2016-17 General MLB Offseason Thread

MikeM

MikeM

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Average Reds said:
A bit silly to think he would sign a deal for significantly less than a qualifying offer in January.
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Not really at this point. The attached pick factor is killing him.

If I'm the Jays he wouldn't be getting a mutual option with a buyout there either. Re-extending their QO he initially turned down is enough in terms of let's just put everything behind us good will.
 
Average Reds

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moondog80 said:
Why? Players/agents misread the market all he time. Nelson Cruz signed for 8 mil after turning down a 14 mil qualifying offer. I'm actually surprised Toronto would give him more significantly more jab the QO given his apparent lack of other suitors. Good for him though. And good for me not having to read any more threads about whether or not the Sox should sign him.
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That's about the most absurd example you could provide.

Cruz was coming off a season where he had served a 50 game suspension related to the Biogensis scandal. The Rangers had shunned him and he had drawn no interest from the wider market. At the end of February, he really had no choice other than taking a below market offer that allowed him to prove himself again and re-set the market.

Bautista had a down year, but he was not suspended and embroiled in a PED scandal, he did not wait until late February to sign and by re-signing with the Jays, he didn't cost them a pick. Literally none of the dynamics associated with the Cruz signing fits here.
 
moondog80

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Average Reds said:
That's about the most absurd example you could provide.

Cruz was coming off a season where he had served a 50 game suspension related to the Biogensis scandal. The Rangers had shunned him and he had drawn no interest from the wider market. At the end of February, he really had no choice other than taking a below market offer that allowed him to prove himself again and re-set the market.

Bautista had a down year, but he was not suspended and embroiled in a PED scandal, he did not wait until late February to sign and by re-signing with the Jays, he didn't cost them a pick. Literally none of the dynamics associated with the Cruz signing fits here.
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Kendrys Morales. Stephen Drew. Ervin Santana. Even before the QO era you had guys like Nomar, Jody Reed, and Matt Harrington. A player accepting less than initially offered isn't unusual. And given that Bautista still hasn't signed, he still might end up on that list.

And Bautista re-signing with the Jays does potentially cost them a pick. If he does sign with. another team before June 1, they get a pick. That goes out the window if they re-sign him, and no doubt is part of the dynamic here. Guys in his position do sometimes find suitors this late in the game -- Ubaldo Jimenez signed a 4 year deal in February -- but given the other power options also out there like Trumbo and Alvarez, having to accept a one year deal for 12 mil is absolutely in play.
 
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Average Reds

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moondog80 said:
Kendrys Morales. Stephen Drew. Ervin Santana. Even before the QO era you had guys like Nomar, Jody Reed, and Matt Harrington. A player accepting less than initially offered isn't unusual. And given than Bautista still hasn't signed, he still might end up on that list.

And Bautista re-signing with the Jays does potentially cost them a pick. If he does sign with. another team before June 1, they get a pick. That goes out the window if they re-sign him, and no doubt is part of the dynamic here. Guys in his position do sometimes find suitors this late in the game -- Ubaldo Jimenez signed a 4 year deal in February -- but given the other power options also out there like Trumbo and Alvarez, having to accept a one year deal for 12 mil is absolutely in play.
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Maybe I was not clear in my first post.

If (like the examples here) Bautista was not able to work out a deal before spring training, he may very well have had to sign a discounted contract. But once we learned that he was going back to the Jays in January, it was obvious (to me, at least) that he was going to do better than the QO, even if only marginally.
 
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Oppo

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Put me in the camp that Toronto should have offered 1/$17.2 or 2/$30. Bautista has zero leverage.
 
mikeford

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Jim Joyce is retiring. He'll be best remembered for blowing Galaragga's perfect game but we should remember him for eventually correctly calling Bellhorn's homer in Game 6.
 
cromulence

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I'll miss his strike calls. Somebody needs to carry the loud strike call torch, but I fear it may die.
 
Average Reds

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mikeford said:
Jim Joyce is retiring. He'll be best remembered for blowing Galaragga's perfect game but we should remember him for eventually correctly calling Bellhorn's homer in Game 6.
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I think Joyce is fine as an ump, but the bolded is woefully inaccurate.

Joyce was stationed in left field. He is the ump who blew the call despite having the best view of the play. The entire crew got together and because everyone else with functional eyes saw the play correctly, they reversed the call. Joyce had nothing to do with the reversal.
 
Ramon AC

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What?
I've always felt like game 6 changed umpiring. Calls simply didn't get reversed before that. What Joyce did was to LET his call be changed. Same with Randy Marsh in the eighth.
 
nvalvo

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Wow. TB turns Jesse Hahn and Alex Torres into Jose De Leon by anticipating that Forsythe would break out. (And, they netted Andriese and Boxberger in the process.) I'm not sure how much better this makes the 2017 Rays, but it's an impressive bit of winning trades.

Did Friedman acquire Forsythe both times?
 
Oppo

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Forsythe was acquired in January 2014, Friedman left for LAD October 2014.

Forsythe just turned 30. Due $5.75 in 2017, $8.5 club option in 2018.

And apparently I'm too dumb to find out how many years of control De Leon has left.
 
nvalvo

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Oppo said:
Forsythe was acquired in January 2014, Friedman left for LAD October 2014.

Forsythe just turned 30. Due $5.75 in 2017, $8.5 club option in 2018.

And apparently I'm too dumb to find out how many years of control De Leon has left.
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De Leon should have a full six years left, stretchable to seven if they send him to Durham for a minute. He was a September call up.
 
jon abbey

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Brett Anderson to the Cubs, they look like they can field a full team and a half again this year.
 
Oppo

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Cards and Carlos Martinez avoid arbitration and agree to 5/$51, buying out 3 arb years and 2 FA years. Largest contract signed by a year 1 arb player. Locked up thru age 29. Solid deal for both sides.
 
Minneapolis Millers

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Oppo said:
Cards and Carlos Martinez avoid arbitration and agree to 5/$51, buying out 3 arb years and 2 FA years. Largest contract signed by a year 1 arb player. Locked up thru age 29. Solid deal for both sides.
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Plus two option years at $17 and $18M, which makes it a very team-friendly deal. Pay more now, get more later.

This is what I'd like the Sox to do with the B's...
 
jon abbey

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Alex Reyes, pretty much the consensus top pitching prospect in baseball (he's on STL), is getting a MRI on his right elbow.
 
jon abbey

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And it's confirmed, Reyes will get TJ surgery, big blow for STL's hopes this year.
 
Oppo

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Sean Rodriguez likely to miss 2017 season after shoulder surgery due to auto accident.

Makes more sense that Atl traded for dat dude.
 
Oppo

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Weiters to Nats. $10 mil in 2017, $11 mil in 2018. Not sure if 2018 is an option or he can opt out after 2017, but the 2/$21 is guaranteed. $5 mil deferred payment to 2021.
 
B H Kim

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Oppo said:
Weiters to Nats. $10 mil in 2017, $11 mil in 2018. Not sure if 2018 is an option or he can opt out after 2017, but the 2/$21 is guaranteed. $5 mil deferred payment to 2021.
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Their 40-man is full (including 5 other catchers), so this may be a precursor to a move for a closer (lots of rumors that they'll include one of the other catchers as part of a package for David Robertson).
 
nvalvo

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B H Kim said:
Their 40-man is full (including 5 other catchers), so this may be a precursor to a move for a closer (lots of rumors that they'll include one of the other catchers as part of a package for David Robertson).
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Such a trade would make a *ton* of sense, as the Nats have a very deep roster with a merely decent bullpen.
 
E5 Yaz

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Balking Bob Davidson is among four umpires to retire -- along with John Hirschbeck, Tim Welke and Jim Joyce
 
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