I want a strong showing in the WS. Of course, I'd love another ring for Papi but if they lose to a juggernaut Cubs team or unhittable Kershaw or such I'm still happy.
How Good Are The Sox Now?
- Thread starter Rasputin
- Start date
I think there's only one team that has a legitimate expectation to beat the Sox in a 7-game series right now, and that's the Cubs. A loss to anyone else would be a disappointment for me.
I feel like if Papi wasn't retiring I might feel a little more relaxed about it, knowing that we have so many great young players and are set up well for the next couple years. But I really, really want to see Papi get that ring.
Brady and Papi both having 4 rings would be something. What a fucking run this last 10 years has been!
Anything short of a World Series win would be disappointing at this point considering where they are and how they've been playing. That's just human nature. But no matter what happens, I think we will have to call this season a success when looking back.
They've exceeded even the rosiest protections without punting the future to fill holes. They have a legitimate shot at a title now and should have a few more before the new core needs to be extended. The rebuild was a bit painful, but it was worth every second.
They've exceeded even the rosiest protections without punting the future to fill holes. They have a legitimate shot at a title now and should have a few more before the new core needs to be extended. The rebuild was a bit painful, but it was worth every second.
House money. The last game of the season is going to be bittersweet no matter what, and while I hope they win that last game, this team has given me everything that could possibly have been expected in March. I'm grateful and the future is brighter than bright.
No regrets, no disappointment, and no shame if they get bounced in the LDS by bad bounces, LOB, or the other team's hot pitchers. This isn't ISIS, nobody's dying. I won't sulk if they come up short.
No regrets, no disappointment, and no shame if they get bounced in the LDS by bad bounces, LOB, or the other team's hot pitchers. This isn't ISIS, nobody's dying. I won't sulk if they come up short.
I would distinguish between disappointment and dissatisfaction here. I'm always disappointed when the Red Sox' season ends without a championship. Which means I'm disappointed nearly every year. That's OK; disappointment is part of the ride.
But dissatisfaction, that gnawing feeling of unfulfilled promise -- this team is well into the bonus round for me on that score. We're playing baseball that matters with a week to go, and our destiny is in our hands. That's all I wanted for early Christmas this year. Anything good that happens from here on in is just another cherry on an already excellent sundae.
But dissatisfaction, that gnawing feeling of unfulfilled promise -- this team is well into the bonus round for me on that score. We're playing baseball that matters with a week to go, and our destiny is in our hands. That's all I wanted for early Christmas this year. Anything good that happens from here on in is just another cherry on an already excellent sundae.
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I want a fourth ring for Papi... I'd be very happy with an AL pennant. if they just get the Division Series and lose but push the series to the limit in the AL champ series I'll consider the season successful. Losing in the division round or WC will bum me out
If they lose in the ALCS, I'll be sad, but I won't be pissed.
If they lose in the ALDS, I'll be pissed.
If they lose in the ALDS, I'll be pissed.
Lived in VT from '63 - '68, and Illinois before and after that until I was about 30. I said many times (before 2004), that the fantasy Series would be Sox and Cubs....both lovable losers....and if we could do it twice, I'd even give the Cubs the first one as long as we got to win once in my lifetime.
I never forgot the "once in my lifetime" thing, btw.....the other two were so much more than I ever dreamed about.
So, if by some chance the Sox make the Series, I'm out of my mind happy, but if by some chance they were to play against the Cubs and lose, I just can't see how that would be a disappointment. And it would be the greatest Series ever for baseball and baseball fans.
Not a chance. WS ratings in the last 10 years are less than half of what they were in late 70s and 80s.
Let's hope that doesn't happen. There will be a lot of fans who will be happy for the Cubs and a lot of other fans pissed as hell fighting with them. I'm with you though.
Me too. Baseball postseason success depends more on who gets hot for a few days than any seeding, so if shit happens then so be it. But this team is well constructed for post-season success, and they are obviously hitting their stride.
I'd be very curious about how this discussion breaks down along age lines. I'm not adept at putting together a poll but I would phrase one something like A) Rings or bust fan since before '86, B) Rings or bust fan since before 2004, C) Some progress in the postseason fan since before '86 or D) Some progress in the postseason fan since before 2004. Maybe even adding '67 (but that is before my time.) How complacent or entitled have we all become? If anyone thinks this is a good idea and can quickly and easily make a poll, I would be grateful. If not I might be able to try this within the next few days if it is considered a worthy discussion.
In years past, my level of misery would be directly proportionate with how close they come to winning it all. (Example: '78 stung for a long time, but that was a function of the larger circumstances. '86 was a significant psychic injury. I've actually blocked 2003 from my memory.) In recent years, I've adopted more of a balanced approach and understand that the post-season is a crapshoot. And yes, much of this maturity comes from the Sox having won it all in '04, '07 and '13.
I love the makeup of this team and I will be disappointed if they don't get to the WS. But not devastated as I would have been in years past. That's the real gift of the Sox finally breaking through in the past decade plus.
(Note: who the fuck am I kidding? I'll be devastated. Fucking win it all.)
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I feel that I don't even know you guys.
This place will be like the 15 year old girl who gets dumped for the first time if they do anything but win it all.
This place will be like the 15 year old girl who gets dumped for the first time if they do anything but win it all.
If/when they clinch the division, we should reach out to Schilling and ask him to start the postseason game thread for us.
"Yeah Curt, it would be great if you came back and kicked off the drive for another WS championship. It will be just like old times. Just don't look at the media, P&G or V&N forums..."
"Yeah Curt, it would be great if you came back and kicked off the drive for another WS championship. It will be just like old times. Just don't look at the media, P&G or V&N forums..."
Is the 4th one he's holding for winning WS MVP? If so, he'll be getting 6!You mean fifth, right?
This.
The calculus has definitely changed for me, because this team feels like they can now win it all. If the Sox make it to the World Series to face the Cubs and Papi gets close to going out on top, I'm going to be pretty f****** pissed if Chicago wins. I'll happily root for the Cubs if they face anyone else, but part of me will never be happy if they beat the Sox.
I agree there will be all sorts of MMQBing and meltdowns if the Sox don't win it all even if it's as simple as we gave up a few ill timed bloops. It's just the nature of some.
I won't be satisfied if they don't win it all but I'll still consider the season a success. I mean, did we feel satisfied after we lost game 7 in 2008? No, we all felt like crap. But that season was a success.
I won't be satisfied if they don't win it all but I'll still consider the season a success. I mean, did we feel satisfied after we lost game 7 in 2008? No, we all felt like crap. But that season was a success.
Win it all. It'd be great for guys like Price to finally win one. And it's a fantastic lesson for the young guys to learn what it takes and give them a taste at the start of their careers now that they won't have Ortiz around to guide them.
Also, Yankee fans would hate it.
Also, Yankee fans would hate it.
I would've been okay with the Cubs losing, and slightly okay losing to them, and then they went out and got domestic abuser Chapman. Now, fuck them.
Chapman certainly seems like a scumbag, but just about every franchise lives in a glass house if you really want to go down this road.
I hate the comparisons that Cubs and Red Sox have gotten over the years. There is no comparison. The Cubs have sucked for 100+ years and pretty much have never been close to winning. They didn't lose 4 game 7's in the World Series in the most heartbreaking fashion that anyone could imagine. They lost one. They didn't play in the same league with the far superior Yankees and finish 2nd for so many seasons. There is nothing in common with the two teams other than not winning it all for a long time.
C'mon - I'd be disappointed if they don't win a ring for Papi but let's be real here. Think about what it felt like in 2003 - the hatred for Grady Little, the feeling that maybe all that curse nonsense was actually true. Einstein used the difference between putting your hand on a hot stove for a minute and talking to a pretty girl for the same period to demonstrate the relativity of time. You could use the disappointment of pre 2004 and post 2004 to demonstrate the relativity of loss just as well.
I don't know how much anyone here cares about this, and at the end of the day it doesn't impact any game they play from here on out, but for what it's worth, baseball-reference's SRS ratings system has Boston now tied with the Cubs for the best number in the majors at +1.3.
This number reflects the number of runs per game they are better (or worse) than the average team. Really, it's run differential plus strength of schedule.
+1.3 is a huge number. There are only five teams better than +0.5
Was: +0.7
Cle: +0.7
Tor: +0.8
Bos: +1.3
ChC: +1.3
This number reflects the number of runs per game they are better (or worse) than the average team. Really, it's run differential plus strength of schedule.
+1.3 is a huge number. There are only five teams better than +0.5
Was: +0.7
Cle: +0.7
Tor: +0.8
Bos: +1.3
ChC: +1.3
This is where I'm at. The Sox have had a bunch of poor seasons surrounding that one magical one in 2013. It feels great just to be watching an exciting and talented team playing meaningful baseball in September, knowing they're getting into the dance in October and having a shot at a title. Everything else is gravy.
Yes, it would be magic to get Papi a ring on his way out, but if it doesn't happen I can live with that knowing the team left it all out on the field and at least made a run.
Changing gears back to assessments of how good this team is...
One thing that been talked a bit about, but not enough is the Sox defense. Some numbers in September:
Errors: Bal 12; Bos 7 (none in last 10); NYY 8; Tor 17(!)
Unearned runs allowed: Bal 9; Bos 4 (1 in last 14); NYY 7; Tor 12
There were a couple of huge moments that these numbers don't show, most of which are in the defensive .gif thread. One that's not there was a drive to right center against the O's, I think, and by the time the camera panned to the outfield, both JBJ and Mookie were camped on the warning track ready to make the grab. The play-by-play guy (Ravech?) was stunned that both guys were there to make that play.
I think defensively going into the playoffs this team has a huge advantage. They're just so solid around the diamond.
One thing that been talked a bit about, but not enough is the Sox defense. Some numbers in September:
Errors: Bal 12; Bos 7 (none in last 10); NYY 8; Tor 17(!)
Unearned runs allowed: Bal 9; Bos 4 (1 in last 14); NYY 7; Tor 12
There were a couple of huge moments that these numbers don't show, most of which are in the defensive .gif thread. One that's not there was a drive to right center against the O's, I think, and by the time the camera panned to the outfield, both JBJ and Mookie were camped on the warning track ready to make the grab. The play-by-play guy (Ravech?) was stunned that both guys were there to make that play.
I think defensively going into the playoffs this team has a huge advantage. They're just so solid around the diamond.
I really hope the Sox face the Cubs in the WS - not just because of the histories of the respective franchises, fan base and their ballparks, not because of Theo and Lester and Lackey, not because they are and have always been my favourite NL team, and not just because I thought it was going to happen in '03 before each club collapsed. But because the Cubs have been regarded as the best in baseball all year long with elite starting pitching, with NL-best defence, with near-elite hitting, and with a very similar mix of home-grown youth and veteran experience to what the Sox have. Chapman - villain or not - has upgraded their bullpen so that this team represents a rare juggernaut that you either lose to with little shame or beat and prove you've gone through the best. I think the Sox have an advantage in having faced better competition day-in and day-out than the Cubs have but that they'll be decided underdogs in a cracking World Series that would pit the two best teams against each other.
Of course neither team is even odds to even make the WS, though both are now the favourite. Let's hope it finally comes to pass.
This from fangraphs' recent article on the most extraordinary stats of the year. #1 is the Cubs mind-boggling .251 BABIP allowed:
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/the-most-extraordinary-team-statistic/
Last night Mookie cuts off a ball that few would to hold Dickerson to a single. That set up the 2 superb plays that kept that inning scoreless. Defense on this team is excellent.
All I can say is what an amazing run - 10 straight - Wow!
The pen has been rejuvenated by the return of Kimbrel & Uehara. Hanley, Ortiz and the gang putting up runs when they're needed - Peddy last night, what an amazing at bat. Price and Porcello doing their job in fine fashion. I think the team is primed for the playoffs.
The pen has been rejuvenated by the return of Kimbrel & Uehara. Hanley, Ortiz and the gang putting up runs when they're needed - Peddy last night, what an amazing at bat. Price and Porcello doing their job in fine fashion. I think the team is primed for the playoffs.
FWIW:
They are now 46-32 at home and 45-32 on the road and 20-14 vs the contenders on the road (fattened up on the O's at 8-2. 12-12 vs the others).
The contenders on the road are:
Cleveland is 37-37 and 11-13 vs contenders(6-0 vs Det and 6-12 against the others)
Texas is 42 and 38 and 24-16 vs contenders
Tor is 41 and 37 and 18-17 vs contenders
Baltimore is 35-40 and 18-23 vs contenders.
Det is 40-38 and 10-16 vs contenders
Seattle is 39-38 and 11-21 vs contenders.
Houston is 40-28 and 16-23 vs contenders (4-16 vs the Sox, Jays, Tigers and Rangers).
A few things stand out to me.
-The Rangers are the weirdest playoff team in recent memory - being just terrible against terrible teams, and awesome against great teams. At 36-11 in one run games, Jeff Bannister deserves Manger of the Year going away.
-Cleveland may be a pushover against a truly good team, based on their having the easiest schedule and only beating up on Detroit who is a fringey team as well.
-The O's have played more than a quarter of their schedule against playoff teams on the road (41 games! And still 3 more against the Jays). If Bannister doesn't win it, and the O's make the playoffs, Buck deserves consideration for having the toughest schedule by far. That's 20 games more than the Indians, and unlike them, had more games out west due to interleague.
They are now 46-32 at home and 45-32 on the road and 20-14 vs the contenders on the road (fattened up on the O's at 8-2. 12-12 vs the others).
The contenders on the road are:
Cleveland is 37-37 and 11-13 vs contenders(6-0 vs Det and 6-12 against the others)
Texas is 42 and 38 and 24-16 vs contenders
Tor is 41 and 37 and 18-17 vs contenders
Baltimore is 35-40 and 18-23 vs contenders.
Det is 40-38 and 10-16 vs contenders
Seattle is 39-38 and 11-21 vs contenders.
Houston is 40-28 and 16-23 vs contenders (4-16 vs the Sox, Jays, Tigers and Rangers).
A few things stand out to me.
-The Rangers are the weirdest playoff team in recent memory - being just terrible against terrible teams, and awesome against great teams. At 36-11 in one run games, Jeff Bannister deserves Manger of the Year going away.
-Cleveland may be a pushover against a truly good team, based on their having the easiest schedule and only beating up on Detroit who is a fringey team as well.
-The O's have played more than a quarter of their schedule against playoff teams on the road (41 games! And still 3 more against the Jays). If Bannister doesn't win it, and the O's make the playoffs, Buck deserves consideration for having the toughest schedule by far. That's 20 games more than the Indians, and unlike them, had more games out west due to interleague.
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Regardess of opposition, Porcello and Price look pretty good starting a 5-game series, don't they?
May as well ensure the first two of those games are at Fenway.
I'd prefer not to deal with a divisional opponent that early, particularly ones that have explosive offenses. That said, you beat who is put in front of you.