ottawa but latest reports are that the Sens are trying to sign both. But Melnyk’s arena deal fell through and he is now suing his business partners so who knows that could change quickly.
     
  20. NYCSox

    NYCSox chris hansen of goats Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    I guess such is life at the Canadian Tire Fire Center. Sorry couldn't resist that one.
     
  21. FL4WL3SS

    FL4WL3SS Member SoSH Member

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    DeBrusk is a guy you build your team around, you don't trade him.

    Bergeron, Pastranak, McAvoy, Marchand, DeBrusk are my untouchables on this team. Everyone else is up for auction.
     
  22. LogansDad

    LogansDad Member SoSH Member

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    I'm a sucker, but I would add Grzelcyk to that list.... I really, really like the improvement I have seen out of him this year, and I think he's a keeper.
     
  23. joe dokes

    joe dokes Member SoSH Member

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    Not sure if he's untouchable, but I think the facile, size-related comparisons to Krug sell him short (sorry). He's listed at the same height and lower weight, but he doesn't seem to get pushed around on defense as much as Krug. Maybe he knows how to use leverage better in tight spaces, or maybe he's just strong like bull. Defensively, he reminds me a bit of Ference, who always seemed to play a bit bigger than he was.
     
  24. AMcGhie

    AMcGhie Set Adrift on Memory Bliss SoSH Member

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    From watching him at BU, he was always really good at keeping track of all the moving pieces on ice and putting himself in positions where the puck was likely to be. I think that strength allows him to outplay his size by a few inches and pounds.
     
  25. kenneycb

    kenneycb Hates Goose Island Beer; Loves Backdoor Play SoSH Member

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    Gryz isn’t an offensive dman so any Krug comparison stops at height. He’s a good dman but I think he’s entirely replaceable. Maybe not very easily but I don’t think he would haunt the B’s if they have him up.
     
  26. joe dokes

    joe dokes Member SoSH Member

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    He's certainly not Krug's equal offensively, but he can move the puck effectively in the way that's required of dmen in today's NHL.
     
  27. Ale Xander

    Ale Xander Member SoSH Member

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    Do you consider trading Bergy and/or Brad to a contender and consider rebuilding around Pasta, McAvoy, and Debrusk? I don;t think the current roster can win it all.
     
  28. lexrageorge

    lexrageorge Member SoSH Member

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    No, you don’t.
     
  29. NYCSox

    NYCSox chris hansen of goats Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    The current roster sans four NHL defensemen? Sure. The fully intact roster with dry powder to acquire at the deadline? Absolutely not. They are easily in the top 10 contenders for the Cup.
     
  30. TFP

    TFP Dope Dope

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    Bergeron, Marchand, and Pasta are maybe the 3 most valuable commodities in the NHL when you consider contract value. If not top 3, then definitely top 10. They're insanely valuable and in no way should any of them be traded, nor do I expect them to be.
     
  31. Ale Xander

    Ale Xander Member SoSH Member

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    Good point about the contracts, forgot about that. Just thinking that you can get a haul for them, since as everyone says, they're valuable.
     
  32. biff_hardbody

    biff_hardbody lurker

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    Call me crazy but as of today Carlo is more untouchable for me than McAvoy.
     
  33. veritas

    veritas Member SoSH Member

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    You're crazy
     
  34. veritas

    veritas Member SoSH Member

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    You too
     
  35. joe dokes

    joe dokes Member SoSH Member

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    Crazy.
     
  36. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    I like him and all, but I’ve never really understood some of the Carlo fascination.
     
  37. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Anywho, Bjork down to Providence.

     
  38. LogansDad

    LogansDad Member SoSH Member

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    This certainly makes me feel a little less crazy...
     
  39. veritas

    veritas Member SoSH Member

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    They're in 5th place in the eastern conference with the guy in my avatar centering the 1st line. It's only gonna get better, everyone relax and enjoy watching these younger players get some seasoning
     
  40. Salem's Lot

    Salem's Lot Andy Moog! Andy God Damn Moog! SoSH Member

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    I really want to know what you are seeing in Carlo that makes you think he has anywhere near the current skills, overall talent, or long term upside that McAvoy has.

    And that’s not a rip on Carlo. I like Carlo, I think in his prime he could be a good 3-4 defenseman on a contending team. But he’s not in the same universe as McAvoy. McAvoy could win multiple Norris Trophies if he stays healthy.
     
  41. Eddie Jurak

    Eddie Jurak Go Leafs Go Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Yes. McAvoy is a special talent. Perception of hom is colored by injuries. Stepping into the NHL playoffs at age 19 and doing what he did is virtually unheard of. This guy checks all the boxes already: mobility, puck moving, offensive skill, understands defense, plays physical, always calm and focused.

    Carlo has some impressive physical tools but his game needs a lot of developmenfensive defensemen can develop slowly. Johnny Boychuck, for example, didn't become an NHL regular until age 25, but by 26 he was a core contributor on a Stanley Cup winner. Kevan Miller, too, came up at 25, looked awful at many times over the next 3 years, but has more recently been one of their more valuable defensemen.

    Carlo, too, has lots of potential for growth (some of which may be starting to show this year), and he's starting from a much higher level, so plenty of reason for optimism with him.
     
  42. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Carlo is a 3/4 at best. He’s a modern defensive defenseman. Big, but not overly physical, and mobile. He can skate the puck out of trouble, but once he’s clear he doesn’t have much offensive instincts.

    Charlie is a 2-way horse with Norris upside. He’s Drew Doughty.
     
  43. veritas

    veritas Member SoSH Member

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    Yeah, Carlo is a weird player. He's really not very good with the puck and very likely won't ever be. But his size and athleticism and defensive instincts make him a useful player that's probably underrated by a lot of shot metrics.

    Really the Bruins have a lot of very weird defensemen. Chara, Krug, Grzelcyk-- there aren't any other players in the league comparable to them at all. They're such massive outliers in terms of how they play (Krug and Grzelcyk aren't even that comparable to each other, despite both being 5'9). Carlo is a little less weird, but I can't think of any obvious comparable players of the top of my head. McAvoy's comparables are a young Drew Doughty, as cshea said, which is a very rare thing.

    Kevan Miller is about as generic as you can get though.
     
  44. biff_hardbody

    biff_hardbody lurker

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    Carlo is a 6'5" defenseman that can skate and made the NHL out of juniors. His offensive skills are limited right now, but big defenseman have tradtionally taken a long time to develop. He is learning from Chara, the poster boy for late blooming defensemen. Saying his upside is as a 3-4 is laughable. He is the prototypical #1 defensive blueliner in today's game.

    I'm going to get killed for this (again), but I have not seen much in the way of development from McAvoy since he came into the league. He is basically the same guy as the 2017 playoffs (still very good). His upside is certainly tantalizing.
     
  45. TheShynessClinic

    TheShynessClinic SoSH's Doug Neidermeyer SoSH Member

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    McAvoy is 20 years old....he's played in 70 total career games. He had 32 points as a 19/20 year old defensemen. He's had barely a full season under his belt.

    Are you out of your fucking mind?
     
  46. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Curious, who do you consider #1’s in the league?
     
  47. NYCSox

    NYCSox chris hansen of goats Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Karl Alzner - at least while he was that age?
     
  48. biff_hardbody

    biff_hardbody lurker

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    I don't watch very many non-Bruins games so I don't have much to compare to out of the division. Chara in his prime was a clear #1. Karlsson is a #1, based on what I saw in the series the Bruins lost to the Sens in McAvoy's first year. Subban was/is a #1.

    Edit: Hal Gill was not a #1.
     
  49. TFP

    TFP Dope Dope

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    Carlo won't sniff any of those names.

    I don't want to get rid of either of them, but McAvoy clearly has a much much higher ceiling than Carlo, and also has skills that are harder to find. I was surprised to find that his rookie year was actually better than Doughty's...but his sophomore year is injury marred.

    I don't think McAvoy is a slam dunk to be a Norris candidate and I'm not as bullish on him as others, but he's got incredible upside and looks like a sure bet to be a top pairing defenseman. Hell, his worst case is probably similar to Dougie Hamilton, which Carlo won't achieve. I'm trying to think of a good comp for Carlo and coming up blank. Maybe Marc Staal?
     
  50. cshea

    cshea Member SoSH Member

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    Hal Gill is actually a decent comparable to Carlo (Alzner too). Big, rangy, not very physical, no offense.

    Carlo is not anywhere close to a Karlsson or Subban or any #1’s in the league. Those guys are elite at both ends of the ice. Carlo’s a nice, steady mid-to-bottom pairing defensive defenseman. Not that points are everything, but Carlo has 24 points in 174 career games. He didn’t produce in juniors either. I’d don’t think he’s ever going to ha e the offensive game to be close to a #1. Guys don’t typically flip a switch this far into their career and develop a previously unseen area of their game. He kind of is what he is. There will likely be some improvement, but not a huge leap that would bring him up to #1 of #2 status.
     

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