Celtics 16/17 Roster and Assets

PedroKsBambino

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I think there is like a .00001% chance it will ever matter.
Agreed. I would prefer Hunter because if I squint I can see one plus skill (shooting threes)--even if not consistently demonstrated--and that is more than I can say for Young.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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I think there is like a .00001% chance it will ever matter.
Both Brad and Danny think that both Hunter and Young will be NBA players, so the chances are probably greater than what you have. How much greater is anyone's guess?

Young is younger, more explosive, and maybe he has a Gerald Green type wake-up call. Hunter is the better basketball player but may have physical limitations that prevents him from being anything more than a 10th person off the bench.

In the new Chad Finn profile of Danny in the Globe (a very good read and for some additional outtakes and insights, see here: http://www.boston.com/sports/boston-celtics/2016/10/23/outtakes-and-insights-from-a-conversation-with-celtics-boss-danny-ainge), DA admits that he overvalues "passion."

My guess is he keeps Hunter for that reason. But who really knows?
 

Cellar-Door

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Either was fine, but I think Young has the better chance of making it in the NBA. He has an NBA body, both have strokes that look good but don't produce so far, but Young has shown progress on D, and uses his body/athleticism to hit the boards hard. Hunter looks worse on defense, has no strength and doesn't rebound. You can't be a wing in the current NBA and not at least rebound and defend a little.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Bentil signs with Indiana. Likely headed to Fort Wayne (D-league affiliate).
Bentil will be waived immediately unless there is a corresponding move since Indiana had just cut down to their 15 prior to todays deadline. This will allow him to be an affiliate player with the Pacers which in some sense is similar to the NFL's practice squad except they aren't with the NBA team. More like a vote of confidence that they have an interest in a player without technically holding their rights.
 

chilidawg

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Bentil will be waived immediately unless there is a corresponding move since Indiana had just cut down to their 15 prior to todays deadline. This will allow him to be an affiliate player with the Pacers which in some sense is similar to the NFL's practice squad except they aren't with the NBA team. More like a vote of confidence that they have an interest in a player without technically holding their rights.
So why couldn't the Celtics have done this with him? Or could they have and he was looking for other options?
 

Cellar-Door

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So why couldn't the Celtics have done this with him? Or could they have and he was looking for other options?
His agent told them he wouldn't go to Maine because he wanted to either go to an NBA team or a D-League team where he had a better shot of NBA playing time this year. Otherwise he'd go to Europe/China etc. I believe.
 

NickEsasky

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As a PC alum, it kills me that Bentil came out given that he's now a D-League player this year.
 

Eddie Jurak

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Hunter waived, Young wins the 15th spot.
Interesting. I would rather have kept Hunter. Neither of them will challenge for playing time anytime soon, and while Young is younger, they have a year less of control. I find it unlikely that he will have a road to enough playing time to stick after his deal is up.

I'm calling this one a mistake, though a small one.
 

moondog80

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I fear he's been Shamgodded.
It's one thing when a guy like Shamgod or Ledo, who struggled academically, leaves school. But Bentil was supposedly an excellent student. I've heard his family needed money but he long term outlook was so much better if they just could have held on for another year or two. Though I guess PC would let him finish his degree for free if he wanted to?
 

nighthob

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Interesting. I would rather have kept Hunter. Neither of them will challenge for playing time anytime soon, and while Young is younger, they have a year less of control. I find it unlikely that he will have a road to enough playing time to stick after his deal is up.

I'm calling this one a mistake, though a small one.
On the other hand come deal time the extra salary for Young might be more valuable.
 

HomeRunBaker

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It's one thing when a guy like Shamgod or Ledo, who struggled academically, leaves school. But Bentil was supposedly an excellent student. I've heard his family needed money but he long term outlook was so much better if they just could have held on for another year or two. Though I guess PC would let him finish his degree for free if he wanted to?
It's easy to say this from where we are sitting but when you have your family living in poverty and the worst case being a $250k contract (best case a guaranteed 1st round deal) that can be hard to resist. I hated his decision but it is understandable.
 

RG33

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The only pay he was getting at PC was maybe a free drink coupon at Bradley's.
I dunno, my roommate was a walk-on 4 years during the Croshere/Shamgod years, and every Sunday when they would do their booster dinner in Federal Hill, he would come home with an envelope. He would get like $200 slipped into his jacket, and the star players were getting a lot more.
 

HomeRunBaker

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I dunno, my roommate was a walk-on 4 years during the Croshere/Shamgod years, and every Sunday when they would do their booster dinner in Federal Hill, he would come home with an envelope. He would get like $200 slipped into his jacket, and the star players were getting a lot more.
I was more or less comparably speaking about the Friars and the powers. If your friend was Dennis Cleary I may have slipped him one of them. ;)
 

RG33

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I was more or less comparably speaking about the Friars and the powers. If your friend was Dennis Cleary I may have slipped him one of them. ;)
Dennis was not my roommate, but we were buddies. D-Nice as Eric Williams called him is a legit dude. LOL.
 

Eddie Jurak

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Jaylen had some good monents last night. He has a long way to go but he's flashing some impressive ability to get to the hoop and to make plays in full court.

Are the C's headed towards a 9 man rotation with the starters and then Marcus, Kelly, Rozier, and Brown off the bench?
 

BigSoxFan

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Jaylen had some good monents last night. He has a long way to go but he's flashing some impressive ability to get to the hoop and to make plays in full court.

Are the C's headed towards a 9 man rotation with the starters and then Marcus, Kelly, Rozier, and Brown off the bench?
I think Jerebko still has a role, particularly once Jaylen starts to struggle.
 

Swedgin

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I think Jerebko still has a role, particularly once Jaylen starts to struggle.
Jaylen will continue to get developmental minutes. He was a high lottery pick. Unless, playing him is the difference between winning a title or not, a smart organization gives finds minutes for those guys, even at the expense of a few wins. Jerekbo has a role, but its more situational and/or dependent on KO's health. If KO can't go, then you need Jonas's floor spacing on the second unit.
 

BigSoxFan

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Jaylen will continue to get developmental minutes. He was a high lottery pick. Unless, playing him is the difference between winning a title or not, a smart organization gives finds minutes for those guys, even at the expense of a few wins. Jerekbo has a role, but its more situational and/or dependent on KO's health. If KO can't go, then you need Jonas's floor spacing on the second unit.
Yes, was just saying that he will be in the rotation going forward even once Kelly comes back.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Scalabrine on SiriusXM this morning talking about how he hears Klay Thompson's name and a specific team who "wears Green" involved in trade discussions. This makes too much sense on so many levels.

* Klay > Avery helps the Celtics
* Klay's contract doesn't prohibit the Celtics from attracting a max guy, trading for Brow, etc
* Avery is a better fit for the Warriors
* Avery's contract helps the Warriors financially the next two summers.
 

DJnVa

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Articles mentioning Anthony Davis have popped up too, but that's just because they are about to play. That would be a pipe dream.
 

DJnVa

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I don't know if anyone in the league has a realistic offer that could get Davis. I certainly don't think we do.
This is from Forsberg:

For the sake of conversation, let's say Ainge called Pelicans GM Dell Demps and threw out an offer like this: Jaylen Brown (No. 3 pick in 2016), Avery Bradley (25-year-old on bargain deal having All-Star-caliber season), Brooklyn's 2017 and 2018 first-round picks, another future first-round pick (either one of Boston's own or one its owed via Memphis), and $17 million in expiring salaries for Davis and Omer Asik.
http://www.espn.com/blog/boston/celtics/post/_/id/4724404/anthony-davis-sees-celtics-as-blueprint-but-boston-yearns-for-star-like-him

If the Nets pick is actually a swap though, I'm not sure how that can be done. I assume there's a way to make it work.
 

sox311

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That's what she said.
The swap would go over easy. They get the Nets pick and the Nets get the Celtics pick. Same as always.

But, that is not enough. Is it near enough? I don't really think so. Bradley means nothing to them, he will be looking for a max deal before they would even get the picks. That's just Forsberg being a homer.

You would think the Lakers would swoop in with a combination of Randle, Russel, and/or Ingram. Then have Davis waste away with that Loul Deng contract.
 

plucy

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Scalabrine on SiriusXM this morning talking about how he hears Klay Thompson's name and a specific team who "wears Green" involved in trade discussions. This makes too much sense on so many levels.

* Klay > Avery helps the Celtics
* Klay's contract doesn't prohibit the Celtics from attracting a max guy, trading for Brow, etc
* Avery is a better fit for the Warriors
* Avery's contract helps the Warriors financially the next two summers.
KNBR talking heads were discussing this in the last hour. Bradley, Crowder and a first rounder to be flipped for Noel. Seems like a lot, even for Klay, plus no salary relief, as you pointed out.
Was the Celtics package rumored recently on one of those marginal click bait sites such as Inquistr?
 

HomeRunBaker

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KNBR talking heads were discussing this in the last hour. Bradley, Crowder and a first rounder to be flipped for Noel. Seems like a lot, even for Klay, plus no salary relief, as you pointed out.
Was the Celtics package rumored recently on one of those marginal click bait sites such as Inquistr?
There was no Klay package mentioned at all and it wasn't a clickbait site.....it came directly out of Scalabrine's mouth that there is Klay to Boston talk.

Amir is the obvious expiring contract to go (and he gives the Warriors frontcourt depth this year) plus we don't need him as we are not building a team to win a championship this year we are putting pieces together to win in another year or two that would attract someone like a Brow if he demands out of NO.

Sure the Warriors have perimeter guys who can step into Klays spot however that weakens their bench and depth. The Warriors, much like the Celtics with Ray Allen, don't "need" a star to play in their complimentary role......all they need for it is a complimentary player and can add payroll flexibility for next summer while doing so. I don't see Crowder being included as the Warriors would never take on his guaranteed salary for a second unit guy when their books are so top-heavy.
 

nighthob

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Boston can, more or less, help the Warriors with their depth issues. I think with Steph's ankles the Warriors might want Rozier to be able to save Curry for the postseason. Something like Bradley, Rozier, Nasser, and Amir for Klay is probably the baseline starting point. (Golden State might want to trade for Noel, but I don't think that's really doable since the Sixers still want the moon.)
 
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plucy

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There was no Klay package mentioned at all and it wasn't a clickbait site.....it came directly out of Scalabrine's mouth that there is Klay to Boston talk.

Amir is the obvious expiring contract to go (and he gives the Warriors frontcourt depth this year) plus we don't need him as we are not building a team to win a championship this year we are putting pieces together to win in another year or two that would attract someone like a Brow if he demands out of NO.

Sure the Warriors have perimeter guys who can step into Klays spot however that weakens their bench and depth. The Warriors, much like the Celtics with Ray Allen, don't "need" a star to play in their complimentary role......all they need for it is a complimentary player and can add payroll flexibility for next summer while doing so. I don't see Crowder being included as the Warriors would never take on his guaranteed salary for a second unit guy when their books are so top-heavy.
The KNBR guys brought up the package. They referred to Scalabrine on Sirius. Maybe they're speculating. An article ran on 11/10 on the Inquisitr site with a Klay trade rumor ( no Crowder, suggested Johnson).
 

HomeRunBaker

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The KNBR guys brought up the package. They referred to Scalabrine on Sirius. Maybe they're speculating. An article ran on 11/10 on the Inquisitr site with a Klay trade rumor ( no Crowder, suggested Johnson).
Yeah they have to be speculating on the package as they, like myself, are going strictly off of Scal's comments in putting a package together that makes sense for both sides.
 

BigSoxFan

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This is not a trade that would happen in November anyways. Still think it's a possibility if things break right.
 

sox311

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That's what she said.
Is there an precedent of a draft and stash player coming over in the middle on an NBA season? Gerald Green is hot garbage and we could use either of Zizic or Yabusele for some rebounding.

Their rookie scale contracts will inflate when the new CBA is signed as well.
 

reggiecleveland

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After watching Bender get abused for two games last week, I have no desire to see Zizic or any other 19 year old forward start his clock early in the NBA.
 

Jed Zeppelin

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On a semi-related note, while the loss sucked, it was at least a little nice that an alien observing basketball for the first time would have watched the Celtics-Pelicans game and come away thinking that Jaylen Brown is more advanced than the three-years-older Buddy Hield.
 

BigSoxFan

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On a semi-related note, while the loss sucked, it was at least a little nice that an alien observing basketball for the first time would have watched the Celtics-Pelicans game and come away thinking that Jaylen Brown is more advanced than the three-years-older Buddy Hield.
Yup. Jaylen Brown is basically Celtics fans' Porzingis. We are lucky to have him and not a mediocre, at best, guy like Hield.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Is there an precedent of a draft and stash player coming over in the middle on an NBA season? Gerald Green is hot garbage and we could use either of Zizic or Yabusele for some rebounding.

Their rookie scale contracts will inflate when the new CBA is signed as well.
You would never want to do this anyway and burn one year of a players cheap rookie contract for a team that isn't competing for a championship unless that player could be the difference. Don't expect this to happen under Ainge's watch.
 

nighthob

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Is there an precedent of a draft and stash player coming over in the middle on an NBA season? Gerald Green is hot garbage and we could use either of Zizic or Yabusele for some rebounding.

Their rookie scale contracts will inflate when the new CBA is signed as well.
A few things here:

  1. Neither of these guys is going to fix Boston's frontcourt problems any time soon.
  2. Boston isn't burning a year's eligibility on these guys to bring them over to play in Maine.
  3. Especially not since they would need clear two roster spots to do it.
  4. Young's play would have made him a tradeable piece had Boston not declined his 2018 option. Now because of that he basically has none since whoever trades for him only has him for the remainder of this year. (Basically find a playoff team desperate for shooting that expects to upgrade the spot with their first round pick, and they might part with a #2 for Young.) So he'd have to be released outright more or less to accommodate one of them.
  5. They have considerably less trade value as roster pieces than they do as overseas rights players. Right now Boston can add these guys (and Nasser) to any trade they make without them eating up salary space, which has value for the team trading for them.
All in all I suspect that Boston is just laying in the weeds waiting for the Warriors to admit that they desperately need depth more than they need Klay Thompson as a floor spacer. Since Bradley/Crowder or Smart/whatever helps them out long term.
 

Sam Ray Not

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Fwiw, as a Ws fan, I don't admit that they "desperately need depth."

• Iguodala, Livingston and West is a perfectly solid vet #6-8
• Clark, Looney and McCaw is a fine young #9-11, the last two seemingly getting better by the game
• McGee is an interesting wild card at #12

On paper, I would strongly consider Klay for Bradley + Crowder and a pick that we could spin into Noel. Love all three of those guys as players; think they would fit Kerr-ball beautifully; and really love Crowder's way-below-market contract, with Steph, KD, Andre and Shaun all going into free agency (and Andre and Shaun getting up there in years).

In the real world of human beings, though, great teams don't typically make radical trades like that for some potential incremental gain at the margins. Beyond being a tough defender, the second-best high-volume three point gunner in history, and arguably the most durable star in the league, Klay, with his ultra-chill "weed buddy" vibe, may be the most beloved guy on the team (anecdotally). Huge potential risk to team chemistry if they let him go. And Myers, Kerr and co. have pretty consistently placed a high premium on character and chemistry in all the moves and non-moves that have gone into building this team.

Nothing to see here, I'm pretty sure.