Ugly ugly ugly. Everyone figured this would be a tough game, but who would have thought the Phins wouldn't show up?
2016 Miami Dolphins: Amazing Gase
- Thread starter sodenj5
- Start date
Congratulations.
Meanwhile, Miami's habit of digging themselves a hole early in games is biting them hard today. They've made adjustments and shown great resiliency during the winning streak, but they've shown no sign of that today. Frustrating.
We're looking at a brutal path to the playoffs from here, but at least the upcoming games will still technically be meaningful.
Then why not a quicker adjustment?
Fuck it anyway since apparently the offense decided not show up, as well.
Fuck it anyway since apparently the offense decided not show up, as well.
physically embarrassed and outcoached on both sides. pretty much all there is to it.
have to win out. Awful performance
have to win out. Awful performance
Question is whether they let the Ravens beat them twice, or are able to bounce back next week and keep their season alive. Will be interesting
Well, at least something broke right. Bottom line is Baltimore played that game and treated it as if it were a playoff game from the opening snap and Miami was just never able to match their intensity. They went for it on fourth down several times and ending up converting and ultimately getting points while Miami was way too slow in making adjustments. Inexplicable to me how Flacco is essentially a statue back there, yet they decide to rush 4 almost all game and play a soft zone coverage.
Speaking of breaks, Kiko Alonso broke his thumb and had surgery to repair it. Still possible he plays Sunday with a cast on it.
Miami needs to win 3 of their last 4 to have a legit shot of making it in. Denver needs to lose 2 of its next 4. Denver is @ the Titans, home vs the Patriots, @ the Chiefs, and home vs. the Raiders.
It's a bit of a long shot, but I can see Denver splitting those two divisional games and possibly losing to NE. Miami's game this week is essentially a must-win because I don't see them running the table and beating the Jets and Bills on the road and the Patriots to close out the season.
Speaking of breaks, Kiko Alonso broke his thumb and had surgery to repair it. Still possible he plays Sunday with a cast on it.
Miami needs to win 3 of their last 4 to have a legit shot of making it in. Denver needs to lose 2 of its next 4. Denver is @ the Titans, home vs the Patriots, @ the Chiefs, and home vs. the Raiders.
It's a bit of a long shot, but I can see Denver splitting those two divisional games and possibly losing to NE. Miami's game this week is essentially a must-win because I don't see them running the table and beating the Jets and Bills on the road and the Patriots to close out the season.
In attendance yesterday. You ran into the wrong team at the wrong time on the road. This loss probably won't look as bad at season's end. I think Baltimore is on the come this last month.
You needed to pressure Flacco, even if it meant giving up more on the ground. He was hot and had only one face palm moment. Too many weapons with SS Sr., Wallace, Perriman and Pitta. Don't know if it showed on tv, but on most plays, they had one or two of them running free.
You needed to pressure Flacco, even if it meant giving up more on the ground. He was hot and had only one face palm moment. Too many weapons with SS Sr., Wallace, Perriman and Pitta. Don't know if it showed on tv, but on most plays, they had one or two of them running free.
Too many weapons? Ravens are like 30th in the league in offensive DVOA and none of those players listed are good anymore.
Offense, sure, whatever, Ravens are really good on defense, Miami's resurgence has been predicated on their running game, and running the ball on Baltimore isn't going to
happen. Wouldn't worry much there. Getting carved up by the Ravens passing game should never happen to a good defense.
Offense, sure, whatever, Ravens are really good on defense, Miami's resurgence has been predicated on their running game, and running the ball on Baltimore isn't going to
happen. Wouldn't worry much there. Getting carved up by the Ravens passing game should never happen to a good defense.
Any reason not to include the Steelers as the other team Miami should be aiming for? Seems less likely to happen since they're playing better and have an easier schedule, but it's a similar scenario in that if Pittsburgh loses, say @ Buffalo and v. Baltimore, a Dolphins 3 - 1 finish would give them a leg up. Unless I'm missing something.
Yeah, there's just no way to sugar coat it. The Dolphins got abused by a weak offense. They can redeem themselves with a decent performance against Arizona on Sunday; it will basically be their moment of truth.
Miami ranked 8 in defensive DVOA, the Patriots 21st.
Miami ranked 6 against the pass, the Patriots 28.
As of 11/29.
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Ravens did not tear up a lousy pass defense yesterday, as you imply. ("Getting carved up by the Ravens passing game should never happen to a good defense.")
Dolphins defense did not get home against Flacco. That was the story of the game.
Dolphins defense did not get home against Flacco. That was the story of the game.
I don't know if it was a no-show as much as a scheme thing. The Ravens identified early on that Alonso and Paysinger were liabilities in coverage and according to Gase, there wasn't enough communication to close up the first windows. Also, they figured out that Lippett had problems on the slant and that's a favorite Flacco throw.
As for the DL, the Ravens basically have their starting OL back and healthy and it is one of their strengths. Yanda is Yanda, Stanley is playing above-average, and when Wagner is healthy, he can be quite good.
Finally, the Ravens I think have figured out the book on Tannehill as they kept him to 90 yards last year and limited him this year.
It's a bad matchup for MIA all the way around.
That being said, with the OL healthy, the Ravens are not going to end up the second-worse offense in the league. If Flacco gets time, he has more than enough weapons to make other teams pay.
I think the only encouraging thing to come from that game is Jay Ajayi actually ran the ball really well against a stingy defense. If Miami didn't fall behind so quickly, so early, I think he breaks over 100 yards the way he was running.
He averaged over 5 yards/attempt, which was his best since his back-to-back 200 yard games.
He averaged over 5 yards/attempt, which was his best since his back-to-back 200 yard games.
Ajayi was phenomenal on Sunday. Consistently making yards out of nothing. Averaged over 5 ypc as you mentioned, albeit only on 12 carries. But he was very, very impressive. For my money, the two bright spots on the field were Ajayi and Dion Sims. Might we finally have something at TE? He seems to be consistently making plays in the passing game that we haven't seen during his tenure in Miami. He would be a welcomed addition to the offense, especially in light of his excellent skills as a blocker.
In terms of the playoff outlook, I think that was the nail in the coffin for this team. I say that because I don't think 10 wins is going to get it done in the AFC with the way those teams out west are refusing to lose. Additionally, I'm a subscriber to the theory that there's zero chance this team beats Buffalo on Christmas Eve. Nothing to hang our heads about though, even with a playoff-less campaign. I think a winning record is attainable and I think we've found an excellent young and hungry HC to lead this team over the coming years.
It finally feels like we might have some stability on an organization-wide basis, which would be a welcomed change from the nightmarish prior decade.
It's official. Miami fans should now be rooting against the Broncos. They're two games back from the Chiefs and Raiders now and Miami's best shot at making it in. They have the Titans, then the Pats, Chiefs and Raiders who might be battling to the death for the AFC West and the 1 or 2 seed.
Kiko Alonso seems like he's going to be a game time decision. The trio of Hewitt, Hull, and Paysinger or Jenkins doesn't make me feel great about stopping David Johnson. Jesus, Miami better draft 2 LBs next year.
Kiko Alonso seems like he's going to be a game time decision. The trio of Hewitt, Hull, and Paysinger or Jenkins doesn't make me feel great about stopping David Johnson. Jesus, Miami better draft 2 LBs next year.
Totally with this. Miami needs to root for Tennessee, New England and KC to beat Denver. If Miami went 3-1 down the stretch with that scenario playing out then they get in as the 6th seed. I played this out in the ESPN playoff predictor.
Thankfully, I ended up moving this past Sunday ... so I still haven't seen last week's game. I had planned to avoid my phone and watch the replay later that night, but my father couldn't help but send me several ball-busting texts for me to read prior to my move being completed.
I've avoided the game since, but I'll endure the process tonight. From the comments made in this thread, my fears (that I buried deep-down) came to fruition. Miami this year as struggled against:
- Superior coaching
- Offenses that excel at isolating LB vs mismatches or taking advantage soft zones.
- Offenses that spread you out, frequent 3-4 WR sets.
In comparison, I think previous teams were a bit foolhardy in trying to remain balanced. They would often run on 1st and 2nd down, frequently allowing 3rd and 7 or worse. That works to Miami's strength. Baltimore, a lot like New England, seems to have gone right after Miami through the air. Quick passing, middle of the field.
I think Miami's a well coached team with several play-makers sprinkled throughout; however, they're not a well-constructed team. There's depth issues in very key positions, as well as players with skill-sets that aren't particular scheme fits. Add the fact that injuries have been rampant, and it's made the roster issue more obvious.
If the Dolphins can win vs. AZ, I think the playoffs are still a chance this year. But either way, I'm really excited about what this staff can do as they add to the roster intelligently.
I've avoided the game since, but I'll endure the process tonight. From the comments made in this thread, my fears (that I buried deep-down) came to fruition. Miami this year as struggled against:
- Superior coaching
- Offenses that excel at isolating LB vs mismatches or taking advantage soft zones.
- Offenses that spread you out, frequent 3-4 WR sets.
In comparison, I think previous teams were a bit foolhardy in trying to remain balanced. They would often run on 1st and 2nd down, frequently allowing 3rd and 7 or worse. That works to Miami's strength. Baltimore, a lot like New England, seems to have gone right after Miami through the air. Quick passing, middle of the field.
I think Miami's a well coached team with several play-makers sprinkled throughout; however, they're not a well-constructed team. There's depth issues in very key positions, as well as players with skill-sets that aren't particular scheme fits. Add the fact that injuries have been rampant, and it's made the roster issue more obvious.
If the Dolphins can win vs. AZ, I think the playoffs are still a chance this year. But either way, I'm really excited about what this staff can do as they add to the roster intelligently.
There are still a handful of scenarios that put Miami in the playoffs. They're only 1 back from DEN and tied with BAL and PIT. Denver's schedule is brutal. The BAL and PIT have one h2h game and one of them is going to take the division leaving 3 teams for one spot.
Remaining schedules:
DEN 8-4 at TEN -- home NE -- at KC -- home OAK - could easily go 2-2 or worse. TEN is 6-6 but playing at home.
BAL 7-5 at NE --- home PHI-- at PIT -- at CIN - could easily go 2-2 9-7
PIT 7-5 at BUF-- at CIN -- home BAL - home CLE easiest schedule of the 4 but BUF and CIN are not gimmies
MIA 7-5 home ARI-- at NYJ-- at BUF -- home NE 2 probable wins left on the schedule which is more than you can say for Denver.
Remaining schedules:
DEN 8-4 at TEN -- home NE -- at KC -- home OAK - could easily go 2-2 or worse. TEN is 6-6 but playing at home.
BAL 7-5 at NE --- home PHI-- at PIT -- at CIN - could easily go 2-2 9-7
PIT 7-5 at BUF-- at CIN -- home BAL - home CLE easiest schedule of the 4 but BUF and CIN are not gimmies
MIA 7-5 home ARI-- at NYJ-- at BUF -- home NE 2 probable wins left on the schedule which is more than you can say for Denver.
The thing is there are no great teams this year. Most very good teams are ether heavy on defense or offense. Any of the above teams could beat the other and depending on the matchup and location you have 3-4 60/40 55/45 50/50 coin flips. Here is my breakdown:
The best of the very good (in no particular order):
1) NE
2) KC
3) OAK
4) BAL (getting healthier on offense and an amazing defense).
5) DAL
6) SEA
7) ATL
Above average to good again in no particular order:
8) PIT
9) GB
10) DEN
11) TB
12) MIN
13) NO
14) WAS
15) SD
16) TEN
17) MIA
18) BUF
19) NYG
Not sure:
20) PHL (once again a better start from the defense deteriorates over the season and the offense hasn't continued their early season success)
21) DET (8-4 but 26th or so in DVOA)
Below average to Bad:
22) CIN
23) ARI
24) CAR
25) CHI (you can put them here or the next circle of hell)
26) HOU (you can put them here or the next circle of hell)
27) IND (you can put them here or the next circle of hell)
Uncle Frank level of cheapness awful:
28) SF
29) CLE
30) LARM
31) NYJ
32) JAC
It's packed tight and close this year so on the one hand Miami doesn't have to slay a Goliath but on the other hand there aren't many gimmes and the competition probably has a schedule that in the aggregate is comparable to yours so you need some luck.
The best of the very good (in no particular order):
1) NE
2) KC
3) OAK
4) BAL (getting healthier on offense and an amazing defense).
5) DAL
6) SEA
7) ATL
Above average to good again in no particular order:
8) PIT
9) GB
10) DEN
11) TB
12) MIN
13) NO
14) WAS
15) SD
16) TEN
17) MIA
18) BUF
19) NYG
Not sure:
20) PHL (once again a better start from the defense deteriorates over the season and the offense hasn't continued their early season success)
21) DET (8-4 but 26th or so in DVOA)
Below average to Bad:
22) CIN
23) ARI
24) CAR
25) CHI (you can put them here or the next circle of hell)
26) HOU (you can put them here or the next circle of hell)
27) IND (you can put them here or the next circle of hell)
Uncle Frank level of cheapness awful:
28) SF
29) CLE
30) LARM
31) NYJ
32) JAC
It's packed tight and close this year so on the one hand Miami doesn't have to slay a Goliath but on the other hand there aren't many gimmes and the competition probably has a schedule that in the aggregate is comparable to yours so you need some luck.
The Dolphins of the last 15 years complete the act of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory in a game like today. But hell, we're now looking at meaningful football games for Miami over the holidays.
It's also worth pointing out that Matt Moore was generally considered one of the better backups in the league when he decided to re-sign with Miami. Some were surprised he didn't go somewhere where he could have competed for a starting job. So it could be worse for the Dolphins, and if Moore can shake off the rust, he might just be OK. In other words....next man up, bitches!
That's my glass half-full take on the situation after another improbable victory that amazingly puts the Phins back in the playoff picture. I'll choose to enjoy the buzz for as long as I can.
It's also worth pointing out that Matt Moore was generally considered one of the better backups in the league when he decided to re-sign with Miami. Some were surprised he didn't go somewhere where he could have competed for a starting job. So it could be worse for the Dolphins, and if Moore can shake off the rust, he might just be OK. In other words....next man up, bitches!
That's my glass half-full take on the situation after another improbable victory that amazingly puts the Phins back in the playoff picture. I'll choose to enjoy the buzz for as long as I can.
Have to feel for Tannehill. He finally gets a coach that believes in him and has his back. His team is playing as well as it has in his 5 years. He's bought in and done everything the coaching staff has asked him to do, and to have his season end like that sucks.
Matt Moore is an interesting contrast to Tannehill. He isn't careful with the ball. He's a gun slinger. Even in the play to Stills, he probably never should have thrown that ball, stumbling off his back foot and throws it up for grabs.
I think Gase is going to have his hands full trying to reign Moore in.
Also, I thought this officiating crew was brutal. Miami has really gotten no help from the refs all year.
Matt Moore is an interesting contrast to Tannehill. He isn't careful with the ball. He's a gun slinger. Even in the play to Stills, he probably never should have thrown that ball, stumbling off his back foot and throws it up for grabs.
I think Gase is going to have his hands full trying to reign Moore in.
Also, I thought this officiating crew was brutal. Miami has really gotten no help from the refs all year.
I particularly enjoyed that phantom holding call on Steen, which called back Ajayi's rushing TD. What bullshit.
The Tannehill injury situation is depressing. This was finally his opportunity to play meaningful football in December with a competent coaching staff. This team, despite the success, has just seemed snake-bitten this year. One injury after another.
For some, this might seem crazy, but I wonder how RT's injury affects his contract situation. Miami can opt-out after this season. Prior to the injury, Miami re-upping had become a no-brainer, but now you have to concern yourself with:
1) Tanny's recovery time. Will he be truly 100% for '17-'18?
2) How will this affect his athleticism going forward?
RT will likely fully recover, but could struggle a bit his 1st year back with lessened athleticism. All that said, is he worth paying 20+ million for after proving that he's (possibly) a slightly above average QB? Certainly makes the decision a little more complicated.
The Tannehill injury situation is depressing. This was finally his opportunity to play meaningful football in December with a competent coaching staff. This team, despite the success, has just seemed snake-bitten this year. One injury after another.
For some, this might seem crazy, but I wonder how RT's injury affects his contract situation. Miami can opt-out after this season. Prior to the injury, Miami re-upping had become a no-brainer, but now you have to concern yourself with:
1) Tanny's recovery time. Will he be truly 100% for '17-'18?
2) How will this affect his athleticism going forward?
RT will likely fully recover, but could struggle a bit his 1st year back with lessened athleticism. All that said, is he worth paying 20+ million for after proving that he's (possibly) a slightly above average QB? Certainly makes the decision a little more complicated.
Also no flag on the hit on Tannehill just underlines how terrible the refs were. They've literally made rules to protect QBs from EXACTLY that type of hit. Unreal.
I don't think there is a question Tannehill is back and the starter next year. I don't think Matt Moore comes in and sets the world on fire. Miami also won't be in the position to draft an obvious replacement, and this is kind of a weak QB class.
As a QB, his recovery from an ACL is shorter than say a WR or RB would be. He might have to wear a brace going forward. Tannehill is also kind of interesting because while he obviously has excellent mobility and athleticism as a QB, he doesn't rely on it like Russell Wilson. It's like his tertiary option. So I wouldn't expect to see a noticeable decline in his play if his athleticism drops a tick next year.
I thought Campbell was pushed into his knee no? Would have been a tough one to call. That said, you're right that's exactly why the rule is in play - to protect QBs
This team has overcome a mountain of adversity. Now they face the Jets on a short week and then go into Buffalo. It would be easy to say they can just ride Ajayi, but the Bills and Jets are both stingy against the run. Matt Moore is going to need to win at least two divisional games in the next three for Miami to make it in.
I think they beat the Jets next week. Let's try not to think any further than that for now.
Some quick thoughts having slept on this game now:
A win this week would mark Miami's first winning season since 2008 and a 3 win improvement over last year's team. A huge amount of credit belongs to Adam Gase but also Mike Tannenbaum and Steve Ross. It finally feels like Miami has their guy.
A few months ago, we talked about what we want out of this season. I said I wanted to see improvement. A winning season and a +3 win step up is a clear and marked improvement, and a huge feather in the cap for Adam Gase in his first year. This roster is largely the same as 2015 and has also been decimated with injuries. Reshad Jones, Mike Pouncey now Ryan Tannehill, not to mention guys like Koa Misi, Xavien Howard, Devante Parker banged up all year. Both Albert and Tunsil missing various games. They keep finding ways to win.
Still feel bad for Tannehill. After seeing the guy get up after getting rocked so many times in 5 years, it's a real shame he's going to miss out on his team's success which was built on a ton of his own hard work this year. He was having the best year of his career under Gase.
A win this week would mark Miami's first winning season since 2008 and a 3 win improvement over last year's team. A huge amount of credit belongs to Adam Gase but also Mike Tannenbaum and Steve Ross. It finally feels like Miami has their guy.
A few months ago, we talked about what we want out of this season. I said I wanted to see improvement. A winning season and a +3 win step up is a clear and marked improvement, and a huge feather in the cap for Adam Gase in his first year. This roster is largely the same as 2015 and has also been decimated with injuries. Reshad Jones, Mike Pouncey now Ryan Tannehill, not to mention guys like Koa Misi, Xavien Howard, Devante Parker banged up all year. Both Albert and Tunsil missing various games. They keep finding ways to win.
Still feel bad for Tannehill. After seeing the guy get up after getting rocked so many times in 5 years, it's a real shame he's going to miss out on his team's success which was built on a ton of his own hard work this year. He was having the best year of his career under Gase.
Holy shit. The dude really is made of iron. I've seen his knee bent the wrong way in pictures. That's insane.
I guess that's the absolute best case scenario for Miami and Tannehill's future.
EDIT:
Jeff Darlington tweeted Miami is cautiously optimistic that Tannehill may be able to return if Miami made the playoffs. Wow.
Also a quick note, Roethlisberger suffered an ACL/MCL sprain in 2015 and returned in 4 weeks. That would put a return for Tannehill for the playoffs within the realm of possibility.
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great news. I think they can beat the Jets and Bills (in the snow) if the o-line is healthy. the D is a disaster, though. Any word on Bobby Mccain? not having your top slot CB is a disaster when playing the Pats or really anyone
Pouncey to the IR in what was essentially a lost season for him. I think the Dolphins are making the right move. Getting him right and at 100% for 2017 should be a higher priority than these next three games. He's been banged up the last few years.
At this point I would be surprised to see Xavien Howard back this year. Also, I don't think Tannehill sees the field again unless Miami makes the playoffs. Then it could be a coin flip based on his rehab and how he looks over the next 4 weeks, assuming the second opinion he is getting today confirms a sprain and no surgery is needed.
At this point I would be surprised to see Xavien Howard back this year. Also, I don't think Tannehill sees the field again unless Miami makes the playoffs. Then it could be a coin flip based on his rehab and how he looks over the next 4 weeks, assuming the second opinion he is getting today confirms a sprain and no surgery is needed.
Xavien Howard was removed from the injury report and confirmed he is playing Saturday. I think if he's 100%, or close to it, he's a boost to the secondary. Outside of Maxwell and Lippett, Miami is pretty thin at CB. Might be a good time to ease him in this week and ramp up his snap count in case Miami makes the playoffs, he'll be close to full speed in 4 weeks.
This is the type of blowout I wanted to see. The Buffalo game should be a much tougher test.
Howard/Lippett could be a really nice CB combo the next few years.
Howard/Lippett could be a really nice CB combo the next few years.
I've had that Buffalo game pegged as an L for a while. This Dolphin LB unit is trash. I don't know how they contain the speed and elusiveness of the Buffalo backfield. Tyrod and McCoy is tough on any defense, particularly one with some serious deficiencies in the front seven.
I hope you're right. After a vicious start to the schedule, the Fins have been handed an apparent gift for the final 3 games. Both the Jets and Bills appear to be imploding internally, with their coaches firmly on the hot seat. It'll be interesting to see how much fight Buffalo has left next week. Meanwhile, the Patriots should have the 1st round BYE locked up prior to their game in Miami. Why risk a Suh cheap-shot vs TB in a game that doesn't matter? <smile>
My father and I (Patriots' fan) have never been closer during the NFL season than in the last 2 weeks.
Howard has been in Marshall's back pocket all night. Great to see he looks 100% after a bumpy start to his career. Lippett had that lovely pick and broke hard on that comeback route on third down. Marshall isn't going to have much to say after this game.