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2017 Eagles: Thread Under the Influwentz

Discussion in 'Blinded by the Lombardis: Patriots Forum' started by LondonSox, Sep 16, 2017.

  1. LondonSox

    LondonSox Robert the Deuce SoSH Member

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    So I guess I'm very late, and we need an Eagles thread.

    I have been a bit overly focused on the Sixers, my personal relocation and my son. So when I have time I'll add some videos etc to support comments, and I'm going off memory so may come back with some corrections.

    Lot of moves and trades etc again this year, I'll focus on the big picture

    Defense

    The Eagles again upgraded the pass rush.
    They added Jernigan from the Ravens to replace the departed Logan, he is seen as an attacking DT and one that prevents teams from constantly double teaming Cox. He's got one year left on his deal so a lot of opportunity for him.
    They also drafted Barnett in the first round (and he's been IMPRESSIVE) I'll add some videos and commentary later.
    They also added Chris Long as a free agent. The D line is potentially the core of the defense, Curry, Cox, Long, Barnett, Graham, Jernigan are the names you know but there is depth behind. If these guys get it right they can cover for the corners. If they get outplayed ... yeah.

    At linebacker the secret stud is Hicks. He's the new Sean Lee, superstar with injury concerns that casual fans don't know. The Eagles generally play only two LB and Bradham has been good. Behind them is Kendricks, who is on the trade block, but had an excellent pre season with interceptions, sacks the lot. If the starters get hurt it's an issue. There's no depth past Kendricks and no one should trust him!

    In the secondary the depth improved at Safety, two good starters in Jenkins and Mcleod and Graham is a nice depth addition.
    The corners... are still an issue. They traded their "best" WR matthews to the bills for Darby, they drafted two corners, but one is out maybe all year (Sidney Jones- who imo they overdrafted but apparently he was likely their first round pick if not for the injury so eh). Mills had a good offseason and camp ( I'm dubious on his top end speed). They also drafted Douglas in the 3rd. The state of the CB position on a decent team led to the trade and now Darby got hurt in week 1- luckily (esp if you saw it) he's only out 6 games ish.
    Long term there are a lot of young corners with talent on the roster, in the near term, this is clearly the weakest link.

    Offense

    On the o-line they added Chance Warmack (and extended him a year). The line is ok depending on your view of Kelce these days and if PEters can keep going, and they have some nice young talent. But the depth isn't ideal and final cuts left them thin.
    It's good on paper. The results on the field are unclear.

    Wide receiver was a gaping chasm of suck last year. They signed Jeffery and Torrey Smith and drafted Hollins and Shelton Gibson. The latter didn't make the team. Not good for a 5th round pick. He was brutal in pre season and camp. The team is convinced Agholor can be a contributor (former first round pick in 3rd year and brutal so far). Pre season and game 1 supported that. Huge upgrade overall and I'm personally very high on Hollins. The idea is clear. Smith offers a deep threat, Jeffery a star and Agholor can use his route running skills in the slot.

    Running back is another gap. As expected Mathews was released, and they drafted one, but in the legendary RB draft they missed all the targets and imo reached on Pumphrey. He barely (and maybe only due to PR) made the team but didn't dress and now today ripped his hamstring and is on IR.
    I like smallwood but he has yet to produce, they signed Blount which is nice but he's been brutal outside New England so... We shall see. Sproles is still here too but there's no sure thing here. Pretty unacceptable given the amount of talent out there.

    TE no change it's just a year older. The project Billy Brown should have made the roster but they got lucky and he made it to the practice squad. Ertz is good, Celek is old and a blocker now, Burton is decent but never really stepped up.

    Finally WB. Wentz is the man. His pocket awareness and ability to manufacture on the move is positively Rodgersesque. But his accuracy, esp on the long ball, is inconsistent. He's the guy and I think his personality is perfect for the situation but I want to see the accuracy.
    Somewhat oddly they replaced Chase daniels with old friend Nick Foles who was hurt all pre season and that's a bit scary.

    Special teams saw long long term LS Dorenbos got somehow traded to the Saints for a 7th round pick. That move saved his life as the medical found a heart condition and the trade was unwound. But there's a new long snapper! Sturgis hurt himself in week 1 and is on IR there's now a new K too (Jake Elliot- i know nothing). Elsewhere ST are unchanged and should decent.

    In summary, the team got better
    QB better (experience)
    RB worse to the same eh
    WR MUCH better
    O line better
    TE same
    D line much better
    LB same
    Safety better (depth)
    CB better but still awful

    The defense will live or die on the front 7 and the offense will be on Wentz. I think they are a 500 to 9 maybe 10 win team at the best. Playoff and division contender but long shot to make noise.
     
  2. dcmissle

    dcmissle Deflatigator Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    This thread needs content.

    So Chip Kelly burns Reidland to the ground, and two years later, after a respectable 7-9 season, the Eagles are probably the best team in the NFC. With a QB playing magnificently in his second season.

    Do I have the chronology right? This seemingly happened overnight.

    Well done. Enjoy.
     
  3. JohnnyK

    JohnnyK Well-Known Member Silver Supporter SoSH Member

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    @Ryan_Messick

    Seth Joyner citing a source that the #Eagles expect to lose Hicks (Achilles) and Peters (MCL/ACL) for the rest of the year. Two huge losses.
     
  4. Average Reds

    Average Reds Dope Staff Member Dope V&N Mod SoSH Member

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    I am beyond ecstatic with the progression of Wentz and overall improvement of the team. However, the loss of Peters is a devastating blow.
     
  5. Kenny F'ing Powers

    Kenny F'ing Powers posts 18% useful shit

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    Any thoughts on the loss of hicks? The original poster seem to be really high on him at the start of the year.
     
  6. Average Reds

    Average Reds Dope Staff Member Dope V&N Mod SoSH Member

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    My comments about Peters was not meant to downplay the loss of Hicks, who was/is a rising star on defense.

    Both are important players. But Peters - a team captain and probable HoF tackle - is a critical cog in the success of the Eagles' offense and far more difficult to replace. If we see a gradual decline in the performance of Wentz from this point on, it will be in no small part due to the loss of Peters.

    Edit: I should also make clear that my reaction to the loss of Peters is driven by what I perceive as the finality of the injury. If the injury is as bad as reported (MCL, ACL) there's a good chance he has played his last down.
     
    #6 Average Reds, Oct 24, 2017
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2017
  7. Bosoxen

    Bosoxen Bounced back Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    With apologies to Fletcher Cox, Hicks might be their best defensive player*. As LondonSox pointed out, he's their Sean Lee and as any Cowboys fan can tell you, losing that particular player is a devastating blow. I do think, however, that Philly's defense is far better-suited to withstand that loss - at least on pass defense - but unless someone really steps up, they're likely to see a significant downgrade in their run defense.

    *I'm only slightly biased, since I've been a huge fan of his since his playing days at Texas. But I've seen how big of a gap there is between a Hicks-led defense and a Hicks-less defense. At both levels. Dude is a really really good player and it's a shame he has trouble staying healthy - again, not unlike Sean Lee.
     
  8. Oil Can Dan

    Oil Can Dan Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Hicks is indeed a huge blow, as is Peters. I'd gladly trade the W for an L if it meant those two weren't injured.

    It sounds like Peter's has an MCL and not an ACL, which means he could be back by Christmas and then the playoffs. I actually think Vaitai will do a fine fill-in job, and I hope they leave Lane at RT rather than bump him over to the left.

    Hicks is a blow for sure especially because they don't have the quality depth at LB that they do on the OL, but if Darby is back then it becomes a lot easier to play a third safety to help cover that loss. But Joe Walker is not good, and anything that puts him on the field more is not good. Mychal Kendricks needs to be healthy ASAP, too. I wouldn't put Hicks on the Sean Lee level (except on the injury front) just yet, either. And while Hicks loss is a big blow, I wouldn't say it's a devastating blow as so long as the Eagles can rotate those seven stud-level DL over the course of a game then I think they're going to be fine, especially while getting healthy at the back-end of the D. As for most valuable Eagles defensive player, I'm going with Malcolm Jenkins followed by Fletcher Cox, and honestly I'm loving Nigel Bradham more than Hicks so far this year.

    And Carson Wentz...what can I even say? He is more then I could have ever hoped for at this point in time and then some. I feel like as long as he's upright, the Eagles have a pretty good chance vs anybody. Thank you, Cleveland!!
     
  9. LondonSox

    LondonSox Robert the Deuce SoSH Member

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    I kind of let the thread go as there was no seeming interest.

    Hicks is a huge loss. However, Kendricks has rebounded in a huge way this year. He missed last night due to a late hamstring pull. If he can recover then the Hicks lost is mitigated somewhat. But the depth behind bradham and Kendricks post Hicks is zero.

    On the plus side for the injuries, Darby should be back soon and Jones is potentially back towards the week 10 bye.
    Which would be nice.

    There is no replacement for peters. That really really sucks and is a big big hit to a very good line.

    Obviously what needed to go right to perform like this has.
    Kelce has rebounded at center and the line has been great. The d line has been sensational and Barnett is coming on now to add another weapon. Teams are unable to exploit the secondary issues. Though also Douglas and Robinson have both been much better than expected.

    The agholor rebound is amazing. Good for the kid. Ertz has broken out. I love hollins. I think he's going to be great. Honestly Smith and Jefferies have been disappointing.

    The big change is wentz. Second year qb and he's in total control pre snap. Amazing. His deep ball accuracy has improved from the early games even this season. His pocket presence is utterly ridiculous.

    49ers next week a huge trap game.
    Then the broncos who have huge issues on the oline which is not what you need Vs this team. Both at home.

    Then a bye. They have a great chance to go into the bye 8-1 or 7-2.
     
  10. bandito0

    bandito0 Well-Known Member Bronze Supporter SoSH Member

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    Truth all the way around. I was livid when they got rid of Jordan Matthews and kept Agholor because I thought Agholor was beyond hope. What a turn around.

    I love Ertz. I made a comment last night on Ertz's TD catch that last year or the year before, Ertz would have fallen down or went out of bound, but this year he is lowering his shoulder and going right at people. I love it. Him and Wentz are totally on the same page.

    7 or 8 wins at the bye? Never in my wildest dreams for this season did I think that total would be in play.
     
  11. Oil Can Dan

    Oil Can Dan Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Peter's tore both his ACL & MCL. That's it for 2017, and I wonder if that's it forever.
     
  12. LondonSox

    LondonSox Robert the Deuce SoSH Member

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    Hicks done for the season with Achilles too.
    Ugh
     
  13. Oil Can Dan

    Oil Can Dan Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    I feel like I should be more worried than I am.

    I blame Wentz.
     
  14. Oil Can Dan

    Oil Can Dan Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    So a 4th to the Phins for Ajay.

    This means that the Eagles traded Sam Bradford for Derrek Barnett and Jay Ajay.

    I like it.

    One of the biggest areas of concern for the Eagles offense is blitz pickup, and I'm hoping Ajay can improve the unit in that regard. PFF ranks him 19th out of 44 RBs in blitz pickup, with Blount 33rd and the other Eagle RBs lower. Wentz takes way too many hits, so anything that minimizes that is a great thing in my book.

    I hope the Eagles at least add a depth piece at OL today, too.
     
  15. LondonSox

    LondonSox Robert the Deuce SoSH Member

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    yeah like the move for this year, but man what a shit pick pumphrey was, and smallwood isn't great either.
     
  16. dcmissle

    dcmissle Deflatigator Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    It's fun watching the arms race between your guys and Seattle.
     
  17. sodenj5

    sodenj5 Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Not to poo poo on the parade, but Ajayi was pretty poor in pass protection. Damien Williams would typically come in on third downs because he was both a superior blocker and receiver to Ajayi.
     
  18. LondonSox

    LondonSox Robert the Deuce SoSH Member

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    sure but the existing options are worse. Smallwood is a 3rd down option for sure.

    I wouldn't enjoy defending Ajay and Blount constantly running fresh

    Blount has been super inconsistent, Smallwood constantly knocked up and no one on the roster can pass protect as well as Darren frickin Sproles
     
  19. Average Reds

    Average Reds Dope Staff Member Dope V&N Mod SoSH Member

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    Bumping this thread to celebrate another Eagles win.

    Just a dominant performance against what was supposed to be one of the better defenses.
     
  20. Valek123

    Valek123 Member SoSH Member

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    Absolutely blistered them, amazing to see Denver hammered like that - so bad they flexed out of the game. Eagles look nasty, and beginning to get as a team.
     
  21. j-man

    j-man Member

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    it was bad they flex thanks u eagles that wentz is a star QB denver is a lost team i fear denver will be 3-13 or 4-12
     
  22. Oil Can Dan

    Oil Can Dan Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    The Eagles have pounced on two teams with pretty bad QBs at the helm over the past two weeks. Credit to them, but that's what you're supposed to do.

    Big test in two weeks - at Dallas on SNF. The Eagles don't seem to do too well out of the gate with longer layoffs so it will be interesting to see how they start that game. Also will be interesting to see if Zeke is playing. The most interesting component of this game (to me) is going to be the trenches. The outstanding Dallas OL vs the outstanding Eagles DL rotation, and the Eagles pretty good OL vs the Dallas really good DL/front seven. I feel like this is going to be an epic game.

    Remaining schedule for Philly:

    bye
    @ Dallas
    Chicago
    @ Seattle
    @ LA Rams (planning on staying on the west coast for this game)
    Giants
    @ Oakland
    Dallas
     
  23. dcmissle

    dcmissle Deflatigator Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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  24. LondonSox

    LondonSox Robert the Deuce SoSH Member

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    I would note that that article misses that the o-line is almost the same as the one Kelly put in place. They kind of ignored that
     
  25. kelpapa

    kelpapa Member SoSH Member

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    Chris Long trying to convince this Broncos offensive lineman that he's playing well.


    Take a look at the first two responses on Twitter.
     
  26. LondonSox

    LondonSox Robert the Deuce SoSH Member

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    Chris long is awesome. Giving away his entire salary, supporting Jenkins on all the social side. Played well too
     
  27. Average Reds

    Average Reds Dope Staff Member Dope V&N Mod SoSH Member

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    Another week, another win that makes me wonder when I’m going to wake up.

    Hope it lasts through early February.
     
  28. Average Game James

    Average Game James Well-Known Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    Not trolling, honest question for anyone who watches the Eagles on a regular basis... what am I missing with what I keep hearing as the slam dunk Carson Wentz MVP case? I mean, we're talking about a guy completing less than 60% of his passes for 243 yards/game with 9 turnovers in 10 games. The TDs stand out, but look to be boosted by a defense that forces a bunch of turnovers and gives him short fields to work with. I'm not saying he shouldn't be a leading candidate, but the media talk would have you think he's got the MVP wrapped up already. Is what he's doing really that much more impressive than Smith, or Brady, or Brees, or even Russell Wilson?
     
  29. Average Reds

    Average Reds Dope Staff Member Dope V&N Mod SoSH Member

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    Anyone saying that Wentz is a slam-dunk MVP is engaging in a bit of hyperbole.

    He’s a 2nd year pro having a breakout season and the Eagles offense is hitting on all cylinders despite losing their top offensive lineman. Eagle fans should be content with his very impressive performance.

    I don’t tend to listen the the football media that much. And the Philly media is about the worst. (Just FYI.)
     
  30. LondonSox

    LondonSox Robert the Deuce SoSH Member

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    It's because they are dominant and he's QB. He's been great, and has improved in every weakness area, but what he has done is been timely. He's constantly hung in, bought time, moved around the pocket and taken the hit to make the play in the red zone and 3rd down.
    Take a look at his numbers on 3rd down.
     
  31. Curt S Loew

    Curt S Loew SoSH Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Where do you keep hearing this? May want to consider the source. Wentz is having a great year on a team that is 9-1. He's a leading candidate, for sure. But, Slam Dunk?
     
  32. slamminsammya

    slamminsammya Member SoSH Member

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    According to vegas wentz was even odds for mvp heading into this past Sunday.
     
  33. Average Game James

    Average Game James Well-Known Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    Perhaps some hyperbole, but it felt like every piece of NFL coverage I've seen the past few weeks concerning the Eagles spoke like Wentz was the clear MVP front runner. It seemed a bit over the top to me based on the numbers, which is why I posed the question as to what I might not be seeing that's happening game to game, and the response here would say that while he's certainly a contender, there's a lot of media driven narrative based on a young QB having a very good year for a 9-1 team. It will be interesting to see what happens with a couple tougher road games coming up in the next 3 weeks (@SEA, @LAR).
     
  34. reggiecleveland

    reggiecleveland sublime Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    If he and Brady are close he wins it. Voters love the new flavour of the Month
     
  35. Curt S Loew

    Curt S Loew SoSH Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Good. I'd rather he win something else. An NFL MVP hasn't won the Super Bowl since Warner in 99.
     
  36. Morgan's Magic Snowplow

    Morgan's Magic Snowplow Well-Known Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    Pederson confirmed Wentz' ACL tear.

    That sucks. Sorry to Eagles fans and to football fans in general, as he is really fun to watch.
     
  37. dcmissle

    dcmissle Deflatigator Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    Condolences. They have been fun to watch.

    League of attrition, this year more than ever.
     
  38. Kenny F'ing Powers

    Kenny F'ing Powers posts 18% useful shit

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    As a fan of a team looking to win a SB, I'm happy. Wentz has a scary good pocket presence, and that team was one of the top teams in the NFL with him under center.

    As a fan of fun football? This sucks.

    Hope he comes back healthy and wins a few SB...when Brady decides to hang them up.

    Tough break, Eagles fans. This league can go from awesome to not fair real goddamn quick.
     
  39. Average Reds

    Average Reds Dope Staff Member Dope V&N Mod SoSH Member

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    I swear, I was actually giddy in the first half yesterday. Even texted my brother-in-law that "it feels odd to be watching the Eagles play for playoff seeding." Oops.

    I think Foles is a great backup, but I still feel a bit snakebitten right now.

    Get well, Carson.
     
  40. 21st Century Sox

    21st Century Sox Member SoSH Member

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    Bad luck, but in an odd way happy to hear about season ending. I was afraid it was a partial tear, and the Eagles would RGIII Wentz, which would have been awful.
     
  41. tims4wins

    tims4wins PN23's replacement SoSH Member

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    Barnwell had a interesting comparison today: the 1990 Giants. Simms was having a really nice year in 1990, a 15:4 TD:INT ratio, highest AY/A of his career, highest passer rating, then got hurt in week 15. Hostetler came off the bench and didn't lose a game. The Eagles are a well rounded team, they can absolutely still get to the Super Bowl. Not sure if they could beat Ben or Brady, but they can get there.
     
  42. djbayko

    djbayko Member SoSH Member

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    Should we change the thread title to "Influwentza Epidemic"?

    This is a shame. Wentz and the Eagles have been one of the great stories of 2017 and the team was really fun to watch. There have been several season-killing QB injuries this season.
     
  43. loshjott

    loshjott Well-Known Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    Absolutely, just thinking the same thing. They have 3 winnable games remaining and very likely to earn a bye with Minn the only realistic competitor for #1 seed. They could be facing Brees outside in January while Minnesota and LA fight it out in the other Divisional game.
     
  44. Ed Hillel

    Ed Hillel Wants to be startin somethin SoSH Member

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    Philadelphia Eagles 2017: Revenge of Santa.

    Count me in as those who think the Eagles still have a pretty decent shot, though I think they went from favorites to middle of the pack odds where NFC teams are concerned.
     
  45. Oil Can Dan

    Oil Can Dan Well-Known Member Lifetime Member SoSH Member

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    They'll get a bye with one more win, and home field throughout with two. With the Giants and Raiders on the schedule I think they'll do just that.

    They have a really good defense, a pretty good running game (at least with Wentz at QB) and yesterdays' punt team aside very good special teams. Foles is a bottom-tier QB, but teams have won with less I guess.

    It's just so fucking disappointing though. What could have been...
     
  46. Marciano490

    Marciano490 Urological Expert SoSH Member

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    Is Foles that bad? He had that one great season, then that crap season, but it was under Jeff Fisher, so maybe it should be taken with a grain of salt?
     
  47. BigSoxFan

    BigSoxFan Member SoSH Member

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    If the playoffs started today, the Eagles would play the winner of Atlanta and the Rams in the Divisional Round. We've yet to see what Goff 2.0 looks like in poor weather but we know the Falcons aren't that good this are and are typically worse outside the friendly confines of a dome. If they win, they'd be getting someone in the Saints/Panthers/Vikings group. I think a Foles-led Eagles team would be small favorites over the Saints/Vikings and decent favorites over the Panthers. I think making the SB is still very much in play.

    The hard part is winning the SB. Barring injury, the opponent is almost certainly going to be either the Pats or the Steelers and I don't see the Eagles being able to score enough with Foles at QB to hang with Brady or Ben. With that said, if this injury had to happen, it's better now than, say, Week 17 as there's plenty of time for Foles to get comfortable heading into the playoffs.

    All in all, it just flat out sucks and I feel bad for the players and fans. That city has had to deal with such crap injury luck and it takes the fun out of sports when your quality teams are constantly getting impacted by major injuries.
     
  48. InstaFace

    InstaFace MDLzera

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    If you're asking me, Philly has the best backup-QB situation in the league, now that the Patriots traded Garoppolo. Having Foles there, who's proven to be a decent starter capable of brilliance, really means their season shouldn't be over-and-done. Philly's strength is their defense anyway.

    Let's remember it was Foles who threw the dagger 3rd-down conversion yesterday to finish off the Rams, which was not an easy throw. I think he's easy to underrate.
     
  49. johnmd20

    johnmd20 literally like ebola Lifetime Member Gold Supporter SoSH Member

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    Foles is a serviceable backup and it's no stretch to say he's better than Case Keenum, Jared Goff, and Joe Flacco. The Eagles can definitely make and win the super bowl with him, but obviously their odds have decreased. Wentz was having a special year. With Foles, they have to gameplan around him, hope the defense keeps killing it, and also hope Blount and Ajayi really pick up the slack. They might be able to.
     
  50. LondonSox

    LondonSox Robert the Deuce SoSH Member

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    I haven't done much anyway but if someone would take over some vague eagles updates going forward that's would be grand.
     

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