2016 Training Camp -Much Needed Relief

RedOctober3829 · Jul 21, 2016

Reiss came out this morning with his projected starters. He used a 4-3 base

QB: Brady/Jimmy G
RB: Lewis
WRs: Edelman, Amendola
TEs: Gronk, Bennett
OL: Solder, Thuney, Stork, Cooper, Vollmer

DL: Nink, Brown, Knighton, Sheard
LB: Collins, Hightower, Freeny
DB: Butler, Chung, DMC, Ryan

Not many surprises except for Thuney being slotted in ahead of Jackson and Mason. If this happens, expect one of them to be cut. Long, Branch, and McClellin should all be used situationally as will Hogan. Hogan should see a lot of snaps. Freeny and McClellin should be a good competition for that LB spot.

Super Nomario · Jul 21, 2016

I don't see Amendola as the second WR. He wasn't the second WR last year even when LaFell was terrible. They'll likely start more of an X type guy opposite Edelman - Hogan, or maybe even Mitchell or Dobson.

RedOctober3829 said:
Not many surprises except for Thuney being slotted in ahead of Jackson and Mason. If this happens, expect one of them to be cut. Long, Branch, and McClellin should all be used situationally as will Hogan. Hogan should see a lot of snaps. Freeny and McClellin should be a good competition for that LB spot.

Thuney's not a surprise to me - he's their highest-drafted interior guy since Mankins. I do agree we'll see a surprising cut on the interior. I don't think that third LB spot is going to play much unless Hightower or Collins gets hurt. Last year that was like a 10-20 snap role.

RedOctober3829 · Jul 21, 2016

Super Nomario said:
I don't see Amendola as the second WR. He wasn't the second WR last year even when LaFell was terrible. They'll likely start more of an X type guy opposite Edelman - Hogan, or maybe even Mitchell or Dobson.

Thuney's not a surprise to me - he's their highest-drafted interior guy since Mankins. I do agree we'll see a surprising cut on the interior. I don't think that third LB spot is going to play much unless Hightower or Collins gets hurt. Last year that was like a 10-20 snap role.

Right on not having 3 LBs much. Base defense is rare on this team and they usually have an extra safety or CB on the field. I will disagree with you on Amendola's usage for now. Amendola will go into training camp as that 2nd guy on the depth chart but there will obviously be a competition for all spots behind Edelman. Hogan will get his share of snaps but he still needs to prove he can be on the same page as Brady/Jimmy G. Will he break the narrative that most new WRs take time to mesh into the Patriots' offense? He'll play, but exactly how effective he'll be in this offense is still up in the air. I like Mitchell's potential and what he brings to the table, but he is a rookie so who knows how productive he can be. Dobson and Washington need to have good camps to even make the roster although I give Washington more of a shot than Dobson. After Edelman, every spot on the depth chart is up for grabs in terms of usage but DA gets the nod heading into camp.

Shelterdog · Jul 21, 2016

Super Nomario said:
Thuney's not a surprise to me - he's their highest-drafted interior guy since Mankins. I do agree we'll see a surprising cut on the interior. I don't think that third LB spot is going to play much unless Hightower or Collins gets hurt. Last year that was like a 10-20 snap role.

Yup, Thuney was drafted to start--he was drafted high and he seems like a classic scar guy. Kline, Stork, Jackson, Mason and Andrews all had chances to establish themselves and no one covered themselves in glory (I thought Mason showed some nice improvement particularly when moved to RG, I thought Stork was decent but not as good as the previous year, I think Kline seemed hurt and not as good as in previous years, I thought Mason was funcitonal but not much more and didn't show improvement, and I thought Andrews was good enough to be an excellent backup but not much moree). If I had to guess Jackson is a goner and it'll be Thuney/Stork/Mason but who knows.

Super Nomario · Jul 21, 2016

RedOctober3829 said:
Right on not having 3 LBs much. Base defense is rare on this team and they usually have an extra safety or CB on the field. I will disagree with you on Amendola's usage for now. Amendola will go into training camp as that 2nd guy on the depth chart but there will obviously be a competition for all spots behind Edelman. Hogan will get his share of snaps but he still needs to prove he can be on the same page as Brady/Jimmy G. Will he break the narrative that most new WRs take time to mesh into the Patriots' offense? He'll play, but exactly how effective he'll be in this offense is still up in the air. I like Mitchell's potential and what he brings to the table, but he is a rookie so who knows how productive he can be. Dobson and Washington need to have good camps to even make the roster although I give Washington more of a shot than Dobson. After Edelman, every spot on the depth chart is up for grabs in terms of usage but DA gets the nod heading into camp.

I just think it's a role thing. The Pats play an X, a Z, and an F (slot guy). Amendola is a slot and a backup Z. He's not an X. Last year, for instance, Amendola and Keyshawn Martin were both active in nine games - Martin played more snaps in five of them. Amendola played more snaps than LaFell only twice. Amendola might end up second on the team in WR snaps if the Pats cycle through X receivers trying to find a guy, but I'll expect he's the #3 guy pretty much every week, barring injury.

RedOctober3829 · Jul 24, 2016

Reiss reports the Pats have signed Vinny Sunseri. Looks to be competing for a spot in ST with Ebner going to the Olympics.

RedOctober3829 · Jul 25, 2016

Patriots opening camp on active/PUP list: Amendola, Edelman, Clay Harbor, Tre' Jackson, Dion Lewis, Shaq Mason, Sebastian Vollmer.

mwonow · Jul 25, 2016

RedOctober3829 said:
Patriots opening camp on active/PUP list: Amendola, Edelman, Clay Harbor, Tre' Jackson, Dion Lewis, Shaq Mason, Sebastian Vollmer.

That's too bad about Harbor and the guards - competition for TE3 and the interior line slots is going to be pretty fierce, and it would be nice to see what all three of these guys can do.

Super Nomario · Jul 25, 2016

mwonow said:
That's too bad about Harbor and the guards - competition for TE3 and the interior line slots is going to be pretty fierce, and it would be nice to see what all three of these guys can do.

They can come off the list at any time; this may be a very short-lived designation.

Shelterdog · Jul 26, 2016

Super Nomario said:
They can come off the list at any time; this may be a very short-lived designation.

They've often used it for a few days and they apparently have historically used it for people who fail the conditioning runs.

bakahump · Jul 26, 2016

IF thats (the conditioning runs) the reason Mason and Jackson are on the PUP, then they really came to camp ready to fight it out eh?

Super Nomario · Jul 26, 2016

bakahump said:
IF thats (the conditioning runs) the reason Mason and Jackson are on the PUP, then they really came to camp ready to fight it out eh?

Remember all the hand-wringing last year because Butler got sent home for being late for OTAs?

Dr. Gonzo · Jul 27, 2016

Per Mike Reiss

New England Patriots assistant coaches are scheduled to address reporters on Wednesday at 11:30 a.m. ET, with Bill Belichick following at noon. In addition, captains Devin McCourty and Matthew Slater are on the schedule for 12:15 p.m.

Looking forward to Coach Bill's press conference to see if he is already in mid-season form. Hoping Albert Breer asks about Brady's suspension just see BB's reaction.

Eddie Jurak · Jul 27, 2016

Dr. Gonzo said:
Per Mike Reiss

Looking forward to Coach Bill's press conference to see if he is already in mid-season form. Hoping Albert Breer asks about Brady's suspension just see BB's reaction.

Hmmm, what will BB say about the suspension?

"We're on to training camp."

"We like the players we have on the roster."

"You'd have to ask the league."

"We'll be prepared to play those games with the players on our roster."

Dr. Gonzo · Jul 27, 2016

Day to day seems to be his phrase right now

GregHarris · Jul 27, 2016

BB in midseason stonewall form this afternoon.

RedOctober3829 · Jul 27, 2016

Pats have signed TE Bear Pascoe and OL Jon Halapio to fill out the 90 man roster. They received a roster exemption for Nate Ebner going to Rio.

ShaneTrot · Jul 27, 2016

RedOctober3829 said:
Pats have signed TE Bear Pascoe and OL Jon Halapio to fill out the 90 man roster. They received a roster exemption for Nate Ebner going to Rio.

With the signing of Halapio and Sunseri is half the roster interior offensive lineman and the other half safeties? By my count that's 11 OG and Cs and 9 safeties(including Ebner).

edmunddantes · Jul 27, 2016

We had finally some clarification on the QB situation.

classic

Tyrone Biggums · Jul 27, 2016

Hate posting this going into training camp. Seems like ESPN still has no chill when it comes to the Patriots

http://itiswhatitis.weei.com/sports/newengland/football/patriots/2016/07/27/ivan-fears-on-espn-report-on-lack-of-diversity-on-pats-staff-i-dont-think-bill-really-cares-about-color/

RedOctober3829 · Jul 27, 2016

Alan Branch has been placed on NFI list with a hip injury.

Shelterdog · Jul 27, 2016

Really interesting story on Scarnecchia. Essentially he said he wants the same five playing the same positions as much as possible.

I think we'll find out who are starting five are pretty soon.
http://espn.go.com/blog/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4794092/returning-patriots-ol-dante-scarnecchia-plans-to-limit-rotation

RedOctober3829 · Jul 27, 2016

Shelterdog said:
Really interesting story on Scarnecchia. Essentially he said he wants the same five playing the same positions as much as possible.

I think we'll find out who are starting five are pretty soon.
http://espn.go.com/blog/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4794092/returning-patriots-ol-dante-scarnecchia-plans-to-limit-rotation

It will be more of a clear picture that first day of joint practices with the Bears.

Shelterdog · Jul 27, 2016

RedOctober3829 said:
It will be more of a clear picture that first day of joint practices with the Bears.

For sure.

Predictions?
I'll go with Solder-Thuney-Stork-Mason-Vollmer, Kline Andrews Weddle Cooper as backups, and Jackson the "surprise" cut.

RedOctober3829 · Jul 27, 2016

Shelterdog said:
For sure.

Predictions?
I'll go with Solder-Thuney-Stork-Mason-Vollmer, Kline Andrews Weddle Cooper as backups, and Jackson the "surprise" cut.

Solder-Kline-Stork-Mason-Vollmer to start off. I think Thuney will get 1st team reps too but will start out as the primary backup at guard. Andrews, Weddle, and Cooper are the other backups. I think there's a decent shot Jackson starts the year on PUP and that Cannon is cut.

mwonow · Jul 27, 2016

RedOctober3829 said:
Solder-Kline-Stork-Mason-Vollmer to start off. I think Thuney will get 1st team reps too but will start out as the primary backup at guard. Andrews, Weddle, and Cooper are the other backups. I think there's a decent shot Jackson starts the year on PUP and that Cannon is cut.

That's a total of six interior guys and only three tackles. Can one of the interior guys (Thuney?) kick outside if they need a fourth guy?

RedOctober3829 · Jul 27, 2016

mwonow said:
That's a total of six interior guys and only three tackles. Can one of the interior guys (Thuney?) kick outside if they need a fourth guy?

Thuney could kick outside. He played there this past season for NC State.

Super Nomario · Jul 27, 2016

RedOctober3829 said:
Solder-Kline-Stork-Mason-Vollmer to start off. I think Thuney will get 1st team reps too but will start out as the primary backup at guard. Andrews, Weddle, and Cooper are the other backups. I think there's a decent shot Jackson starts the year on PUP and that Cannon is cut.

I'm going to be massively disappointed if neither Cooper nor Thuney cracks the starting lineup. That would basically mean they traded their best pass rusher for two backup guards and a fourth-round WR.

RedOctober3829 · Jul 28, 2016

Super Nomario said:
I'm going to be massively disappointed if neither Cooper nor Thuney cracks the starting lineup. That would basically mean they traded their best pass rusher for two backup guards and a fourth-round WR.

My projected line is the one they start camp with. Competition in camp will determine who starts Week 1.

Shelterdog · Jul 28, 2016

Super Nomario said:
I'm going to be massively disappointed if neither Cooper nor Thuney cracks the starting lineup. That would basically mean they traded their best pass rusher for two backup guards and a fourth-round WR.

My guess is that Cooper is either starting or off the team--he's pretty expensive for a backup and he is (or at least was, when he came out of school) so physically talented that it strikes me that he either puts it together and pays off or he's still struggling with injuries/technique, in which case you'd just as soon keep a cheaper younger player.

RedOctober3829 · Jul 28, 2016

Ben Volin ‏@BenVolin 4m4 minutes ago
Brady has been going first in every drill today, but Garoppolo goes first in 11 on 11

Ben Volin ‏@BenVolin 2m2 minutes ago
Dobson makes a great 1 handed catch for a TD, gets a chest bump from Blount. 2 circus catches and a drop for Dobson today

tims4wins · Jul 28, 2016

Apparently Collins wasn't present - reason unknown

tims4wins · Jul 28, 2016

Shelterdog said:
My guess is that Cooper is either starting or off the team--he's pretty expensive for a backup and he is (or at least was, when he came out of school) so physically talented that it strikes me that he either puts it together and pays off or he's still struggling with injuries/technique, in which case you'd just as soon keep a cheaper younger player.

Cooper is making the team, because if they cut him they actually LOSE $600K in cap space, as per miguel

Super Nomario · Jul 28, 2016

Shelterdog said:
My guess is that Cooper is either starting or off the team--he's pretty expensive for a backup and he is (or at least was, when he came out of school) so physically talented that it strikes me that he either puts it together and pays off or he's still struggling with injuries/technique, in which case you'd just as soon keep a cheaper younger player.

Overthecap has basically Cooper's whole salary guaranteed, FWIW.

RedOctober3829 said:
Ben Volin ‏@BenVolin 2m2 minutes ago
Dobson makes a great 1 handed catch for a TD, gets a chest bump from Blount. 2 circus catches and a drop for Dobson today

Dobson might be less than 50/50 to make the team, but I give him, I dunno, like a 15-20% of winning the starting job opposite Edelman. He played over LaFell the last game in 2015 before he got hurt. He's the closest thing they have to a prototypical X receiver.

RedOctober3829 · Jul 28, 2016

Super Nomario said:
Overthecap has basically Cooper's whole salary guaranteed, FWIW.

Dobson might be less than 50/50 to make the team, but I give him, I dunno, like a 15-20% of winning the starting job opposite Edelman. He played over LaFell the last game in 2015 before he got hurt. He's the closest thing they have to a prototypical X receiver.

I'm hoping Dobson actually stays on the field and performs as he'd add a lot that is needed to this offense.

Shelterdog · Jul 28, 2016

Super Nomario said:
Overthecap has basically Cooper's whole salary guaranteed, FWIW.

Dobson might be less than 50/50 to make the team, but I give him, I dunno, like a 15-20% of winning the starting job opposite Edelman. He played over LaFell the last game in 2015 before he got hurt. He's the closest thing they have to a prototypical X receiver.

Serves me for not doublechecking Cooper's contract.

I'm pretty hopeful with Dobson as well--his rookie numbers are pretty good for a pats receiver (roughly the same range as Gronk/Hernandez), Brady seems to like him reasonably well, and he's just been snake bitten ever since. There's somethin stylistically about the guy (long striding? getting hurt? misses some catches) that drives fans crazy but his productivity has been solid when he's been able to pay.

RedOctober3829 · Jul 28, 2016

Shelterdog said:
Serves me for not doublechecking Cooper's contract.

I'm pretty hopeful with Dobson as well--his rookie numbers are pretty good for a pats receiver (roughly the same range as Gronk/Hernandez), Brady seems to like him reasonably well, and he's just been snake bitten ever since. There's somethin stylistically about the guy (long striding? getting hurt? misses some catches) that drives fans crazy but his productivity has been solid when he's been able to pay.

I believe that a roster spot is up for grabs between Dobson and Nate Washington. Hoping 1 of those 2 steps up and provides some speed and ability on the outside.

Super Nomario · Jul 28, 2016

RedOctober3829 said:
I believe that a roster spot is up for grabs between Dobson and Nate Washington. Hoping 1 of those 2 steps up and provides some speed and ability on the outside.

I think Washington is on the Michael Jenkins plan.

You have to figure Edelman, Amendola, Hogan, and Mitchell are locks given their contract / draft status. That leaves probably just one spot for Dobson / Washington / Keshawn Martin / Devin Lucien / Chris Harper / DeAndre Carter, though keeping two of those guys wouldn't be unthinkable. IMO, Dobson and Washington are competing with Hogan as much as with each other / those other guys. If Dobson (or Washington) is the best X, he'll stick, but if Hogan is the best X, it's going to make more sense to keep one of the younger guys as the fifth wideout.

RedOctober3829 · Jul 28, 2016

Well, for me at least, this is a surprise to see. Not to some other people here. Per Reiss, Thuney and Cooper were installed as 1st team guards.

Thuney and Cooper at guard. One day after offensive-line coach Dante Scarnecchia talked about the importance of continuity, it was notable that third-round pick Joe Thuney (left) and trade acquisitionJonathan Cooper (right) continued to be the top options at guard. In the competition at center headlined by Bryan Stork and David Andrews, it was Stork as the top option on Day 1.

http://espn.go.com/blog/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4794129/football-excitement-in-region-as-12393-fans-show-at-patriots-opening-practice

RedOctober3829 · Jul 29, 2016

Jamie Collins is back at practice.

Tom E. Curran ‏@tomecurran 57m57 minutes ago
Belichick, asked if there was a scenario in which Garoppolo would be named starter in Week 5, shakes head and mutters "Jesus Christ"

Video of BB answering that question. It's gold.
http://cbsloc.al/2a9xA00

tims4wins · Jul 29, 2016

I love that man

wilked · Jul 29, 2016

We need to ID that reporter

amarshal2 · Jul 29, 2016

RedOctober3829 said:
Jamie Collins is back at practice.

Tom E. Curran ‏@tomecurran 57m57 minutes ago
Belichick, asked if there was a scenario in which Garoppolo would be named starter in Week 5, shakes head and mutters "Jesus Christ"

Video of BB answering that question. It's gold.
http://cbsloc.al/2a9xA00

More from Curran's Twitter (sorry no links):

"That's the first recorded press conference JC in memory."

"Reminds me of when Tim Tebow was here and a player dropped a loud JC in locker room. Tebow turned around and said, "He loves you!"

BaseballJones · Jul 29, 2016

RedOctober3829 said:
Jamie Collins is back at practice.

Tom E. Curran ‏@tomecurran 57m57 minutes ago
Belichick, asked if there was a scenario in which Garoppolo would be named starter in Week 5, shakes head and mutters "Jesus Christ"

Video of BB answering that question. It's gold.
http://cbsloc.al/2a9xA00

Great. Now there's a QB controversy between Jimmy Garoppolo and Jesus Christ.

NortheasternPJ · Jul 29, 2016

The first question that kicked off that video was one of the dumbest questions I've ever heard asked.

Norm loves Vera · Jul 29, 2016

This guy fits right in:

Mike Reiss ‏@MikeReiss 10m10 minutes ago

TE Martellus Bennett asked if it's challenging to develop chemistry w/ 2 new QBs. His answer: "I've dated 2 girls at the same time before."

tweet by Reiss: "TE Martellus Bennett asked if it's challenging to develop chemistry w/ 2 new QBs. His answer: "I've dated 2 girls at the same time before."

Van Everyman · Jul 29, 2016

So awesome. Meanwhile here's Florio with a ridiculous column about this answer:

http://wp.me/p14QSB-a4Zw

wilked · Jul 29, 2016

I would encourage everyone not to give Florio a click. The article is more worthless than I even imagined.

2016 Training Camp -Much Needed Relief

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