2015 NBA Draft Thread-Choke For Oak?

HomeRunBaker

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Pacers sign Rakeem Christmas to a similar deal to that of Jordan Mickey. 4 years/$4.3m with first two guaranteed.

This began with Parsons, then a few others, followed by Ricky Ledo. Now it seems to be the new norm for second round picks who hold little leverage as the team demands the 3rd and 4th years as Team Options at a minimal salary.
 

Jed Zeppelin

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Apparently, Danny's offer for #9 was #16, #15 (through a prearranged deal with ATL), either Memphis or Minny #1, and one of the Brooklyn picks.

Steep price to move up 7 spots, but I guess it wouldn't look so bad if it was the Minny pick, the '18 BK pick and James Young traded for #15 or something like that.
 

jscola85

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The BKN pick I think is the dealbreaker for me, as it is looking more and more likely that the '16 BKN pick on its own will end up higher than Charlotte's 9th pick this year.
 

bowiac

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jscola85 said:
The BKN pick I think is the dealbreaker for me, as it is looking more and more likely that the '16 BKN pick on its own will end up higher than Charlotte's 9th pick this year.
I think it largely depends on how you view Winslow. Is he a generic 9th overall pick, or is he a high lottery talent who slipped because sometimes that happens (Pierce). I mostly think he's the latter, and given that offer from Danny, it seems like he agrees.
 

ElcaballitoMVP

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Jed Zeppelin said:
Apparently, Danny's offer for #9 was #16, #15 (through a prearranged deal with ATL), either Memphis or Minny #1, and one of the Brooklyn picks.

Steep price to move up 7 spots, but I guess it wouldn't look so bad if it was the Minny pick, the '18 BK pick and James Young traded for #15 or something like that.
I was pretty surprised to hear Charlotte turn down 4 1sts for the right to take Frank Kaminsky and I'm even more surprised now. That BKL pick alone would've made me think about trading the pick, let alone two more 1sts this year that they could've used to try to trade back up to get him. I suppose if they knew he wouldn't be there, and he's their guy, it makes some sense to take him, but is Frank the tank going to put Charlotte over the top? I'd rather have the BKL lotto ticket, but MJ had to have his guy. Danny wasn't kidding when he said after draft night that he probably went too far with his offer. 
 

HomeRunBaker

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bowiac said:
I think it largely depends on how you view Winslow. Is he a generic 9th overall pick, or is he a high lottery talent who slipped because sometimes that happens (Pierce). I mostly think he's the latter, and given that offer from Danny, it seems like he agrees.
This was also one of the deepest drafts at the top (I would go as far as to say overall too) in a long long time. We've seen limited wing players/role players like Kidd-Gilchrist (2nd), Evan Turner (2nd), Wesley Johnson (4th), Derrick Williams (2nd), Vesely (6th), Waiters (4th), and the list goes on and on. This draft has legit impact players all the way down to #7 in Mudiay......Winslow was not your normal #9 pick just as Dirk and Pierce weren't your everyday 9 and 10 which was known at the time.
 

jscola85

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bowiac said:
I think it largely depends on how you view Winslow. Is he a generic 9th overall pick, or is he a high lottery talent who slipped because sometimes that happens (Pierce). I mostly think he's the latter, and given that offer from Danny, it seems like he agrees.
 
Fair, though I think the 2016 draft is going to have 5-6 really good players that are just as good or better than Winslow and the Nets pick should fall right in there.  Skal, Jaylen Brown, Simmons (though I don't love him #1, he will be good), Kris Dunn, and Brandon Ingram could all step in next year from Day 1 and be impact contributors, and then there's others that could blow up this winter like Justin Jackson, Sabonis' kid, Cheick Diallo Demetrius Jackson and Nigel Hayes.  Have no idea on the Euros but I suspect at least one will develop enough to be a Hezonja-type prospect if not generate the buzz that KRISTAPS! did.
 

Drocca

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Brandon Ingram has a LOT of work to do on his body before he is anywhere near Winslow. I do not think he will be a one and done.
 

jscola85

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Winslow is certainly physically mature, but Ingram's got more upside.  The one thing you can almost guarantee from guys in the NBA is that they will get stronger thanks to the strength & conditioning programs by pro teams.  I tend to actually like guys in the draft who are young and need to get stronger because that's the easiest thing to project improvement for in the NBA.  Just look at how Anthony Davis and Rudy Gobert have developed in their first 2-3 years in the league.
 

HomeRunBaker

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jscola85 said:
Winslow is certainly physically mature, but Ingram's got more upside.  The one thing you can almost guarantee from guys in the NBA is that they will get stronger thanks to the strength & conditioning programs by pro teams.  I tend to actually like guys in the draft who are young and need to get stronger because that's the easiest thing to project improvement for in the NBA.  Just look at how Anthony Davis and Rudy Gobert have developed in their first 2-3 years in the league.
That is essentially the basis of the definition of upside which many people don't fully understand (not referring to yourself, as you clearly do). Players who are physically mature when they first enter the league don't have a lot of room to grow which is why Smart's improvement will almost be fully dependent on him developing a consistent 3-point shot......since his strength and body is already where it needs to be. This has been my issue with some of Ainge's draft picks recently in selecting low-upside players at a time when we need to "hit" draft picks in a big way. Sullinger, Olynyk, Smart......while passing on guys like The Greek Freak and Gobert were available). I probably shouldn't include Smart as that was a weak draft without much available after him so I was fine with that pick. The Olynyk one along with the entire philosophy is one I've been displeased with in recent years.
 

nighthob

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jscola85 said:
Fair, though I think the 2016 draft is going to have 5-6 really good players that are just as good or better than Winslow and the Nets pick should fall right in there.  Skal, Jaylen Brown, Simmons (though I don't love him #1, he will be good), Kris Dunn, and Brandon Ingram could all step in next year from Day 1 and be impact contributors, and then there's others that could blow up this winter like Justin Jackson, Sabonis' kid, Cheick Diallo Demetrius Jackson and Nigel Hayes.  Have no idea on the Euros but I suspect at least one will develop enough to be a Hezonja-type prospect if not generate the buzz that KRISTAPS! did.
Jamal Murray. Remember the name. I like him more than I did D'Angelo Russell and I liked Russell a lot. The only question with him (and in fairness it's the same question with Russell) is if he has enough lateral quickness to defend both guard spots at the NBA level (or grow a couple of inches so that he can defend both wing spots). In a vacuum I like him more than Dunn (and I like Dunn a lot as well).
 

EL Jeffe

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Murray is a phenom. Combo guard who can shoot, creates his own shot, takes over games and carries himself like the best player on the court. I also like him better than Russell; I don't think his playmaking skills are at Russell's league, but I think he's a tougher dude to defend. Best guard Cal has had since Wall.