Celtics in 18-19

Clears Cleaver

Lil' Bill
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A lot of the stats comparing this year to last year understate how the entire league offensively is better, right? The C's might be the same offensive team as last year, but relatively speaking they are a lot worse?

in 2017/18 C's averaged 104 PPG and gave up 100.4 PPG, placing them 19th in scoring and 3rd in defense (6th best points differential in league)
in 2018/19 C's averaging 105.8 PPG and giving up 103.4 PPG, ranking them 23rd and 3rd respectively (12th best points differential in league)

The NBA scoring has jumped from an average of 106.3 PPG per team to 110.4 PPG per team this year. the celtics are not keeping up

plus, Jaylen has largely sucked badly shooting the basketball, his stats across the board are way down and basically a disaster.
 

InstaFace

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Might as well get used to the losing because Kyrie will likely be a Celtic for the next 5 1/2 years. He's an immense talent who is not a good fit for this roster. It could very well turn out to be Oklahoma City redux.
Well, I'm convinced, especially from all the evidence posted. See you all in 2023, folks!

Why the love for Baynes over Thies in a major role? What does Baynes do markedly better than Thies other than guard other big burly dudes (a role he will obviously maintain)? I’d rather have Thies out there on defensive switches and his athleticism has been a positive around the basket offensively. He had his best game of the season offensively right before he got hurt where they made a long run with him in there mixing it up.
From watching the last few games, now that Theis has actually made it into real minutes, I'd say the difference is defense. Theis is routinely getting beat on the ground, has had little impact around the rim, doesn't rebound or box out, and has been a bit of a foul machine - 4 in 12 minutes vs Utah, 3 in 15 last night. I'll agree he's done better at setting up dunks and layups on offense, but we all know that Brad plays you or sits you primarily based on your focus on D, and with Baynes' newfound shooting skills their offense might be a wash anyway. Baynes has mobility limits that Theis doesn't have, but one thing he's consistent about is focus and effort on D.
 

BigSoxFan

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Ok, I'm going to be that guy. Anyone here seriously interested in a Bradley Beal trade? Come January, when Smart can be traded, I would make a Jaylen/Smart/Morris/lesser pick for Beal trade in a cocaine heartbeat. If we're going to go bombs away from 3, we might as well line up the best shooters we can. Depth would obviously take a hit but you only need 8-9 guys in the playoffs anyways.

Baynes / Williams
Horford / Theis
Tatum / Semi
Beal / Hayward
Kyrie / Rozier

Now, who's with me?!

*crickets*
 

the moops

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Beal for Smart/Brown/Yabusele/Ojeleye works. Morris is too important to this team, and if WAS is blowing it up, they wouldn't want one year of Morris anyway.
 

Papelbon's Poutine

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And Tatum is never going to be the Tatum we saw last year with Kyrie and Hayward here-- and let's not even get into the adverse effects on Jalen Brown and Terry Rozier.

Might as well get used to the losing because Kyrie will likely be a Celtic for the next 5 1/2 years. He's an immense talent who is not a good fit for this roster. It could very well turn out to be Oklahoma City redux.
This take is so hot it burned my eyes reading it. Try better.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Ok, I'm going to be that guy. Anyone here seriously interested in a Bradley Beal trade? Come January, when Smart can be traded, I would make a Jaylen/Smart/Morris/lesser pick for Beal trade in a cocaine heartbeat. If we're going to go bombs away from 3, we might as well line up the best shooters we can. Depth would obviously take a hit but you only need 8-9 guys in the playoffs anyways.

Baynes / Williams
Horford / Theis
Tatum / Semi
Beal / Hayward
Kyrie / Rozier

Now, who's with me?!

*crickets*
Sign me up but no real need to include Morris (unless you need his salary which I haven't looked at) as the Wizards would be in rebuild mode. We don't need "elite" depth as those players typically aren't the best fit for second unit roles. It will be fairly simple to add a piece or two who are better fits after Dec 15th if we did a Beal deal.

Edit: what the moops said.
 

BigSoxFan

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Beal for Smart/Brown/Yabusele/Ojeleye works. Morris is too important to this team, and if WAS is blowing it up, they wouldn't want one year of Morris anyway.
I figure they might like Morris to flip but I agree that losing him would be really tough. However, I like your construct much better and it seems to be a reasonable deal but I think a pick would be needed to complete it, which is obviously something we could easily offer. Smart gives them a solid PG if they are somehow able to deal Wall's monstrous contract. If not, he is a solid backup and easily tradeable. Jaylen would be the "prize" of the deal and gives them a young cost-controlled wing to replace Beal and, more importantly, would help to change a toxic culture. Yabu and Semi are mostly filler but they are cheap guys who still have at least a little upside.

Danny probably isn't interested but I think it makes a lot of sense from the Celtics' standpoint. I'm not sure who else could realistically offer more than Jaylen/Smart/filler/pick. Charlotte is reportedly interested but they don't really have anyone who approaches Jaylen's value.
 

lovegtm

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Beal for Smart/Brown/Yabusele/Ojeleye works. Morris is too important to this team, and if WAS is blowing it up, they wouldn't want one year of Morris anyway.
This deal makes sense for WAS, and would make the Celtics really, really good. The problem (as noted in another thread by HRB I think) is that Danny won't do anything until AD is off the market in one way or another.

I don't hate flipping Brown into Beal, since Beal has 3 more years of team control, and also because the team is going to have to develop whomever it gets with all the picks this year. It's a pretty good time to consolidate some players for one guy.
 

BigSoxFan

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This deal makes sense for WAS, and would make the Celtics really, really good. The problem (as noted in another thread by HRB I think) is that Danny won't do anything until AD is off the market in one way or another.

I don't hate flipping Brown into Beal, since Beal has 3 more years of team control, and also because the team is going to have to develop whomever it gets with all the picks this year. It's a pretty good time to consolidate some players for one guy.
AD isn't going to be available any time soon so I would hope that Ainge doesn't pass on a guy like Beal, if he really is attainable, to chase that white whale. However, I don't think these deals would be mutually-exclusive. Theoretically, you could trade Jaylen/Smart/filler for Beal and then Tatum/Horford or Hayward/picks for AD.
 

Jed Zeppelin

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AD isn't going to be available any time soon so I would hope that Ainge doesn't pass on a guy like Beal, if he really is attainable, to chase that white whale. However, I don't think these deals would be mutually-exclusive. Theoretically, you could trade Jaylen/Smart/filler for Beal and then Tatum/Horford or Hayward/picks for AD.
Historically speaking, it is much better to do it this way anyways. Say you have all of Brown/Tatum/Smart/picks in the cupboard when AD is available—guess what the asking price will be?

The Wolves would have loved to get the Celtics #5 pick in the KG trade (we know the original iteration of the deal included this before KG nixed it), but it was already off to Seattle for Ray. It’s hard to get away with NOT including whatever young pieces you have in these trades, so if you can make a lesser deal first while holding on to the trump card (Big Al/Tatum), you’re still in the driver’s seat should another shoe drop later on.
 

chilidawg

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Sign me up but no real need to include Morris (unless you need his salary which I haven't looked at) as the Wizards would be in rebuild mode. We don't need "elite" depth as those players typically aren't the best fit for second unit roles. It will be fairly simple to add a piece or two who are better fits after Dec 15th if we did a Beal deal.

Edit: what the moops said.
I don't get the Beal fit. Sure doesn't fix the problem of too many shooters, since all you're subtracting are Smart (who doesn't shoot much) and Brown, and you're replacing with them with a high volume guy. And now you have an undersized backcourt with two below average defensive players starting.
 

BigSoxFan

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I don't get the Beal fit. Sure doesn't fix the problem of too many shooters, since all you're subtracting are Smart (who doesn't shoot much) and Brown, and you're replacing with them with a high volume guy. And now you have an undersized backcourt with two below average defensive players starting.
If the Celtics are going to shoot as many 3’s as they are, you might as well tailor your personnel to fit the scheme and acquiring Beal would give the team an elite shooter from downtown. Defense would certainly take a hit but I would much rather have Beal playing off of Kyrie’s penetration than Jaylen. Beal would also provide more spacing, which could potentially enable guys like Tatum to be more aggressive in attacking the rim.
 

DJnVa

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I guess Ainge hasn't put a team around Kyrie that's good enough to win. So let's dump Brown (two bad games in a row!), Smart (can't shoot) and a couple of other guys and try again with Beal. Better?
You realize they were winning with Kyrie last year right?

You’re taking things off the table here.
 

Sam Ray Not

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Does Kyrie have fond memories of his old backcourt mate JR Smith? Could be a homeless man's Beal, and could probably be had for next to nothing, allowing you to use the Rozier chip elsewhere,

 

Big John

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You realize they were winning with Kyrie last year right?

You’re taking things off the table here.
Yep, 20 in a row at one point. They also did pretty well without him later in the season.
What I see when I watch the games is nothing like what I saw during last year's winning streak. The team has regressed, and so has Kyrie. No ball movement, insufficient effort on defense.

I do see parallels with OKC. Westbrook is the best guard on the planet, a triple double machine. They'v had good players around him over the years: Harden, Durant,. Oladipo, Adams, and now PG13, just to name 5. Yet there have been no championships, and certainly nothing on the horizon. They are 2-3 years or one serious Westbrook injury away from a complete rebuild. If Presti gets fired, maybe the Celtics should hire him as a special consultant. But I'll provide the answer at no charge: one on five or two on five basketball rarely works, unless one of the players is Michael Jordan or LeBron James.
 

Sam Ray Not

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It could very well turn out to be Oklahoma City redux.
I do see parallels with OKC.
It's such a great comp it needed to be said twice!

Other than the fact that Kyrie is nothing like Westbrook (much closer to Curry or Lillard, fwiw), Stevens is nothing like Donovan, the teams are constructed and play very differently, etc...

I mean, yeah, they're both groups of tall human beings; and they're both NBA basketball teams with championship aspirations who haven't reached them yet, and may need a move or coaching tweak or two get there (which is I assume is the central point you're concern-trolling here). But you could say the same about every team in the NBA who isn't (1) totally hopeless; or (2) the Warriors.

And of course, you could have said the same about the Warriors in 2014-15, or about the Rockets last year before they came thisclose to ending the Warriors' hegemony. Etc.

What are you advocating here, again? That the Celtics dump Kyrie, give up their immediate chase for a title, and start back at square one? Because of a stretch of 17 games in which the ball movement has been sub-optimal?
 
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Sam Ray Not

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There's a less than zero chance that a team will trade for him let alone the Celtics.
Haha, is he that bad these days? I guess I thought of him as a better-conditioned Swaggy P — a pain in the ass, but potentially moderately useful on a team in need of a jolt of perimeter shooting off the bench from time to time (which I think describes the Cs). But I'll admit I haven't watched him that closely over the last couple years; and I wouldn't be surprised if the headaches now outweighed any mild basketball positives.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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There is no way J.R. Smith will make it through the season in Boston, especially if he is on the bench with younger players. CHB/Shank and his ilk- and these are guys who probably cannot name one Celtics player beyond maybe Irving or Tatum without invoking some shade-throwing nickname - would nearly die of happiness if Boston picked up Smith. The columns write themselves, especially if the Cs' continue to struggle.

Smith in Philadelphia is a different story. If he stays in the East, my guess is there unless the Knicks or Nets want him. I could see him winding up with any of the WC teams not named the Warriors with the Thunder, Rockets, Grizzlies and Blazers all candidates for his services. Hell, maybe Pop would even take a flier on him. I simply cannot see him in Boston...
 

Big John

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I think the Celtics are stuck with Kyrie. With his impending free agency and his stated preference for remaining in Boston, Ainge would be lucky to get 50 cents on the dollar. You couldn't even get Beal straight up for him.

What irks me is folks who make excuse after excuse for the team's bad performance. It's the new rules, or Stevens' rotations, or Hayward's injury or bad performances from the classic whipping boys (Smart) or the new ones (Jaylen Brown). The fact is that this is now Kyrie's team, and the buck stops with him. If they reel off 20 in a row again, he'll get the credit. But when they are 9-8 and losing to bad teams, he gets the blame. It isn't the rest of the team because they proved that they could win without him.
 

benhogan

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It's such a great comp it needed to be said twice!

Other than the fact that Kyrie is nothing like Westbrook (much closer to Curry or Lillard, fwiw), Stevens is nothing like Donovan, the teams are constructed and play very differently, etc...

I mean, yeah, they're both groups of tall human beings; and they're both NBA basketball teams with championship aspirations who haven't reached them yet, and may need a move or coaching tweak or two get there (which is I assume is the central point you're concern-trolling here). But you could say the same about every team in the NBA who isn't (1) totally hopeless; or (2) the Warriors.

And of course, you could have said the same about the Warriors in 2014-15, or about the Rockets last year before they came thisclose to ending the Warriors' hegemony. Etc.

What are you advocating here, again? That the Celtics dump Kyrie, give up their immediate chase for a title, and start back at square one? Because of a stretch of 17 games in which the ball movement has been sub-optimal?
+1. I thought it was such a bazaar comp that Big John must be joking.

No team in their right mind would add JR Smith, he will end up in Area 21 with KG by January.

Celts have no need to deal Kyrie, Brown, Smart or Rozier. Let's keep our talent, Brad just needs to find the right rotations and time for it to gel. It will take a few months since Gordon is playing prominent/high leverage minutes and he won't be 100% for a while. Getting Baynes and Theis more minutes will add toughness and balance to the lineup. Jae Crowder was correct when he said the Celtics needed players to do some dirty work.

https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2018/11/18/jae-crowder-thinks-celtics-big-problem-is-lack-of-dirty-work-players/
 
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DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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I think the Celtics are stuck with Kyrie. With his impending free agency and his stated preference for remaining in Boston, Ainge would be lucky to get 50 cents on the dollar. You couldn't even get Beal straight up for him.

What irks me is folks who make excuse after excuse for the team's bad performance. It's the new rules, or Stevens' rotations, or Hayward's injury or bad performances from the classic whipping boys (Smart) or the new ones (Jaylen Brown). The fact is that this is now Kyrie's team, and the buck stops with him. If they reel off 20 in a row again, he'll get the credit. But when they are 9-8 and losing to bad teams, he gets the blame. It isn't the rest of the team because they proved that they could win without him.
Serious question - what bad teams have defeated the Celtics? And you are firm in your view that this is the finished product after less than 20 games?
 

Big John

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Well, if it's the finished product we're really screwed. Has anyone seen significant improvement in the quality of their play since the preseason? I haven't. There have been some good individual performances, but as a team they have been unfocused and sloppy. So let's have some product development.

As for losses to bad teams, Orlando and Charlotte are bad teams whose decent records up to this point don't obscure that fact. They nearly lost to the Knicks as well.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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Orlando is bad.
Denver started hot, but they are have one win and six losses since they beat us.
Utah is under .500
The Hornets are .500.
I guess we have to agree on what bad is but imho, none of the teams the Celtics have lost to could be characterized as 'bad". For my definition, the league's bad teams are the Cavs, Suns, Knicks, Hawks and Bulls. And "almost" losing to a team doesn't constitute a loss - it counts as a win in the standings regardless of the score. Each of these teams, save maybe Cleveland, is capable of giving any team, including the Warriors, a tough game.

They lost to Denver on the road and its a notoriously tough place to play. And despite their struggles, Denver is not a bad team - they have one of the deeper rosters in the West. Ditto Utah who is not a bad team either. Orlando just lost to Toronto tonight by two on a buzzer beater and the Hornets gave Philly all they could handle on Saturday night - their best player is essentially unstoppable right now too.

The nature of the NBA is that on any given night the worst teams can challenge the best teams, especially early on. And especially on the road. Given that view, my view is that the Celtics have yet to lose to an "actual" bad team.
 

lovegtm

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I would have loved to see BigJohn's takes on LeBron 17 games into the 2010-2011 Heat's campaign.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Well, if it's the finished product we're really screwed. Has anyone seen significant improvement in the quality of their play since the preseason? I haven't. There have been some good individual performances, but as a team they have been unfocused and sloppy. So let's have some product development.

As for losses to bad teams, Orlando and Charlotte are bad teams whose decent records up to this point don't obscure that fact. They nearly lost to the Knicks as well.
While agree that the Celtics issues are personnel fit related you are way off in your assessment of the Hornets. They have the 3rd best Point Diff in the EC, 8th in the league. Of their 8 losses, 4 have come by 2 points or less, one by 4-points and another by 9 in OT. They are far from a "bad team."
 

Big John

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The Hornets are a bad team with a point guard on a tear. The loss to Charlotte was a direct result of Kyrie missing all of his shots in the last two minutes, and Kemba making his. Of course, Hayward missing every shot he took after the first one went in didn't help either. Semi Ojeleye can do that for considerably less money.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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The Hornets are a bad team with a point guard on a tear. The loss to Charlotte was a direct result of Kyrie missing all of his shots in the last two minutes, and Kemba making his. Of course, Hayward missing every shot he took after the first one went in didn't help either. Semi Ojeleye can do that for considerably less money.
HRB shared data in the post above that completely contradicts your description of the Hornets as a "bad" team. What is your criteria exactly in defining them as such? You haven't even cited their losses to Cleveland and the Bulls but, again, those teams are going to steal games from other teams early on including elite squads - there are a number of instances where this happens each and every NBA season.

I get that watching the Celtics thus far has been frustrating - I don't think there is anyone here who roots for them who is pleased with the results thus far (and I suspect that someone who doesn't really like SRN would still agree). However, the takes that they are destined to lose because of Kyrie and that they are succumbing to bad teams should, at least, be accompanied by supporting data.

What is your definition of a "bad" team? Is it simply any team who you think the Celtics should beat?
 

Big John

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Well, look at the personnel. After Kemba-- leading the league in scoring at the moment-- what do they have? Batum, Lamb, an over-the-hill Tony Parker, Marvin Williams (who has been a journeyman in the league since the stone age), and Willy Hernangomez, who in fairness destroys the Celtics every time they play against him. Frank the tank hardly gets off the bench these days.

Am I supposed to conclude this is a good team?
 

HomeRunBaker

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Well, look at the personnel. After Kemba-- leading the league in scoring at the moment-- what do they have? Batum, Lamb, an over-the-hill Tony Parker, Marvin Williams (who has been a journeyman in the league since the stone age), and Willy Hernangomez, who in fairness destroys the Celtics every time they play against him. Frank the tank hardly gets off the bench these days.

Am I supposed to conclude this is a good team?
The Hornets won 4 of their games with Kemba scoring 18, 19, 20, and 24 points. They are 3-4 in games he's gone for 30+. It's isn't like he's singlehandedly carrying to wins.......actually it's quite the opposite. It is more to do with the Hornets being a deep and well balanced team who is 7th overall in OffRat and 12th in DefRat.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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Well, look at the personnel. After Kemba-- leading the league in scoring at the moment-- what do they have? Batum, Lamb, an over-the-hill Tony Parker, Marvin Williams (who has been a journeyman in the league since the stone age), and Willy Hernangomez, who in fairness destroys the Celtics every time they play against him. Frank the tank hardly gets off the bench these days.

Am I supposed to conclude this is a good team?
Good teams are, more often than not, top-heavy with talent. If you are arguing that by excluding some of that that talent, the team wouldn't be as good, I doubt anyone would disagree. That said, I don't know how you define bad so its hard for me to answer whether Charlotte is "good" or not.

Players like Lamb, Hernangomez and even Monk have all improved and appear to be developing into good NBA rotation players. The rest of the roster is your typical NBA squad with some wily veterans and some rookies. The Hornets probably aren't going to the finals but they can compete with anyone on a given night and will likely be a tough out in the early rounds of the playoffs.
 

Big John

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Any NBA team can compete on any given night, even the Celtics.

Was anyone picking Charlotte to make the playoffs this year? Maybe some folks had them on the cusp, but that's about it. Good teams don't lose at home to teams like that. The Celtics are not a good team right now, and instead of blaming the role players and the rookies, let's put the blame where it belongs.
 

lexrageorge

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Any NBA team can compete on any given night, even the Celtics.

Was anyone picking Charlotte to make the playoffs this year? Maybe some folks had them on the cusp, but that's about it. Good teams don't lose at home to teams like that. The Celtics are not a good team right now, and instead of blaming the role players and the rookies, let's put the blame where it belongs.
The Celtics lost on the road to Charlotte. Kemba Walker had an amazing game during an amazing stretch. Stuff happens.

And, if you think Kyrie is where the blame "belongs", it needs to be pointed out that Kyrie scored 27 points, dished 11 assists and was a +6 in his 34 minutes on the court. He did have a really bad night shooting the 3 (1-8), which makes his stat line all the more proof that Kyrie is not where the problem resides. Shutting down Walker wasn't his job, nor would it normally be.
 

Clears Cleaver

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Life in the nba. Celtics won last yeAr because they played hard every night. Effort on both ends. Guess what? Most nba team don’t try every night. Most players don’t try their hardest three quarters of a game. Kyrie is known not to play D until the nba playoffs. The cavs and warriors didn’t give a crap about regular season last year.

Stevens had a young team and a superstar playing in a new city last year. Max effort guy Marcus smart was playing for a contract. A year later that’s mostly changed. They don’t win games now with hustle plays and crisp execution.

Honestly, it’s fine assuming heyward can actually play at a high level again. Regular season doesn’t really matter. Toronto this year is a lot like Boston last year. They’ll win their 60 games but not sure it matters if they play Milwaukee Boston and/or philly in the east semis or finals.
 

Big John

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The question is what the other players are doing while Kyrie piles up the numbers.
The Celtics are 9-8. One approach is to say that 9-8 is perfectly understandable given the new mix of players. I believe Mike Gorman at one point predicted this kind of rough start. The other approach is to concede that their performance has been disappointing and try to find reasons for it. If you want to call me crazy for blaming some of it on the team's best player, feel free to do so. But my eyeballs tell me there is too much standing around while Kyrie dances with the ball. There are also way too many short "one pass and a long jumper" possessions, as other players try to get theirs before Kyrie takes over.

They're facing plenty of bad teams over the next 10 games or so. Let's see how they do.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Was anyone picking Charlotte to make the playoffs this year?
CHA was going to make the playoffs simply because they have a roster that is going to try. Although assuming CLE, ATL, NYK, and CHI are not going to make the playoffs, and 'Zards look to be imploding and I'm not following MIA closely enough to know what is going on down there, you are running out teams that won't make the playoffs.
 

HomeRunBaker

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The Celtics lost on the road to Charlotte. Kemba Walker had an amazing game during an amazing stretch. Stuff happens.

And, if you think Kyrie is where the blame "belongs", it needs to be pointed out that Kyrie scored 27 points, dished 11 assists and was a +6 in his 34 minutes on the court. He did have a really bad night shooting the 3 (1-8), which makes his stat line all the more proof that Kyrie is not where the problem resides. Shutting down Walker wasn't his job, nor would it normally be.
Yeah why should we ever hold a PG accountable for checking his counterpart at the PG position. Like when Isaiah was here, if Kyrie cannot matchup with the opponents PG you are placing the rest of your defense at an immense disadvantage having to cover for him. Kyrie's energy on switches, particularly in the 4th quarter, were borderline embarrassing. He didn't even attempt to show and defend the 3-point shot on more than one occasion.

I love Playoff Kyrie but this is what he was in Cleveland during the regular season prior to last year. Great offensive player who goes through the motions defensively during the regular season but even offensively he is being passive on most nights. Big John is correct in some respects here.
 

Lazy vs Crazy

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I feel like Smart was on Kemba for most of the fourth, not Kyrie. He was chasing him around and getting torched.
 

joe dokes

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I dont do this very often, but about 3 weeks ago in the Jaylen Brown thread, when things were looking a bit rocky:
http://sonsofsamhorn.net/index.php?threads/jaylen-brown-underrated.17489/page-14#post-3115595

End of last season there was no Irving, no Hayward, and a not-quite otherworldly Tatum.
There are only two players who look totally unaffected by the new dynamic. Tatum, who is better than last year. And Morris, who is the exact same guy (more often than not for the better, but occasionally not).
Game 19 is the day after Thanksgiving. Game 33 is Christmas. I think that will be the stretch where they reach cruising altitude. Until then, I expect 10-8 or 9-9.
Tatum has slid back a bit since then, but I think people need to calm down about trades and blame and trying to figure out from the television out who isn't "playing hard enough." Its just not that easy to instantly re-integrate two top-flight players into a team that did really well without them. They'll be fine. The players, coach and management are all really good.
 

HomeRunBaker

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30,096
I feel like Smart was on Kemba for most of the fourth, not Kyrie. He was chasing him around and getting torched.
Yes, this is what I'm referring to by placing the team in a precarious position as quick guards have always been the worst matchup for Smart but since Kyrie can't/won't compete in defending Kyrie it forced Brad to weaken our defense at multiple spots.