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2019 Patriots: Post-SB Roster Thread

Discussion in 'Blinded by the Lombardis: Patriots Forum' started by RedOctober3829, Feb 4, 2019.

  1. BaseballJones

    BaseballJones goalpost mover SoSH Member

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    That would be a fantastic WR corps, especially if Gordon was able to stick around all year (not likely but still). I mean, they just won the Super Bowl with Edelman, an invisible Hogan, Dorsett, and Patterson, and not much else.
     
  2. snowmanny

    snowmanny Well-Known Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    I heard he once outplayed Tom Brady for part of a playoff game.
     
  3. bsj

    bsj Renegade Crazed Genius SoSH Member

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    Tate expected to choose between NE and PIT today.

    I cant fathom where the Pats are even finding the money to make this competitive
     
  4. BaseballJones

    BaseballJones goalpost mover SoSH Member

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    Hell if I know. Maybe it's all just...

    [​IMG]
     
  5. DeadlySplitter

    DeadlySplitter Member SoSH Member

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    the Steelers are a tire fire, he might take a bit less to come here. if he cares about that, Humphries seemed not to prioritize winning if we really bumped up the offer that much.
     
  6. Mystic Merlin

    Mystic Merlin Member SoSH Member

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    Part if it might be he already orally committed to the Titans at that point.

    Doesn’t mean what, say, Anthony Barr did was beyond the pale, but I get it.
     
  7. InstaFace

    InstaFace MDLzera

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    You're arguing that we need to wait to see how SF did in the trade (i.e., how Garoppolo performs) to evaluate what the Patriots ended up getting in return for our backup QB?

    I mostly was just glad to proclaim the Dorsett trade a success, just because the odds of that seemed so remote back in 2017. We now know that the Jimmy G trade was harder for BB than even we appreciated at the time, so I'm certainly anxious to see the extent to which his sentimentality got the better of him ("...that one time!")
     
  8. jsinger121

    jsinger121 @jsinger121 SoSH Member

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  9. DrewDawg

    DrewDawg Dorito Dink SoSH Member

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    They have $12 million according to Miguel. Sign Tate then they can rework some guys to create what they need for draft.
     
  10. jsinger121

    jsinger121 @jsinger121 SoSH Member

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  11. DennyDoyle'sBoil

    DennyDoyle'sBoil Found no thrill on Blueberry Hill SoSH Member

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    They don't need much for the draft. They need money to start the season though. September 1 is when the rule of 51 goes away and all your practice players start to count.

    With the signings yesterday, they don't have much room. They'd have to give Tate a big signing bonus and postpone most of the money to future years. Still, just looking at some of the deals, it's going to be at least $6 million or so next year unless they get really creative. Also, they lose a comp pick. My guess is that this isn't going to happen, but if it does, there must be something going on behind the scenes on a restructure or something that we don't know about.

    Do you think there's any chance that Brady is getting ready to do something crazy? I mean, if the guy came out and said, "I'll play for $10 million a year in 2020 and 2021 if you give me a no trade clause" or something like that, all of the sudden, the Patriots can do anything. But I can't believe he would actually do that. He's a $28 million player. But, who knows? If he decides this team is his best chance for whatever he has left then maybe he just says "fuck it, I have enough money." His agent would never go for it and the league would lose its mind but it's kind of a very special circumstance and maybe, just maybe?
     
  12. TheoShmeo

    TheoShmeo Skrub's sympathy case Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Perhaps he was just trying to scare up interest but Tate’s comments as reported by Reiss give me some hope that he will choose NE.

    http://www.espn.com/blog/new-englan...welcome-chance-to-catch-passes-from-tommy-boy

    Money quotes:

    “I would love it. That organization, they've proven to be champions year-in and year-out," Tate said on the Prostyle Podcast with former NFL receiver Earl Bennett. "They work hard, for sure. But you know where you're going to be at the end of the season; you're going to be looking at not [only] going to the playoffs, but maybe a first-round bye. You got to admire that organization. They do things right and they've been doing it for a long, long, long time.

    "So I'd definitely love to be a part of something like that, and definitely catch a few passes from old Tommy Boy."
     
  13. DrewDawg

    DrewDawg Dorito Dink SoSH Member

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    I thought Miguel's cap numbers reflected those signings. Is that not the case? If that's the case, and we don't need a lot for the draft, Tate getting $6M isn't a killer.
     
  14. DrewDawg

    DrewDawg Dorito Dink SoSH Member

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    I thought Miguel's numbers reflected the signings. Is that not the case?

    If they do, and have $12M plus, how is Tate's $6M a problem? What else are they saving for besides the draft? They were trying to fit Humphries in and I think he's getting more than Tate will.

    EDIT: I guess Dorsett's amount hasn't been announced yet...
     
  15. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    Breaking: Golden Tate expected to finalize deal with #Patriots.

    As I reported Sunday, he met with #Steelers and they we’re back up option but chose New England. #Cowboys also showed some interest.
     
  16. koufax32

    koufax32 He'll cry if he wants to... SoSH Member

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    Edit: Don’t do that to me guys
     
  17. DrewDawg

    DrewDawg Dorito Dink SoSH Member

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    That’s a handicapper...

    I need more.
     
  18. PC Drunken Friar

    PC Drunken Friar Member SoSH Member

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    That guy has less than 500 Twitter followers...calls himself the premier Pittsburgh handicapper and sports insider...I will wait for better confirmation before a get too excited.
     
  19. DennyDoyle'sBoil

    DennyDoyle'sBoil Found no thrill on Blueberry Hill SoSH Member

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    Miguel's 12.3m number does not include Dorsett, McCourty, Bolden or Simon.

    They need $2.8 to $3.0 million for the draft if they keep their current spots. They will also need to start the season with at least $5 million. This is a point that people don't really appreciate this time of the year when they see all the numbers about how much teams have. The off season cap is different from the season cap. Right now, the cap only includes your top 51 players. During the season, your cap includes your entire 53-man roster and your practice squad and your PUP and IR players. So, you know, if a player goes on IR and you need to replace him with a $700,000 player you need $700,000 in cap room. So, you usually try to start the season with at least $5 or $6 million give or take and then whatever you have left carries over.
     
  20. rodderick

    rodderick Member SoSH Member

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    Tate seems like a perfect fit for the Patriots offense. I have a feeling the Pats believe Gordon will play next year, but I'd still like them to target an outside receiver just to be sure.
     
  21. DrewDawg

    DrewDawg Dorito Dink SoSH Member

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    Okay. But again, they were apparently going to $10M for Humphries. It seems like they can make it work.
     
  22. tims4wins

    tims4wins PN23's replacement SoSH Member

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    He says it is updated as of 2 hours ago?

     
  23. steveluck7

    steveluck7 Member SoSH Member

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    It is but i don't think the $$ for J. McCourty has been announced. Also, Simon got announced since this update, I believe
     
  24. DennyDoyle'sBoil

    DennyDoyle'sBoil Found no thrill on Blueberry Hill SoSH Member

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    ICYMI - My current Patriots salary cap space number is $12,386,721. It accounts for the Jones/Gordon RFA tenders and the Bennett trade. Does not yet account for the Dorsett, Bolden, McCourty and Simon signings. Why? Do not have yet the details of the deals.
     
  25. Ed Hillel

    Ed Hillel Wants to be startin somethin SoSH Member

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    Again, they will still pretty easily be able to create at least 10 million in cap space, probably more. They clearly have some money to work with, based on their actions.

    I’m gonna guess that Simon deal is basically a 1 year deal extended out to spread his small bonus.
     
  26. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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  27. tims4wins

    tims4wins PN23's replacement SoSH Member

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    Thanks
     
  28. Super Nomario

    Super Nomario Member SoSH Member

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    This sort of thing usually resolves itself though, right? Like, they draft a kid at a position they have a higher-priced vet at, and they decide to trade / cut the vet on the final day and clear up a couple million. Last year they saved $1.5 MM cutting Marquis Flowers and $2.5 MM cutting Mike Gilllislee. I'd be interested to see what the cap space typically is when they start the preseason versus the opening day roster.
     
  29. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    Doesn't Bill usually keep about $4-$6 million at a minimum for in-season moves?
     
  30. DennyDoyle'sBoil

    DennyDoyle'sBoil Found no thrill on Blueberry Hill SoSH Member

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    Yes, right -- there will be natural attrition that will result in cap savings which are different from moves deliberately designed to save cap space (like restructures). But I think still it isn't exactly neutral for most teams and there are no obvious cuts on the Patriots. I haven't followed it too closely. But, yeah, definitely, there will be some netting out. Also, you start the year with a contingency plan that assumes a worst case. If you end up bringing in a $700,000 player to replace an injured player in week 10 it affects your cap differently than if you do it in week 1, etc. If the Patriots get through free agency and rookie signings without being in a hole they will find a way. The bottom line, though, is that right now you're looking at 51 players and in a few months you're looking at 53 players plus the practice squad.

    I'll just throw out my wild ass guesses on cap effect of the four signings from yesterday. Again, this is just rank speculation just to go on record and see how I do when they are announced. These are strictly cap effects for 2019 without regard to actual salary or future years and are net of the savings due to rule of 51. Bolden $400,000. Dorsett $1,400,000. McCourty $1,800,000. Simon $2,000,000. So, I'm saying a cap number remaining around 6.7 million.
     
  31. DrewDawg

    DrewDawg Dorito Dink SoSH Member

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    Gotta think someone else would have this, no?
     
  32. tims4wins

    tims4wins PN23's replacement SoSH Member

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    Clayborn seems pretty obvious
     
  33. DrewDawg

    DrewDawg Dorito Dink SoSH Member

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    Someone show this to Mr. Tate:

     
  34. DennyDoyle'sBoil

    DennyDoyle'sBoil Found no thrill on Blueberry Hill SoSH Member

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    Yeah -- I think he's pretty much baked in at this point. I've kind of been expecting that we're going to see a Gostkowski deal and a Clayborn cut right around the same time.

    If the Patriots do a Tate signing or something like it though I'd guess we're probably looking at a rookie kicker. Hope there's a good one out there!
     
  35. steveluck7

    steveluck7 Member SoSH Member

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    Using overthecap, I could find about $11.5 million in savings by cutting:
    Adrian Clayborn
    Lawrence Guy
    Brian Hoyer
    Nate Ebner
    Elandon Roberts

    also Gronk extension would net them about 6 million or so.
    A Brady extension could also net the another 10 but he can't be restructured until August (365 day rule)

    Greg Bedard was just on with Felger and Mazz and he is very bearish about the Pats cap situation
     
  36. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    It may not be official yet pending physical. Looking on this guy's timeline it's apparent he would have a source inside the Steelers. But until somebody bigger than him says this, then it's not official.
     
  37. DennyDoyle'sBoil

    DennyDoyle'sBoil Found no thrill on Blueberry Hill SoSH Member

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    Just a few points and then I'll STFU, since I'm posting too much and take everyone's comments off air.

    1) The cap savings on those 5 cuts actually is about $8.8 million because you have to factor back in the next man up.
    2) Someone (redoctober?) demonstrated that brady can be restructured at any time.
    3) It will be hard to get more than $5 million out of Brady unless he does us a massive favor but I'm hoping.

    Edit: 9.2, not 8.8
     
  38. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    A Brady extension will not net a $10 million savings. $5 million at best. Also, he can get extended at any time because he did not get more money in his last restructure.
     
  39. steveluck7

    steveluck7 Member SoSH Member

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    Bedard addressed this because it was his thought as well and said that someone in the org. "who would know"told him that the 365 day rule does apply to Brady
     
  40. Saints Rest

    Saints Rest Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    I too have often wondered why Brady wouldn't say "I've made $300M in my career, my wife brings in $30M/year, a few million in salary means nothing to me. But adding a 7th or 8th Super Bowl would be worth every penny I give up. So, Bill, put me down for the vet minimum and spend the rest on whatever you think is best to add more RINGS to my world!"
    I know the union would freak out, but is there anything they can do?

    I agree with you on Clayborn, completely disagree on Guy, and think the other three are unlikely but they wouldn't shock me. Now come training camp, perhaps one or more of those latter three could end up being cuts, but not today.
     
  41. Dick Pole Upside

    Dick Pole Upside Member SoSH Member

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    Re Tate: there was a fake Rapoport tweet going around from an hour ago... some SoSHers re-tweeted without looking for the blue check mark...
     
  42. DennyDoyle'sBoil

    DennyDoyle'sBoil Found no thrill on Blueberry Hill SoSH Member

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    As I understand it the issue is this: Does adding incentives, which were NLTBE and which in fact were not actually earned, constitute new money for purposes of the CBA prohibition on a second restructure of a vet contract within 12 months? My reading says no but it's clear as mud. Maybe Bedard does have a source.

    Ok, carry on, now I'll STFU.
     
  43. steveluck7

    steveluck7 Member SoSH Member

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    I should have been more clear. the intent of my post was to demonstrate the cap constraints the team has. Cutting those 5 guys would "only" net a max of $11 million (less, as pointed out in subsequent posts thanks to the rule of 51). I wasn't advocating getting rid of them. I just picked non-star players making "real" money who would provide "real" cap savings if cut
     
  44. Brand Name

    Brand Name thinks there's no 'i' in denial Staff Member Dope Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Cole Tracy from LSU/Assumption is probably the best pure guy in years, no mechanical issues, solid in kickoffs but he's no Ghost in that regard, probably the only one I'd want from this class.

    My silver, for however you see this, is John Baron II from San Diego State is solid, like his leg strength (5/5 from 50+) but am not as sold on his consistency overall.
     
  45. bagwell1

    bagwell1 lurker

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    For those that seem to have 2019 cap space angst, from an estimate looking at the 2019 contracts on OTC, I would say the Pats could create a minimum of 35M in space not counting Brady and not cutting anybody. The Brady expected restructure will help replenish the "in season bank" so I didn't include that one.

    And please remember, the 2019 cap hit for any free agent can be fairly minimal if necessary.
     
  46. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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    Cole Beasley said in his press availability that his decision came down to Buffalo, Dallas, and New England.
     
  47. RedOctober3829

    RedOctober3829 Member SoSH Member

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  48. DrewDawg

    DrewDawg Dorito Dink SoSH Member

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    That dude is now saying the Steelers will sign Justin Houston.
     
  49. Ed Hillel

    Ed Hillel Wants to be startin somethin SoSH Member

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    And also said Bell to the Raiders
     
  50. DrewDawg

    DrewDawg Dorito Dink SoSH Member

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    Yeah, I'm going to go ahead and disregard him until something else comes out.
     

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