2019 Patriots: Post-SB Roster Thread

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 2, 2006
22,345
Philadelphia
Texans are going to cut Demaryius Thomas. He's coming off a torn achilles, and I have no idea how long that will take for him to be healthy. But assuming that drives his price down, might he be worth picking up? The Pats were obviously interested in him at the trade deadline (pre-injury).
Counting on him to play any kind of significant role seems like a mistake. His production has been in decline for years and he was basically a bust for the Texans. Then add in an achilles injury, a tough one to come back from when you're in your 30s. And the injury occurred late in the year, so he'll definitely miss OTAs and possibly much of training camp.
 

Jed Zeppelin

Member
SoSH Member
Aug 23, 2008
51,289
I don't necessarily want either coming off an achilles injury but if I had to choose I would much prefer Emmanuel Sanders in this offense.
 

BigSoxFan

Member
SoSH Member
May 31, 2007
47,083
I don't necessarily want either coming off an achilles injury but if I had to choose I would much prefer Emmanuel Sanders in this offense.
Yup. I'd kick the tires on him. He would have eviscerated people in the Pats offense but we'll have to see what he has left. Turns 32 in March.
 

Van Everyman

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 30, 2009
26,991
Newton
The guy nobody talks about/knows who would be a perfect fit is Adam Humphries from Tampa Bay. Slot receiver who had 80 catches this year with Famous Jameis throwing him the ball. Plus he’s an undrafted white guy, so helps keep the reputation going. It almost has to happen.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HumpAd00.htm
If by "nobody" you mean Ben Volin, I agree with you:

I would love to see Adam Humphries in New England. Humphries had 76 catches for 816 yards and five touchdowns for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers last season. Solid production for a 26-year-old who has missed only one game in three years.

But Humphries should have suitors, and if the Patriots sign him, they may also need to give Edelman a raise from $3 million to keep order in the locker room.
https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/patriots/2019/02/11/here-are-moves-patriots-should-make-this-offseason/el8ueAjiLiwzaxkDsss8qO/story.html
 

Jed Zeppelin

Member
SoSH Member
Aug 23, 2008
51,289

SMU_Sox

queer eye for the next pats guy
SoSH Member
Jul 20, 2009
8,878
Dallas
He’s going to get drafted because his other tape is elite. He was probably going to be a day 2 pick because of the optics but maybe now he’s the first guy take in round 4. I know these guys aren’t angels but I hope we don’t draft him. I know he has an explanation and even married the person after but I’m usually a pass on assault/violence types of character issues.
 

RG33

Certain Class of Poster
SoSH Member
Nov 28, 2005
7,199
CA
6 SBs later, and I am arguably more excited about the roster-build and draft of the Patriots in February, than I am about Spring Training, the Celtics and Bruins playoff push, and pretty much anything else in my life. I love this franchise.
 

Jed Zeppelin

Member
SoSH Member
Aug 23, 2008
51,289
6 SBs later, and I am arguably more excited about the roster-build and draft of the Patriots in February, than I am about Spring Training, the Celtics and Bruins playoff push, and pretty much anything else in my life. I love this franchise.
Have a buddy at work who is a lifelong Jets fan and I have to stop myself from gushing too much at times. Especially when I start talking matter-of-factly about how much better everything in the off-season feels coming off a SB win vs. a SB loss or earlier playoff exit.
 
Last edited:

tims4wins

PN23's replacement
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
37,054
Hingham, MA
6 SBs later, and I am arguably more excited about the roster-build and draft of the Patriots in February, than I am about Spring Training, the Celtics and Bruins playoff push, and pretty much anything else in my life. I love this franchise.
Yes yes yes
 

rodderick

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 24, 2009
12,749
Belo Horizonte - Brazil
There's nothing better than a post SB win offseason where your team is loaded with picks and will have a great opportunity to be even better than they were the previous year. I'll enjoy this one all the way to September.
 

EL Jeffe

Member
SoSH Member
Aug 30, 2006
1,314
He’s going to get drafted because his other tape is elite. He was probably going to be a day 2 pick because of the optics but maybe now he’s the first guy take in round 4. I know these guys aren’t angels but I hope we don’t draft him. I know he has an explanation and even married the person after but I’m usually a pass on assault/violence types of character issues.
You think so, SMU? All the draft evaporators I respect the most saw him as a top 10 selection even with the assault background. From what I understand, the Miss St coaching staff fully vouched for him and that he genuinely grew after the incident.

The Patriots, with all those extra picks, seem like a very logical landing spot (I'm guessing late 2, early 3?). He checks so many boxes for them - SEC, scheme diverse, strong hands/anchor, with excellent rush skills. He's the sort of talent that's usually long gone by the time the Patriots pick, so I imagine BB will be very intrigued - even with a red shirt year. Most GMs don't have that kind of job security to take a red shirt player on Day 2.
 

pappymojo

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 28, 2010
6,667
Have a buddy at work who is a lifelong Jets fan and I have to stop myself from gushing too much at times. Especially when I start talking matter-of-factory about how much better everything in the off-season feels coming off a SB win vs. a SB loss or earlier playoff exit.
matter-of-factory is a great term to describe the Patriots off-season.
 

soxhop411

news aggravator
SoSH Member
Dec 4, 2009
46,274
Pats poach another coach

The New England Patriots have added another piece from Youngstown State.

Penguins offensive line coach Carmen Bricillo is heading to the NFL as an assistant offensive line coach, multiple sources familiar with the matter said. He had been with YSU for the past nine seasons.

He joins former Penguin players Derek Rivers and Damoun Patterson in New England. The Mahoning Valley connections with the Patriots don’t end there as Cardinal Mooney and Ohio State graduate John Simon suited up for the Patriots as they won their sixth Super Bowl on Feb. 3, beating the Los Angeles Rams, 13-3. Simon is set to become a free agent in March.
http://www.vindy.com/news/2019/feb/12/football-ysu-o-line-coach-going-to-pros/
 

SeoulSoxFan

I Want to Hit the World with Rocket Punch
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jun 27, 2006
22,089
A Scud Away from Hell
6 SBs later, and I am arguably more excited about the roster-build and draft of the Patriots in February, than I am about Spring Training, the Celtics and Bruins playoff push, and pretty much anything else in my life. I love this franchise.
It's really a 365 days thing.

The last time I felt this way was for the Bruins in the 80's (the Pederson/Middleton then Remelin/Neely years) and of course the 2004 through 2007 Sox run.

Grateful everyday for this franchise, starting with the Krafts.
 

Jed Zeppelin

Member
SoSH Member
Aug 23, 2008
51,289
Yes yes yes
Had a class in high school in 2004 where we used computers, business class I think. I still remember me and the guy next to me spending basically all of our days devouring every new mock draft in the wake of SB38 trying to figure out who they'd get with the Kyle Boller pick and being shocked that Vince fell so far. Don't think he was even on our radar at the time.
 

tims4wins

PN23's replacement
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
37,054
Hingham, MA
Had a class in high school in 2004 where we used computers, business class I think. I still remember me and the guy next to me spending basically all of our days devouring every new mock draft in the wake of SB38 trying to figure out who they'd get with the Kyle Boller pick and being shocked that Vince fell so far. Don't think he was even on our radar at the time.
There have been two draft picks in Pats history that I was basically screaming at the TV when they were on the clock and they actually picked that guy: Terry Glenn and Vince Wilfork
 

BigSoxFan

Member
SoSH Member
May 31, 2007
47,083
There have been two draft picks in Pats history that I was basically screaming at the TV when they were on the clock and they actually picked that guy: Terry Glenn and Vince Wilfork
Funny. I did the same with Wilfork. I also high fived my buddies when Chris Canty was picked in 1997. That was my Bill Simmons/James Young moment...
 

Papelbon's Poutine

Homeland Security
SoSH Member
Dec 4, 2005
19,615
Portsmouth, NH
There's nothing better than a post SB win offseason where your team is loaded with picks and will have a great opportunity to be even better than they were the previous year. I'll enjoy this one all the way to September.
Very true, but they have a lot of holes. They basically have one WR on the roster and rumored possible retirements could cause big holes at S and TE. They could use some help on DL as well as some supper at LB.
 

pappymojo

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 28, 2010
6,667
Based on the discussion in the "Why Are The Patriots So Good" thread I had a thought. I think players playing under a rookie contract are underpaid. I think Belichick recognizes this and hoards draft picks not just as a way to acquire talent but as a way to manage the salary.

I think comp picks are the most recent instance where Belichick is flexible in his approach roster construction. I wonder if we see fewer instances of the Patriots trading a player who is due to become a free agent within the next two years a year early. Instead I suspect we may see the Patriots actively acquiring those types of players specifically from teams that have undergone organizational changes (changes to the head coach and/or general manager). These would be players playing on the fourth year of their rookie contract. Two examples from last year:

Last year they traded a third round pick to the 49ers for Trent Brown and a fifth round pick. 2018 was the fourth year of the contract he had signed with the 49ers. I believe he was signed by Trent Baalke. John Lynch became GM in 2017. If he signs elsewhere as a free agent, it is likely that the Patriots will be awarded a third round pick as a comp pick.

Last year they traded a third round pick to the Browns for Danny Shelton and a fifth round pick. 2018 was the fourth year of the contract he signed with the Browns. I believe he was drafted under Ray Famer. Jon Dorsey became GM in 2017. I don't know how much he will get as a free agent or what sort of comp pick the Patriots would receive if he signs elsewhere.

So, thinking about similar opportunities for this offseason. Players from the 2016 draft (going into the fourth year on their rookie contract) where the team has undergone recent changes to the General Manager position. Anyone jump out?
 

Super Nomario

Member
SoSH Member
Nov 5, 2000
14,012
Mansfield MA
Based on the discussion in the "Why Are The Patriots So Good" thread I had a thought. I think players playing under a rookie contract are underpaid. I think Belichick recognizes this and hoards draft picks not just as a way to acquire talent but as a way to manage the salary.

I think comp picks are the most recent instance where Belichick is flexible in his approach roster construction. I wonder if we see fewer instances of the Patriots trading a player who is due to become a free agent within the next two years a year early. Instead I suspect we may see the Patriots actively acquiring those types of players specifically from teams that have undergone organizational changes (changes to the head coach and/or general manager). These would be players playing on the fourth year of their rookie contract. Two examples from last year:

Last year they traded a third round pick to the 49ers for Trent Brown and a fifth round pick. 2018 was the fourth year of the contract he had signed with the 49ers. I believe he was signed by Trent Baalke. John Lynch became GM in 2017. If he signs elsewhere as a free agent, it is likely that the Patriots will be awarded a third round pick as a comp pick.

Last year they traded a third round pick to the Browns for Danny Shelton and a fifth round pick. 2018 was the fourth year of the contract he signed with the Browns. I believe he was drafted under Ray Famer. Jon Dorsey became GM in 2017. I don't know how much he will get as a free agent or what sort of comp pick the Patriots would receive if he signs elsewhere.

So, thinking about similar opportunities for this offseason. Players from the 2016 draft (going into the fourth year on their rookie contract) where the team has undergone recent changes to the General Manager position. Anyone jump out?
By my reckoning, you've got 12 teams that have made GM changes in that time span: JAX (Jalen Ramsey, Myles Jack, Yannick Ngakoue), SF (DeForest Buckner, Joshua Garnett), BUF (Shaq Lawson), IND (Ryan Kelly, Joe Haeg), OAK (Karl Joseph), CAR (Vernon Butler, James Bradberry), CLE (Emmanuel Ogbah, Joe Schobert, Shon Coleman, Derrick Kindred, Seth Devalve), HOU (Will Fuller, Nick Martin), NYG (Sterling Shepherd), GB (Kenny Clark, Blake Martinez, Dean Lowry), BAL (Ronnie Stanley, Tavon Young, Matt Judon), and MIA (Laremy Tunsil, Xavien Howard, Kenyan Drake). I haven't checked throroughly to see if some of these guys have been extended already.
 

RedOctober3829

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 19, 2005
55,298
deep inside Guido territory
By my reckoning, you've got 12 teams that have made GM changes in that time span: JAX (Jalen Ramsey, Myles Jack, Yannick Ngakoue), SF (DeForest Buckner, Joshua Garnett), BUF (Shaq Lawson), IND (Ryan Kelly, Joe Haeg), OAK (Karl Joseph), CAR (Vernon Butler, James Bradberry), CLE (Emmanuel Ogbah, Joe Schobert, Shon Coleman, Derrick Kindred, Seth Devalve), HOU (Will Fuller, Nick Martin), NYG (Sterling Shepherd), GB (Kenny Clark, Blake Martinez, Dean Lowry), BAL (Ronnie Stanley, Tavon Young, Matt Judon), and MIA (Laremy Tunsil, Xavien Howard, Kenyan Drake). I haven't checked throroughly to see if some of these guys have been extended already.
Out of those names ones that interest me are certainly Ramsey/Jack/Ngakoue but beyond those I'd say Will Fuller, Sterling Shepard, Xavien Howard, and Kenyan Drake.
 

pappymojo

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 28, 2010
6,667
By my reckoning, you've got 12 teams that have made GM changes in that time span: JAX (Jalen Ramsey, Myles Jack, Yannick Ngakoue), SF (DeForest Buckner, Joshua Garnett), BUF (Shaq Lawson), IND (Ryan Kelly, Joe Haeg), OAK (Karl Joseph), CAR (Vernon Butler, James Bradberry), CLE (Emmanuel Ogbah, Joe Schobert, Shon Coleman, Derrick Kindred, Seth Devalve), HOU (Will Fuller, Nick Martin), NYG (Sterling Shepherd), GB (Kenny Clark, Blake Martinez, Dean Lowry), BAL (Ronnie Stanley, Tavon Young, Matt Judon), and MIA (Laremy Tunsil, Xavien Howard, Kenyan Drake). I haven't checked throroughly to see if some of these guys have been extended already.
Thank you. Do we know if any of these teams significantly changed their approach (for example, going from a 4-3 defense to a 3-4 defense as a result of a coaching change)?
 

SeoulSoxFan

I Want to Hit the World with Rocket Punch
Moderator
SoSH Member
Jun 27, 2006
22,089
A Scud Away from Hell
So, if Trent Brown signs a huge contract elsewhere (as many believe he will) Patriots could be looking at a decent draft pick in the 3rd-4th round range, no?
 

Red Averages

owes you $50
SoSH Member
Apr 20, 2003
9,054
19mm per year is "very team friendly" now? Interesting.

Hard pass. Vastly perfer what it would take to get a lesser WR, with less assets and less of a commitment to a guy who has played a total of 16 games the last two years and frequently shows himself as an individual over a teammate. Besides, NFL players (particularly OBJ) frequently comment on other players Instagram.
 

Harry Hooper

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jan 4, 2002
34,367
Lazar is suggesting the Pats converting much of OBJs deal into a signing bonus for cap purposes. What could possibly go wrong with giving him most of the money up front? Get real.
 

Super Nomario

Member
SoSH Member
Nov 5, 2000
14,012
Mansfield MA
Lazar is suggesting the Pats converting much of OBJs deal into a signing bonus for cap purposes. What could possibly go wrong with giving him most of the money up front? Get real.
The Patriots literally don't have enough cap space right now ($15.8 MM) to absorb Beckham's hit ($17 MM). They have some ways to clear space, but they have other needs, too. So if the Pats wanted to make this happen (a dubious assumption), it would be necessary to convert some of Beckham's salary to bonus and spread out the hit.
 

Jettisoned

Member
SoSH Member
May 6, 2008
1,059
So, if Trent Brown signs a huge contract elsewhere (as many believe he will) Patriots could be looking at a decent draft pick in the 3rd-4th round range, no?
I think those come into effect next year. The Pats will get a few from losing Solder, Butler, Amendola, Lewis, etc..
 

Jettisoned

Member
SoSH Member
May 6, 2008
1,059
To me, the biggest question mark is Josh Gordon. If he can play a bunch of games next year they probably don't need to spend a lot of resources acquiring receivers. They could probably just get away with trying to get an upgrade for Hogan, but even then if Berrios takes over the slot, they could move Edelman over to the Z role and keep things more or less the same. In this case, re-signing Brown is the biggest move they'd need to make.

If Gordon can't go next year they will have to make some serious moves for Z and X receivers, because Hogan and Dorsett don't seem like they'll be able to get it done consistently. That would probably preclude them from re-signing Brown as well.
 

axx

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 16, 2005
8,126
Gordon I believe is a UFA. They could sign him of course if he manages to get reinstated.
 

Super Nomario

Member
SoSH Member
Nov 5, 2000
14,012
Mansfield MA
To me, the biggest question mark is Josh Gordon. If he can play a bunch of games next year they probably don't need to spend a lot of resources acquiring receivers. They could probably just get away with trying to get an upgrade for Hogan, but even then if Berrios takes over the slot, they could move Edelman over to the Z role and keep things more or less the same. In this case, re-signing Brown is the biggest move they'd need to make.

If Gordon can't go next year they will have to make some serious moves for Z and X receivers, because Hogan and Dorsett don't seem like they'll be able to get it done consistently. That would probably preclude them from re-signing Brown as well.
Gordon was great but he's an addict. They just cannot count on him for a whole season, even if he's able to get in the field initially.
 

RedOctober3829

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 19, 2005
55,298
deep inside Guido territory
Chris Simms said the Giants were shopping OBJ last offseason and the team most aggressive in trying to deal for him was the Patriots. Now, that may be before he got his extension and he was on his last year. But maybe the talks begin again?

 

rodderick

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 24, 2009
12,749
Belo Horizonte - Brazil
Chris Simms said the Giants were shopping OBJ last offseason and the team most aggressive in trying to deal for him was the Patriots. Now, that may be before he got his extension and he was on his last year. But maybe the talks begin again?

You ever get the feeling sometimes that a certain player will inevitably end up on your team in the future, for some reason? That's me with OBJ.
 

5dice

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2001
663
west of town
Just tell me this doesn't look 100% right to you:
It doesn't look 100% right to me. Picturing the moments during and after a unique Patriots' offensive gameplan that includes not throwing to him and he acts detrimental to the team for the world to see and for the hot take business to seize upon.

And before anyone pulls the Moss and Dillon cards out and lazily throws them on the table as comps, they were both in late career stages at 30 years old where they just wanted to win and have a chance on a marquee playoff team. ODB just turned 26 and is at the top of his game and top 3 in the league. What about this player, salary and career stage says Patriots, beyond his talent?

Throw in how tight the Patriots cap is with signings that still need to happen along with giving up valuable trade capital and this seems really far-fetched. My .$02.
 
Last edited:

Seels

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 20, 2005
4,948
NH
I think the only Michael Felgerism I've ever agreed with is that the salary cap is (mostly) a myth.

If the opportunity was out there for the Pats to actually get OBJ, and they placed value on getting him and signing Flowers, I'm sure they could do so quite easily. Cutting or restructuring Cannon Allen Claymore is about as easy as it gets.

The only difficulty lies in whether or not Gronk / McCourty and their respective cap hits are coming back or can be restructured if they do.

That said it remains unlikely given the holes the team has at various positions.
 

tims4wins

PN23's replacement
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
37,054
Hingham, MA
I think the only Michael Felgerism I've ever agreed with is that the salary cap is (mostly) a myth.

If the opportunity was out there for the Pats to actually get OBJ, and they placed value on getting him and signing Flowers, I'm sure they could do so quite easily. Cutting or restructuring Cannon Allen Claymore is about as easy as it gets.

The only difficulty lies in whether or not Gronk / McCourty and their respective cap hits are coming back or can be restructured if they do.

That said it remains unlikely given the holes the team has at various positions.
It might be a myth for a given year, or even a 2-3 year period of time, but eventually you have to pay the piper.
 

Jimbodandy

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 31, 2006
11,403
around the way
I wouldn't base anything on what Chris Simms says. The man is blinded by hate. Not sure what his angle is here.

Beckham or any diva receiver can work here or anywhere under the right circumstances. In Bill we trust, yada yada.
 

rodderick

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 24, 2009
12,749
Belo Horizonte - Brazil
It doesn't look 100% right to me. Picturing the moments during and after a unique Patriots' offensive gameplan that includes not throwing to him and he acts detrimental to the team for the world to see and for the hot take business to seize upon.

And before anyone pulls the Moss and Dillon cards out and lazily throws them on the table as comps, they were both in late career stages at 30 years old where they just wanted to win and have a chance on a marquee playoff team. ODB just turned 26 and is at the top of his game and top 3 in the league. What about this player, salary and career stage says Patriots, beyond his talent?

Throw in how tight the Patriots cap is with signings that still need to happen along with giving up valuable trade capital and this seems really far-fetched. My .$02.
I will pull the Moss and Dillon cards because everything you said about those two players is a hindsight analysis. There absolutely were similar questions about their commitment, personality and locker room fit before they came to New England.