July 2: International Signing Day

crazybird1

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Nov 10, 2006
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If you are wondering how the Sox can afford all these goodies, they traded Nick Longhi to the Reds for money
 

crazybird1

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Nov 10, 2006
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Is the additional money they are receiving being used to pay for the three picks they signed, or is it going to be used for someone else later?
 

Cesar Crespo

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Dec 22, 2002
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They are at $6.1mil in signings and have a hard cap of 4.75. Without knowing what slot changed hand, it's impossible to know but I'm guessing they are close to their max.

edit: It's also possible you see more trades for cap space from teams that can't use their cap space.

Those teams are Atlanta, Cincinnati, Houston, Oakland, St. Louis, San Diego and Washington. That's like $35mil of cap space up for grabs if you want to trade fringe prospects away.
 

tonyarmasjr

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I'm not a huge fan of the international cap, as it limits the reach of teams (specifically our team) that have invested heavily and laid the groundwork in some of these countries. However, the ability to trade for cap space adds a fun layer to the signing period and the ml structure in general.
 

Snodgrass'Muff

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They are at $6.1mil in signings and have a hard cap of 4.75. Without knowing what slot changed hand, it's impossible to know but I'm guessing they are close to their max.

edit: It's also possible you see more trades for cap space from teams that can't use their cap space.

Those teams are Atlanta, Cincinnati, Houston, Oakland, St. Louis, San Diego and Washington. That's like $35mil of cap space up for grabs if you want to trade fringe prospects away.
3.1 for Daniel Flores, 1.6 for Danny Diaz and 1.4 for Antoni Flores is 5.1M spent so far. Did you see another signing somewhere?

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2017/07/red-sox-to-sign-daniel-flores-danny-diaz.html

Edit: I'm a dumbass.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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They are at $6.1mil in signings and have a hard cap of 4.75. Without knowing what slot changed hand, it's impossible to know but I'm guessing they are close to their max.

edit: It's also possible you see more trades for cap space from teams that can't use their cap space.

Those teams are Atlanta, Cincinnati, Houston, Oakland, St. Louis, San Diego and Washington. That's like $35mil of cap space up for grabs if you want to trade fringe prospects away.
The other thing to keep in mind is that while you can trade for additional cap space, there is a limit on how much of that extra space you can acquire...75% of their original cap. So if the Sox started at $4.75M, they can acquire up to an additional $3.56M for a total of $8.31M.
 

Cesar Crespo

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Dec 22, 2002
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Baseball America has us signing SS Nelfy Abreu DR and SS Denny Daza Venezuela. No contract information.
 

soxhop411

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Baseball America has us signing SS Nelfy Abreu DR and SS Danny Daza Venezuela. No contract information.
Doubt we get any contract info for ANY Venezuela player (for any team) given what's going on in the country.
 

Cesar Crespo

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So the Sox could possibly have a little more to spend depending on how much they got from STL and how much Daza and Abreu cost.
 

nvalvo

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Zach Buchanan‏Verified account @ZachENQ 3h3 hours ago
Zach Buchanan Retweeted Zach Buchanan

Correction: They traded the right to spend $2,750,000, not $275,000. Accounting error!


Longhi to Reds got us $2.75M in more spending
It's interesting as we feel out the market here: how much prospect does $2.75M buy?

We also acquired more budget space from STL for two infielders I'd never heard of, Imeldo Diaz and Stanley Espinal. I haven't been able to learn how much we got, but if any one else knows, please post.
 

Cesar Crespo

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Dec 22, 2002
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Never heard of Imeldo but Stanley Espinal isn't really even a prospect.

edit: Looks like Imeldo is the fringiest of prospects as well. Not sure I get it on St. Louis's end but I guess something is better than nothing.
 

Drek717

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Never heard of Imeldo but Stanley Espinal isn't really even a prospect.

edit: Looks like Imeldo is the fringiest of prospects as well. Not sure I get it on St. Louis's end but I guess something is better than nothing.
If they weren't planning on spending anything of substance on international prospects this year the money is basically an unusable and expiring asset, so flipping it for anything would have value.

But just to frame how legitimate Diaz and Espinal are, Chris Hatfield at SoxProspects commented that the max they can acquire from other teams is 75% over their current budget, so $8.3M, and with Longhi getting them $2.75M the most they could have gotten for Diaz and Espinal would be about $812K.

So with $6.1M to the three headliners they'd have another $2.2M for Daza, Abreu, and anyone else they get.

Longhi was starting to show some life but he's sandwiched between Sam Travis and Josh Ockimey and I think it's fair to say that most view them both as superior prospects to Longhi. Then there's Dalbec who is a coin toss to stick at 3B, and while Devers and Chavis both look like they're 3B capable at this time they can't both play it at the same time in Boston.

I wonder how much the SLG% surge over the last month made this possible, or if the Reds simply weren't looking to spend at all in the IAFA market because $2.75M is almost half their budget for a first base prospect with a consistent history of mid 700's OPS seasons throughout the minors.

This is an interesting strategy for the Sox to take. I'd have to think that a big part of this was Eddie Romero's move up to Assistant GM last October, as this is the spending period where he earned his credentials, being involved with signing Anderson Espinoza, Rafael Devers, the Basabe brothers, and Javier Guerra. To see the Sox go this hard in a market Ben Badler referred to as the best IAFA class in a while is very interesting.

A bit of background:
The Sox went hard in the 2014-2015 International Amateur FA market, that's when they signed Anderson Espinoza and Christian Acosta, a host of other lower budget guys (Junior Espinoza, Roniel Raudes, etc.) and blew past the max budget before signing Moncada and going way over budget, resulting in the penalty for the next year.

In the 2015-2016 market the Sox were capped at $300K for an individual bonus limit. They signed a host of players but 5 of the 7 they gave $300K to saw those contracts voided based on MLB's assessment that the Sox were transferring bonus money through lower signings to them, circumventing the system.

That resulted in the 2016-2017 ban on signing international amateurs.

It's been a tumultuous and abnormal market for the Sox and this season looks to continue that trend apparently.
 

joe dokes

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I'm not a huge fan of the international cap, as it limits the reach of teams (specifically our team) that have invested heavily and laid the groundwork in some of these countries.
It's hard to artificially restrain earnings without artificially restraining spending.
 

BuellMiller

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Mar 25, 2015
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Never heard of Imeldo but Stanley Espinal isn't really even a prospect.

edit: Looks like Imeldo is the fringiest of prospects as well. Not sure I get it on St. Louis's end but I guess something is better than nothing.
Maybe Houston had them as highly rated prospects?
 

Snodgrass'Muff

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It's been a tumultuous and abnormal market for the Sox and this season looks to continue that trend apparently.
I think this is probably the new normal for the IFA market going forward. This is the first year with that hard spending cap and this is basically how analysts predicted it would play out. What will be interesting is when we get past the penalties from the previous system and no one is restricted to 300K on signings anymore. Trades like Longhi to the Reds for 2.75 million probably won't be as common then and the dispersal of talent among the 30 MLB teams will probably even out some. Which is the intent, of course.

Edit: Of course, the competitive balance considerations like losing cap space for signing QO free agents will create some imbalances that might lead a team to punt on an IFA class here and there.

Anyway, if Abreu and Daza end up being 10K signings (not out of the realm of possibility) that 2.2M could be stashed just in case Otani does end up posting. It would make them competitive with anyone else looking to sway him.
 

Plympton91

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Oct 19, 2008
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I wonder what the exchange rate is between IFA bonus pool money and real money. Longhi fetching $2.75 million in real money would be a very stark reminder of how much minor league salaries are out of whack with the actual value of prospects. But I assume that, even if allowed, the Reds wouldn't have written a check of that magnitude to acquire Longhi. Still, it's interesting as a thought experiment.
 

Cesar Crespo

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Dec 22, 2002
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I wonder what the exchange rate is between IFA bonus pool money and real money. Longhi fetching $2.75 million in real money would be a very stark reminder of how much minor league salaries are out of whack with the actual value of prospects. But I assume that, even if allowed, the Reds wouldn't have written a check of that magnitude to acquire Longhi. Still, it's interesting as a thought experiment.
Longhi will have to be placed on a 40 man this offseason. Assuming he wasn't, a team would pay $50k for him in the Rule 5 draft. So maybe $250-300k? If that. This trade only happened because the Reds couldn't spend their cap space.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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Longhi will have to be placed on a 40 man this offseason. Assuming he wasn't, a team would pay $50k for him in the Rule 5 draft. So maybe $250-300k? If that. This trade only happened because the Reds couldn't spend their cap space.
Yes, that money was practically useless. It has/had no value to the Reds, so unless a bunch of teams were beating down their door to get their surplus cap space, they weren't going to get much for it. To them, Longhi was a free player.
 

Cesar Crespo

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Dec 22, 2002
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But just to frame how legitimate Diaz and Espinal are, Chris Hatfield at SoxProspects commented that the max they can acquire from other teams is 75% over their current budget, so $8.3M, and with Longhi getting them $2.75M the most they could have gotten for Diaz and Espinal would be about $812K.

.
Pretty sure the least they could have gotten for Diaz and Espinal is $600,000.002 unless they were sold as a package. Minimum slot has to be greater than the 300k that doesn't count against the cap. They would have had more than enough to sign everyone by just selling Longhi. Instead, they sold Diaz and Espinal as well. Other signings are coming or they spent way too much on Daza and Abreu.
 

Ramon AC

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Apr 19, 2002
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What?
Zeng signed in July.

强巴仁增 - Qian Ba Ren Zeng (Justin)

  • Born in 01/01/2001 - He is from Tibet! Hence the long Chinese name!
  • Listed at 180 cm and 78 kg
  • He plays Shortstop and Catcher - I heard he has more offensive and defensive skill than Xu Gui Yuan
  • He is from the Nanjing MLB academy and is currently preparing for the Annual 11th Asian Youth Baseball Championship.
  • Will join the Gulf Coast League Redsox in August.
  • Very attractive young man and I'm not stroking egos!
 

soxhop411

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Dec 4, 2009
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What I would give to see Remy try and pronounce that name

The Boston Redsox signs young Tibetan baseball player from Tibet. Major League Baseball Boston Red Sox officially signed Qian Ba Ren Zeng (Justin) to become China’s first professional club and the signing of the Tibetan baseball player. The official signing took place on July 13th this year at MLB Baseball Development Center in Nanjing Dongshan Foreign Language School.

Qian Ba Ren (Chinese pronunciation of Tibetan name) which is pronounced as Jampa Rinzin in English language is a Tibetan youth born in Tibet Autonomous Region(TAR) in 2001 to a working class family. He started to learn playing baseball since 2007 when he became a part of Beijing Dacheng school baseball team.


In 2011, after his team excelled in various tournaments and lifted the Junior Baseball League “Diamond Cup” champion, Jampa won the individual award of ‘Best Pitcher’ in the tournament. In September 2015, he was successfully admitted to the MLB Nanjing Baseball Development Center. By December last year, Jampa starred in China’s first baseball youth top idol drama “our youth” and the show started to broadcast on Hunan TV from July 9 this year.
http://www.tibetanjournal.com/index.php/2017/07/22/boston-redsox-signs-young-tibetan-baseball-player/
 

effectivelywild

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Jul 14, 2005
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Thank goodness he is a "very attractive young man." I was tired of all those uggos we had in the low minors.
 

The Gray Eagle

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This article from China Daily has his first name as Justin.

"Born to a working-class family in Tibet's Maizhokunggar county in 2001, Qiangbarenzeng joined the Beijing Dacheng School baseball team under coach Li Wei at age 6. Three years later he helped Team China beat Chinese Taipei to win a tournament in Japan and was one of six Chinese selected for the All-Star team.

"Justin's baseball IQ is on a whole new level," said Ray Chang, a Chinese-American who played Triple A ball in the US and is now head coach at the Nanjing DC.

"What makes Justin different is that he makes adjustments very, very quickly.

"With Justin, you know his mind is always going, always turning, always making quick adjustments, always making himself better. That's what will help him achieve success in the States."

Chang was convinced of the kid's work ethic when he witnessed Qiangbarenzeng practicing sliding on a soggy infield after a sudden rainstorm. "I knew then that he was something special," said the coach.

Dell agrees.

"Justin has an outstanding work ethic, and I'm sure that's what the Boston Red Sox have seen. He's very adaptable. Just two months ago he switched positions from second base to catcher and he has done it seamlessly."