2017 Patriots FA & Trades Thread
- Thread starter RedOctober3829
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None of the NFL deal are "real"
This is fun, but that team is almost too good. Cut down day won't be easy when you're at 50 players before the draft.
Imagine all the trading down BB can do without having to draft any players!
In all honesty, I just wanted to see what kind of capspace they had. If you couldn't tell by the above...its a lot. If they wanted to resign their own guys and go get 2-3 high caliber free agents, they have the cash to do it.
The cap space combined with the Collins trade (which locked in a comp pick even if they sign more comp players than they lose) makes me think they are more likely than usual to be involved in the pricier-tier of free agent spending, Im just not sure which specific player they are likely to target.
I agree. I actually think Berry, Campbell, and Pryor are BB kind of guys. Obviously thats completely wishful thinking, but...
I gotta say, if they opt to walk into next season with $30-40 million in cap space, I'm going to be a little pissed. They have a chance to turn a very good defense into an elite one, and they can do it without blowing up the future or losing their depth. You don't get many opportunities like that, especially when you're already the best team in the league. I'm praying that BB was playing the long game with the contracts he's dolled out, and now he's going to cash in.
For the record: Miguel has the Pats currently just over $61 million in cap space. That number should go up to just over $67 million after they cut Amendola.
Don't forget about the Brady restructure (i bet they get him down to 7 or 8 million, saving 4-5 million).
I definitely think Campbell will be a target especially with the age of the DE's coupled with the fact Arizona will be using their tag on Chandler Jones.
There was quite a bit of "sure wish they had kept Chandler Jones" after the Collins trade. Instead they pay neither, are compensated for both, win the Super Bowl anyway, and are now set up in a golden position to come back with a team that's potentially even better on paper next year. And people wonder why the Patriots keep winning.
Breer
What notable vets will be jumping on the Pats’ gravy train? This year it was Chris Long. Two years ago it was Darrelle Revis and Brandon Browner. Inevitably there’ll be some veteran in his 30s who’ll take less to try and get some of the ice the Patriots have earned over the last decade-and-a-half. So who could the candidates be this time around? I still think pass rush has to be a priority, and so guys like DeMarcus Ware or Julius Peppers could be in play.
http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2017/02/07/super-bowl-51-patriots-falcons-offseason-moves?xid=socialflow_twitter_si
What notable vets will be jumping on the Pats’ gravy train? This year it was Chris Long. Two years ago it was Darrelle Revis and Brandon Browner. Inevitably there’ll be some veteran in his 30s who’ll take less to try and get some of the ice the Patriots have earned over the last decade-and-a-half. So who could the candidates be this time around? I still think pass rush has to be a priority, and so guys like DeMarcus Ware or Julius Peppers could be in play.
http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2017/02/07/super-bowl-51-patriots-falcons-offseason-moves?xid=socialflow_twitter_si
Yeah, I mean if they'll come for next to nothing, sure. But I'd like to retain some key guys and land a blue chipper or two. Campbell would be awesome.
Pryor is getting tagged in Cleveland. And you just called him a "BB kind of guy". He is pretty much the opposite of a Belichick type of player.
He got beat out by Matt McGloin in Oakland due to mental preparation issues / ability to grasp the scheme. He wouldn't fit well.
Pats had Pryor in for tryout in 2015 and nearly signed him, so while I acknowledge the questions about preparation you raise it does seem like there's reason to think Belichick is interested, at least.
This. He's also very flexible. He can play across the formation and has the utility knife value that BB values.
The article you're responding to mentioned Julius, so I'm not arguing. Just pointing out that most people talking about Peppers in this thread are talking about Jabrill Peppers out of Michigan, so we should try to keep that distinction straight.
In regards to Pryor, Lombardi was on Simmons' podcast at one point this year saying "We (Pats FO) dropped the ball on that one. We shouldn't have let him leave without a contract". Or something very similar, so I'd bet that's one BB would like to do over.
It worked with Bryan Cox and Roman Phifer. I think they were both 33 when they signed.
Sure, but big difference between signing him last year when he was a bargain and this year when he'll cost market price. I'm sure the Patriots would love to have Pryor, but I can't see them paying what it will take.
Fun post - but I bet Blount can be had for about half of that and Hightower may settle for $10m.
I also wouldn't sign Ryan for more than $6m, and if he wanted more, I'd let him walk because I think he's fairly replaceable. I'm also not sure if you need him at a high cap number if your safeties are Berry and McCourty.
I also wonder if Berry would settle for $10-$11m per if he knows he's legitimately competing for a Super Bowl in New England.
Finally, if we have Edelman, Mitchell, Amendola, and Hogan, do we really need to spend $7.5m on Pryor? That seems like unncecessary overspending...right now WR is a position of strength for the Pats, especially if you can also get Floyd back on a cheap deal.
I think they could do everything suggested for maybe even a little less, sign Bennett instead of Pryor, and still have ~$25 million in cap space (or more if they don't re-sign Ryan).
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Duron Harmon is a guy I'd want the Patriots to lock up, even if they extend beyond their normal comfort zone for him. He plays a key role within the defense, and he plays it very well. Similar to McCourty, it doesn't always show up on the stat sheet, but he plays the deep zones really well. He's a very good tackler and durable to boot. With the Jordan Richards pick looking like a bust, they have no replacement on hand. They'd either have to use a premium pick on a free safety (and prior premium round picks on Richard and Tavon Wilson didn't work out), sign a different free agent, or move to a different defensive alignment. I'd rather just keep Harmon and sacrifice elsewhere. He's a key piece in their ability to limit big plays.
The Pats play enough 3 safety looks that they could absolutely keep Chung if they brought in someone like Berry. It's just getting the right fit. You want someone who can play a good single-high safety, which allows someone like Chung to matchup against a pass catching TE or RB. If you get two Chung-types, you start exposing yourself to the deep ball.
If another team decides that he can be a pretty good starting FS in the league, I think it will be hard for us to match their offer. The basic reality is that he'll be worth more to another team that will see him as an every down starting FS.
A decent comp is Tyvon Branch, who was the third safety for KC in 2015 but had a pretty good season in a sub package role, and signed for 2/10M in Arizona. Harmon is younger, probably has more upside (Branch was a bit of a journeyman at that point), and the cap just went up a lot. I think there is a good chance somebody offers him $3/18 or something similar that we'll be hard pressed to match.
Yeah, I guess my question was more about whether Berry can convert to SS and matchup with tight ends? I haven't watched much of his play over the last few years and know more about him based on his reputation than what my eyes have been able to tell me.
Berry is about the same weight as Chung and an inch taller. I'm just not sure how physical he is in coverage, or whether he'd even want to switch from FS to SS.
I'm this scenario, I guess we convert Berry to SS and keep Harmon (or someone league-average) as a second FS.
Edit: Actually, Berry is listed as more of a SS than FS. This may actually make sense.
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One more question...
Are we sure Nink is back? He's going to be 33 and looked pretty slow throughout the year, though I know he was battling leg injuries (including blood clots, which, as someone that has survived a PE myself, is terrifying to think about playing football with).
He'd only save ~$1.4 against the cap, but does Belchick have the "Bruschi talk" with him this offseason?
Are we sure Nink is back? He's going to be 33 and looked pretty slow throughout the year, though I know he was battling leg injuries (including blood clots, which, as someone that has survived a PE myself, is terrifying to think about playing football with).
He'd only save ~$1.4 against the cap, but does Belchick have the "Bruschi talk" with him this offseason?
Miguel has Logan Ryan surpassing Robert Alford's contract extension signed a couple of months ago (4 yrs, $38 million). No thanks. I'm a big Ryan fan but not for that kind of money.
Harmon's a decent player himself, and does his responsibilities well (although I thought he tackled miserably in the Super Bowl), but he is exactly the kind of player the Pats won't overpay for. If they could do something around 3 years $11-12 mill I do think we could see him back.
I don't think Chung is expendable, not that I expect them to cut him for almost 0 cap benefit. He reasonably fills the LB/SS hybrid role that is becoming pretty en vogue around the league (Deion Jones, Deone Bucannon) and has consistently been one of the teams better tacklers for 3 years now.
Harmon's a decent player himself, and does his responsibilities well (although I thought he tackled miserably in the Super Bowl), but he is exactly the kind of player the Pats won't overpay for. If they could do something around 3 years $11-12 mill I do think we could see him back.
I don't think Chung is expendable, not that I expect them to cut him for almost 0 cap benefit. He reasonably fills the LB/SS hybrid role that is becoming pretty en vogue around the league (Deion Jones, Deone Bucannon) and has consistently been one of the teams better tacklers for 3 years now.
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I was wondering about Nink too. Especially if they are able to add a couple edge guys in draft or FA. He is still good for a couple of really heads up high effort type plays a year (e.g. the fumble recovery in the AFCCG) but does not seem able to compete on a consistent basis physically at this point.
The edge will definitely be a priority in the draft/FA period. I think Nink sticks around throughout the offseason and stands a good chance of eventually making the team in a backup/elder statesman type role, since the benefit to cutting him is fairly minimal. But I think they'll bring in a lot of competition - at least one high-or-middle round draft pick on an edge player and probably 1-2 veteran FAs - and that there is a reasonable chance he gets cuts in August.
I think the time is right to move on from Nink. He looked painfully slow out there this year. Edge pressure is what turned the game around for us. I'd like to see Long back on a short deal but want another blue chipper on the line. I think Calais Campbell would make a great Patriot given how versatile he is. Turns 31 this year so may be a little too old to interest BB.
Between Sheard, Long, and Nink, edge is pretty much the only position they can't line up and compete right now in 2017. If they lose Hightower, they have Van Noy, McClellin, and Roberts. Butler will be back. Even if Ryan leaves they will have Butler, Rowe, Jones, and Coleman. If (when) Bennett leaves they still have Gronk. If Amendola and/or Floyd leave, they have Jules, Hogan, and Mitchell. If Branch leaves they have Valentine, Brown, and Flowers. But edge is an issue.
Calais Campbell is a player right up BB's alley. 31 the perfect age to come here to chase the ring that he won't win in Arizona and he is still very productive. He should be a target of this team.
Yeah. Hightower made the big defensive play and Roberts damn near killed us (but did great to correct his mistake). I think Hightower is an absolute must priority this offseason with Butler.
Yeah fair enough. But counter point is he only played half the snaps in the AFCCG. And he is somewhat of an injury prone player. Love him and hope he is back but my point was mainly that they can field a team at LB. They don't have any edge players on the roster right now aside from Nink, who is super close to washed up.
Chung to me is a lot like Blount (although Chung is a better player than Blount)- he's a useful piece with us, and he's been a shitshow elsewhere. I think he plays the rest of his (meaningful) career here on relatively short money.
His cap hit is a little high next year (5M, but its back down to 3M the year after), and in the 3M range he's an absolute bargain. Safety is a strong position for the Pats - spending a bunch of money trying to upgrade it seems like a poor use of resources, largely because you can't ever be sure a guy is going to transition to the system well.
I think Nink is effectively gone - he'll be 34, has had a bunch of injuries, and is slowing down. He may still be on the team, but he's not going to be counted on to be a full time starter.
Not to get all Jeterian about it, but Campbell came across as very impressive in the Amazon Hard Knocks-ripoff series about the Arizona Cardinals. Leaderly, respected by both older and younger teammates, go-to guy for the coaching staff...
If Logan Ryan leaves, I imagine they'll look to replace him by signing someone? Here is a list of UFA CBs. I don't follow players on other teams closely enough to comment, but I'll put it out there for reference.
I am not particularly optimistic that Hightower will be back. For me, if he is, it will be a pleasant surprise. But I could see the Pats not wanting to shell out top top dollar for a guy with his injury history.
Mike Reiss ESPN Staff Writer
LB Dont'a Hightower touched on becoming a free agent and if he would be back with Patriots in 2017. "That's up in the air right now," he said on ESPN's NFL Insiders show. "I'm going along with the ride and enjoying this victory. ... I'm sure in a couple weeks all that free agency stuff will pick up. I'll handle that whenever that comes."
He's also not going to the White House, although he says he didn't go the last time either. Went when Alabama won; now says "been there, done that"