2018 NBA Game Thread

Sam Ray Not

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 19, 2005
8,872
NYC
Ho-hum. Just your average 147-140 regulation game between the Ws and Pels.

Meanwhile, another 3 pt record falls on the same night — makes, not attempts, this time. 43 combined, on 86 attempts.

KD 30/15/4, AD 30/18/7, Steph 41 points on 22 fga.

Dray$ 27 dimes and two turnovers in the last two games.
 
Last edited:

Apisith

Member
SoSH Member
Oct 19, 2007
3,217
Bangkok
I read a suggestion by one of my favourite economist (Scott Sumner):

‘Reduce the number of free throws by awarding only 2 when a three point shooter is fouled. The penalty should fit the damage, and the damage caused to the offense by fouling a three point shooter is no worse than the damage caused by fouling someone at the rim. The expected points lost is roughly the same.’

I kind of agree with it. What do you guys think?
 

HowBoutDemSox

Member
SoSH Member
Aug 12, 2009
10,161
I read a suggestion by one of my favourite economist (Scott Sumner):

‘Reduce the number of free throws by awarding only 2 when a three point shooter is fouled. The penalty should fit the damage, and the damage caused to the offense by fouling a three point shooter is no worse than the damage caused by fouling someone at the rim. The expected points lost is roughly the same.’

I kind of agree with it. What do you guys think?
Would we also reduce the foul shots for a mid range shot to just one foul shot, given the expected value would be less than two points there? Should it all depend on how good a shooter the fouled player is?
 

HomeRunBaker

bet squelcher
SoSH Member
Jan 15, 2004
30,345
Would we also reduce the foul shots for a mid range shot to just one foul shot, given the expected value would be less than two points there? Should it all depend on how good a shooter the fouled player is?
Have a personal take foul on Lonzo Ball simply result in a side-out for the other team to speed the game up and save wear and tear on the rim.
 

Sam Ray Not

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 19, 2005
8,872
NYC
Harden's last two games:

Points scored: 115
Points scored off assists from teammates: 0

I'm not sure if that's awe-inspiring or just gross. I guess both...?
 

The Needler

New Member
Dec 7, 2016
1,803
I read a suggestion by one of my favourite economist (Scott Sumner):

‘Reduce the number of free throws by awarding only 2 when a three point shooter is fouled. The penalty should fit the damage, and the damage caused to the offense by fouling a three point shooter is no worse than the damage caused by fouling someone at the rim. The expected points lost is roughly the same.’

I kind of agree with it. What do you guys think?
But who ever said free throws were supposed to provide actual damage compensation for a foul? They’re not, and they don’t. They are penalty shots. They are supposed to be worse for the defense than allowing the offense to fairly shoot. They provide a disincentive for fouling. So, based on the current leaguewide 2-pt percentage of 57.6, the EV of a 2-pointer is 1.15 points. But the EV of 2 free throws at .764 is 1.53 points. And it makes sense that the league would like to even further disincentivize teams from fouling a shooter in the game’s most exciting shots, and thus it imposes an even greater penalty. What’s more, the unintended consequences of attempting to reduce free throws is likely to be more trips to the free throw line, especially at the end of games when teams have large leads, and are opposing good 3point shooters.

And why would you want to take skill and performance out of the equation? A great (or not great) shooter should have the opportunity to succeed, whether it be by a 3-pointer or hitting three free throws. Especially at the end of the game, teams shoot threes more for the potential reward than the EV of the shot. You take away an enormous amount of excitement from the game and incentivize teams to foul in many situations where they otherwise wouldn't.

If you think free throws are too easy, move the FT line back.
 

ifmanis5

Member
SoSH Member
Sep 29, 2007
63,968
Rotten Apple
Have at it, hoop narcs....

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/25785435/fans-interact-social-media-real-refs-games
NBA referees will answer questions about calls in real time over Twitter in a selection of games for the rest of the season, starting with two games next week.

During Monday's Golden State Warriors at Los Angeles Lakers game on TNT and Wednesday's San Antonio Spurs at Philadelphia 76ers game on ESPN, fans can tweet @OfficialNBARefs or use the hashtag #RefWatchParty to get responses from officials who are watching the game.
 

DannyDarwinism

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 7, 2007
4,901
Harden's last two games:

Points scored: 115
Points scored off assists from teammates: 0

I'm not sure if that's awe-inspiring or just gross. I guess both...?
That’s incredible. Utterly bonkers.

For some reference, this year 28.2% of Kyrie’s 2s have been assisted, and 60.2% of his 3s. Harden is at 12.7% and 12.6%, respectively.

It’s interesting to look at his evolution. During his time with OKC, about 85% of his 3s were assisted. That number dropped by half for his first four years with Houston, and in the past three years, it has steadily fallen to the 12.7 this year.

Steph Curry, the GOATfather of the pull-up three, has never had lower than 45.6% of his 3s assisted. This year he’s at 66.8%. I know it’s not exactly a secret, but Harden and the Rockets are just playing an entirely different brand of basketball than the rest of the league.
 

HomeRunBaker

bet squelcher
SoSH Member
Jan 15, 2004
30,345
That’s incredible. Utterly bonkers.

For some reference, this year 28.2% of Kyrie’s 2s have been assisted, and 60.2% of his 3s. Harden is at 12.7% and 12.6%, respectively.

It’s interesting to look at his evolution. During his time with OKC, about 85% of his 3s were assisted. That number dropped by half for his first four years with Houston, and in the past three years, it has steadily fallen to the 12.7 this year.

Steph Curry, the GOATfather of the pull-up three, has never had lower than 45.6% of his 3s assisted. This year he’s at 66.8%. I know it’s not exactly a secret, but Harden and the Rockets are just playing an entirely different brand of basketball than the rest of the league.
This is a product of D'Antoni's system coupled with the loss of Chris Paul. If Capela, Tucker, or Green have the ball it is likely off a pass from Harden for the purpose of them shooting. Only Rivers, and now Gordon that he's back, are capable of doing any type of creating and even then it is D'Antoni's system for them in iso. Basically, no offensive set is ever designed for a player to be creating off the dribble for the purpose of passing to Harden...….those are the plays Harden is 30-feet from the hoop taking a play off. It is still crazy that not a single assist has occurred even by accident.
 

DannyDarwinism

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 7, 2007
4,901
Basically, no offensive set is ever designed for a player to be creating off the dribble for the purpose of passing to Harden...….those are the plays Harden is 30-feet from the hoop taking a play off.
Very true, and surprisingly (to me, anyway) even so when Paul is playing. The stats reflect this- Harden's split stats don't show a big difference in %Ast'd corresponding to time CP missed.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/h/hardeja01/shooting/2019
https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/h/hardeja01/shooting/2018

Paul himself has seen a similar, if not quite as extreme, rise in unassisted 3s since playing for D'Antoni (23.5% with Houston, and he was over double that for his career before).
 

Deathofthebambino

Drive Carefully
SoSH Member
Apr 12, 2005
42,084
As one of the few remaining holdouts from Twitter, I would even consider opening an account to get in on this shit. Unfortunately, I can't imagine the officials they use won't do anything but back their colleagues except in the most egregious situations, just like Blandino/Steratore et al during NFL broadcasts. I think someone referred to Steratore as having the credibility of the Iraqi Minister of Defense in one of the game threads, which was perfect.
 

terrynever

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Aug 25, 2005
21,717
pawtucket
76ers putting on a clinic tonight in Indy. Defense, rebounding, hot shooting up and down the roster. Aussie Jonah Bolden the new backup center.
 

benhogan

Granite Truther
SoSH Member
Nov 2, 2007
20,357
Santa Monica
Sun and Raptors were in a tight one.

BUT the Suns imploding with Jackson getting ejected, Oubre technical...ugh

Refs missed several calls - set off JJ
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

Member
SoSH Member
Mar 26, 2005
30,805
I read a suggestion by one of my favourite economist (Scott Sumner):

‘Reduce the number of free throws by awarding only 2 when a three point shooter is fouled. The penalty should fit the damage, and the damage caused to the offense by fouling a three point shooter is no worse than the damage caused by fouling someone at the rim. The expected points lost is roughly the same.’

I kind of agree with it. What do you guys think?
Not really answering your question but I think inside the arc should be 3 points and outside the arc should be 4 points to stop the emphasis on jump shooting.
 

benhogan

Granite Truther
SoSH Member
Nov 2, 2007
20,357
Santa Monica
Siakam with a game-winning drive at the buzzer.

Jeez. Josh Johnson and the Suns need to keep their composure in the middle of the 4thQuarter of a tight game. 3 technicals and a flagrant

Kawhi has not played in one back-to-back game this season. Take note Celtics and rest Al (and Gordon)
 

Kliq

Member
SoSH Member
Mar 31, 2013
22,838
I really like what Ferguson and Grant have been able to provide for OKC. Springy athleticism, versatility on defense, decent perimeter shooting and high-energy defense. Right now I’d probably take those two with George/Russ/Adams over any other five man unit outside of Golden State.
 

HomeRunBaker

bet squelcher
SoSH Member
Jan 15, 2004
30,345
Michael Beasley with my self-proclaimed "idiot tell"...…..as he checked into the game, takes off his warmups at the scorers table and has black shorts on instead of the Lakers gold.
 

Gunfighter 09

wants to be caribou ken
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2005
8,550
KPWT
I really like what Ferguson and Grant have been able to provide for OKC. Springy athleticism, versatility on defense, decent perimeter shooting and high-energy defense. Right now I’d probably take those two with George/Russ/Adams over any other five man unit outside of Golden State.

That unit just got beat by ten in OT by the Lakers kids.
 

Gunfighter 09

wants to be caribou ken
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2005
8,550
KPWT
I speaking specifically to the overtime. I should have written "beat by ten in the OT".

That lineup you mentioned (Russ/PG/Adams/Grant/Furgeson)was on the floor for the entire overtime while the Lakers played Ball-Ingram-Hart-Kuzma-All NBA Center Zubac (the kids) for the first 4:43 of overtime. It wasn't close. It seemed like Russ and PG had trouble on the offensive end when challenged by Lonzo and Ingram and that Adams was having a very difficult time matching up for Zubac on the defensive end.
 

HomeRunBaker

bet squelcher
SoSH Member
Jan 15, 2004
30,345
Not quite, the Same OKC bench was horrible and killed them while the Laker bench crushed it. Ivan Zubac has 25 and 12 off the bench.
Zubac made Adams his bitch last night. He’s made a tremendous leap with several huge games in short minutes. He’s a keeper for a LeBron-led team in the Tristan role while providing more offense in the paint. He has a really nice scoring touch.....very underrated.
 

Cesar Crespo

79
SoSH Member
Dec 22, 2002
21,588
I read a suggestion by one of my favourite economist (Scott Sumner):

‘Reduce the number of free throws by awarding only 2 when a three point shooter is fouled. The penalty should fit the damage, and the damage caused to the offense by fouling a three point shooter is no worse than the damage caused by fouling someone at the rim. The expected points lost is roughly the same.’

I kind of agree with it. What do you guys think?
This used to be the case and at the end of games with teams down by 3, the other team would intentionally foul so the trailing team couldn't get a 3 pointer off. It was one of the things that annoyed me the most about basketball as a kid.
 

Deathofthebambino

Drive Carefully
SoSH Member
Apr 12, 2005
42,084
Not going to lie, I'm more than a little curious to see how Golden State is able to integrate Boogie into the lineup tonight. They come in on an absolute tear, scoring 140+ in 3 of their last 4 games, and 6 straight wins.
 

JCizzle

Member
SoSH Member
Dec 11, 2006
20,651
Unsportsmanlike conduct so Draymond can stay in the game. Give me a fucking break. Anyone else gets a T and ejected there, especially one Marcus Smart. He cries more than anyone in the league.
 

shawnrbu

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 14, 2005
39,846
The Land of Fist Pumps
Clippers fall into 9th place. Remember when they were leading the West?

Warriors
Nuggets
Blazers
Thunder
Rockets
Spurs
Jazz
Lakers

I think we have our 8 playoff teams barring a season ending injury for LeBron.
 

Sam Ray Not

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 19, 2005
8,872
NYC
Cousins: 15 minutes, 14 points (5-11 fg), 6 reb, 3 ast, 1 blk, 1 stl, 1 tov, 6 fouls.

15 minutes on court: +21
33 minutes off court: -3

3FG 3-4 (75%)
Rest of GS 6-33 (18%)

Looked rusty and a few steps slow, but much better than I expected him to, especially defensively. The Clips with their bullyball bigs (Gortat, Harrell, Boban) seemed like a good matchup for him.

Apart from my Warriors rooting interest, it's mostly just great to see him back on the floor looking happy. It may take him another year to get back to peak Boogie, but at age 28 I'd guess he has a great chance to get there.
 
Last edited:

Sam Ray Not

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 19, 2005
8,872
NYC
Clippers fall into 9th place. Remember when they were leading the West?

Warriors
Nuggets
Blazers
Thunder
Rockets
Spurs
Jazz
Lakers

I think we have our 8 playoff teams barring a season ending injury for LeBron.
I wouldn't discount Sacramento or New Orleans catching fire and sneaking in, but yeah, those 8 seem like a good bet. I won't be shocked to see Utah move up to #3 or even #2 when it's all said and done.
 

Imbricus

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 26, 2017
4,877
Our friend Ante Zizic is rounding into form. Has scored in double figures four of the last five games. He was 7/12 with 10 rebounds last night. At this point, no one regrets the Kyrie trade, especially considering how amazing he's been this season, but it does have long legs, considering Zizic and a draft pick were part of the package. (Sexton hasn't been doing much lately though in his first season.)
 

lovegtm

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 30, 2013
12,233
Our friend Ante Zizic is rounding into form. Has scored in double figures four of the last five games. He was 7/12 with 10 rebounds last night. At this point, no one regrets the Kyrie trade, especially considering how amazing he's been this season, but it does have long legs, considering Zizic and a draft pick were part of the package. (Sexton hasn't been doing much lately though in his first season.)
It's sort of good that Zizic is ok: a team might possibly consider maybe making a trade with Danny again.
 

Deathofthebambino

Drive Carefully
SoSH Member
Apr 12, 2005
42,084
If you're not watching, tune into the Philly/Thunder game. OKC with a 3 point lead with 1:46 left in Philly. Very physical game. Westbrook just caught a pass on a fast break, then fumbled it a little just as he was about to go up, catching Embiid as he was leaping to make a block. If anything, it was Westbrook's fault that led to the collision. After writhing around a little bit, Westbrook jumped up and looked like he was going to go after Embiid, but it was more of a tough guy "hold me back, hold me back" move because he knew he'd never get to him.
 

scottyno

late Bloomer
SoSH Member
Dec 7, 2008
11,342
OKC late game offense probably shouldn't be one of the worst mid/long range shooters in the NBA taking jump shots, it's basically like if last years Smart was taking a million jump shots a game
 

scottyno

late Bloomer
SoSH Member
Dec 7, 2008
11,342
RWB fouls Embiid on a 3 down 3 with 15 secs left, and then OKC throws the ball away instead of calling timeout to take the ball at half court, genius team